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NewColtsFan

A few thoughts about Desir....

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So I ran across something the other day and I admit it made my heart skip a beat or two.....     and NOT in a good way.

 

Bill Barnwell is one of ESPN's top football writers.    He's going division by division talking about key decisions each team has to make.    And he reached the AFC South.     And here's what he wrote about the Colts.     I'll put into bold the part that jumps out at me.

 

 

"1. Bring back Pierre Desir and Clayton Geathers. Desir was the standout corner for a surprising Colts defense last season. After losing his job with the Browns amid one of their many regime changes and bouncing around practice squads, he has found a home in Indy over the past two seasons. The Colts let starting corner Rashaan Melvin leave for the Raiders after the 2017 campaign, but I don't think they'll be as comfortable moving on from the 6-foot-1 Desir, whose size will interest teams like the Falcons in free agency.  Kyle Fuller picked up a four-year, $56 million offer as a restricted free agent in 2018 after one good season as a corner, and Desir might angle for a similar sort of deal.

 

Indy will hope to get Desir signed for less than that, and bringing back Geathers would allow the Colts to keep their starting secondary intact. Geathers is a highlight-reel hitter, but the concern is health; the 2015 fourth-rounder has missed 22 games over the past three seasons, mostly with a neck injury. The Colts shouldn't be treating their 2018 team as a precious, irreplaceable group of players, but Geathers is a useful box safety and could even be a hybrid linebacker in nickel packages. If the team does re-sign Geathers, it will likely want to try to build his deal around per-game roster bonuses and prepare for the possibility that Geathers gets hurt during his deal.

 

General manager Chris Ballard also will have the ability to sort through some of the bargain-bin finds he has made over the past couple of seasons. He already has re-signed Mark Glowinski, but the Colts will have to decide whether they want to bring back veterans such as Margus Hunt, Najee Goode and Dontrelle Inman for 2019 or try to upgrade."

 

Holy Crap!    Even if Barnwell is wrong about a possible $14 Mill a year offer,  how far off can he be?     My fear is even if the $$$ don't reach that high,  they might just reach $10 Mill per year.      And if they get that high,  I think we can all waive goodbye to our top corner.    Hard to see Ballard paying that kind of money to a corner,  even one who completely shutdown Hopkins of Houston --- twice!

 

That would be disappointing.    My hunch is Ballard would like to do a 3-year deal for $20-25 Mill.    He might be open to that.    But $10 Mill-plus over 4 or more years?     Gonzo.     Remember,  free agent money can get crazy.     Seriously, crazy!

 

And then we're either looking to sign a FA type and hope we hit as we did when we signed Desir,  and possibly also draft a Corner with a Day 2 pick.

 

 

 

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We don’t need to pay a cover 2 corner big money. They’re the easiest to find. We are not asking them to protect an island all day like we did Vontae in our old man scheme. 

 

Our defense requires our corners to be physical and they will take a beating. So will our safeties. 

 

In my mind, we should only pay big money to our quarterback, the front seven and the offensive line. Every other position we need to get at a bargain or we let walk. 

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29 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

We don’t need to pay a cover 2 corner big money. They’re the easiest to find. We are not asking them to protect an island all day like we did Vontae in our old man scheme. 

 

Our defense requires our corners to be physical and they will take a beating. So will our safeties. 

 

In my mind, we should only pay big money to our quarterback, the front seven and the offensive line. Every other position we need to get at a bargain or we let walk. 

Hardcore and to the point. 

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46 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

So I ran across something the other day and I admit it made my heart skip a beat or two.....     and NOT in a good way.

 

Bill Barnwell is one of ESPN's top football writers.    He's going division by division talking about key decisions each team has to make.    And he reached the AFC South.     And here's what he wrote about the Colts.     I'll put into bold the part that jumps out at me.

