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Jacoby Brissett

Are Colts fans overvaluing or undervaluing Jacoby Brissett?  

114 members have voted

  1. 1. Are Colts fans overvaluing or undervaluing Jacoby Brissett?

    • Overvaluing
      78
    • Undervaluing
      37


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37 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

I apologize in advance for my following comments...    I’ve said this before and I know it bothers some.   But it can’t be helped.   And a heads up...   this will be a long post. 

 

You know who I am, right?    Media guy.   30 years in the business.   I can spot a badly written or thought through article a mile away.

 

I don’t believe Stampede Blue (which I like but don’t love) is monitized.  That means they don’t make money.   The people who work on the site are, for the most part,  not professional.    They’re just members who have shown enough and are devoted enough to do the work for free.   Doesn’t mean they know proper valuations and what makes a fair and proper deal.  

 

By the way,  in the interest of fairness Colts.com stole Stampede’s best writer a year ago and he now works for us.  Forgive me, I’m having a senior moment and I can’t temember his name, but he’s good and I am very happy we stole him.  

 

The other site had Brissett rated with Jimmy Garapollo.   I rolled my eyes the moment I read that.   These are written BY fans FOR fans.   I know amateur work when I read it.   

 

I don't have to agree with a writer to know if he’s a good professional writer or not.  I disagree with plenty of professionals.   It’s about the explanations they give for the positions they take.  It’s about the arguments they can make to support a position.   

 

Sorry,  I’m a pro and I recognize other pros and I also can spot a Fan Boy amateur.   And that’s what I thought of those two articles.   You’re free to disagree, I’m just explaining my position.

 

Apologies again for dropping the “Do you know who I am?” card.  I’m not comfortable doing that,  but I never know who does and doesn’t know my background.   Media is my area of expertise.  

I accept your apology but as a professional, please go a little easy on us amateurs. After all it is an opinion board.

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13 minutes ago, hoosierhawk said:

I accept your apology but as a professional, please go a little easy on us amateurs. After all it is an opinion board.

Much appreciated.

 

And I understand it’s an opinion board.  I’m posting less and less the last few years.   I’m also responding less and less to the mock drafts and off-season posts that people here make.   I’ve been trying to make an effort to get into fewer and fewer fights here on the website.

 

Again, I only got into it with that one poster because he seemed determined to attack me at all costs.   Since I hadn’t attacked him at all,  I was caught off guard by the fight.  I was simply trying to brush him off. 

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1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

Much appreciated.

 

And I understand it’s an opinion board.  I’m posting less and less the last few years.   I’m also responding less and less to the mock drafts and off-season posts that people here make.   I’ve been trying to make an effort to get into fewer and fewer fights here on the website.

 

Again, I only got into it with that one poster because he seemed determined to attack me at all costs.   Since I hadn’t attacked him at all,  I was caught off guard by the fight.  I was simply trying to brush him off. 

Keep posting. Enjoy your posts, especially concerning Stanford.

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Holder is reporting today that the Colts have been in dialogue with backup QB's ,plural, but he wouldn't read anything into it regarding Brissett.  Okay.  But if everyone thinks Brissett is going nowhere and we are all set why would you be talking to other backup QB's now considering all of the other positions we have to strengthen?   Nothing to it or they think there is a chance and they have to be ready? 

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47 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Holder is reporting today that the Colts have been in dialogue with backup QB's ,plural, but he wouldn't read anything into it regarding Brissett.  Okay.  But if everyone thinks Brissett is going nowhere and we are all set why would you be talking to other backup QB's now considering all of the other positions we have to strengthen?   Nothing to it or they think there is a chance and they have to be ready? 

 

Because you need more than one backup QB during the offseason, and Philip Walker isn't good.

 

Edit: The guy that Holder says the Colts were interested in is a CFL QB, so this is the time to work on getting him on an NFL roster, before the CFL season gets underway. It's CFL free agency right now.

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8 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Because you need more than one backup QB during the offseason, and Philip Walker isn't good.

