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Doyle is out until training camp


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Just now, pacolts56 said:

In light of this information.... I wouldn’t complain if we took T.J. Hockenson early on, unless one of the top 3-tech DTs drop.

If TJ Hockenson is there he'd be by far the best player available. He's a stud and can do all the dirty work Doyle does and more. I'd be all for it but I think he'll shoot up the boards after the combine.

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31 minutes ago, MacDee1975 said:

 

Why?  It said out until training camp, not out for the season.

Or he could wind up like Dennis Pitta.... hip injuries suck and sometimes become chronic. 

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2017/06/07/ravens-release-te-dennis-pitta-after-third-hip-injury/102594226/

 

IMO.... if Hockenson is available at the #26 spot and the top 3-tech DTs are off the board... he’s as good a choice as any. 

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12 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Elderly people recover from hip replacement surgery pretty fast.  He's a professional athlete.  There is a long way to go until camp.  I'm not worried.  

 

Not so fun fact, after hip surgeries, mortality rates in older adults surge to about 25% within the first year following the injury. It’s a pretty straightforward and common procedure, but most “elderly people” are never the same afterward. 

 

That being said, it’s Jack-freaking-Doyle, and I’m also not worried. :) 

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2 hours ago, pacolts56 said:

Or he could wind up like Dennis Pitta.... hip injuries suck and sometimes become chronic. 

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2017/06/07/ravens-release-te-dennis-pitta-after-third-hip-injury/102594226/

 

IMO.... if Hockenson is available at the #26 spot and the top 3-tech DTs are off the board... he’s as good a choice as any. 

 

Or he could recover 100%.

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7 hours ago, pacolts56 said:

In light of this information.... I wouldn’t complain if we took T.J. Hockenson early on, unless one of the top 3-tech DTs drop.

Uh... no way....  hat's the definition of a luxury pick, even if Doyle is hurt....  jmo

 

That said, Doyle has to be the most over-rated Colt by fans of the team, it's almost like he's a Pacer the way Indy folks overrate him... lol..... He's a decent TE, but man.... you'd think he was a more durable, and dependable, better route-running, better blocking, more sure handed version of the Poor Man's Jack Doyle...... Rob Gronkowski on these boards... lol

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52 minutes ago, Shafty138 said:

Uh... no way....  hat's the definition of a luxury pick, even if Doyle is hurt....  jmo

 

That said, Doyle has to be the most over-rated Colt by fans of the team, it's almost like he's a Pacer the way Indy folks overrate him... lol..... He's a decent TE, but man.... you'd think he was a more durable, and dependable, better route-running, better blocking, more sure handed version of the Poor Man's Jack Doyle...... Rob Gronkowski on these boards... lol

Either him or clayton geathers lol

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I find it interesting and also confusing....    Jack Doyle, the Colts starting Tight End is out and won't be available until camp opens in Late July.

 

Fans here are worried that he might ever be the same.     OK,  fair concern.

 

But let's remember,  that Jack Doyle was himself an UnDrafted Free Agent.    And worked his way into being a starter.     A good starter.

 

And to replace him,  some here are recommending that we use our FIRST ROUND DRAFT PICK to replace an Undrafted Free Agent.     I think Tight End is an important position.   I don't think it's the equal to cornerback.     But the First Round Pick?       There's no part of me that wants to use a first round pick on a tight end.    Not at this stage of Ballard's rebuilding project. 

 

How about using the first round pick (and maybe even pick 34) on defensive lineman.    Positions that are critical for the success of Ballard's defense.    Especially since it's a draft that is unusually heavy in high quality defensive lineman.     I think some where are just over-thinking this.

 

No need to use a 1st on a tight end.   There are other priorities.

 

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TY is our star, Ebron is our TD machine, the running backs (specifically Hines) are good for chunk plays and screens and flats, but no one else on our roster is a proven and reliable chain mover like Doyle.

