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DaveA1102

Zak Keefer - Quenton Nelson Mindset

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3 minutes ago, DaveA1102 said:

Couple of great tweets from Zak about the big fella.

 

 

 

 

Well, Luck has been known to compliment defenders, but I don't think it was Luck that Nelson was talking to.  

 

 

Then again, maybe it was, hmmmm.

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1 minute ago, Cynjin said:

 

Well, Luck has been known to compliment defenders, but I don't think it was Luck that Nelson was talking to.  

 

 

Then again, maybe it was, hmmmm.

 

That's exactly what I was thinking.

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Have I died and gone to Heaven?  I will know for sure  if Mack announces Jerry Rice is his personal trainer. 

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34 minutes ago, Cynjin said:

 

Well, Luck has been known to compliment defenders, but I don't think it was Luck that Nelson was talking to.  

 

 

Then again, maybe it was, hmmmm.

 

Yeah I'm not sure I like that Quenton Nelson story.  I'm all about giving it everything you have on every play but you can do that and be a good sport.  

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When Quentin is pulling it's like a QNAbrahms coming at you. Duck and cover and hope your not on the next QN highlight reel.

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23 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Yeah I'm not sure I like that Quenton Nelson story.  I'm all about giving it everything you have on every play but you can do that and be a good sport.  

 

Obviously this is a matter of personal opinion. However there is plenty of trash talking from the other team going on as well that we don’t know about/hear on tv.

 

IMO as long as the trash talk stays on the field then it doesn’t cause a distraction and really isn’t being a bad sport. Just competitive.

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37 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Yeah I'm not sure I like that Quenton Nelson story.  I'm all about giving it everything you have on every play but you can do that and be a good sport.  

 

Yeah, neither do I. 

 

The second part is great, the first part doesn't impress me.

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11 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Yeah, neither do I. 

 

The second part is great, the first part doesn't impress me.

 Can't say the first part impressed me when I first read it.  But as I thought about it the point is during the game remember they are the enemy.  He didn't say to be a poor sport, to trash talk, spit on, etc.  He just said "don't talk to...".  

 

That actually doesn't bother me at all.  

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53 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Yeah I'm not sure I like that Quenton Nelson story.  I'm all about giving it everything you have on every play but you can do that and be a good sport.  

 

15 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Yeah, neither do I. 

 

The second part is great, the first part doesn't impress me.

 

As long as he keeps it on the field and is not a dirty player, I am okay with it.  I wouldn't do it that way, but I have seen much worse behavior.

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If history tells us anything, BigQ probably said it at the dinner table, or something, and someone just dubbed that into a mic'd up clip.

 

 

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In terms of the first one, I can see why people dislike it, but I can imagine it is what makes him the player we love.

 

The pancakes and strong finishes will come from his determination to "own" the opposition and that will come from internal processing of them as the enemy. 

 

As long as it works for him and he leaves it on the field, which he seems to do, then I am all for it.

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4 minutes ago, gspdx said:

 Can't say the first part impressed me when I first read it.  But as I thought about it the point is during the game remember they are the enemy.  He didn't say to be a poor sport, to trash talk, spit on, etc.  He just said "don't talk to...".  

 

That actually doesn't bother me at all.  

 

He shouted to his teammate not to talk to members of the other team. How about you don't talk to them if you don't want to, and leave me alone to do as I wish?

 

But what has started to bother me is this cult following for Nelson, where this "macho" attitude or whatever it is is being lauded and applauded, and I kind of don't like it. 

 

Even the viral scream video, when it came out that it was edited, Nelson's reaction wasn't all that appealing to me. He wound up getting fined on that play, and everyone assumes that he would not have been fined if not for the viral video, as if only viral plays get fines. He says he went into the media guy's office, slammed the letter on his desk, and asked for the money. I don't like any of that. It's not the media guy's fault that Nelson threw an illegal block.

 

Look, I'm all about Quenton Nelson, I think he's going to be great for the Colts, I'm glad he's on the team, I'm looking forward to him continuing to establish himself as one of the best in the game. I have no problem with him physically imposing his will on the field, within the rules. But I'm not a big fan of some of this other stuff.

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I think I would need a lot more context than a quote from Keefer to make a judgement.  Were the Colts winning or losing?  Was the guy or guys he was congratulating talking trash all game?  Was it a young player that was playing soft?  There are a bunch of situations where that could be acceptable and a bunch where he's just being a jerk.

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This is why Q is nasty. You need this kind of attitude to be the best you can be. I see nothing wrong with it. If it was to Luck I kind of find it funny.