 

 

"1. Bring back Pierre Desir and Clayton Geathers. Desir was the standout corner for a surprising Colts defense last season. After losing his job with the Browns amid one of their many regime changes and bouncing around practice squads, he has found a home in Indy over the past two seasons. The Colts let starting corner Rashaan Melvin leave for the Raiders after the 2017 campaign, but I don't think they'll be as comfortable moving on from the 6-foot-1 Desir, whose size will interest teams like the Falcons in free agency.  Kyle Fuller picked up a four-year, $56 million offer as a restricted free agent in 2018 after one good season as a corner, and Desir might angle for a similar sort of deal.

 

Indy will hope to get Desir signed for less than that, and bringing back Geathers would allow the Colts to keep their starting secondary intact. Geathers is a highlight-reel hitter, but the concern is health; the 2015 fourth-rounder has missed 22 games over the past three seasons, mostly with a neck injury. The Colts shouldn't be treating their 2018 team as a precious, irreplaceable group of players, but Geathers is a useful box safety and could even be a hybrid linebacker in nickel packages. If the team does re-sign Geathers, it will likely want to try to build his deal around per-game roster bonuses and prepare for the possibility that Geathers gets hurt during his deal.

 

General manager Chris Ballard also will have the ability to sort through some of the bargain-bin finds he has made over the past couple of seasons. He already has re-signed Mark Glowinski, but the Colts will have to decide whether they want to bring back veterans such as Margus Hunt, Najee Goode and Dontrelle Inman for 2019 or try to upgrade."

 

Holy Crap!    Even if Barnwell is wrong about a possible $14 Mill a year offer,  how far off can he be?     My fear is even if the $$$ don't reach that high,  they might just reach $10 Mill per year.      And if they get that high,  I think we can all waive goodbye to our top corner.    Hard to see Ballard paying that kind of money to a corner,  even one who completely shutdown Hopkins of Houston --- twice!

 

That would be disappointing.    My hunch is Ballard would like to do a 3-year deal for $20-25 Mill.    He might be open to that.    But $10 Mill-plus over 4 or more years?     Gonzo.     Remember,  free agent money can get crazy.     Seriously, crazy!

 

And then we're either looking to sign a FA type and hope we hit as we did when we signed Desir,  and possibly also draft a Corner with a Day 2 pick.

 

 

 

I understand your points and concern.  In our scheme, as stated already above this, these positions aren't as valued as man.  The point I want to add is that Hopkins was the walking wounded in the playoffs, (can't recall for sure, but wasn't he banged up in the second game too?) so that didn't count for much really.  He was mostly just a lame duck decoy that game.  

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I like Desir and want to bring him back but not at a ridiculous price. He's also going to turn 29 during the season so the comparisons to Fuller aren't apples to apples. It would stink to let him walk but you can find cover 2 corners more easily.

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I like Desir but I wouldn't pay that ridiculous amount of money.  I just hope he takes less money to stay in Indy.

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8 hours ago, BlueShoe said:

In my mind, we should only pay big money to our quarterback, the front seven and the offensive line. Every other position we need to get at a bargain or we let walk. 

i dont think thats a super bowl winning team.  the best teams in the league now have highly paid guys at the skill positions 

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9 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

So I ran across something the other day and I admit it made my heart skip a beat or two.....     and NOT in a good way.

 

Bill Barnwell is one of ESPN's top football writers.    He's going division by division talking about key decisions each team has to make.    And he reached the AFC South.     And here's what he wrote about the Colts.     I'll put into bold the part that jumps out at me.

 

 

"1. Bring back Pierre Desir and Clayton Geathers. Desir was the standout corner for a surprising Colts defense last season. After losing his job with the Browns amid one of their many regime changes and bouncing around practice squads, he has found a home in Indy over the past two seasons. The Colts let starting corner Rashaan Melvin leave for the Raiders after the 2017 campaign, but I don't think they'll be as comfortable moving on from the 6-foot-1 Desir, whose size will interest teams like the Falcons in free agency.  Kyle Fuller picked up a four-year, $56 million offer as a restricted free agent in 2018 after one good season as a corner, and Desir might angle for a similar sort of deal.

