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Colts sign Devin Funchess (Merge)

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1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

That's true, but that doesn't mean we have to spend it. And it certainly doesn't mean we have to give it to players like Funchess.

 

I mean... if it has to be spent one way or the other.... I don't see why not bring in a player like Funchess for it? It'll be dead money either way. 

 

So the fact that it is just a 1 year $10m deal means it isnt really that big an issue. I get that it is probably more than Funchess deserved, but at this point with money that is probably being spent either way..... meh....

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13 hours ago, Superman said:

 

 

He was a second rounder. And he hasn't lived up to that selection, either. But that's not my problem. 

 

My problem is I think we could have signed a better receiver for the same -- actually, less -- money. And that's my opinion of this player and his fit for the team, vs the rest of the market and their fit for the team. 

 

But even if I liked the player, and the price, the 'we have a lot of cap space' argument falls short. As Doc Brown always told Marty McFly: You're not thinking fourth dimensionally. You don't determine a player's value on the basis of how much cap space you have. Just like you don't determine how much you're going to pay for gas on the basis of how much extra money you have. Gas has value; you don't pay an extra forty cents/gallon just because you had a few extra bucks.

 

And of course I defer to Ballard and Reich and their staffs, but this doesn't fit my thoughts on what we needed, and what we should have paid.

I think you're right on the fourth dimension bit (not the band).  If I'm Ballard I go ahead and secure a need pre-draft so I'm not held hostage to drafting a receiver which I don't really want to do (at least not in desperation).  This is a D-Line draft and Ballard is pretty transparent about wanting DLineman.  This to me takes Harry off the board as a first-rounder and frees up Ballard on draft day at basically zero risk in a one-year deal, if Funchess performs, great and if he doesn't we move on.  So, my hunch is this is about draft flexibility in some ways.

 

I'm not in love with the deal mind you, but I think I get it.  He's also looking to the future, we have cornerstone guys we need to re-sign next year as well, so we as fans need to understand some of the bigger picture at play here.  All the conversations so far are 'need receiver/pay receiver' and I think Ballard is playing more chess than checkers at the moment and I'm really good with that.

 

All that said, if we spend long term real money somewhere it will be at pass rusher not receiver.

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4 minutes ago, Chucklez said:

 

I mean... if it has to be spent one way or the other.... I don't see why not bring in a player like Funchess for it? It'll be dead money either way. 

 

So the fact that it is just a 1 year $10m deal means it isnt really that big an issue. I get that it is probably more than Funchess deserved, but at this point with money that is probably being spent either way..... meh....

 

My thing is, if we're going to pay a premium, how about pay it for a premium player? 

 

This 'we had to spend money' thing isn't a defense for a questionable signing. It's not the end of the world; even if they paid him double what the next team was offering, $5m isn't going to make or break this team now or next year. But it's still questionable.

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3 minutes ago, Rally5 said:

This is a D-Line draft and Ballard is pretty transparent about wanting DLineman.  This to me takes Harry off the board as a first-rounder and frees up Ballard on draft day at basically zero risk in a one-year deal, if Funchess performs, great and if he doesn't we move on. 

 

It's as much of a WR draft as it is a DL draft, and I actually like the WR value on Day 2 better than the DL value on Day 1.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

It's as much of a WR draft as it is a DL draft, and I actually like the WR value on Day 2 better than the DL value on Day 1.

 

 

 

Soo... why are we against a 1 year deal with incentives for Funchess again? We all know it takes receivers a year or two before they produce like true WR1 and WR2 players... 

 

Could it be Ballard's plan?

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5 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

It's as much of a WR draft as it is a DL draft, and I actually like the WR value on Day 2 better than the DL value on Day 1.

 

 

My hunch is Ballard agrees with you and that's part of the Funchess signing.  Funchess is a 10M insurance policy in case the draft doesn't fall the way he expects and there's no receivers in R2 or R3 that meet the WR2 standard.

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It's a 1 year $10 mill prove it or goodbye. We all love Ballard, best draft class of 2018 in based on one deal you don't trust him?

 

Get a grip and let's cheer for him to succeed

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14 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

Soo... why are we against a 1 year deal with incentives for Funchess again? We all know it takes receivers a year or two before they produce like true WR1 and WR2 players... 

 

Could it be Ballard's plan?

 

Two reasons I'm not a fan:

 

1) Funchess doesn't fit my ideal for what I think the offense needs. (And to be fair, maybe he does, and I don't see it.)

2) I don't think the market justifies what we're reportedly giving him.