 

Edit: The guy that Holder says the Colts were interested in is a CFL QB, so this is the time to work on getting him on an NFL roster, before the CFL season gets underway. It's CFL free agency right now.

It may also be because if there is action on Brissett, you'd better be prepared with a backup plan. I suspect that the way the draft falls will have a significant impact upon a Brissett trade. If an offer is forthcoming, I doubt the Colts will get a real one until Day 1 is over, and the dust has settled. 

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39 minutes ago, Hoose said:

It may also be because if there is action on Brissett, you'd better be prepared with a backup plan. I suspect that the way the draft falls will have a significant impact upon a Brissett trade. If an offer is forthcoming, I doubt the Colts will get a real one until Day 1 is over, and the dust has settled. 

 

I'm sure they have a handful of Plan B QBs, if someone makes a legit offer for Brissett. This Mitchell guy is a hot commodity, though, and Holder makes it seem like the ship has sailed for him and the Colts. 

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1 hour ago, Hoose said:

It may also be because if there is action on Brissett, you'd better be prepared with a backup plan. I suspect that the way the draft falls will have a significant impact upon a Brissett trade. If an offer is forthcoming, I doubt the Colts will get a real one until Day 1 is over, and the dust has settled. 

 

Simply my opinion, but a backup QB's primary existence (in a system like ours, and Luck's age) should be 1) get through short term injury situations (like a couple snaps or a few games), and 2) take useless snaps when the game is already decided. It should be someone who is a good game manager and familiar with the existing system, and someone that's either on a cheaper rookie contract, or a reasonable experienced journeyman.

 

A backup should not be someone expected to play a bunch, cost a ton, or have a problem being a proverbial backup. Now it's different perhaps for a team that has a run heavy QB, but not for the Colts. 

 

We only picked up Jacoby because of the long term injury to Luck. He was a great pick up given the situation (Luck's injury, duration of injury, and Jacoby's contract situation). Things are different now. Luck is back to being Luck, Jacoby's in his final contract year, etc. I don't see Ballard paying to keep him after 2019, nor do I see Jacoby wanting to stay. If Jacoby is who I think he is, he wants to start, and will go to a place that gives him opportunity. 

 

Our best bet is either to 1) trade him this year if we can get a third or better pick, or 2) if we can't, ride out his contract and potentially get a comp pick in 2020 (which we can use on another backup). If we trade him this year, not sure the "plan" is anything much more than a 3rd or later pick that will allow us to lock in someone for 4 years. And whoever we pick up, assuming Luck is healthy, just needs to be a game manager type, and a good fit for the system. If Luck goes down long term, I'm happy with losing and getting a better draft for the next year. If he's out for an extended time (like 2017), then things change, just like when we traded for Jacoby.

 

My guess, Indy and Miami work out a player swap (not draft picks). They'll likely draft a run heavy QB in the 1st, will need a 1 year transition guy, and won't want to give up draft picks to get one.

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On 2/24/2019 at 8:14 PM, crazycolt1 said:

I totally agree.

Ballard has said he liked having Brissett around for insurance in case Luck missed any games. Has said he sleeps better at night. :dunno:

I am curious as to know if Brissett would stay if Ballard offered him a fair contract? I don't know what that number would be either.

I think we have a lot of good info on his market value, especially if NO ONE comes kicking the tires.  If that happens, or we only get back up worthy offers, then he may assess a good paying back up job here looks better than he may have thought.  

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personally i picked undervalued but think i value him just at what hes at. hes better than some starters.  we forget that last season we could have finished MUCH better if our coach wasnt checked out and he made mistakes only in the end of the game.

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2 hours ago, JPFolks said:

I think we have a lot of good info on his market value, especially if NO ONE comes kicking the tires.  If that happens, or we only get back up worthy offers, then he may assess a good paying back up job here looks better than he may have thought.  

I could be wrong but I think Ballard said he hasn't received any offer yet so we wait and see I guess.

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7 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

I could be wrong but I think Ballard said he hasn't received any offer yet so we wait and see I guess.