 

Indy will hope to get Desir signed for less than that, and bringing back Geathers would allow the Colts to keep their starting secondary intact. Geathers is a highlight-reel hitter, but the concern is health; the 2015 fourth-rounder has missed 22 games over the past three seasons, mostly with a neck injury. The Colts shouldn't be treating their 2018 team as a precious, irreplaceable group of players, but Geathers is a useful box safety and could even be a hybrid linebacker in nickel packages. If the team does re-sign Geathers, it will likely want to try to build his deal around per-game roster bonuses and prepare for the possibility that Geathers gets hurt during his deal.

 

General manager Chris Ballard also will have the ability to sort through some of the bargain-bin finds he has made over the past couple of seasons. He already has re-signed Mark Glowinski, but the Colts will have to decide whether they want to bring back veterans such as Margus Hunt, Najee Goode and Dontrelle Inman for 2019 or try to upgrade."

 

Holy Crap!    Even if Barnwell is wrong about a possible $14 Mill a year offer,  how far off can he be?     My fear is even if the $$$ don't reach that high,  they might just reach $10 Mill per year.      And if they get that high,  I think we can all waive goodbye to our top corner.    Hard to see Ballard paying that kind of money to a corner,  even one who completely shutdown Hopkins of Houston --- twice!

 

That would be disappointing.    My hunch is Ballard would like to do a 3-year deal for $20-25 Mill.    He might be open to that.    But $10 Mill-plus over 4 or more years?     Gonzo.     Remember,  free agent money can get crazy.     Seriously, crazy!

 

And then we're either looking to sign a FA type and hope we hit as we did when we signed Desir,  and possibly also draft a Corner with a Day 2 pick.

 

 

 

 

 Our D desperately needs a good shutdown corner don't be _____ about it folks.
 It is about winning Playoff games and the SB not beating the other 22 Joe's. 
 That is expected.
 

 Fuller is younger, better, with a different level of expectations so the comp is IFFY.

 And he got a poison pill offer from GB with $18M fully guaranteed. His $1M 1st year salary and his signing bonus.
 Fuller had a 81 PFF grade last year #7 CB. Desir 77 and #18 CB.
 Jaylen Collins had a 81 grade once. CB was more than kicking tires? 
 My Guesstimate for Desir is his 1st year also guaranteed set up similar to Fuller's, but no more than 8-10M, if that, and a roster bonus in year 2 of a Milliom or two paid in March 2020, leaving his buyer with an option to move on. A 3 yr deal.
 I definitely thought his game got really good in the 2nd half of the season,
He didn't turn the ball over like we could use, so Collins and the draft are strong possibilities i am sure.

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Desir played well but he is by no means worth anything like the contract Fuller received. if he tries that let him go and if he succeeds we get a comp pick. I think Ballard will address CB and S in this draft or free agency. You have to balance the good of the team in regards to what cap space you have. Desir does not force you to make that tough decision 

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19 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

i dont think thats a super bowl winning team.  the best teams in the league now have highly paid guys at the skill positions 

 

I consider the quarterback, the offensive line, and the front seven to all be skilled positions. 

 

So I disagree. 

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15 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

I consider the quarterback, the offensive line, and the front seven to all be skilled positions. 

 

So I disagree. 

 

i meant WR, TE and even RB.  the best teams tend to have better CBs than us too

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Just now, aaron11 said:

 

i meant WR, TE and even RB.  the best teams tend to have better CBs than us too

 

I know what you meant. I just disagree. 

 

We have way different opinions... :) 

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2 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

I know what you meant. I just disagree. 

 

We have way different opinions... :) 

not many teams have won super bowls with worse receiving groups than what we have

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1 minute ago, aaron11 said:

not many teams have won super bowls with worse receiving groups than what we have

 

Do you think the Patriots have a great group of receivers?