 

When he went out, even though we kept winning, you could see the negative effect. Couldn’t buy a first down against Jacksonville or KC. Had stretches where the offense straight up got shut out (6 straight quarters vs Jacksonville, the second half in WC game vs Houston, first half vs KC etc). 

 

This offense without him is still good. But with him, it’s more consistent, and one step closer to being elite.

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7 hours ago, Shafty138 said:

Uh... no way....  hat's the definition of a luxury pick, even if Doyle is hurt....  jmo

 

That said, Doyle has to be the most over-rated Colt by fans of the team, it's almost like he's a Pacer the way Indy folks overrate him... lol..... He's a decent TE, but man.... you'd think he was a more durable, and dependable, better route-running, better blocking, more sure handed version of the Poor Man's Jack Doyle...... Rob Gronkowski on these boards... lol

Over rated?  I guess you never watched him play?

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You take the best player available for the draft. I wouldn't be thinking about taking a TE just yet because we're not even sure how the players will fall yet. I believe Doyle will still play at a high level for us, just needs to heal and most likely take it easy during training camp.

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16 hours ago, pacolts56 said:

Or he could wind up like Dennis Pitta.... hip injuries suck and sometimes become chronic. 

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2017/06/07/ravens-release-te-dennis-pitta-after-third-hip-injury/102594226/

 

IMO.... if Hockenson is available at the #26 spot and the top 3-tech DTs are off the board... he’s as good a choice as any. 

Pitta fractured and dislocated his hip. Considering Doyle played again after his hip injury I don't think his injury is quite as severe.

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9 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I find it interesting and also confusing....    Jack Doyle, the Colts starting Tight End is out and won't be available until camp opens in Late July.

 

Fans here are worried that he might ever be the same.     OK,  fair concern.

 

But let's remember,  that Jack Doyle was himself an UnDrafted Free Agent.    And worked his way into being a starter.     A good starter.

 

And to replace him,  some here are recommending that we use our FIRST ROUND DRAFT PICK to replace an Undrafted Free Agent.     I think Tight End is an important position.   I don't think it's the equal to cornerback.     But the First Round Pick?       There's no part of me that wants to use a first round pick on a tight end.    Not at this stage of Ballard's rebuilding project. 

 

How about using the first round pick (and maybe even pick 34) on defensive lineman.    Positions that are critical for the success of Ballard's defense.    Especially since it's a draft that is unusually heavy in high quality defensive lineman.     I think some where are just over-thinking this.

 

No need to use a 1st on a tight end.   There are other priorities.

 

 

Several issues.  

 

1. It took several years for Doyle to develop into a starting TE.  

2. Just because we found a gem in Doyle does not mean we are likely to be able to replace his production with another UDFA.  There is luck involved in that.

3. The offense uses the TE's a great deal.   So it might be important to the offense that we have a couple good starters.

4. Both Doyle and Ebron have their contracts run out after this year.  Doyle will hit 30 in the 2020 season.  Ebron on the other hand if he see's production like he did last season will likely be pushing for a big contract that I'm not personally sure that he is worth.  

 

I'm not saying we have to get a TE in the first round but there is some reasoning in the idea.  

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5 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Several issues.  

 

1. It took several years for Doyle to develop into a starting TE.  

2. Just because we found a gem in Doyle does not mean we are likely to be able to replace his production with another UDFA.  There is luck involved in that.

3. The offense uses the TE's a great deal.   So it might be important to the offense that we have a couple good starters.

4. Both Doyle and Ebron have their contracts run out after this year.  Doyle will hit 30 in the 2020 season.  Ebron on the other hand if he see's production like he did last season will likely be pushing for a big contract that I'm not personally sure that he is worth.  

 

I'm not saying we have to get a TE in the first round but there is some reasoning in the idea.  

 

Good post.

 

And I agree to every point.   

 

Again, I recognize that tight end is important to our offense.    And perhaps we use pick 59 or pick 89?

 

I was just trying to cool the idea of using pick 26 or 34.    That’s all I was trying to suggest.