 

 I think we DO have good info on his market value, especially BECAUSE Ballard has said NO ONE has come kicking the tires SO FAR. 
 That is what I got from JP's comment. 
 I know i hope there is interest before the trade deadline.

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12 hours ago, JPFolks said:

I think we have a lot of good info on his market value, especially if NO ONE comes kicking the tires. 

 

 

Too early and too many options for teams right now. Down the road?

 

12 hours ago, JPFolks said:

If that happens, or we only get back up worthy offers, then he may assess a good paying back up job here looks better than he may have thought.  

 

If he gets only backup offers, he may assess of them where the starter is often injured, and/ or on a short leash.  The potential to get in and 'take over' is higher there than holding a clipboard for Luck.  Andrew has learned the hard way how being overly aggressive can be hazardous (kidney, shoulder issues). So JB isn't getting in unless the unthinkable should happen.

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6 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 I think we DO have good info on his market value, especially BECAUSE Ballard has said NO ONE has come kicking the tires SO FAR. 
 That is what I got from JP's comment. 
 I know i hope there is interest before the trade deadline.

I think you mis read my comment.  I never said anything about his market value.

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IMO, it's too early to get "starter" offers. JB is a tweener at this point. Great back-up and potential starter. Teams looking for a starter are going to see what falls out in the draft, and preferably lock someone in to a rookie contract if possible. Those unhappy with what is available, or those with bigger other needs, will come calling during the draft, or post draft depending on how things shake out. 

 

I would not be shocked to see him go to Miami, TN, or Jax. QB is not deep this year. If I'm a team with a QB need, I'd go JB before I'd reach for 2nd tier in the draft. JB would be much cheaper, and you'd have one year to kick the tires.

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4 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

IMO, it's too early to get "starter" offers. JB is a tweener at this point. Great back-up and potential starter. Teams looking for a starter are going to see what falls out in the draft, and preferably lock someone in to a rookie contract if possible. Those unhappy with what is available, or those with bigger other needs, will come calling during the draft, or post draft depending on how things shake out. 

 

I would not be shocked to see him go to Miami, TN, or Jax. QB is not deep this year. If I'm a team with a QB need, I'd go JB before I'd reach for 2nd tier in the draft. JB would be much cheaper, and you'd have one year to kick the tires.

 

:facepalm:

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10 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

IMO, it's too early to get "starter" offers. JB is a tweener at this point. Great back-up and potential starter. Teams looking for a starter are going to see what falls out in the draft, and preferably lock someone in to a rookie contract if possible. Those unhappy with what is available, or those with bigger other needs, will come calling during the draft, or post draft depending on how things shake out. 

 

I would tend to agree with this

 

Briskett IS a "tweener" with some potential. The unknown is what is his true ceiling.

 

I like most of what I saw from him last year.  

 

Because there are some decent QBs in play that may slide, I dont see a deal before the draft, if there is one to be had

 

During the draft, you may see some calls for him if the top QBs all go early

There are some QBs in the draft, going to me slotted for the 3rd and 4th round this year.  

 

The question that a GM has to have is, which is more of a risk Brissett who has a sample of experiene or a rookie coming out

 

It will all play out

 

There is at least a 50/50 chance that Brisett is on our sideline this year

 

 

 

 

Deano

 

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18 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

I think you mis read my comment.  I never said anything about his market value.

 

  I was thinking the nuance of what JPFolks was saying went over your head.
 Because of course YOU DID talk about Market Value when you wrote about "fair value" and what that might be for Brissett. And his response to Your post showed a knowledge about NO One calling "kicking tires" on Brissett.

 I'm just having me some fun with how posts are interpreted and the different wave lengths posters think at.
 Enjoy your day. 

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4 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

I would tend to agree with this

 

Briskett IS a "tweener" with some potential. The unknown is what is his true ceiling.

 

I like most of what I saw from him last year.  

 

Because there are some decent QBs in play that may slide, I dont see a deal before the draft, if there is one to be had

 

During the draft, you may see some calls for him if the top QBs all go early

There are some QBs in the draft, going to me slotted for the 3rd and 4th round this year.  