 

How well did they protect their quarterback and how well did they get after the opposing quarterback?

 

That is what wins football games in the modern era. 

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4 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

Do you think the Patriots have a great group of receivers?

 

How well did they protect their quarterback and how well did they get after the opposing quarterback?

 

That is what wins football games in the modern era. 

edelman is better than any colt receiver besides ty, gronk is better than any of our TEs.  they also just spent a first round pick on a running back.  i wont say they are great though

 

i dont think we can replicate what they do either, thats a product of brady and BB.  the two most recent winners besides NE did have highly paid and drafted receiver groups.  the patriots also do spend a lot on corner backs

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Just now, aaron11 said:

edelman is better than any colt receiver besides ty, gronk is better than any of our TEs.  they also just spent a first round pick on a running back

 

i dont think we can replicate what they do either, thats a product of brady and BB.  the two most recent winners besides NE did have highly paid and drafted receiver groups.  the patriots also do spend a lot on corner backs

 

We could do this all day, but I won't. :)

 

I have my opinion and you have yours. We do not agree, and we are not going to agree. 

 

No offense, but I am not spending any more of my time discussing this. I've already had this discussion several times with others and myself over the past 30 years or so. I have come to my beliefs based on a few decades of data that has flowed in and out of my brain. 

 

There are people who believe the way you do (like Grigson) and there are people who look at things the way I do (like Belichick). 

 

You are free to have your own opinion on how to build a football team. :) 

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3 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

There are people who believe the way you do (like Grigson) 

 

grigson was bad, but the model im talking bout worked well for the eagles recently 

 

i think that would easier to replicate than what the patriots do.  no one has been able to copy that effectively 

 

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Desir is just a regular guy. We can easily find his replacement. Not that I don't like the guy, he deserves whatever contract he gets but I think there are many other Desir type players in the league right now.

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Safeties are more important in our defense then a CB. We will not pay him that much.

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Desir came here to have a second chance at football life, to show

his talents and to show the NFL that he is worthy of a decent payday.

Ballard dumpster dives for these players on the cheap and gets

motivated players fighting for their football lives.

 

Desir will test his worth on the open market, and if he hits it big then

that's awesome for him. Either way the Colts will be fine.

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11 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

So I ran across something the other day and I admit it made my heart skip a beat or two.....     and NOT in a good way.

 

Bill Barnwell is one of ESPN's top football writers.    He's going division by division talking about key decisions each team has to make.    And he reached the AFC South.     And here's what he wrote about the Colts.     I'll put into bold the part that jumps out at me.

 

 

"1. Bring back Pierre Desir and Clayton Geathers. Desir was the standout corner for a surprising Colts defense last season. After losing his job with the Browns amid one of their many regime changes and bouncing around practice squads, he has found a home in Indy over the past two seasons. The Colts let starting corner Rashaan Melvin leave for the Raiders after the 2017 campaign, but I don't think they'll be as comfortable moving on from the 6-foot-1 Desir, whose size will interest teams like the Falcons in free agency.  Kyle Fuller picked up a four-year, $56 million offer as a restricted free agent in 2018 after one good season as a corner, and Desir might angle for a similar sort of deal.

 

Indy will hope to get Desir signed for less than that, and bringing back Geathers would allow the Colts to keep their starting secondary intact. Geathers is a highlight-reel hitter, but the concern is health; the 2015 fourth-rounder has missed 22 games over the past three seasons, mostly with a neck injury. The Colts shouldn't be treating their 2018 team as a precious, irreplaceable group of players, but Geathers is a useful box safety and could even be a hybrid linebacker in nickel packages. If the team does re-sign Geathers, it will likely want to try to build his deal around per-game roster bonuses and prepare for the possibility that Geathers gets hurt during his deal.

 

General manager Chris Ballard also will have the ability to sort through some of the bargain-bin finds he has made over the past couple of seasons. He already has re-signed Mark Glowinski, but the Colts will have to decide whether they want to bring back veterans such as Margus Hunt, Najee Goode and Dontrelle Inman for 2019 or try to upgrade."

