Official complaints about Free Agency thread (merge)

[aaron11]

Just now, jvan1973 said:

But they lost a lot of games.   Being big players in free agency didn't help them

it didnt hurt them either, they are actually pretty good at managing the cap.  

[NewColtsFan]

45 minutes ago, threeflight said:

A 5th rounder is hardly going to make or break you.  Most aren't even around after a year or two.  If I can get a top ten talent in the 5th round?  Hell yes that is worth the risk lol.

 

OK....    now you're just deliberately ignoring facts and logic in favor of your opinion which you're massively in love with for no apparent reason.

 

You've pretty much been proven wrong on almost every one of your complaints.

 

Congrats!    You're batting a 1,000!

 

[jvan1973]

Just now, aaron11 said:

it didnt hurt them either, they are actually pretty good at managing the cap.  

They have 28 million in cap space this year without the Nick foles contract and what ever else they do.   They failed to buy a Superbowl.   Almost every team that tries fails 

[threeflight]

1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

OK....    now you're just deliberately ignoring facts and logic in favor of your opinion which you're massively in love with for no apparent reason.

 

You've pretty much been proven wrong on almost every one of your complaints.

 

Congrats!    You're batting a 1,000!

 

What were the facts I ignored?

I said if he is never cleared to play its no big loss. A 5th rounder.  Who cares.  How many 5th rounders ever go on to be anything?

 

But if he was cleared to play (and he has been) its a huge win.

 

Not sure what you are arguing here.

[threeflight]

8 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

What are you basing number one on?    Do you know the guy?

Players who have played with him in the past.

Coaches who have coached him.

 

Nothing bad was ever said about the guy until this year.

 

I am not excusing his actions but imo there was a reason for them.  He wanted out of a toxic situation.  A 3rd and a 5th and $5 M more than what we paid Devin Futchess of all people was well worth it.

Vegas oddsmakers seem to agree.

[aaron11]

6 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

They have 28 million in cap space this year without the Nick foles contract and what ever else they do.   They failed to buy a Superbowl.   Almost every team that tries fails 

most teams fail period.  nothing wrong with going for it, it can work sometimes

[threeflight]

4 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

most teams fail period.  nothing wrong with going for it, it can work sometimes

This.

[Dark_Indy]

12 minutes ago, threeflight said:

What were the facts I ignored?

I said if he is never cleared to play its no big loss. A 5th rounder.  Who cares.  How many 5th rounders ever go on to be anything?

 

But if he was cleared to play (and he has been) its a huge win.

 

Not sure what you are arguing here.

 

Considering you're advocating that we trade for a guy who was drafted in the sixth round...

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

AB was a sixth round draft pick. Lol

[jvan1973]

12 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

most teams fail period.  nothing wrong with going for it, it can work sometimes

When was the last time it worked?

[jvan1973]

19 minutes ago, threeflight said:

Players who have played with him in the past.

Coaches who have coached him.

 

Nothing bad was ever said about the guy until this year.

 

I am not excusing his actions but imo there was a reason for them.  He wanted out of a toxic situation.  A 3rd and a 5th and $5 M more than what we paid Devin Futchess of all people was well worth it.

Vegas oddsmakers seem to agree.

 You understand Vegas odds makers make their offs 5 based on the money bet,   not the actual relevance of the trade,   right?  I bet the patriots are the odds on favorite to win.   What big time FA have they signed in the last 5 years?

[threeflight]

1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

AB was a sixth round draft pick. Lol

 

1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

AB was a sixth round draft pick. Lol

Out of Central Michigan.  Which is about 45 minutes from where I grew up.

 

So just that I understand this, you would not give a 3rd and a 5th for one of the greatest WRs to ever play the game, all because he was drafted in the 6th round 

 

Ok then.

 

I guess you wouldn't want Tom Brady either.

 

 

[aaron11]

Just now, jvan1973 said:

When was the last time it worked?

eagles two years ago.  i even found an article here https://www.nj.com/eagles/2017/03/eagles_2017_nfl_offseason_moves_tracker_and_timeli.html

 

they made more moves than most people seem to remember, and had the least cap space in the league going into the season.  

[NewColtsFan]

22 minutes ago, threeflight said:

What were the facts I ignored?

I said if he is never cleared to play its no big loss. A 5th rounder.  Who cares.  How many 5th rounders ever go on to be anything?

 

But if he was cleared to play (and he has been) its a huge win.