 

The question that a GM has to have is, which is more of a risk Brissett who has a sample of experiene or a rookie coming out

 

It will all play out

 

There is at least a 50/50 chance that Brisett is on our sideline this year

 

 

 

 

Deano

 

Personally, if my teams needs a QB, but has other big holes, i'd be open to giving up a 3rd round pick for JB. you know what you're getting more so than reaching with a guy like Thorson, Finley, Stidham, etc.. There's 3, maybe 5 good QBs in the draft. And they all are likely gone after the first round. Everyone else is a stretch, or a project. Even QBs 4 and 5 (Jones and Grier) are stretches to me, and wouldn't want to use a 1st on them. 

 

I'm good with JB staying. We'll get a comp pick if he leaves later. I'd rather have another pick now though

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15 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

I would not be shocked to see him go to Miami, TN, or Jax. 

we wont trade him to the jags or titans.  he hasnt done enough for them to make a crazy big offer, and a realistic trade could help them more than we would want

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1 hour ago, aaron11 said:

we wont trade him to the jags or titans.  he hasnt done enough for them to make a crazy big offer, and a realistic trade could help them more than we would want

i disagree. it's not like we're trading pro bowler. i'd rather send JB, then for them to get a 1st round QB.  i think we'd send him anywhere so long as Ballard got what he wanted. i also doubt Ballard would hold him back from a potential starting gig. We shall see.

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Per Pro Football Rumors;  Tony Pauline of draftanaylst.com is reporting per sources at the combine that the Colts "Would demand a second round draft choice "for Jacoby Brissett.  Their reasoning is if he signs a contract next year with another team the contract he receives would then turn into a third round compensatory pick.  Therefore if you want him a year early on a cheap contract the price is a 2nd.  They are very high on Brissett as we know.

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31 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Per Pro Football Rumors;  Tony Pauline of draftanaylst.com is reporting per sources at the combine that the Colts "Would demand a second round draft choice "for Jacoby Brissett.  Their reasoning is if he signs a contract next year with another team the contract he receives would then turn into a third round compensatory pick.  Therefore if you want him a year early on a cheap contract the price is a 2nd.  They are very high on Brissett as we know.

just part of the sales pitch/game i'd imagine. Ballard isn't going to say out loud, "hey we'll take a 3rd or 4th for him cause we want to get rid of him before he leaves as a FA".... 

 

like i said earlier, it's too early to expect any real offers. top FA QBs and others top guys on the block will be the first to drop. JB's situation to me says any action at all will happen right around (before or after), the draft. i could see Ballard preferring a personnel trade too.  

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6 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

just part of the sales pitch/game i'd imagine. Ballard isn't going to say out loud, "hey we'll take a 3rd or 4th for him cause we want to get rid of him before he leaves as a FA".... 

 

like i said earlier, it's too early to expect any real offers. top FA QBs and others top guys on the block will be the first to drop. JB's situation to me says any action at all will happen right around (before or after), the draft. i could see Ballard preferring a personnel trade too.  

 

I not so sure it is part of a sales process.  If he does leave as a FA, odds are the Colts would get a 3rd round comp pick for him.  Why would they take anything less than a 2 for him this year, especially since he is on his rookie contract?

 

That being said, I am not sure another team would be willing to give up a 2nd round pick.

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10 minutes ago, Cynjin said:

 

I not so sure it is part of a sales process.  If he does leave as a FA, odds are the Colts would get a 3rd round comp pick for him.  Why would they take anything less than a 2 for him this year, especially since he is on his rookie contract?

 

That being said, I am not sure another team would be willing to give up a 2nd round pick.

a third round pick this year, is worth more than a third round pick next year. it's that simple. the whole "i want a second now, or i'll take a third later" is nothing but sales theater to me. 

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1 minute ago, Irish YJ said:

a third round pick this year, is worth more than a third round pick next year. it's that simple. the whole "i want a second now, or i'll take a third later" is nothing but sales theater to me. 

