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Marcus Johnson

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Do you guys think Marcus Johnson will be on the roster next season?

 

We traded for him and he seemed to be contributing before his unfortunate injury.

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He's got the size and speed....knows the system....and has a couple seasons of seasoning behind him. He's a converted QB just like Cain. He's got as good a chance as Pascal, Ishmael, Cain and Fountain....

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11 hours ago, Scott Pennock said:

He's got the size and speed....knows the system....and has a couple seasons of seasoning behind him. He's a converted QB just like Cain. He's got as good a chance as Pascal, Ishmael, Cain and Fountain....

 

I am not sure there is anything more overrated than "knows the system."

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11 hours ago, Scott Pennock said:

He's got the size and speed....knows the system....and has a couple seasons of seasoning behind him. He's a converted QB just like Cain. He's got as good a chance as Pascal, Ishmael, Cain and Fountain....

We have some young athletes who could do some things at WR. Johnson is not just the most experienced but also the fastest in that group. I think he has a great shot at the 53 man. He will get a full camp this year. 

 

Fountain is a kid who still intrigues me. He didn't get a combine invite but his pro day 42.5 vertical and 11'2" broad jump would have been tops in the WR group.  I'm not discouraged at all by his rookie year. We knew he needed time. His physical tools are rare.  

 

Cain is on track to be ready this summer as well. It should be an exciting camp from a position group many see as lacking. 

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1 hour ago, jskinnz said:

 

I am not sure there is anything more overrated than "knows the system."

 

Not sure if you're joking, but 'knows the system' is a huge advantage over someone coming in cold.

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33 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

 

Not sure if you're joking, but 'knows the system' is a huge advantage over someone coming in cold.

 

Not joking at all.

 

More talent in a guy who needs to learn the system is far superior to a guy with minimal talent but knows the system.  WR is not a substitute for a NASA engineer.  The system can be learned.

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50 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

 

Not joking at all.

 

More talent in a guy who needs to learn the system is far superior to a guy with minimal talent but knows the system.  WR is not a substitute for a NASA engineer.  The system can be learned.

I think it depends on what time of the year. Off season? Doesn't mean as much. Late addition or in season? I have seen that aspect used a great deal in FA acquisition. 

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3 hours ago, jskinnz said:

 

I am not sure there is anything more overrated than "knows the system."

 

In a sense, maybe. But...

 

1 hour ago, Smonroe said:

 

Not sure if you're joking, but 'knows the system' is a huge advantage over someone coming in cold.

 

True in that is how JAG journeymen make their NFL living.  Some bounce from team to team over many years.  They go to other teams that have the same system(s).  Generally, the most they need to learn would be different 'language', not new plays.

 

It helps a lot during the season when a guy is suddenly needed, and like yesterday. Would get a nod over a slightly more talented guy that only knows a different system/scheme.

 

But from a training camp perspective, there is plenty of time for all players to learn the system(s) as they gets installed in mini and training camps. Knowing the system might be an advantage in the first week or two...  maybe.

 

Except QB's...  that's a horse of a different color.

530537432_f7ea35383a.jpg

 

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2 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

In a sense, maybe. But...

 

 

True in that is how JAG journeymen make their NFL living.  Some bounce from team to team over many years.  They go to other teams that have the same system(s).  Generally, the most they need to learn would be different 'language', not new plays.

 

It helps a lot during the season when a guy is suddenly needed, and like yesterday. Would get a nod over a slightly more talented guy that only knows a different system/scheme.

 

But from a training camp perspective, there is plenty of time for all players to learn the system(s) as they gets installed in mini and training camps. Knowing the system might be an advantage in the first week or two...  maybe.

 

Except QB's...  that's a horse of a different color.

530537432_f7ea35383a.jpg

 

 

This. Should have added this clarity. 

 

In season it lessens the ramp ramp up time. See Inman. But in pre season / training camp the system familiarity is a non issue

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On 2/9/2019 at 11:48 AM, jskinnz said:

 

This. Should have added this clarity. 

 

In season it lessens the ramp ramp up time. See Inman. But in pre season / training camp the system familiarity is a non issue

 

I agree to some extent, but I still think it's somewhat of an issue, especially for young, unproven guys.  

 

There's that old saying about first impressions being lasting impressions and if a guy fighting for the 5-6 WR spot with half a dozen other guys can come in day 1 making good impressions it can definitely go a long way (e.g., probably getting thrown to by a back up QB also fighting to make the roster and if the WR can win the trust of the QB right out of the gate it can go a long way).  Also, a lot of what separates the guys who make the final roster vs. the practice squad or getting waived can come down to confidence (and in some instances luck, which, IMO, you have better odds at having better luck if you're prepared and know a system right out of the gate than if you've got to spend a few weeks trying to learn it).  