 

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12 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Good post.

 

And I agree to every point.   

 

Again, I recognize that tight end is important to our offense.    And perhaps we use pick 59 or pick 89?

 

I was just trying to cool the idea of using pick 26 or 34.    That’s all I was trying to suggest.

 

 

I would think that there would be defensive positions that would be a higher priority.  

 

But Best player available that makes sense I'm not totally opposed to a TE if that's the best player available that makes sense.  

 

 

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22 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Several issues.  

 

1. It took several years for Doyle to develop into a starting TE.  

2. Just because we found a gem in Doyle does not mean we are likely to be able to replace his production with another UDFA.  There is luck involved in that.

3. The offense uses the TE's a great deal.   So it might be important to the offense that we have a couple good starters.

4. Both Doyle and Ebron have their contracts run out after this year.  Doyle will hit 30 in the 2020 season.  Ebron on the other hand if he see's production like he did last season will likely be pushing for a big contract that I'm not personally sure that he is worth.  

 

I'm not saying we have to get a TE in the first round but there is some reasoning in the idea.  

Totally agree!!!!  And I don't even think we have this surplus of tight ends like other people speak about.   I think we have 2 good TE and that is Ebron and Doyle.  And personally I think we could stand to start looking for an upgrade on Doyle.  I certainly think Hochenson would represent that. I am not clamoring for us to get him, but if CB did it wouldn't take me long to accept the pick. 

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Thankfully there are a number of TE's that will be available in rd 4-5 that remind of Doyle. And YES we need to draft his replacement now because it will Likely take the guy into year 2-3 to develop all the skills that Jack has.
 Mo Allie is a very valuable as a in-line blocker, and his receiving should improve.
 And baring injury, i don't see Hewitt on the 53.

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10 hours ago, Shafty138 said:

Uh... no way....  hat's the definition of a luxury pick, even if Doyle is hurt....  jmo

 

That said, Doyle has to be the most over-rated Colt by fans of the team, it's almost like he's a Pacer the way Indy folks overrate him... lol..... He's a decent TE, but man.... you'd think he was a more durable, and dependable, better route-running, better blocking, more sure handed version of the Poor Man's Jack Doyle...... Rob Gronkowski on these boards... lol

What does the Pacer reference mean?    

He's been pretty durable.   He is a very good blocker.   He is a very good route runner.   He's got great hands.   He has great character.    What's not to like. 

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41 minutes ago, Myles said:

What does the Pacer reference mean?    

He's been pretty durable.   He is a very good blocker.   He is a very good route runner.   He's got great hands.   He has great character.    What's not to like. 

Oh, sorry....   Firstly, I am fine with Doyle as a player, he's been the epitome of solid....  It's his folk hero status, surging toward Bob Sanders levels, that I find funny.....  also, the Pacers fan reference....  It's well established that P's fans, especially the forum frequenting ones......  massively overvalue their team's players value to the rest of the NBA....   ;)

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21 hours ago, Shafty138 said:

Oh, sorry....   Firstly, I am fine with Doyle as a player, he's been the epitome of solid....  It's his folk hero status, surging toward Bob Sanders levels, that I find funny.....  also, the Pacers fan reference....  It's well established that P's fans, especially the forum frequenting ones......  massively overvalue their team's players value to the rest of the NBA....   ;)

Fair enough.

I agree with you that to Colts fans, Doyle is over-rated.   But since he is a good blocker, good route runner, good hands and good character, he is a good asset.

 

The Pacers are a franchise who will always be a playoff team but never a championship contender.   NBA sucks!

 

If Bob Sanders could have played for 10 years at his best, he would be the greatest ever.

 

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31 minutes ago, Myles said:

Fair enough.

I agree with you that to Colts fans, Doyle is over-rated.   But since he is a good blocker, good route runner, good hands and good character, he is a good asset.

 

The Pacers are a franchise who will always be a playoff team but never a championship contender.   NBA sucks!