 

I'm not sure what you base the bolded on.

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1 hour ago, Irish YJ said:

i disagree. it's not like we're trading pro bowler. i'd rather send JB, then for them to get a 1st round QB.  i think we'd send him anywhere so long as Ballard got what he wanted. i also doubt Ballard would hold him back from a potential starting gig. We shall see.

i would be shocked if they didnt take a qb in the first at this point.  they could even trade up from #7

 

they would have to be pretty high on JB to trade for him with one year remaining on his contract when they can get a 5 year deal on a rookie.  i still think the colts would be reluctant to send him there, but i doubt we will find out

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5 minutes ago, Cynjin said:

 

I'm not sure what you base the bolded on.

 

simple economics. just like a dollar, having a draft pick now is always worth more this year, than next. 

 

a third round pick next year doesn't help you on the field this year. a third round pick this year can. 

 

3 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

i would be shocked if they didnt take a qb in the first at this point.  they could even trade up from #7

 

they would have to be pretty high on JB to trade for him with one year remaining on his contract when they can get a 5 year deal on a rookie.  i still think the colts would be reluctant to send him there, but i doubt we will find out

 

which team are you talking about? i listed 3

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16 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

 

 

simple economics. just like a dollar, having a draft pick now is always worth more this year, than next. 

 

a third round pick next year doesn't help you on the field this year. a third round pick this year can. 

 

 

which team are you talking about? i listed 3

im talking about Jacksonville. 

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37 minutes ago, Cynjin said:

 

I not so sure it is part of a sales process.  If he does leave as a FA, odds are the Colts would get a 3rd round comp pick for him.  Why would they take anything less than a 2 for him this year, especially since he is on his rookie contract?

 

That being said, I am not sure another team would be willing to give up a 2nd round pick.

 

I think it’s highly unlikely that Brissett would bring the Colts a 3rd round comp pick.   Those picks are determined in large part on the size of the FA contract he signs.

 

Do you see Brissett signing a FA deal that averages more than $10 mill a year?    I sure don’t.   And that’s about what it would take.

 

So if we keep JB one more year the Colts would more likeky be looking at a 4 or a 5 as a comp pick.   A 3 is a long shot. 

 

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16 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

 

 

simple economics. just like a dollar, having a draft pick now is always worth more this year, than next. 

 

a third round pick next year doesn't help you on the field this year. a third round pick this year can. 

 

 

 

That depends on who is available and who is drafted, it is not anything like money.  Also, having JB this year is more valuable to another team than having him next year since he is still on his rookie contract.  Next year he will be much more expensive to sign.

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1 hour ago, Cynjin said:

 

I not so sure it is part of a sales process.  If he does leave as a FA, odds are the Colts would get a 3rd round comp pick for him.  Why would they take anything less than a 2 for him this year, especially since he is on his rookie contract?

 

That being said, I am not sure another team would be willing to give up a 2nd round pick.

 

The odds are we will get nothing for him if we keep him next season and let him go.
We Are going to sign more FA than we let go, so that will wipe out us getting ANY comp picks.

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Just now, NewColtsFan said:

 

I think it’s highly unlikely that Brissett would bring the Colts a 3rd round comp pick.   Those picks are determined in large part on the size of the FA contract he signs.

 

Do you see Brissett signing a FA deal that averages more than $10 mill a year?    I sure don’t.   And that’s about what it would take.

 

So if we keep JB one more year the Colts would more likeky be looking at a 4 or a 5 as a comp pick.   A 3 is a long shot. 

 

 

If he leaves, odds are it will be for the opportunity to start.  Starting QBs get more than 10mil a year, unless they are on their rookie contracts.  So, yes if he leaves I believe he will probably get more than 10mil.  Could I be wrong, absolutely.

 

If he is just leaving to be a back up, he might as well stay here.

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Just now, throwing BBZ said:

 

The odds are we will get nothing for him if we keep him next season and let him go.
We Are going to sign more FA than we let go, so that will wipe out us getting ANY comp picks.