 

And as a point of slight disagreement, not every receiver takes a year or two to produce. Christian Kirk (one of my favorites last year) and Antonio Callaway as rookies both produced similar to how Funchess produced in his fourth year.

 

7 minutes ago, indyagent17 said:

It's a 1 year $10 mill prove it or goodbye. We all love Ballard, best draft class of 2018 in based on one deal you don't trust him?

 

Get a grip and let's cheer for him to succeed

 

Just because I don't like the deal doesn't mean I'm not cheering for him to succeed.

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I mentioned Funchess a lot as a potential target for us this offseason.  I'm shocked at how much negativity bringing him in on a 1 year deal has created.  I actually think a 1 year deal is perfect.  It gives Cain a year to develop without the pressure of being the WR2 behind TY but it also gives Cain a target (in Funchess) of a guy that he can surpass and supplant maybe even next year.

 

It was surprising to hear about Devin's drops last year but wasn't Ebron known for the same thing until we brought him in???  And looking at some of the game tape of Funchess that guys have posted on this thread it's quite apparent to me how Luck and Frank will use him.  He will see a lot of back shoulder throws, deep ins, and post corner routes. 

 

Also he will get a lot of red zone work.  I expect to see him get a lot of work on double moves in the red zone like Inman ate up the Texans with in the playoff game.  That seems to be his specialty.  Luck will get the most out of him and I wouldn't at all be surprised if that resulted in double digit touchdowns.  If everything falls just right, Luck will throw for 40 more TD's and could flirt with 50 next season. 

 

Not a bad signing at all.  And if AJ Brown is still there when the pick we got from the Jets comes up, I expect us to draft him with it.  I see us using our first rounder on defense.  CB or DL.

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48 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

That's true, but that doesn't mean we have to spend it. And it certainly doesn't mean we have to give it to players like Funchess.

 

These guys-

 

Kevin Rogers  - Director of Pro Personnel
Todd Vasvari - Senior Player Personnel Scout
Jon Shaw - Assistant Director of Pro Scouting
Joey Elliott - Pro Scout
Brian Decker - Director of Player Development

 

I want to know who (and how many within that group) pounded the table, and convinced Reich/Ballard to look at tape and see if they see what he/they see in Funchess, and how he fits and Reich/Sirianni can use him? 

 

I know for fact Chris didn't say-  'Hey fans want a WR, so let me put my finger down on one on this receiver list and see what name comes up.' And I know they looked at tape (good and bad) before making an offer.  And did the agent convince them to go up with other teams potential offers?

 

I can't wait for the next press conference for his reasoning.  He is not without reasoning and a plan.  I thought it was a bit rich for even for first wave FA, and Ballard is not loose with the cap space. So...

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9 minutes ago, Smoke317 said:

I mentioned Funchess a lot as a potential target for us this offseason.  I'm shocked at how much negativity bringing him in on a 1 year deal has created.  I actually think a 1 year deal is perfect.  It gives Cain a year to develop without the pressure of being the WR2 behind TY but it also gives Cain a target (in Funchess) of a guy that he can surpass and supplant maybe even next year.

 

It was surprising to hear about Devin's drops last year but wasn't Ebron known for the same thing until we brought him in???  And looking at some of the game tape of Funchess that guys have posted on this thread it's quite apparent to me how Luck and Frank will use him.  He will see a lot of back shoulder throws, deep ins, and post corner routes. 

 

Also he will get a lot of red zone work.  I expect to see him get a lot of work on double moves in the red zone like Inman ate up the Texans with in the playoff game.  That seems to be his specialty.  Luck will get the most out of him and I wouldn't at all be surprised if that resulted in double digit touchdowns.  If everything falls just right, Luck will throw for 40 more TD's and could flirt with 50 next season. 

 

Not a bad signing at all.  And if AJ Brown is still there when the pick we got from the Jets comes up, I expect us to draft him with it.  I see us using our first rounder on defense.  CB or DL.

I tend to agree with this post. 

1. Funchess will have a better QB throwing to him. That will help.

 

2. He will be playing in a more diverse offense, and that will help. 

 

3. There isn't a long term commitment here. You have to believe that Ballard wasn't thrilled with the long term options in FA, and took what he felt was the smarter path. If this guy busts out, he'll be more than worth it, with the chance to re-sign him. If not, they move on. 