 

In terms of having a plug-and-play guy that can fill in mid-season, familiarity with the system is absolutely an issue.  In terms of it being an issue in training camp, I don't think it's as much of an issue, but if you can come in and start making good impressions from day 1 as opposed to day 14, it certainly cannot hurt your chance of getting noticed by the coaching staff in a positive way.

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On 2/9/2019 at 7:37 AM, akcolt said:

We have some young athletes who could do some things at WR. Johnson is not just the most experienced but also the fastest in that group. I think he has a great shot at the 53 man. He will get a full camp this year. 

 

Fountain is a kid who still intrigues me. He didn't get a combine invite but his pro day 42.5 vertical and 11'2" broad jump would have been tops in the WR group.  I'm not discouraged at all by his rookie year. We knew he needed time. His physical tools are rare.  

 

Cain is on track to be ready this summer as well. It should be an exciting camp from a position group many see as lacking. 

I think Cain, Fountain, Johnson and Ishmael will be why you don't see us make a whole bunch of moves at WR.  At least not what people are hoping will happen.

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1 hour ago, krunk said:

I think Cain, Fountain, Johnson and Ishmael will be why you don't see us make a whole bunch of moves at WR.  At least not what people are hoping will happen.

 

That would be disappointing...especially with a deep draft class. For two straight years, they have tried the cheap approach at WR. Luck is back and healthy...time to give him some legit weapons at WR.

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19 minutes ago, shastamasta said:

 

That would be disappointing...especially with a deep draft class. For two straight years, they have tried the cheap approach at WR. Luck is back and healthy...time to give him some legit weapons at WR.

Not to me.  It doesn't mean they won't draft a guy, but I do think it means we won't go out and draft 2, 3 or 4 like some may be thinking.  Between the young guys we already have plus FA I think it will actually be pretty easy to fill the WR issue.

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4 hours ago, shastamasta said:

 

That would be disappointing...especially with a deep draft class. For two straight years, they have tried the cheap approach at WR. Luck is back and healthy...time to give him some legit weapons at WR.

I completely agree. Maybe one of those young guys steps up...maybe, but the Colts need a thoroughbred across from TY. Time to invest in one instead of hoping to get lucky with a stable full of nags. 

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That ankle was at least his second "unfortunate injury" since he was a UDFA in 2016. He has a grand total of 12 touches --- 11 receptions for 147 yards, one rushing attempt for -2 yards, and one touchdown to show for his three years in the NFL. I wouldn't expect to see him make the 53-man roster, or even the practice squad. 

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7 hours ago, HarryTheCat said:

That ankle was at least his second "unfortunate injury" since he was a UDFA in 2016. He has a grand total of 12 touches --- 11 receptions for 147 yards, one rushing attempt for -2 yards, and one touchdown to show for his three years in the NFL. I wouldn't expect to see him make the 53-man roster, or even the practice squad. 

 

Exactly.  Why is this nobody even being discussed?  Not even an NFL caliber player, yet some of you people actually want to waste a roster spot on Marcus Johnson.

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On 2/9/2019 at 8:32 AM, jskinnz said:

 

I am not sure there is anything more overrated than "knows the system."

 

Dontrelle Inman would like to have a word with you. 

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I think Johnson should be brought back to compete at a minimum.   You got 3 guys who have nice size and can get deep between Cain, Fountain, and Johnson.  And you've got a good possesion guy with nice size and hands in Steve Ishmael.  To me these are young pieces you keep for your competition.  You can still draft a guy like Deebo Samuel or somebody to go along with that.  My gut is Ballard probably won't draft any more than 1 WR. 

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On 2/9/2019 at 11:36 AM, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

In a sense, maybe. But...

 

 

True in that is how JAG journeymen make their NFL living.  Some bounce from team to team over many years.  They go to other teams that have the same system(s).  Generally, the most they need to learn would be different 'language', not new plays.

 

It helps a lot during the season when a guy is suddenly needed, and like yesterday. Would get a nod over a slightly more talented guy that only knows a different system/scheme.

 

But from a training camp perspective, there is plenty of time for all players to learn the system(s) as they gets installed in mini and training camps. Knowing the system might be an advantage in the first week or two...  maybe.

 

Except QB's...  that's a horse of a different color.

530537432_f7ea35383a.jpg

 

 

 100% disagree.  I believe the statement that the biggest jump a player makes is going from Year one to Year two is factual. Not from week one to week 2.
 THAT is all about being in the system. 
 Being on the same page as the guys around you, knowing your job, insatnt adjustments against all opponents, all situations, especially with your QB, more often takes more than one season. Or even two. To me That is what knowing the system is.
 It took Eb a half a season and then some to add some complication to his "Simple Zone" D. And i bet you believe he looks forward to adding considerably more to his system with more talent and more players with experienced in his system . 
 The best teams have their core having lots of players with 4-7 years of experience.
 The BEST reason to Keep your own. Experience in the system allows you to teach the new players their jobs in meetings, through good reps in practice and games. 
 Just elaborating for all readers as i am sure you could add much to this.

