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Landon Collins status/rumors (merge)


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1 hour ago, krunk said:

I totally don't see Collins and Geathers on the same team at the same time.

 

If Geathers signs, we'll have to see what the contract is like.

 

I don't see Ballard or any GM looking at a player on Geathers' level, a player who has averaged 6 starts a season in his career as the future.  

 

I could be wrong, but I'm guessing he either signs a Butler-type deal or turns it down and moves on like Melvin did.

 

 

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To me..... if you get a chance at Collins, and it isnt crazy money...... you do the deal

 

EVEN IF, you also sign Geathers.........

 

I am sure that he can come in as a fast LB on passing downs

 

I just dont trust Geathers to be the guy.........

 

 

Additionally......

 

We had guys named Wilcox and Odum playing  downs last year at S, WHILE Geathers and Hooker were out there

 

Surely we can find a defense that could use Collins AND Geathers at the same time

 

In this defense, the FS and SS are two very important cogs   

 

Geathers is GOOD (when actually on the field)

Collins is GREAT

 

This defense, at a key position needs some GREAT to be able to get through a playoff run.

 

 

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People talk about the safety position not being valued but according to snap counts Hooker was 2nd on the defense in snaps played, only behind Leonard and Geathers, even with his injuries was 6th, so he would have been top 3 had he played a full season.  So, whomever the Colts sign at safety is going to be on the field a lot.

 

To me, it makes sense to sign a young probowl player if the opportunity presents itself.

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48 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

 

 

To me, it makes sense to sign a young probowl player if the opportunity presents itself.

This.......

 

To me....... he hits the top four

Young - Check

Leader - Check

Top Performer - Check

Improves our defense - Check

 

Lets say that he wants 13Mil........ SO WHAT?.... Do It..... sign the man

 

That 2-3 mil above baseline isnt going to put us over the cap......

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

To me..... if you get a chance at Collins, and it isnt crazy money...... you do the deal

 

EVEN IF, you also sign Geathers.........

 

I am sure that he can come in as a fast LB on passing downs

 

I just dont trust Geathers to be the guy.........

 

 

Additionally......

 

We had guys named Wilcox and Odum playing  downs last year at S, WHILE Geathers and Hooker were out there

 

Surely we can find a defense that could use Collins AND Geathers at the same time

 

In this defense, the FS and SS are two very important cogs   

 

Geathers is GOOD (when actually on the field)

Collins is GREAT

 

This defense, at a key position needs some GREAT to be able to get through a playoff run.

 

 

 

Yep...team needs to be 3 deep with starting caliber Ss...AND have some solid depth for those 3. I don't really want to see this team using 3 LBs very often...unless they upgrade pass coverage from the MIKE spot. 

 

But S depth is critical...so I wouldn't rule out signing Collins and drafting someone...in addition to tendering Farley or bringing back Geathers. But there are a lot of Ss available...so Ballard could decide to go in a few different directions.

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5 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

This.......

 

To me....... he hits the top four

Young - Check

Leader - Check

Top Performer - Check

Improves our defense - Check

 

Lets say that he wants 13Mil........ SO WHAT?.... Do It..... sign the man

 

That 2-3 mil above baseline isnt going to put us over the cap......

 

 

 

 

 You are funny. Let's say Ballard has a limit of $10M for the position and stays disciplined. 
 But you don't have a Limit to build Your 53 man roster. You see a hot babe and buy her a Maseratti. Ballard and his Capologist actually have a long term plan if you can possibly believe him.
They aren't :loco: :cheers: sailors.
 

Quote

 

 

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1 hour ago, Coffeedrinker said:

People talk about the safety position not being valued but according to snap counts Hooker was 2nd on the defense in snaps played, only behind Leonard and Geathers, even with his injuries was 6th, so he would have been top 3 had he played a full season.  So, whomever the Colts sign at safety is going to be on the field a lot.

 

To me, it makes sense to sign a young probowl player if the opportunity presents itself.