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As long as he doesn’t get a flag or a fine on the field or arrested off the field, I don’t care what he does.  :dunno:

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I don’t want soft players on my team. This is the kind of attitude the entire team needs. You take a opposing team and you stomp on them. 

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2 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

I don’t want soft players on my team. This is the kind of attitude the entire team needs. You take a opposing team and you stomp on them. 

 

Define soft.

 

If I don't shout at a teammate for talking to the opposing team, it makes me soft? If I talk to members of the opposing team, it makes me soft?

 

This 'we need nasty players' stuff is nonsense.

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15 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

I don’t want soft players on my team. This is the kind of attitude the entire team needs. You take a opposing team and you stomp on them. 

Are you saying Andrew Luck is soft?

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12 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Define soft.

 

If I don't shout at a teammate for talking to the opposing team, it makes me soft? If I talk to members of the opposing team, it makes me soft?

 

This 'we need nasty players' stuff is nonsense.

His attitude will rub off on other teammates. This is the stuff a leader would do. Do you think Brady or any of the patriots is telling a defense good job after a great play. Heck no.

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2 minutes ago, 21isSuperman said:

Are you saying Andrew Luck is soft?

No but Luck could use this kind of attitude.

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1 minute ago, Chloe6124 said:

His attitude will rub off on other teammates. This is the stuff a leader would do. Do you think Brady or any of the patriots is telling a defense good job after a great play. Heck no.

Who cares what the Brady and the Patriots do or don't do?

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48 minutes ago, Superman said:

Even the viral scream video, when it came out that it was edited, Nelson's reaction wasn't all that appealing to me. He wound up getting fined on that play, and everyone assumes that he would not have been fined if not for the viral video, as if only viral plays get fines. He says he went into the media guy's office, slammed the letter on his desk, and asked for the money. I don't like any of that. It's not the media guy's fault that Nelson threw an illegal block.

 

 

Ditto. I felt a bit bad for the media people after hearing the story, because he very well could have been fined either way. I understand that a lot of people thought it was ~cool~ or funny, but I’d hate to have been that media person, Q sounded like a butt. Actually that whole story made me uncomfortable. I thought it was weird how he didn’t even show the slightest enjoyment about how funny that video was. Or how viral it went. Idk.

 

 

Not sure I have an issue with him viewing the other team as “the enemy” during the game, but there are so many unknown factors with that quote.  Could help our team get that nasty edge that gets us to a W. 

 

I should also add, I LOVE how Q is always there to pickup his teammate and celebrate after a good run or play. He really seems to be a good teammate.

 

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23 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Define soft.

 

If I don't shout at a teammate for talking to the opposing team, it makes me soft? If I talk to members of the opposing team, it makes me soft?

 

This 'we need nasty players' stuff is nonsense.

That’s your opinion.....and in my opinion you’re being too sensitive, especially when we don’t know to who or why he said it.  He’s been an excellent teammate so far, if you’ve listened to him mic’d up you pick up on it right away. He’s always one of the first guys to run and help his teammates up off the ground, and is always complementing guys. What he says to or about the enemy that day I couldn’t care less, as long as it stays on the field. And no I do not support purposely hurting guys either, just manhandling them, which seems to be his specialty. Yes we need nasty players, this is football for Pete’s sake.

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As long as they’re playing hard and destroying the opposition I don’t care if they’re nasty, friendly, trash talk or simply ignore the players on the other team, after the play is over.

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39 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

His attitude will rub off on other teammates. This is the stuff a leader would do. Do you think Brady or any of the patriots is telling a defense good job after a great play. Heck no.

 

What @Coffeedrinker said. Who cares about the Patriots?

 

I don't have a problem with the attitude. I just don't get all excited to hear that he's shouting at a teammate because of how they interact with an opposing player. 

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45 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Who cares what the Brady and the Patriots do or don't do?

This is true

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26 minutes ago, HOZER said:

That’s your opinion.....and in my opinion you’re being too sensitive, especially when we don’t know to who or why he said it.  He’s been an excellent teammate so far, if you’ve listened to him mic’d up you pick up on it right away. He’s always one of the first guys to run and help his teammates up off the ground, and is always complementing guys. What he says to or about the enemy that day I couldn’t care less, as long as it stays on the field. And no I do not support purposely hurting guys either, just manhandling them, which seems to be his specialty. Yes we need nasty players, this is football for Pete’s sake.