 

4. They will be in a better position to move on if: 1) Cain or one of the other  youngsters shows up; and 2) if the WR I believe they will draft Day 2 proves to be as good as hoped. And as to that WR draft pick: I expect AJ Brown to be gone by the Colts' first round pick. Look for Parris Campbell at #34. Electric. 

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Someone at Stampede Blue has a film room mini study on Funchess-

 

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2019/3/12/18260983/film-room-what-does-new-colts-receiver-devin-funchess-bring-to-the-team?utm_campaign=stampedeblue&utm_content=chorus&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

 

His conclusion-

 

"Devin Funchess is a good fit in the Colts offense as their number two receiver. His route running, strength, and ability to catch away from his frame are the perfect make up for what Coach Reich looks for in his offense. Add in that he can also be a valuable red zone threat and I really like the fit. He does struggle with smaller details such creating after the catch, drops, and run blocking but those are areas to work on as a role player."

 

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19 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

These guys-

 

Kevin Rogers  - Director of Pro Personnel
Todd Vasvari - Senior Player Personnel Scout
Jon Shaw - Assistant Director of Pro Scouting
Joey Elliott - Pro Scout
Brian Decker - Director of Player Development

 

I want to know who (and how many within that group) pounded the table, and convinced Reich/Ballard to look at tape and see if they see what he/they see in Funchess, and how he fits and Reich/Sirianni can use him? 

 

I know for fact Chris didn't say-  'Hey fans want a WR, so let me put my finger down on one on this receiver list and see what name comes up.' And I know they looked at tape (good and bad) before making an offer.  And did the agent convince them to go up with other teams potential offers?

 

I can't wait for the next press conference for his reasoning.  He is not without reasoning and a plan.  I thought it was a bit rich for even for first wave FA, and Ballard is not loose with the cap space. So...

Good post.  I don't think you'll get the full open heart confessional at the presser either as I suspect Funchess (as previously stated) is an insurance policy with a high premium.  He's not a long term solution (right now) or it wouldn't be a 1 yr deal.  Ballard can't say that...

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4 minutes ago, Hoose said:

I tend to agree with this post. 

1. Funchess will have a better QB throwing to him. That will help.

 

2. He will be playing in a more diverse offense, and that will help. 

 

3. There isn't a long term commitment here. You have to believe that Ballard wasn't thrilled with the long term options in FA, and took what he felt was the smarter path. If this guy busts out, he'll be more than worth it, with the chance to re-sign him. If not, they move on. 

 

4. They will be in a better position to move on if: 1) Cain or one of the other  youngsters shows up; and 2) if the WR I believe they will draft Day 2 proves to be as good as hoped. And as to that WR draft pick: I expect AJ Brown to be gone by the Colts' first round pick. Look for Parris Campbell at #34. Electric. 

I agree with your post, except for the second to last sentence in your point #3.

 

I personally believe that if Funchess plays well this year, he will essentially price himself out of Ballard's range. The odds are, this is very much a 1-year signing.

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6 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

I agree with your post, except for the second to last sentence in your point #3.

 

I personally believe that if Funchess plays well this year, he will essentially price himself out of Ballard's range. The odds are, this is very much a 1-year signing.

If he comes in and works hard and has a great  season Ballard will pay him because he helped our team.  The only thing that could maybe give Ballard pause is if Cain and fountain turn into great receivers. If Cain turns out to be as good as advertised and Funchess has a great season imagine what our receiving core would look like with Hilton, Cain , and Funchess for the future. He also seems like a great kid. In the interview I watched from a few days ago the first thing out of his mouth was winning a SB.

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32 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

I want to know who (and how many within that group) pounded the table, and convinced Reich/Ballard to look at tape and see if they see what he/they see in Funchess, and how he fits and Reich/Sirianni can use him? 

 

 

I agree with the spirit of the post, but I don't think any of those guys in the brain trust said 'Chris, overshoot the market for this guy by 40%, we have to have him!'

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It costs more to rent than own.  Always has always will.  Yet...

 

Some assets are better to rent than own.  We’re renting this one.

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Think will be shocked now if don’t draft a WR in R1 or R2.

 

Think some of the hate on the move is overblown.  It’s a lot of money no doubt at max value considering his past record, but risk is completely mitigated.  If he blows up to exceeding value greatly, can lock it up.  It matches value and Colts decide to let walk, comp pick potential.    