 

If anything, Ss not being valued highly plays into the Colts' hands...because that means they can sign multiple Ss without breaking the bank.

 

I don't necessarily agree with the notion that Ss aren't highly valued. I just think the supply is higher than the demand...as there are more and more good ones coming out of a college each year. 

 

For these reasons...it's a position where the Colts should really shine...with the resources they have...and the defense they run. 

 

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37 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 You are funny. Let's say Ballard has a limit of $10M for the position and stays disciplined. 
 But you don't have a Limit to build Your 53 man roster. You see a hot babe and buy her a Maseratti. Ballard and his Capologist actually have a long term plan if you can possibly believe him.
They aren't :loco: :cheers: sailors.
 

 

I dont know   ........ is plus 2 Mil to get a your pro bowl needed player a stretch?

 

I think 12 mil ISNT too much

 

And...... if I was a younger and SINGLE man..........  I am not buying a hot babe a Maserati.........

 

Being divorced once, I dont exactly know how to cut a sports car in HALF  :(

 

 

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25 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

I dont know   ........ is plus 2 Mil to get a your pro bowl needed player a stretch?

 

I think 12 mil ISNT too much

 

And...... if I was a younger and SINGLE man..........  I am not buying a hot babe a Maserati.........

 

Being divorced once, I dont exactly know how to cut a sports car in HALF  :(

 

 

 

  
 We can get a very solid S in the draft at pick 59 or 90. Or a less expensive FA.
 I have a hard time believing CB pays up that kind of $$$ for safety before he has his D-Line set. 
 Of course if he lands his pass rusher that would leave us in a great position to add one more high end FA, then nail the draft to improve on all 3 levels.
He is going to do it, just a matter of how, who, and how fa$t.  lol

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2 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

  
 We can get a very solid S in the draft at pick 59 or 90. Or a less expensive FA.
 I have a hard time believing CB pays up that kind of $$$ for safety before he has his D-Line set. 
 Of course if he lands his pass rusher that would leave us in a great position to add one more high end FA, then nail the draft to improve on all 3 levels.
He is going to do it, just a matter of how, who, and how fa$t.  lol

Agreed.  I think people r going to b disappointed when he doesn't make play for Collins.  Just a hunch of mine.  I believe Ballard may pay top money for Thomas and Berry in their prime.  If Hooker reaches that level then he may pay him top dollar.  Not sure he is going to doll out 12 million or more for a strong safety.

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Everyone has to remember just because we don’t get a FA doesn’t mean he was not willing to pay him or didn’t go after them. There is always a chance the player didn’t want to come here or they like another city better. Don’t assume he didn’t try. Collins is exactly the type of free agent Ballard would want. We will see.

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4 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

This.......

 

To me....... he hits the top four

Young - Check

Leader - Check

Top Performer - Check

Improves our defense - Check

 

Lets say that he wants 13Mil........ SO WHAT?.... Do It..... sign the man

 

That 2-3 mil above baseline isnt going to put us over the cap......

 

 

 

 

That is known as death by inches.  

 

He does check all the boxes like you suggest but the bolded to me is death by inches.  It sets precedent and seemingly opens the door for other similar "slightly over the top" contracts.

 

 

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1 hour ago, jskinnz said:

 

That is known as death by inches.  

 

He does check all the boxes like you suggest but the bolded to me is death by inches.  It sets precedent and seemingly opens the door for other similar "slightly over the top" contracts.

 

 

Actually no

 

If you have to overpay slightly on ONLY your 3-4 KEY positions, the positions that make the defense work such as DE, SS, WSLB, FS, you arent going to net a cap problem.

If you draft right, 2-3 of these positions at any given time, might be on cheaper rookie contracts

 

The same goes for our offense. Your highest paid will be LT, WR1, QB.

 

Everyone is worried about our cap.........  Its not our money being spent.

