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Surge89

The big mess that is the Steelers

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So I wanted to see what everyone's opinion was for the Steelers in a couple of areas.

 

A. Who is primarily at fault for the drama?

B. Who needs to go to right the ship?

C. Who has any value left after this fiasco?

D. What are the real problems with Pit besides drama?

 

A. I think this is a problem building up for the past 3 years and Tomlin has done nothing to tighten the reigns.  Imo Tomlin is the biggest culprit here but also the one with the biggest margin for error given his track record.  While Ben has been an a hole and AB and Bell drama queens it's the allowance for these people to get to this point that's a huge issue. 

 

B. I think to right the ship in Pit they will need to get rid of Ben and Bell and hope that Tomlin gets his stuff together. Brown is a franchise player that I think falls in line with a better and more mature QB.  I don't think this will happen in fact I bet they can everyone else but keep Ben, but hey they can self implode all they want lol.

 

C. I'm sure Brown will have value after this. I'd say he's probably the only one who can still produce at an elite level. I think Ben is about done and the only reason he's still relevant is due to the outstanding talent around him.  Bell has been done and probably won't do much more. And Tomlin if he's let go I think still has value but I'm not sure the NFL will see him.  He could be the next big commodity for a head coach or may be a guy who has to earn his stripes again.  

 

D. This last one I think is interesting because I don't doubt the talent level in Pit.  I think they are the most talented team in the AFC by a wide margin yet they refuse to dominate any team. Not even the lower ones.  I'd say this is one of the biggest faults of Tomlin.  He believes in a dated defensive philosophy which hinders his talented defense and his offensive coordinator picks have gotten worse by each hiring. He doesn't sorround himself with ingenuity but instead tries to retread past glory but with less esteemed background individuals.

 

What are everyone else's thoughts? 

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Tomlin is not above Big Ben = bad for team spirit. They might both have to go, but that would obviously be a massive move.

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I’d say the biggest blame should be between the GM/Tomlin, and AB. I don’t blame Big Ben or Le’Veon Bell nearly as much. The whole organization is a mess now and if they want to fix it they need to make changes in the front office and coaching staff. Then they need to trade AB.

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1 hour ago, Mr. Irrelevant said:

Tomlin is not above Big Ben = bad for team spirit. They might both have to go, but that would obviously be a massive move.

They need to clean out the coaching staff and tell ben he has two choices retire or be cut.

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5 minutes ago, 18to87 said:

We all know how this ends ... Brown to NE :Gaah:

 

Worse. Brown to cleveland. All boy, steeler fans would burn their AB jerseys

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Obviously I’m ecstatic that the Steelers are a hot mess. I think they have no choice but to trade Brown, as he essentially quit on the team. Bell will be gone also, and Ben is getting near the end. To me, I believe the Browns and Ravens will be battling for the division crown next year. 

Still, there is still a lot of talent in Pittsburgh.  They also draft very well, including top skill position players. 

This is a vampire type organization, where a stake needs to be driven through their heart. 

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It all IMO falls on Tomlin. The lack of discipline inside that locker room cost them this year.  AB been immature for years and they have done zero to ever reign him in.. and they are shocked by his outbursts now??   

 

To correct the ship they need a new HC, it’s his locker room and his lack of leadership and commanding respect has shown threw..

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I don’t usually agree with Rex Ryan but he sounded pretty smart today when he said these GROWN MEN need to sit down in a no holds barred conversation and find some fixes for this thing. So I guess the question I have is this : in other businesses, bad relationships are often fixed with professionalism and negotiation, not someone getting fired. Is there a solution to this mess that doesn’t involve someone getting fired/traded/released?

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I think at this point you have to trade and get rid of the trouble makers. Maybe even fire Tomlin because it all starts with him.

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How do you to reign in a grown man who is multi-millionaire sociopath? I think his maturation has run its course at this point.

 

Most people cant even reign in their broke teenage daughter.

 

Tomlin is a great coach and they would be * to fire him because some spoiled prima donna cant be a professional.

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I frankly don't care what happens to the Steelers, just as long as Ballard doesn't bring Brown or Bell to Indy. I'd like to think that Ballard is smart enough not to poison the Colts' locker room with either one of those divas. 

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On ‎1‎/‎6‎/‎2019 at 4:39 PM, JimJaime said:

It all IMO falls on Tomlin. The lack of discipline inside that locker room cost them this year.  AB been immature for years and they have done zero to ever reign him in.. and they are shocked by his outbursts now??   

 

To correct the ship they need a new HC, it’s his locker room and his lack of leadership and commanding respect has shown threw..

Tomlin is an * that's why that team hasn't won.

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Also they can’t cut or trade AB without having a 21 million dead cap hit.  So AB aid staying put.. no team that stupid, not even the Steelers.