 

Not sure what you are arguing here.

 

FACT:  He's cleared to play and yet 31 teams removed him from their boards.

 

FACT:  You ignored what I wrote,  that the Colts medical team removed Hurst from consideration.  That means the GM does not over-ride that call.    And that Irsay also had a voice in this.   And I know this because both ESPN and NFL Network who cover the draft talked about this during last year's draft.    So even though I've explained Ballard likely couldn't have drafted him even if he had wanted to,  it was out of his hands,  your response has ignored all that.    

 

Opinion over fact.    It's what you do.

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, threeflight said:

 

Out of Central Michigan.  Which is about 45 minutes from where I grew up.

 

So just that I understand this, you would not give a 3rd and a 5th for one of the greatest WRs to ever play the game, all because he was drafted in the 6th round 

 

Ok then.

 

I guess you wouldn't want Tom Brady either.

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, threeflight said:

 

Out of Central Michigan.  Which is about 45 minutes from where I grew up.

 

So just that I understand this, you would not give a 3rd and a 5th for one of the greatest WRs to ever play the game, all because he was drafted in the 6th round 

 

Ok then.

 

I guess you wouldn't want Tom Brady either.

 

 

This was directed at the person above who said a 5th round WR won’t ever do anything in the nfl. AB proves that is not the case.

[threeflight]

5 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

When was the last time it worked?

I don't think anyone is talking about spending 100s of $millions on tons of players.

 

We are talking about adding a game changer or two for a large contract.  If you have to over pay a tad?  Ok...that is called Free agency.  Someone who can take you from a average playoff team to a SB contender.

[mahagga73]

7 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

When was the last time it worked?

Rams , last year.  

[threeflight]

4 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

FACT:  He's cleared to play and yet 31 teams removed him from their boards.

 

FACT:  You ignored what I wrote,  that the Colts medical team removed Hurst from consideration.  That means the GM does not over-ride that call.    And that Irsay also had a voice in this.   And I know this because both ESPN and NFL Network who cover the draft talked about this during last year's draft.    So even though I've explained Ballard likely couldn't have drafted him even if he had wanted to,  it was out of his hands,  your response has ignored all that.    

 

Opinion over fact.    It's what you do.

 

And again, he never had to play.  IF he wasn't cleared when he was drafted then so be it.  Doesn't mean that a year or two down the line he could be cleared to play.

But...the fact is he was cleared to play by UM and did so.

 

The fact is he was cleared to play by the NFL, and did so.

 

Very well in fact.

 

Maybe you should read this article before talking about things you don't know.

 

https://justblogbaby.com/2019/02/16/oakland-raiders-maurice-hurst-graded-top-5-afc-west/

 

False opinion over fact.

 

It's what you do.

 

Very well.

[threeflight]

5 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

 

This was directed at the person above who said a 5th round WR won’t ever do anything in the nfl. AB proves that is not the case.

Ok got it.  

 

That being said, it is a pretty rare occurrence for a 5th rounder to amount to anything let alone become a star.

[mahagga73]

7 hours ago, krunk said:

You guys know damn well when Ballard likes to shop and it ain't when everybody else is throwing their money away.  In a couple days you'll be saying "dang Ballard is signing everything!"

Yeah, he will be making moves soon.  As he said , they assign a monetary value to free agents.  I have to assume none of these guys with their ridiculous contracts fit the bill. 

[threeflight]

13 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

When was the last time it worked?

I would say:

 

Bears

Rams

Saints

Eagles

Patriots of 2017

 

Hell even the Browns spent a ton last year and by the end of the season were playing very very well and are likely to make the playoffs this year.

 

It can work.  And you have to spend it anyway.

 

I would rather over spend on a proven commodity like a Brown or Bell than $13 M for Devin freaking Funchess for crying out loud.

[jvan1973]

1 minute ago, threeflight said:

I would say:

 

Bears

Rams

Saints

Eagles

Patriots of 2017

 

Hell even the Browns spent a ton last year and by the end of the season were playing very very well and are likely to make the playoffs this year.

 

It can work.  And you have to spend it anyway.

 

I would rather over spend on a proven commodity like a Brown or Bell than $13 M for Devin freaking Funchess for crying out loud.

 I'm sure you have spent countless hours scouting funchess.   

 

What big free agents did the patriots sign in 2017?

 

How many Superbowl winners are on your list?     How many are in cap hell now?    It isn't Madden.   Get a grip

13 minutes ago, mahagga73 said:

Rams , last year.  