 

Not a dime is coming out of my pocket

 

We have so much room, we can spend a bit more this year....... not stupid money,

but $ on a proven star.... 

 

If we bring in just TWO top FAs and 2-3 mid teir FAs........, and then get a starter or two and depth in the draft..... This team can compete for a Superbowl.... This year.....

and if the FAs are young..........for a few years in the future

 

Watching the Colts play since 1971 (I was 9) The Colts have been in the SB, only a few times.

If you are close, and have the resources (yes on both)

 

You might take a bigger step

 

That's my only point

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

Actually no

 

If you have to overpay slightly on ONLY your 3-4 KEY positions, the positions that make the defense work such as DE, SS, WSLB, FS, you arent going to net a cap problem.

If you draft right, 2-3 of these positions at any given time, might be on cheaper rookie contracts

 

The same goes for our offense. Your highest paid will be LT, WR1, QB.

 

Everyone is worried about our cap.........  Its not our money being spent.

 

Not a dime is coming out of my pocket

 

We have so much room, we can spend a bit more this year....... not stupid money,

but $ on a proven star.... 

 

If we bring in just TWO top FAs and 2-3 mid teir FAs........, and then get a starter or two and depth in the draft..... This team can compete for a Superbowl.... This year.....

and if the FAs are young..........for a few years in the future

 

Watching the Colts play since 1971 (I was 9) The Colts have been in the SB, only a few times.

If you are close, and have the resources (yes on both)

 

You might take a bigger step

 

That's my only point

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think they do one market setting contract.  Collins may be that player and I really have no problem with that.

 

But I also really like and respect Ballard for his ability to stay disciplined and not get into bidding wars. I think that kind of restraint serves the team best in the long run

 

My two cents... 

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When I look at his highlights he is a playmaker. There is a huge gap between how good he is and Geathers. Teams have to game plan around Collins. Geathers is efficient and does his job. Collins would be a huge upgrade over Geathers. But there is still a place for Geathers.

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9 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Can teams talk to players before the 13th.

March 11-13

Clubs are permitted to contact, and enter into contract negotiations with, the certified agents of players who will become Unrestricted Free Agents upon the expiration of their 2018 player contracts at 4:00 p.m., New York time, on March 13.

https://operations.nfl.com/football-ops/league-governance/2018-19-important-nfl-dates/

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10 minutes ago, Virtuoso80 said:

March 11-13

Clubs are permitted to contact, and enter into contract negotiations with, the certified agents of players who will become Unrestricted Free Agents upon the expiration of their 2018 player contracts at 4:00 p.m., New York time, on March 13.

https://operations.nfl.com/football-ops/league-governance/2018-19-important-nfl-dates/

Next week is going to be very interesting. Should be fun. 

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9 hours ago, jskinnz said:

 

I think they do one market setting contract.  Collins may be that player and I really have no problem with that.

 

But I also really like and respect Ballard for his ability to stay disciplined and not get into bidding wars. I think that kind of restraint serves the team best in the long run

 

My two cents... 

I agree with you 

 

We need to be selective

 

Bringing in 6 top FAs  MAY look good for a year or two.... You will spike at very high levels, you will drop at very low levels.

 

 

 

 

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Heard an interesting take on NFL radio during the drive into work.  The talking heads were Bob Papa (Giants play by play guy) and Charlie Weis.  Both know a little bit about the game and the Giants.

 

Weis posed the question - do people think Gettlemen got stupid overnight in relation to all the uproar over Collins not being signed or tagged.  Paraphrasing here but the basic premise was that the GM knows what he is doing and while Weis likes Collins as a player, there are some clear limitations.  He also said he was not very good in 2018.  Papa chimed in with similar takes.

 

Now someone's trash is another man's treasure and Collins could come here (or anywhere) and be fantastic.  But this "pushback" on the Collins' hype was interesting. Why exactly are the Giants allowing a universally loved, young lockerroom leader to walk out the door?