 

That could happen as well, depending on what happens in free agency next year.

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59 minutes ago, Cynjin said:

 

If he leaves, odds are it will be for the opportunity to start.  Starting QBs get more than 10mil a year, unless they are on their rookie contracts.  So, yes if he leaves I believe he will probably get more than 10mil.  Could I be wrong, absolutely.

 

If he is just leaving to be a back up, he might as well stay here.

 

Honestly...   I don’t know the rules on signing a contract with bonuses or “escalators”? 

 

So Brissett could hypothetically sign a deal as a high priced backup with escalators that could eventually pay him starters money depending on how many games he starts.   He might make an additional $400-500k every game he starts.   His $6 mill contract could easily turn into $12 mill or more.

 

What I don’t know is how those numbers get computed to determine the comp pick formula.

 

Perhaps @Superman knows?   This might be a deep dive for good info. 

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1 hour ago, aaron11 said:

im talking about Jacksonville. 

 

it's a toss up right now with mocks between QB and Edge. NFL.com for instance has them taking an Edge with their first pick. some mocks have them trading up to get a QB.

 

i'm a fan of building the lines before getting a franchise QB. i'd prefer like NFL.com to have a high edge with that early pick. and if they do that, JB would be a great one year plan to bridge till they are ready to take a QB. and if he works out, resign him, and you're not looking for an early round QB anymore.

 

1 hour ago, Cynjin said:

 

That depends on who is available and who is drafted, it is not anything like money.  Also, having JB this year is more valuable to another team than having him next year since he is still on his rookie contract.  Next year he will be much more expensive to sign.

 it's exactly like money. to say it's not is silly.  sure the draft is a crap shoot, but that goes for every year. being able to invest today, or have a player that can contribute today, is more valuable than having that same player next year. and there's not even a guarantee we'd get 3rd or 4th next year (although I think it's a fair shot). Right now he's nothing more than an unproductive insurance policy. i do agree, a team benefits from getting him this year. they can kick the tires for a year without committing to what will be more money next. 

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1 hour ago, Cynjin said:

 

If he leaves, odds are it will be for the opportunity to start.  Starting QBs get more than 10mil a year, unless they are on their rookie contracts.  So, yes if he leaves I believe he will probably get more than 10mil.  Could I be wrong, absolutely.

 

If he is just leaving to be a back up, he might as well stay here.

 

  Today, i would think his best hope is to replace someone injured like he came here, or to just get a chance to compete with someone that has issues.

 Minus large incentives, that $10M threshold is significant, and would still be leveraged against the total of our FA signings, not just be an automatic comp based on his individual contract. I would bet you know this so this is for all readers.
 And no doubt if he didn't like his FA situation, he could get paid reasonablly to stay here for a year.

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8 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

  Today, i would think his best hope is to replace someone injured like he came here, or to just get a chance to compete with someone that has issues.

 Minus large incentives, that $10M threshold is significant, and would still be leveraged against the total of our FA signings, not just be an automatic comp based on his individual contract. I would bet you know this so this is for all readers.
 And no doubt if he didn't like his FA situation, he could get paid reasonablly to stay here for a year.

we have a lot of contracts expiring in 2020, so it won't be just JB. we could lose several FAs. Doyle, Ebron, Castonzo, Sheard, Clark, are the high dollar ones, but many more.

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2 hours ago, Cynjin said:

 

If he leaves, odds are it will be for the opportunity to start.  Starting QBs get more than 10mil a year, unless they are on their rookie contracts.  So, yes if he leaves I believe he will probably get more than 10mil.  Could I be wrong, absolutely.

 

If he is just leaving to be a back up, he might as well stay here.

i doubt anyone will promise him a starting job if he hits FA, but i could see him leaving to some place where he has a better chance to compete for the job. we all know hes not going to beat a healthy andrew luck

 

id like to see him traded for an asset we will actually use, but unfortunately there are not many teams in need right now, and the ones that are ended up with high picks. 

 

 

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