 

Holy Crap!    Even if Barnwell is wrong about a possible $14 Mill a year offer,  how far off can he be?     My fear is even if the $$$ don't reach that high,  they might just reach $10 Mill per year.      And if they get that high,  I think we can all waive goodbye to our top corner.    Hard to see Ballard paying that kind of money to a corner,  even one who completely shutdown Hopkins of Houston --- twice!

 

That would be disappointing.    My hunch is Ballard would like to do a 3-year deal for $20-25 Mill.    He might be open to that.    But $10 Mill-plus over 4 or more years?     Gonzo.     Remember,  free agent money can get crazy.     Seriously, crazy!

 

And then we're either looking to sign a FA type and hope we hit as we did when we signed Desir,  and possibly also draft a Corner with a Day 2 pick.

 

 

 

 

First of all, Fuller had a first-team All-Pro year, which means he had an absolutely exceptional year and was considered one of the 2 best CBs in the NFL.  Desir had a 'good' year, not a First-Team All-Pro year.  Second, Fuller has started 62 of 64 games in his career (he missed one season due to injury) ... this was not his first 'good' year.... Fuller has had 3 good or very good years and last year he was the best in the NFL at his position.  Desir was a healthy scratch for 3/4 of his rookie season in which he had 1 start (compared to Fuller who started 14 games as a rookie), his second year he had 1 start, then he was waived and was a practice squad or unemployed for 2 years.  Prior to us picking Desir up, he was on the Seahawks practice squad and then waived by the Seahawks.

 

I generally like Barnwell, but he is so far off here.  Fuller has been playing at a very high level his whole career and last year, he was regarded as the best (or top 2) in the NFL at his position.  Desir is a journeyman who had a good season for us last year (not a first-team all-pro season, not a second-team all-pro season, not a pro-bowl season.... a pretty good season).  Desir has nowhere near as much leverage when negotiating a contract as Fuller had. 

 

10 hours ago, JPFolks said:

Hardcore and to the point. 

 

Look at who we face in the AFC in terms of WRs.  KC has Tyreek Hill, who will kill a team without a good secondary and a fast safety.  HOU has DeAndre Hopkins who will kill a team who doesn't have a physical CB to match up against him.  PIT has Ju-Ju Smith-Schuster (and unlikely AB), either one of those guys can kill a team who doesn't have an adequate secondary.  

 

I could go on and on... but I don't think @BlueShoe was 'Hardcore and to the point.'  Yes, it's critical to have a solid QB, front seven, OL, etc... but you don't win in this league with your secondary being entirely compromised of 'bargain picks.'

 

1 hour ago, BlueShoe said:

 

Do you think the Patriots have a great group of receivers?

 

How well did they protect their quarterback and how well did they get after the opposing quarterback?

 

That is what wins football games in the modern era. 

 

The Patriots held the Rams to 3 points in the Superbowl.  Very few teams in the NFL could beat the Rams by only scoring 13 points.  And as @aaron11 said, Edelman is better than any of our WRs outside of TY, Gronk is a more dangerous receiving threat than I think anyone on our team, and the Patriots played exceptionally well on defense.

 

You are right, and Ballard says this over and over again that great teams are built in the trenches.  However, that doesn't mean you just look for bargains at every position outside of QB and the trench positions.  

 

A major contributor on that team was All-Pro CB Stephon Gilmore.  And the rest of the secondary was very good as well.  They don't hold the Rams to 3 points without the play of their secondary (perhaps the biggest play of that game was McCourty breaking up the pass in the back of the endzone when Goff had all day to throw. 

 

58 minutes ago, pgt_rob said:

Desir is just a regular guy. We can easily find his replacement. Not that I don't like the guy, he deserves whatever contract he gets but I think there are many other Desir type players in the league right now.