They got a ring?   

[mahagga73]

1 minute ago, jvan1973 said:

 I'm sure you have spent countless hours scouting funchess.   

 

What big free agents did the patriots sign in 2017?

 

How many Superbowl winners are on your list?     How many are in cap hell now?    It isn't Madden.   Get a grip

They got a ring?   

No, but they got there.  They had their shot , came up short. 

[jvan1973]

17 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

eagles two years ago.  i even found an article here https://www.nj.com/eagles/2017/03/eagles_2017_nfl_offseason_moves_tracker_and_timeli.html

 

they made more moves than most people seem to remember, and had the least cap space in the league going into the season.  

Of those the eagles signed,   how many were big contracts

[jvan1973]

1 minute ago, mahagga73 said:

No, but they got there.  They had their shot , came up short. 

And most are in cap purgatory now.    Smart Gms don't make stupid signings.   Luckily Ballard is mote intelligent than most here

[aaron11]

1 minute ago, jvan1973 said:

Of those the eagles signed,   how many were big contracts

jeffery got a lot, i think it was more than the colts have ever given an outside free agent per year.  foles also got a lot for a back up.  then they signed some mid  and lower level guys, overall they spent quite a bit

[NewColtsFan]

22 minutes ago, threeflight said:

And again, he never had to play.  IF he wasn't cleared when he was drafted then so be it.  Doesn't mean that a year or two down the line he could be cleared to play.

But...the fact is he was cleared to play by UM and did so.

 

The fact is he was cleared to play by the NFL, and did so.

 

Very well in fact.

 

Maybe you should read this article before talking about things you don't know.

 

https://justblogbaby.com/2019/02/16/oakland-raiders-maurice-hurst-graded-top-5-afc-west/

 

False opinion over fact.

 

It's what you do.

 

Very well.

 

He was clearly by the NFL.     And yet 31 teams removed him from consideration.

 

What does that tell you?

 

[GusFring]

Even the Browns are making splashes now. This is like Christmas when your friends get videogames and cool bikes, and you get socks and a stupid sweater. 

[NewColtsFan]

3 hours ago, aaron11 said:

Revis , Gilmore and moss to name a few.  It does pay to be aggressive sometimes.  They never sit on 100 million$ ever

 

The Rams had a lot too and they got pretty far.  The jags had spent a lot last year when they made a run

 

We talked about this yesterday.     Moss was NOT a FA signing.    He was a trade.    Not the same thing.

 

And the two you mentioned are not "to name a few"....   because there aren't many more over a span of 20 years.      The ones you named are the exceptions to the rule.    Generally speaking, the Pats do not spend big on free agency.    They do what Ballard does...   shop for bargains in the low and mid-priced players.

 

The Pats are practically the ones who invented getting the most comp picks.   I believe they've been awarded more comp picks than any other team.    That's because they let their high priced guys walk,  and buy much cheaper guys.

 

If you've got other high priced examples,  feel free to post them.   But I think you're going to struggle to find them.

 

[threeflight]

16 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

 I'm sure you have spent countless hours scouting funchess.   

 

What big free agents did the patriots sign in 2017?

 

How many Superbowl winners are on your list?     How many are in cap hell now?    It isn't Madden.   Get a grip

They got a ring?   

Pats spent $126 M in 2017.  I would say a SB appearance that year and a SB win the next is pretty good validation am I right?

 

The Rams making it to the SB but not winning it isn't good enough for you?  That is justification for not spending money in free agency?

 

SB win or bust?

 

Ok.

[aaron11]

2 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

We talked about this yesterday.     Moss was NOT a FA signing.    He was a trade.    Not the same thing.

 

And the two you mentioned are not "to name a few"....   because there aren't many more over a span of 20 years.      The ones you named are the exceptions to the rule.    Generally speaking, the Pats do not spend big on free agency.    They do what Ballard does...   shop for bargains in the low and mid-priced players.

 

The Pats are practically the ones who invented getting the most comp picks.   I believe they've been awarded more comp picks than any other team.    That's because they let their high priced guys walk,  and buy much cheaper guys.

 

If you've got other high priced examples,  feel free to post them.   But I think you're going to struggle to find them.

 

they dont spend a lot every year because they usually dont have much cap space.  they spend it when they do have it, and certainly dont hang on to 100 million 

 

i bring up moss because it was a sign and trade, that was a lot of money back then 

[threeflight]

13 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

And most are in cap purgatory now.    Smart Gms don't make stupid signings.   Luckily Ballard is mote intelligent than most here

Curious...just how much does your man love for Ballard go?