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45 minutes ago, krunk said:

I think Johnson should be brought back to compete at a minimum.   You got 3 guys who have nice size and can get deep between Cain, Fountain, and Johnson.  And you've got a good possesion guy with nice size and hands in Steve Ishmael.  To me these are young pieces you keep for your competition.  You can still draft a guy like Deebo Samuel or somebody to go along with that.  My gut is Ballard probably won't draft any more than 1 WR. 

 

 CB will want a steady flow of players with 2,3,4+ years of experience with Andrew to win Big with. A couple have a good shot being here awhile. lol
 

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1 hour ago, lollygagger8 said:

 

Dontrelle Inman would like to have a word with you. 

 

Mid-season pick up - you are correct.

 

For anyone in pre-season, OTA, training camp which is where this conversation was going - it is not important.

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36 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 100% disagree.  I believe the statement that the biggest jump a player makes is going from Year one to Year two is factual. Not from week one to week 2.
 THAT is all about being in the system. 
 Being on the same page as the guys around you, knowing your job, insatnt adjustments against all opponents, all situations, especially with your QB, more often takes more than one season. Or even two. To me That is what knowing the system is.
 It took Eb a half a season and then some to add some complication to his "Simple Zone" D. And i bet you believe he looks forward to adding considerably more to his system with more talent and more players with experienced in his system . 
 The best teams have their core having lots of players with 4-7 years of experience.
 The BEST reason to Keep your own. Experience in the system allows you to teach the new players their jobs in meetings, through good reps in practice and games. 
 Just elaborating for all readers as i am sure you could add much to this.

 

What's the argument?  I feel system is not overrated by and large.  However, I feel Elite players can excel in any system.  OTOH, even good players have proven to show some difficulty (4-3 D player going to a 3-4, West Coast offense guy going to Air Coryell) converting over.  Most guys move to teams with similar systems because of  it. And I am a draft and pay your own fan, not a FA spendthrift. (but not against getting good ones at good/fair value)

 

Young players that do not pickup the playbook/system quickly in camp often get put on the PS and run the scout team at practice and study their playbook at night. If fortunate, they might ride the pine and play ST's learning the playbook/system. Get a rotation or two here and there.  Then maybe year 2 they make bigger strides. 

 

Anybody remember this when our round 2 best CB in the SEC wasn't playing?

 

“When Quincy practices and plays better than the other guys, he will be (active) and will be playing,” a candid Moncachino said on Thursday. “He played in the Arizona game and played very well. We are not at all worried about putting Quincy in the game, but he’s got to practice and prepare well. That’s part of him being young and also part of him being a little immature, and also a function of he’s got guys that are pretty good pros that are working their tails off that keeps him where he is right now. Hopefully that’s a motivator for him. Just to hear me say that: when he practices better and prepares more".

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He's an ERFA so he will most likely be brought back. Only costs $645K. He'll be in camp and will compete in the preseason.  

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On 2/12/2019 at 10:04 AM, krunk said:

I think Johnson should be brought back to compete at a minimum.   You got 3 guys who have nice size and can get deep between Cain, Fountain, and Johnson.  And you've got a good possesion guy with nice size and hands in Steve Ishmael.  To me these are young pieces you keep for your competition.  You can still draft a guy like Deebo Samuel or somebody to go along with that.  My gut is Ballard probably won't draft any more than 1 WR. 

I don't think you can afford to put so much faith in three untested and raw rookies. I know you like Fountain; I'm not a fan, but hope you're right. Cain showed great promise, but his knee has to be a concern until proven otherwise. Johnson....who knows? 

Which means a FA like A. Humphries or T. Williams should be at the top of the Colts' wish list. Bring in someone who can be a strong #2 to TY, and hope that the young guys, including a new draft pick, can become the depth the team badly lacks right now. 

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1 minute ago, Hoose said:

I don't think you can afford to put so much faith in three untested and raw rookies. I know you like Fountain; I'm not a fan, but hope you're right. Cain showed great promise, but his knee has to be a concern until proven otherwise. Johnson....who knows? 

Which means a FA like A. Humphries or T. Williams should be at the top of the Colts' wish list. Bring in someone who can be a strong #2 to TY, and hope that the young guys, including a new draft pick, can become the depth the team badly lacks right now. 