 

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11 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

Heard an interesting take on NFL radio during the drive into work.  The talking heads were Bob Papa (Giants play by play guy) and Charlie Weis.  Both know a little bit about the game and the Giants.

 

Weis posed the question - do people think Gettlemen got stupid overnight in relation to all the uproar over Collins not being signed or tagged.  Paraphrasing here but the basic premise was that the GM knows what he is doing and while Weis likes Collins as a player, there are some clear limitations.  He also said he was not very good in 2018.  Papa chimed in with similar takes.

 

Now someone's trash is another man's treasure and Collins could come here (or anywhere) and be fantastic.  But this "pushback" on the Collins' hype was interesting. Why exactly are the Giants allowing a universally loved, young lockerroom leader to walk out the door?

 

Personally I think Gettlemen is an odd duck.  He doesn't want to pay a team captain and a top safety top dollar.  But he pays OBJ and is now willing to listen to trade overtures.  Two of his best players.  Doesn't look like he is trying to win now.  Looks like he is entering rebuild territory.  Good luck to them and good luck for us I hope.  

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28 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

Heard an interesting take on NFL radio during the drive into work.  The talking heads were Bob Papa (Giants play by play guy) and Charlie Weis.  Both know a little bit about the game and the Giants.

 

Weis posed the question - do people think Gettlemen got stupid overnight in relation to all the uproar over Collins not being signed or tagged.  Paraphrasing here but the basic premise was that the GM knows what he is doing and while Weis likes Collins as a player, there are some clear limitations.  He also said he was not very good in 2018.  Papa chimed in with similar takes.

 

Now someone's trash is another man's treasure and Collins could come here (or anywhere) and be fantastic.  But this "pushback" on the Collins' hype was interesting. Why exactly are the Giants allowing a universally loved, young lockerroom leader to walk out the door?

 

well, the Giants have been making a TON of stupid moves the last year or two

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I'd love to get Collins. But I am not sure it is even smart based on value alone.

 

There are a lot of solid Safeties on this market right now.

 

Safety was very very slow to develop last year. Guys like Reid (yes I know there were other factors), Boston, Vaccaro all sat out there for awhile and then signed deals way less than people anticipated. This year there is even more talent out there.

 

L.Collins

A.Amos

L.Joyner

E.Thomas

T.Mathieu

H.Clinton-Dix

T.Boston

K.Vaccaro

A.Harris

E.Weddle

A.Phillips

J.Ward

G.Quinn

 

That's 13 guys right there that could start or be a fantastic 3rd Safety. And of them all, only Weddle, Quinn and E.Thomas are over the age of 28.

 

So there is a lot of talent out there at the Safety position.

 

This doesn't even include Geathers.

 

This is why I bet Ballard is letting Geathers test the waters. That market is going to be flush with talent and some of these guys will have to settle for small one and two year deals.

 

Heck, last year Boston, Phillips, Vaccarro and Reid all basically settled for 1 year, $1.5M deals essentially.

 

W a market this flush, some guys will have to take similar deals and can likely be had for 2 year deals in the $4M-$8M range at the rate of $2M-$4M a year.

 

This is where the Collins stuff gets complicated. Is Collins at $10M+ a year (if he commands that as some of our fans are suggesting) a better pickup than some of these other guys at considerably less?

 

I would rather sign Anthony Harris or Tre Boston or a guy like that for $2M-$4M if I had to make that choice.

 

I would be happy to have Collins, but I would not want to pay him more than around $8M a year in this market. Even that is rich with how many good Safeties are out there for a lot cheaper.

 

This is also why I think fans might be disappointed if/when we do not land Collins. If we are even in contention for him that's a plus. But the sky is not falling if we miss out. There are a lot of good Safeties out there for the taking this off-season.

 

 

 

 

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44 minutes ago, csmopar said:

well, the Giants have been making a TON of stupid moves the last year or two

 

I am not a Giants fan so I don't really care but I would bet your definition of stupid differs from Gettleman. 

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