 

First bolded: Of course it's my opinion. I never offered it as anything more.

 

Second bolded: I'm not offended by it, so I'm not being sensitive at all. My point is that while everyone else is acting like this makes Nelson great, I cringe because I think it's kind of fake toughness, ala Ritchie Incognito. 

 

Third bolded: I never suggested he isn't a good teammate.

 

Fourth bolded: Tough doesn't have to be nasty. Incognito was nasty (and evidently mentally unstable); Suh can be nasty, and it's not endearing. Play hard, dominate your opponent, leave no doubt = tough. Shouting at a teammate for his interaction with the opposing player, or demanding the media guy get your fine covered because you threw an illegal block = fake tough, "macho," and a little over the line. It goes beyond the way the game is played, and speaks more to how you treat other people.

 

And to the part that I underlined and italicized, you might notice that the incidents I'm taking exception to are related to his interaction with his teammates, or members of the Colts staff. Not how he interacts with opponents.

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2 hours ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Yeah I'm not sure I like that Quenton Nelson story.  I'm all about giving it everything you have on every play but you can do that and be a good sport.  

Has nothing to do with being a good sport or not.  And its not at all disrespectful (within those 3 hours of gametime).

  Its a mindset.  Its 100% , full throttle life and death.  And it should be for those 4 quarters lastling about 3,hours every Sunday.

  BTW, its also about being the 1st to help a teammate up, to tirelessly work to improve yourself AND your teammates.  After the game ends, Q is out thrre talkin and shakin hands.

  But for those 3 hours every Sunday, i want him HATING anyone asdociated with the other team, even the stupid mascot.  I want my WHOLE team to feel that way.  Not disrespectful, just not really cordial.  Theres time for that AFTER and he game.  During the game, i want a relentless 100% physical and mental effort to DOMINATE the opponent on EVERY play.  To beat the good teams, you really have to.  we have seen this this year as our OL literally took the steam out of a defensive front.  Multiple times.  You just keep pounding till they break.  No mery.  No mr nice guy.  Just do the play, dominate your guy, and go back to the huddle.  Simple to remember.

 

this year, i'm hoping Big Q puts up a poster in the locker room.

a "Big Q's Pancake Club" poster.

The guy with the most pancakes for the week gets breakfast on Big Q.

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I’m not worried about Nelson.  Everyone says this  locker room was great.  They never said it was great except for Nelson. Besides if he gets out of hand the others will correct him.  I believe that. 

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If Old school Mudd likes it, then so do I. I happen to like the first part. Each member of this team has 52 others to compliment. It’s not about being friendly. This team is labeled soft as it is. I love the attitude Nelson brings. 

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2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

He shouted to his teammate not to talk to members of the other team. How about you don't talk to them if you don't want to, and leave me alone to do as I wish?

 

But what has started to bother me is this cult following for Nelson, where this "macho" attitude or whatever it is is being lauded and applauded, and I kind of don't like it. 

 

Even the viral scream video, when it came out that it was edited, Nelson's reaction wasn't all that appealing to me. He wound up getting fined on that play, and everyone assumes that he would not have been fined if not for the viral video, as if only viral plays get fines. He says he went into the media guy's office, slammed the letter on his desk, and asked for the money. I don't like any of that. It's not the media guy's fault that Nelson threw an illegal block.

 

Look, I'm all about Quenton Nelson, I think he's going to be great for the Colts, I'm glad he's on the team, I'm looking forward to him continuing to establish himself as one of the best in the game. I have no problem with him physically imposing his will on the field, within the rules. But I'm not a big fan of some of this other stuff.

That "other stuff" is the attitude that had our OL playing as good as any team n the league, imo.  This is football, not golf.

i dont think people really watch what is going on in an actual NFL game.  The true down-and-dirty physical and psychological battles.  And what it requires.  None of us do at this level.

There is NO info anywhere that i hav seen regarding his "attitude" other than on the field.  Its a non-issue.

  You want the pancakes, you get this mindset.  They are one and the same.  People are acting like he's going around yelling obscenities at people.  He told his teammate, after he probably just got smashed by the defender to basically not compliment a guy who just schooled ur butt in a very direct way.  He wasnt taunting or talking to the defender.  I just dont see the problem.

i dont want thugs on the team either, but Big Q never gloats, just does his job and goes back to HIS side until the next play.

But hey, what do i know, i dont like to be chummy with my "victims" on the golf course either. I figure, i'll be nice to them AFTER the round when they are paying for my drinks.