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1 hour ago, JimJaime said:

Also they can’t cut or trade AB without having a 21 million dead cap hit.  So AB aid staying put.. no team that stupid, not even the Steelers.

If they trade him, wouldn't the team taking him take his contract and cap hit?

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29 minutes ago, Narcosys said:

If they trade him, wouldn't the team taking him take his contract and cap hit?

 

I would think so.

 

They wouldn't mind sending him to the Arizona Cardinals - NFC team and a team that needs WRs, they might get a 2nd round pick in return, which is as good as a 1st rounder, IMO. Kliff Kingsbury and his Air Raid style of offense will dig it. 

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At the end of the day, as much as people want to bash Tomlin (and he deserves some blame) and Big Ben (he also deserves some blame), I put the majority of the blame on Steelers leadership (i.e. their GM and Owner).

 

People are very quick to forget that who was the one guy who truly backed L.Bell in all his holdout drama?.....Antonio Brown.

 

Brown did not bash Bell. Brown supported Bell and kept supporting him even as other teammates turned on him.

 

The entire Bell saga was a significant mismanagement on the part of Steelers leadership. They basically thought (like many fans did, myself included) that there was no way Bell would sit out half a year or 10 games or an entire season and fore-go all that money.

 

They low-balled Bell contractually (from a guaranteed money standpoint) and then when they did not get him at their low rate offer, they tagged him again despite him claiming the previous year that he would sit out. They called his bluff and they lost (yes, Bell lost too from a financial standpoint. But the Steelers lost a lot more from a team standpoint in my opinion).

 

The entire Bell drama started all this fraying of the team and the locker room. And Brown was one of the few who seemed to side w Bell. That pushed another wedge between him, his teammates and management.

 

Brown (like many star WRs) is already a diva. Add in the Bell drama and the fact that JuJu has stepped up and taken some of Brown's shine away, and it is a recipe for disaster.

 

It still makes almost no sense to trade Brown from a football standpoint in terms of the product on the field. He is still fantastic and the cap charges make it so that trading him essentially saves you no money at all. You would basically be paying the same amount to have him on the field or to not.

 

But the Steelers need to not repeat the 2018 Bell drama with Brown.

 

If he is unhappy, don't call his bluff. You will lose. He will sit out practices, games, etc. He will be disciplined by Tomlin when he quits on the team and it will become another big headache they do not need. And frankly, it is unfair to Tomlin to put him in the position to have to deal w that crap.

 

This all began w the miscalculation on Bell and it either needs to be fixed ASAP or they need to cut their losses and move on.

 

What  a mess

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34 minutes ago, Narcosys said:

If they trade him, wouldn't the team taking him take his contract and cap hit?

 

There are some really good articles out there on the impacts.

 

The best one to summarize shows that if traded:

 

- $21.12 million on the salary cap.

 

"This dead money is from a $19 million signing bonus paid to Brown in 2017, plus a $12.96 million salary conversion paid to Brown in 2018 that was intended to help the Steelers with their salary cap. The $19 million was prorated over five years, and the $12.96 million over four years. Both have three years of proration remaining."

 

"If Brown is released, the team will save $1.045 million in cap room. At least $495,000 of that would be offset by whomever takes his place on the roster, so the effective cap savings are nil.

In terms of cash, the Steelers would save $15.2 million by releasing Brown in March."

 

 

So essentially there is no cap savings for the Steelers from a trade perspective. They would save the $15M in cash by not having to pay his salary though. 

 

The acquiring team wouldn't be on the hook for any of his guaranteed money. So they would get an amazing deal:

 

"A team that traded for Brown would get him at cap costs of $15.125 million in 2019, $11.3 million in 2020 and $12.5 million in 2021. None of that is guaranteed. The team would get one of the top wide receivers in the NFL at a cost of $12.975 million per year with no guarantees."

 

 

This article sums it up. Lots of good info.

 

http://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/trade-cut-or-keep-antonio-brown-explaining-the-steelers-options-for-2019-offseason/v6clnf5f6znh19vc6y8145sgb

 

 

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13 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

I would think so.

 

They wouldn't mind sending him to the Arizona Cardinals - NFC team and a team that needs WRs, they might get a 2nd round pick in return, which is as good as a 1st rounder, IMO. Kliff Kingsbury and his Air Raid style of offense will dig it. 

I thought so.

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1 hour ago, Narcosys said:

If they trade him, wouldn't the team taking him take his contract and cap hit?

Dead money hit for them. The bonus they paid him and also the last 2 years of his old contract that they extended.. (per bleacher report) 22 million dead money

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FWIW I saw today that Brown unfollowed the steelers on social media.

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this isnt a mess. just a tiny bump in the road for them.

 since the 70s, they havent stopped making the playoffs on a regaular basis. this is just some short lived artificial drama. doesnt matter who's on the team. they win and win

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