 

If Bob Sanders could have played for 10 years at his best, he would be the greatest ever.

 

I don't think anyone in here thinks Jack Doyle is great or an all-pro. He actually has the 2nd best hands on the team though behind Hilton. Colts fans, at least me do not overrate him. He is just a solid TE with good hands. A player worth having that is for sure.

 

Regarding the Pacers, your comment is so far off base that it is laughable saying we will never be a championship contender. If we had Victor we could win the East this year, look how we are playing without him. Next season we will be loaded with Victor back. We have been Championship contenders a lot in the past = 1994, 1995, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2004, 2013, 2014 so saying "never" is an odd word to use.  We made the ECFinals in all those years I mentioned and made the Finals in 2000. Last season we took LeBron 7 games and had we had HCA we would've won that series and maybe the conference.

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10 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I don't think anyone in here thinks Jack Doyle is great or an all-pro. He actually has the 2nd best hands on the team though behind Hilton. Colts fans, at least me do not overrate him. He is just a solid TE with good hands. A player worth having that is for sure.

 

Regarding the Pacers, your comment is so far off base that it is laughable saying we will never be a championship contender. If we had Victor we could win the East this year, look how we are playing without him. Next season we will be loaded with Victor back. We have been Championship contenders a lot in the past = 1994, 1995, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2004, 2013, 2014 so saying "never" is an odd word to use.  We made the ECFinals in all those years I mentioned and made the Finals in 2000. Last season we took LeBron 7 games and had we had HCA we would've won that series and maybe the conference.

The Pacers are a well run organization that puts a good team out there every year.   Unfortunately, that works against a small market team that has trouble attracting top free agents.   i don't think the Pacers would be winning the East with Victor.   In a way, not having Victor has let the team grow.   It would be great if he could come back before this season is over.  

The offseason will be interesting.

 

 

image.thumb.png.bd80d4ace180982b6988918df4d1ffe4.png

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6 hours ago, Myles said:

The Pacers are a well run organization that puts a good team out there every year.   Unfortunately, that works against a small market team that has trouble attracting top free agents.   i don't think the Pacers would be winning the East with Victor.   In a way, not having Victor has let the team grow.   It would be great if he could come back before this season is over.  

The offseason will be interesting.

 

 

image.thumb.png.bd80d4ace180982b6988918df4d1ffe4.png

I think the Warriors will lose a player or 2 and their dynasty will come to end after they win it all this season. We will have to agree to disagree regarding the Pacers being a Championship contender if they had Vic. I do not believe we nor anyone can beat the Warriors this season but next season with Vic healthy, we will be right there with the best teams IMO if we bring Bogey and Thad back. Not having a hardcap is what makes the NBA suck but our team chemistry makes up for only having 1 star = Vic. We just need to bring most everyone back next season and have a healthy Vic. Bogey is a borderline all-star in his own right.

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On February 28, 2019 at 10:02 AM, Rackeen305 said:

Ever since Doyle made the "Pro Bowl", he has been hurt, ineffective. Time to move on plain and simple. I would even trade him for draft picks. Did he even play last year? Now TE Mo Alie-Cox can gain more PT.

 

I've not read all your posts to be sure but the ones I have are universally Dear God worthy.  This one is no exception.

 

Dear God...

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On 2/27/2019 at 3:37 PM, pacolts56 said:

Or he could wind up like Dennis Pitta.... hip injuries suck and sometimes become chronic. 

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2017/06/07/ravens-release-te-dennis-pitta-after-third-hip-injury/102594226/

 

IMO.... if Hockenson is available at the #26 spot and the top 3-tech DTs are off the board... he’s as good a choice as any. 

I’m not in belief that we take anything but a defensive player at that 26 spot but if, like you said, all the top defensive guys are gone already and we become forced to grab someone just to go defense, I could live with a top offensive TE,WR or even a tackle. I think we are wide open to options at this stage of the game. Helps we have that early 2nd too. 

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