 

I tend to agree.  He played well here last year.  He is probably comfortable in this system.  However, if he's demanding elite CB money, we'll be fine letting him walk.

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Ballard let Desir walk last year and he came right back to us after he saw nobody would pay him. I still don't think the year he had last year was better than what Melvin did and Melvin couldn't get any more than a 1 year deal on the market.

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One thing to consider is that I actually think Ballard wants the D to play more aggressive coverage packages so I'm not sure the "cover 2 CBs are a dime a dozen" argument holds weight. Not saying PD is worth a big contract, but I don't think the cover 2 rational is why. 

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16 minutes ago, Larry Horseman said:

One thing to consider is that I actually think Ballard wants the D to play more aggressive coverage packages so I'm not sure the "cover 2 CBs are a dime a dozen" argument holds weight. Not saying PD is worth a big contract, but I don't think the cover 2 rational is why. 

 

I think we will eventually get more complex with our scheme, but right now we are playing a lot cover 2 in the nickel and our corners are not required to have long speed because they are mostly playing zone.

 

As the defense progresses, then we will need to add some press-man with help over the top, but even then the corners will not be required to have long speed. We need to them to be more physical and sticky within 20-yard spaces rather than super-fast track stars. 

 

Think of it this way... Darrelle Revis would not have been a good fit for our current defense. It would have been a waste of his talents and it would have exposed is only weakness - tackling. However, he would have been a perfect fit for the 3-4 man scheme that Pagano ran.

 

It's about fitting the right pieces in the right places and fortunately for us, corners who have the skill set to play in the cover 2 are not typically high-priced. 

 

By the way, I love your Shoe! I feel like I am starting a revolution.   :) 

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54 minutes ago, krunk said:

Ballard let Desir walk last year and he came right back to us after he saw nobody would pay him. I still don't think the year he had last year was better than what Melvin did and Melvin couldn't get any more than a 1 year deal on the market.

 

Correct. And Melvin technically didn't fit the cover 2 scheme that well. 

 

Plus, I think Ballard wanted to get Melvin out of Morrison's crosshairs. He probably saved Melvin's life by shipping Antonio to the NFC. :D 

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Getting off topic here.  I haven't seen my good buddy Soutwest 1 in quite some time.     Anybody seen SW1?  Chime in my friend if you're still with us.....

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12 hours ago, JPFolks said:

I understand your points and concern.  In our scheme, as stated already above this, these positions aren't as valued as man.  The point I want to add is that Hopkins was the walking wounded in the playoffs, (can't recall for sure, but wasn't he banged up in the second game too?) so that didn't count for much really.  He was mostly just a lame duck decoy that game.  

Well in the 3 games between the two Colts matchups, Hopkins had 31 catches for 421 yards and 2 TDs.  So I doubt if he just happened to be a lame duck in those two games.

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22 minutes ago, krunk said:

Getting off topic here.  I haven't seen my good buddy Soutwest 1 in quite some time.     Anybody seen SW1?  Chime in my friend if you're still with us.....

Was wondering this the other day been quite a long time since I've seen him post 

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56 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

I think we will eventually get more complex with our scheme, but right now we are playing a lot cover 2 in the nickel and our corners are not required to have long speed because they are mostly playing zone.

 

The question I have is whether they keep the scheme simple out of necessity because we don't have good corners, or if they aren't too worried about corners because they're going to keep the scheme simple.

 

Based on recent comments from Ballard, I'm thinking it might be more of the former than the latter, and once we have corners who can play more coverages, we'll mix up the coverages more than than we did in 2018. 

 

Either way, I don't think Ballard will be spending big money on any corner this offseason, especially not an average journeyman like Desir. 

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I think it's about security for a lot of players at his stage in his career. A front loaded 5 year deal, and I think Desir would take a lot less on the whole instead of testing the market. But I don't see Ballard offering a year deal....probably a modest 3. 

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31 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

The question I have is whether they keep the scheme simple out of necessity because we don't have good corners, or if they aren't too worried about corners because they're going to keep the scheme simple.