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Superman you can talk about showing sportsmanship all you want. Go tell that to the KC fans who threw snowballs at us.

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6 minutes ago, a06cc said:

If Old school Mudd likes it, then so do I. I happen to like the first part. Each member of this team has 52 others to compliment. It’s not about being friendly. This team is labeled soft as it is. I love the attitude Nelson brings. 

What makes you think Mudd likes it?  All he said was, "pretty infectious".  I've been thinking about his response.  And it's impossible to tell what he thinks about it from that statement.  People often use infectious as a negative since it is closely associated with infection.  But on the other hand, if we wants people to catch that attitude then he would say infectious.  Great answer by him.

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57 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

First bolded: Of course it's my opinion. I never offered it as anything more.

Your second post said it was “nonsense,” which I disagree with and said that’s your opinion. The following are my opinions.....

Quote

 

Second bolded: I'm not offended by it, so I'm not being sensitive at all. My point is that while everyone else is acting like this makes Nelson great, I cringe because I think it's kind of fake toughness, ala Ritchie Incognito. 

Fake toughness? Really? He has proven his toughness on the field and was an all pro as a rookie! The guy man handles vets, nothing fake about that.  Nelson to me is the bowling ball of butcher knives that Pagano so desired except for hes not a running back .

Quote

 

Third bolded: I never suggested he isn't a good teammate.

You mentioned him yelling at teamates,  like he’s a big jerk to them, the audio from him being mic’d suggests otherwise. Even if he did, he was probably trying to be a leader and trying to get his teamates into the right mindset to play, at least that would be my interpretation of it.

Quote

 

Fourth bolded: Tough doesn't have to be nasty. Incognito was nasty (and evidently mentally unstable); Suh can be nasty, and it's not endearing. Play hard, dominate your opponent, leave no doubt = tough. Shouting at a teammate for his interaction with the opposing player, or demanding the media guy get your fine covered because you threw an illegal block = fake tough, "macho," and a little over the line. It goes beyond the way the game is played, and speaks more to how you treat other people.

Terrible comparisons. Incognito is a proven psychopath and Suh is a thug who purposely hurts opponents and can’t control his temper. Nelson “yelled” at a teammate???? That makes him like those two, or shows he is trending in that direction? Teamates yell at teamates, in all sports. Peyton manning yelled at his teamates. Lebron  James tells at his teamates. Heck I bet Tiger Woods even yelled at his caddy. It happens in the heat of competition, tempers flare, feelings get hurt, you move on. I’ve played many contact sports, it’s part of it. And the teams with players that were mean and nasty on the field or in the ring won more then the ones who got thier feelings hurt easily. The whole media incident is silly, he probably wouldn’t have even been fined if the media guy wouldn’t have brought so much attention to it with the fake sound bite. There was nothing fake about him confronting the guy, it took cahones IMO because there could have been repercussions to him doing that.

Quote

 

And to the part that I underlined and italicized, you might notice that the incidents I'm taking exception to are related to his interaction with his teammates, or members of the Colts staff. Not how he interacts with opponents.

And you’ll notice I said to or about, meaning what he says to his teamates about the opposing team, like telling his teamates not to talk to opposing players.

 

No matter what people will find things to complain about, I get it.

 

Again, it’s football for Pete’s sake!!! 

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1 minute ago, Coffeedrinker said:

What makes you think Mudd likes it?  All he said was, "pretty infectious".  I've been thinking about his response.  And it's impossible to tell what he thinks about it from that statement.  People often use infectious as a negative since it is closely associated with infection.  But on the other hand, if we wants people to catch that attitude then he would say infectious.  Great answer by him.

Why do you think he came back for coaching? That attitude Nelson has needs to become infectious. 

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15 minutes ago, a06cc said:

Why do you think he came back for coaching? That attitude Nelson has needs to become infectious. 

Could be, but it probably has more to do with the talent and ability of the oline and less to do with attitude.

 

I've followed Mudd's career for years and I've never heard him talk about wanting or liking players that are, to use some of the words in this thread, nasty.

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2 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

No but Luck could use this kind of attitude.

How would that make his game any better?  He's one of the league's best QBs with his current approach; why would be need to change that?

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22 minutes ago, HOZER said:

 

No matter what people will find things to complain about, I get it.

 

Again, it’s football for Pete’s sake!!! 

I don't need to speak for @Superman but I will say, Superman wasn't complaining, he just stated he didn't like it.  the rest of the time he's been explaining and defending his viewpoint to posters who wanted to tell him how wrong he is to not like it.

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