 

Give me examples at your home for example.  

[NewColtsFan]

28 minutes ago, threeflight said:

And again, he never had to play.  IF he wasn't cleared when he was drafted then so be it.  Doesn't mean that a year or two down the line he could be cleared to play.

But...the fact is he was cleared to play by UM and did so.

 

The fact is he was cleared to play by the NFL, and did so.

 

Very well in fact.

 

Maybe you should read this article before talking about things you don't know.

 

https://justblogbaby.com/2019/02/16/oakland-raiders-maurice-hurst-graded-top-5-afc-west/

 

False opinion over fact.

 

It's what you do.

 

Very well.

 

There was nothing in the article that infomed me of anything.    I knew everything that was in the story.      Nothing new.    

 

All it does is reinforce your opinion.    SURPRISE!!  

 

It says Hurst was good.     I knew that.

 

Says Hurst was cleared by the NFL.    I knew that.

 

It says nothing about why the other 31 teams took him off their boards.     It does nothing to make your argument strong.    

 

FanBay talk.      It's what you do.

 

[threeflight]

8 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

He was clearly by the NFL.     And yet 31 teams removed him from consideration.

 

What does that tell you?

 

It tells me 31 teams (if that is even true) weren't smart enough.

 

The Raiders were.

 

I am not a huge Gruden fan but I like they way they are going.  Going to be good just in time for Vegas.
 

And their GM is smart smart smart.  And he seems to have zero issue spending money and trading for quality players.

[threeflight]

4 minutes ago, GusFring said:

Even the Browns are making splashes now. This is like Christmas when your friends get videogames and cool bikes, and you get socks and a stupid sweater. 

Yup.

 

But we can't because of culture and 'reasons'.

 

I surely hope we do not look back at this time in Lucks career and $100 M in cap space and wonder what if.

[NewColtsFan]

1 minute ago, aaron11 said:

they dont spend a lot every year because they usually dont have much cap space.  they spend it when they do have it, and certainly dont hang on to 100 million 

 

i bring up moss because it was a sign and trade, that was a lot of money back then 

 

1 minute ago, aaron11 said:

they dont spend a lot every year because they usually dont have much cap space.  they spend it when they do have it, and certainly dont hang on to 100 million 

 

i bring up moss because it was a sign and trade, that was a lot of money back then 

 

I'm sorry.    Not trying to be difficult.    But I believe the part about Cap Space is false too.

 

They typically have tons of space.    Belichick is famous for being tight with money and having plenty of space.     He wins without having to spend very much money.   

 

If you find something that shows otherwise,  please link it here.    I'd love to see that.

 

[csmopar]

9 hours ago, GusFring said:

Zero excitement around what should be an exciting time. Not 1 big splash. Not 1. I just don't know what to say.

I’m just gonna say this... 1070 the fan poll shows 84 percent approve of Colts FA thus far...

[threeflight]

3 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

they dont spend a lot every year because they usually dont have much cap space.  they spend it when they do have it, and certainly dont hang onto 100 million 

 

i bring up moss because it was a sign and trade, that was a lot of money back then 

I think it is useless to try to explain this to certain people.

 

It's either kiss Ballard's feet or be attacked apparently.

[aaron11]

3 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

 

I'm sorry.    Not trying to be difficult.    But I believe the part about Cap Space is false too.

 

They typically have tons of space.    Belichick is famous for being tight with money and having plenty of space.     He wins without having to spend very much money.   

 

If you find something that shows otherwise,  please link it here.    I'd love to see that.

 

i'll let you look for that one lol

 

i can tell you they didnt have much space left last year

[threeflight]

4 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

There was nothing in the article that infomed me of anything.    I knew everything that was in the story.      Nothing new.    

 

All it does is reinforce your opinion.    SURPRISE!!  

 

It says Hurst was good.     I knew that.

 

Says Hurst was cleared by the NFL.    I knew that.

 

It says nothing about why the other 31 teams took him off their boards.     It does nothing to make your argument strong.    

 

FanBay talk.      It's what you do.

 

So a top ten talent who is in the fifth round, who played full time at U-M, and who was cleared by the NFL, isn't worth taking in the fifth round to you?

 

Ok then.  No harm.  To me he was.  Apparently to the Raiders as well.