 

Based on recent comments from Ballard, I'm thinking it might be more of the former than the latter, and once we have corners who can play more coverages, we'll mix up the coverages more than than we did in 2018. 

 

Either way, I don't think Ballard will be spending big money on any corner this offseason, especially not an average journeyman like Desir. 

 

I don't think we will evolve into a defense that drops both safeties in the box and leaves our corners one-on-one. Therefore, a shut-down corner is just not necessary. Even if we did call cover 0 on a few plays, it would be very rare. 

 

In my opinion, we don't need track stars with long speed at corner. I think we need physical, quicker than fast players, with good balls skills. Deandre Baker would be a great fit, but I am not sold on taking a corner that high in the draft if an edge player is there. That said, I believe Baker would be more than worthy at #26.

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Desir’s career has mirrored Rashaan Melvin’s much more than Kyle Fuller’s. He’s been a journeyman, fourth round pick (Melvin was undrafted), had one good year on his fourth team, and is the same age as Melvin was last year going into free agency. Kyle Fuller was a first round draft pick who has played well since his rookie year, just had one year where he was hurt in the preseason and went to IR. 

 

Desir won’t come close to Fuller. He’ll be offered a shade more than Melvin. He can either pull a Melvin and have an inflated sense of his own ability, go to some crappy team like the Jets for the same contract we’re offering anyway, and end up hating it, or he can roll with the team that’s given him a chance and pile up W’s. 

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5 hours ago, krunk said:

Ballard let Desir walk last year and he came right back to us after he saw nobody would pay him. I still don't think the year he had last year was better than what Melvin did and Melvin couldn't get any more than a 1 year deal on the market.

Shhhh.... don't talk about cold hard reality.   Even if Desir gets some huge deal offer and walks (more like runs) to that team, Ballard already proved he knows what his value truly is.  I am not against a longer term contract with fair terms to reward potential (last year was meaningless, he got paid for that, but what are you going to give me worth a pay increase and guaranteed money?).   Good post Krunk.  

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5 hours ago, Larry Horseman said:

One thing to consider is that I actually think Ballard wants the D to play more aggressive coverage packages so I'm not sure the "cover 2 CBs are a dime a dozen" argument holds weight. Not saying PD is worth a big contract, but I don't think the cover 2 rational is why. 

Well, we can speculate on him changing philosophy but it's a baseless guess either way.  We'll never know what he has planned until he goes there.  Even if he SAYS it, it doesn't mean that much until it happens.  I actually like the idea of being more versatile between Man and Zone than I think we were last year.  Perhaps Desir is just the guy to achieve that.  But it would only be a "wish" on my end that that happens.  If they stick with and build on the fundamentals that they did last year, then it seems like Corner isn't a position of value.  And it is impossible to value all positions at once.  It is a give and take.  That is why most fans want big time receivers by default but cooler heads say, sure, we'll take the right guy at the right price, but we're building our fundamentals first and foremost and if we're going to overpay somewhere, it will be in those areas.  That and (in my opinion) our own guys worthy of being resigned who play in those key areas.   I like Desir, hope he stays.   For whatever that is worth.  I don't want him to spend money on him that we need elsewhere more.  

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Desir's replacement is likely already on the roster in the form of Jalen Collins - who talent wise is as good or better than anybody else we have - IF he keeps his nose clean.

 

Wilson and Collins on the outside and Moore in the slot will be just fine. Plus whomever we draft or sign in Free Agency.

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It's a Catch 22. 

We don't need Top Corners because we play a Tampa 2 OR we play a Tampa 2 because we don't have or unwilling to pay top $ to Top Corners.

 

Either way it's a Red Flag that in a 'passing league' we will have lesser talented corners to cover Top Receivers.

 

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21 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

So I ran across something the other day and I admit it made my heart skip a beat or two.....     and NOT in a good way.