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3 hours ago, JPFolks said:

Do you know what their differences were in the combine? Also, I don't even see the straight line speed.  

https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/alshon-jefferyh

https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/devin-funchess

 

this site has Funchess 40 time slower then the 4.47 but if you google the 4.47 is the first time you see interesting  This could also explain what you see on tape 

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1 hour ago, Smoke317 said:

I mentioned Funchess a lot as a potential target for us this offseason.  I'm shocked at how much negativity bringing him in on a 1 year deal has created.  I actually think a 1 year deal is perfect.  It gives Cain a year to develop without the pressure of being the WR2 behind TY but it also gives Cain a target (in Funchess) of a guy that he can surpass and supplant maybe even next year.

 

It was surprising to hear about Devin's drops last year but wasn't Ebron known for the same thing until we brought him in???  And looking at some of the game tape of Funchess that guys have posted on this thread it's quite apparent to me how Luck and Frank will use him.  He will see a lot of back shoulder throws, deep ins, and post corner routes. 

 

Also he will get a lot of red zone work.  I expect to see him get a lot of work on double moves in the red zone like Inman ate up the Texans with in the playoff game.  That seems to be his specialty.  Luck will get the most out of him and I wouldn't at all be surprised if that resulted in double digit touchdowns.  If everything falls just right, Luck will throw for 40 more TD's and could flirt with 50 next season. 

 

Not a bad signing at all.  And if AJ Brown is still there when the pick we got from the Jets comes up, I expect us to draft him with it.  I see us using our first rounder on defense.  CB or DL.

You get it just like I get it!!! And I'm glad you mentioned Deon Cain in this mix.

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Look, there is no chance in hell that Funchess isn’t what HC Reich ordered (or amongst those WR he wanted). This is isn’t a random WR that Ballard just went shopping for.

 

So I will trust that Reich have a plan for him.

 

What makes me uncomfortable is that this team really needs a quality #2 WR and the fact that Funchess is only a one year deal implies that we are not really sure about his talent.

 

That is not good enough IMO, I would like a solution that we have faith in and that Luck can create chemistry with for years.

 

Sure, Funchess could work out, but you don’t get that warm fuzzy feeling that we nailed it. More like a gamble.

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4 hours ago, Flash7 said:

I agree with your post, except for the second to last sentence in your point #3.

 

I personally believe that if Funchess plays well this year, he will essentially price himself out of Ballard's range. The odds are, this is very much a 1-year signing.

If that ends up being the case then Ballard was right.

We have no clue what Funchess mindset will be this time next year so lets not get ahead of the situation.

 

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Colin Cowherd

@ColinCowherd

·

22h

Colts offense got better. Devin Funchess w Andrew Luck is not inconsistent Devin Funchess w Cam Newton. Everyone gets that, right? #duh

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18 hours ago, akcolt said:

Funchess 4.47 40 Alshon 4.48 

Funchess ran an electronic 4.7 twice at the combine. UM Pro Day had him 4.47 and 4.53. Keep in mind that College Pro Days have been historically very "generous" to their players. There's a reason that 90+% of players turn out better time at Pro Days than the NFL Combine.

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I think the question every one is thinking is is funchess with luck going to be as good as Beckham  or brown with Luck. The answer is most likely no. We want that wr that can catch 15 plus tds in a season.

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10 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

Funchess ran an electronic 4.7 twice at the combine. UM Pro Day had him 4.47 and 4.53. Keep in mind that College Pro Days have been historically very "generous" to their players. There's a reason that 90+% of players turn out better time at Pro Days than the NFL Combine.

His 40 time is not my concern. Can he catch and get separation. 

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18 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't have to sell.       I'm not a fan of the signing.    I'm not a fan of Funchess.

 

I ***am*** a fan of Ballard's.     He's earned it and then some.     I don't think he has anything to apologize for.     He's not perfect,  and he owns his mistakes.    Which is more than most GM's do.

 

You Bill Belichick,  the defensive mastermind,  has a relatively low success rates on drafting defensive backs.    Plenty of quality picks of his have flamed out.    It's been written about.

 

Everyone makes mistakes in the personnel game.    It comes with the job.

 

When Ballard starts making bigger mistakes and not just little mistakes,  then we'll have something to talk about.     Otherwise,  this barely registers on my meter.

 

Again.    Not a fan of Funchess.    Not a fan of the signing.   But I admire Ballard and so should all of us and with good reasoning.

 

I love Ballard. He's a F'ing rock star coming off of last year's draft. Doesn't mean I have to like everything he does. To me, it doesn't fill the WR2 need, and spending top 20 WR money on a guy 81st in production is silly. I wasn't a fan of some of the higher dollar and longer term options (like TW), but at least that would have filled a need, and had better production. 