It's not great faith at all.  It's young pieces with good measurables, speed, and size. that we already have on the roster. Just because you haven't seen then play so much doesn't mean there's not any data.  The Colts have a years worth of seeing what these guys have.   I just seriously doubt the Colts are going to draft more than 1 WR.  I think Ballards going to see what

he has out of this group he and Reich brought in, plus a FA aquistion or two..  The guys

I mentioned are part of the competition. After a FA aquistion and a draft pick to go along

with what we've already got there should be plenty to work with.    I'm not saying there's

a bunch there but I think there's more there than what others are trying to dismiss.

 

Again you got:

 

Cain

Fountain

Ishmael

Johnson

Inman

Hilton

 

And you can bring in a FA and a Draft Pick.  Personally I think that's pretty good competition.

 

I think everybody else we have can kick rocks and go to another team as far as I'm concerned.

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Possibly a camp body, never know... I've been surprised before with some of these guys. But I wouldn't hold too much stock at the moment. 

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One of the big things we need are better athletes than the ones we have now.  The guys who are starting now outside of TY are all slot receiver type athletes.  They all can get open in short spaces, have decent hands, good route runners but their athletic profiles leaves much to be desired.  The young guys we have behind them I think have much better athletic profiles but they are short on experience.   The guys I mentioned I think we should keep around for the competition, plus any FA aquisitions and draft pick(s).

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1 hour ago, krunk said:

It's not great faith at all.  It's young pieces with good measurables, speed, and size. that we already have on the roster. Just because you haven't seen then play so much doesn't mean there's not any data.  The Colts have a years worth of seeing what these guys have.   I just seriously doubt the Colts are going to draft more than 1 WR.  I think Ballards going to see what

he has out of this group he and Reich brought in, plus a FA aquistion or two..  The guys

I mentioned are part of the competition. After a FA aquistion and a draft pick to go along

with what we've already got there should be plenty to work with.    I'm not saying there's

a bunch there but I think there's more there than what others are trying to dismiss.

 

Again you got:

 

Cain

Fountain

Ishmael

Johnson

Inman

Hilton

 

And you can bring in a FA and a Draft Pick.  Personally I think that's pretty good competition.

 

I think everybody else we have can kick rocks and go to another team as far as I'm concerned.

Interesting to me that you did not include Z. Pascal on your list. He started out the same as the others during training camp and worked his way up to earn a spot on the 53-man roster over Fountain and Ishmael. I think he belongs on the list at least. To me, Z. Pascal has shown what we hoped Fountain would have shown.

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16 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

Interesting to me that you did not include Z. Pascal on your list. He started out the same as the others during training camp and worked his way up to earn a spot on the 53-man roster over Fountain and Ishmael. I think he belongs on the list at least. To me, Z. Pascal has shown what we hoped Fountain would have shown.

I don't think Pascal is all that great of an athlete.  He's more of a possession guy to me. I'm not that high on him myself.   He's okay in my opinion.  I think what kept him ahead of Ishmael and Fountain was experience and the ability to return kicks. 

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On 2/18/2019 at 10:30 AM, krunk said:

It's not great faith at all.  It's young pieces with good measurables, speed, and size. that we already have on the roster. Just because you haven't seen then play so much doesn't mean there's not any data.  The Colts have a years worth of seeing what these guys have.   I just seriously doubt the Colts are going to draft more than 1 WR.  I think Ballards going to see what

he has out of this group he and Reich brought in, plus a FA aquistion or two..  The guys

I mentioned are part of the competition. After a FA aquistion and a draft pick to go along

with what we've already got there should be plenty to work with.    I'm not saying there's

a bunch there but I think there's more there than what others are trying to dismiss.

 

Again you got:

 

Cain

Fountain

Ishmael

Johnson

Inman

Hilton

 

And you can bring in a FA and a Draft Pick.  Personally I think that's pretty good competition.

 

I think everybody else we have can kick rocks and go to another team as far as I'm concerned.

You can add Hines to that list.    I could see him getting more time in the slot next yr 

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I’m excited to see what Cain can bring this upcoming season. I’m intrigued to see if Fountain can contribute anything that CB seen as potential in him. I’m more interested in seeing if we have anything in Johnson honestly, he may be a receiver we all have somewhat looked for, he has those measurables. And finally, I’m hopeful we bring back Inman and continue his chemistry going he was developing with Luck near the end. I think it’s quite possible that if we don’t take a wr with the first pick, we don’t take a wr in this draft. It will be a trenches build with the first 4 picks and then grab the safety and cb guys. I think the team at least isn’t in dire need of too many positions like they appeared to be in last year. 

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On 2/20/2019 at 7:30 AM, DerekDiggler said:

You can add Hines to that list.    I could see him getting more time in the slot next yr 

 

 I see Hines snaps dropping signicantly next season.
 Where our offense was come playoff time is more to what Frank is building for and Hines was mostly left out. How i see it anyway.

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