 

Bill Barnwell is one of ESPN's top football writers.    He's going division by division talking about key decisions each team has to make.    And he reached the AFC South.     And here's what he wrote about the Colts.     I'll put into bold the part that jumps out at me.

 

 

"1. Bring back Pierre Desir and Clayton Geathers. Desir was the standout corner for a surprising Colts defense last season. After losing his job with the Browns amid one of their many regime changes and bouncing around practice squads, he has found a home in Indy over the past two seasons. The Colts let starting corner Rashaan Melvin leave for the Raiders after the 2017 campaign, but I don't think they'll be as comfortable moving on from the 6-foot-1 Desir, whose size will interest teams like the Falcons in free agency.  Kyle Fuller picked up a four-year, $56 million offer as a restricted free agent in 2018 after one good season as a corner, and Desir might angle for a similar sort of deal.

 

Indy will hope to get Desir signed for less than that, and bringing back Geathers would allow the Colts to keep their starting secondary intact. Geathers is a highlight-reel hitter, but the concern is health; the 2015 fourth-rounder has missed 22 games over the past three seasons, mostly with a neck injury. The Colts shouldn't be treating their 2018 team as a precious, irreplaceable group of players, but Geathers is a useful box safety and could even be a hybrid linebacker in nickel packages. If the team does re-sign Geathers, it will likely want to try to build his deal around per-game roster bonuses and prepare for the possibility that Geathers gets hurt during his deal.

 

General manager Chris Ballard also will have the ability to sort through some of the bargain-bin finds he has made over the past couple of seasons. He already has re-signed Mark Glowinski, but the Colts will have to decide whether they want to bring back veterans such as Margus Hunt, Najee Goode and Dontrelle Inman for 2019 or try to upgrade."

 

Holy Crap!    Even if Barnwell is wrong about a possible $14 Mill a year offer,  how far off can he be?     My fear is even if the $$$ don't reach that high,  they might just reach $10 Mill per year.      And if they get that high,  I think we can all waive goodbye to our top corner.    Hard to see Ballard paying that kind of money to a corner,  even one who completely shutdown Hopkins of Houston --- twice!

 

That would be disappointing.    My hunch is Ballard would like to do a 3-year deal for $20-25 Mill.    He might be open to that.    But $10 Mill-plus over 4 or more years?     Gonzo.     Remember,  free agent money can get crazy.     Seriously, crazy!

 

And then we're either looking to sign a FA type and hope we hit as we did when we signed Desir,  and possibly also draft a Corner with a Day 2 pick.

 

 

 

 

He is gonna turn 29 next year why break the bank on him? Let him walk we still have Jalen Collins and IMO regardless of him not playing last season he is a far better CB than Desir. There is always the draft as well. If Geathers is brought back it should be only on a cap friendly deal. I only see him primarily suited as a Nickle and Dime Linebacker, he isn’t a great cover safety.

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Desir played well last year. He's going to get paid much better this year. I hope the Colts step up and pay the man a fair salary. Something like 2 yrs/$12m. with a team option for year 3. $8 m guaranteed. Keep the talent you have and build out from there. I believe the Colts would miss Desir if they let him walk. If a crazy offer comes forward, so be it. But if he's available for the price tag noted above, re-sign the man. He earned it. 

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57 minutes ago, ProblChld32 said:

 

He is gonna turn 29 next year why break the bank on him? Let him walk we still have Jalen Collins and IMO regardless of him not playing last season he is a far better CB than Desir. There is always the draft as well. If Geathers is brought back it should be only on a cap friendly deal. I only see him primarily suited as a Nickle and Dime Linebacker, he isn’t a great cover safety.

 

I'm not in favor of breaking the bank on Desir.

 

I posted the article to let the Colts Community know that if the writer's guesstimation is even close to being right,  then there's little chance of the Colts bringing him back.     Just a heads-up so that posters here are not surprised by what Desir might get on the open market.

 

I assume Ballard will have all the bases covered.     We should be fine.

 

 

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