 

I really hope this works out. Even if he only hits 800 yards, I'll be very happy. 800 yards is top 30ish money. 1000 yards is top 20 money, which is what we are paying him. But if he hits that, he's actually getting paid top 15 money (which top 15 production is 1200).

 

In short, I think he'll improve simply by getting better balls thrown to him. But, his snap count and opportunity are a huge question marks. If we just end up lowering Ebron's snap count or production to get DF more balls, it's not really a plus.

 

If he works out at the true WR2, I'll be very happy. I certainly won't be cheering against him, I just don't think he hits 800+ while not taking away production from Ebron.

 

 

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33 minutes ago, Stephen said:

His 40 time is not my concern. Can he catch and get separation. 

his stats say he drops it a lot (going back to even his college days). his advanced states aren't all that good relative to separation.

 

i just hope luck throwing him balls helps improve in both of those areas. i just don't want to move production from Ebron to Funchess. I want Funchess to get true WR2 production, and help keep TY out of double coverage.

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7 hours ago, Nate! said:

Think will be shocked now if don’t draft a WR in R1 or R2.

 

Think some of the hate on the move is overblown.  It’s a lot of money no doubt at max value considering his past record, but risk is completely mitigated.  If he blows up to exceeding value greatly, can lock it up.  It matches value and Colts decide to let walk, comp pick potential.    

 

I'll be an unhappy camper too, as most will be I'd bet. 

 

If they get a true WR2 in the draft, that can extend the D, and take double coverage off TY, nobody will care about the money spent on Funchess. 

 

7 hours ago, ztboiler said:

It costs more to rent than own.  Always has always will.  Yet...

 

Some assets are better to rent than own.  We’re renting this one.

 

yup. 20-30% premium on 1 year rental deals. 

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You cant tell me Luck cant do some damage with this guy.

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33 minutes ago, krunk said:

You cant tell me Luck cant do some damage with this guy.

Plus he is a 20 yo rookie in some of those highlights. 

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I'm not a huge Funchess fan, but I get it.  The Colts need help at WR, and he's a big, even if slow, target.  Even if he can only help in the red zone, anything will help.  But I still believe the Colts may not be done in FA yet and I think they could still draft one or two.  And they do potentially have Cain coming back as well.

 

Not the signing I was hoping for, but I'm not convinced Ballard is done yet either.

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And for the slot im really hoping Ballard drafts Pariss Campbell. I believe thats where hes going. I think he has great size for a slot guy to go along with the blazing speed. Hes a smooth runner after the catch who can pick up yards in a hurry. I also think he can do more than the slot. Another tough matchup player.

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Just read a article in the Athletic that really makes me like this guy. Sorry I can’t link it. He turned down a two year deal because he wanted to play for the colts. He is taking a big risk here and betting on himself.  We need guys that want to play for this team.

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10 hours ago, krunk said:

And for the slot im really hoping Ballard drafts Pariss Campbell. I believe thats where hes going. I think he has great size for a slot guy to go along with the blazing speed. Hes a smooth runner after the catch who can pick up yards in a hurry. I also think he can do more than the slot. Another tough matchup player.

 

I'll take it.

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After having read the pages and pages about this signing, filtering out the usual "noise", I think IMO I'm ok with the signing if we're talking ability/potential. I do think we overpaid, but it sounds like there was a competitive market for him out there. 

 

What I really don't like is the one year nature of the deal, as @Superman has said, outside the obvious that he might have a mega season, there's no real upside here. If the reports of him refusing multi-year deals elsewhere are true it does seem he/his agent have a firm plan to maximise his value for the next round of FA. I don't think we can expect any form of home town discount if he balls out next year. 

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Here what I like about what Ballard did with funchess. He has to earn his way into a contract with the colts after next year. He is going to work hard. Instead of just handing  a player like Williams a four year deal we are making Funchess earn it. This is very ballard like. He wants players to earn their way onto this team. That is exactly what funchess is doing. He doesn’t like to hand out contracts to players who haven’t earned their way onto the colts.


 

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Ballard has always been about competition. Let Funchess, Cain, a draft pick and maybe Inman battle it out for the number 2 wideout spot.

 

I believe that's what we tried doing last year with guys like Rogers, Grant and Cain, but the latter got injured and the former two just aren't good enough to be NFL number 2s. 

 

But the four I listed above (assuming we draft someone and resign Inman), would all either have experience (Inman), upside (draft pick and Cain), or both (Funchess). So lets see how it goes.

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