Rams Trading #2 Pick Vs. Colts Trading #1 Pick

[Ramblinwreck7]

Immature? Perhaps. But spot on.

You typed a novel on something that absolutely no chance of happening. All those players are gone and you know what? Rightfully so. Their time has come and gone and the financial cost of those players came nowhere near their productivity.

The Colts have a dire need for a QB and cannot pass on Luck. They have to take him. The Skins trade does not impact that.

A novel lol? I hope your kidding considering I wrote less than a page of words. Thank you for being concerned though.

[Ramblinwreck7]

Dude - get your head out of the sand. Those guys are long-gone.

I am currently not on a beach, so I don't know how to take your advice...

[jskinnz]

A novel lol? I hope your kidding considering I wrote less than a page of words. Thank you for being concerned though.

How about this? You typed a short-story on something has next to no chance of happening. I guess that makes it fiction.

Clever too about not living on a beach.

Seriously - in your heart of hearts, you don't really believe those guys were cut just to be brought back. This is just the ramblings of a frustrated fan but not something you truly believe, right?

[Ohio Colt]

Never going to happen ... join the rest of us and accept reality

couldn't have said it better myself

[DG1]

How about this? You typed a short-story on something has next to no chance of happening. I guess that makes it fiction.

Clever too about not living on a beach.

Seriously - in your heart of hearts, you don't really believe those guys were cut just to be brought back. This is just the ramblings of a frustrated fan but not something you truly believe, right?

+1

I am happy to see that the FO has finally been cured of the "Bob Sanders Syndrome". I understand loyalty and love of players, but if they can't produce you can't keep throwing money at them. Would you keep paying someone you employed who only worked half the time or hire someone who would be there everyday and be more productive?

[Ramblinwreck7]

How about this? You typed a short-story on something has next to no chance of happening. I guess that makes it fiction.

Clever too about not living on a beach.

Seriously - in your heart of hearts, you don't really believe those guys were cut just to be brought back. This is just the ramblings of a frustrated fan but not something you truly believe, right?

Thank you I though it was pretty clever

Hmmm... it's not like it took me hours to write or anything, just 10-15 minutes.

I don't know what the colts will do. It seems like they want to shred the team and do a total rebuild when they could just reload the team and prepare for the future instead, which makes a lot more sense to me to do. It's not out of the realm of possibility that they could be brought back, it just takes the colts realizing that the other option is better and not being stubborn.

[Ramblinwreck7]

+1

I am happy to see that the FO has finally been cured of the "Bob Sanders Syndrome". I understand loyalty and love of players, but if they can't produce you can't keep throwing money at them. Would you keep paying someone you employed who only worked half the time or hire someone who would be there everyday and be more productive?

Yes, but your argument is about productivity. If someone is more productive than Bob Sanders, then you play him. The reason we kept Bob Sanders was because he was extremely productive while he was on the field.

[jskinnz]

Thank you I though it was pretty clever

Hmmm... it's not like it took me hours to write or anything, just 10-15 minutes.

I don't know what the colts will do. It seems like they want to shred the team and do a total rebuild when they could just reload the team and prepare for the future instead, which makes a lot more sense to me to do. It's not out of the realm of possibility that they could be brought back, it just takes the colts realizing that the other option is better and not being stubborn.

Absolutely amazing.

And just simply wrong.

[GoColts8818]

How about this? You typed a short-story on something has next to no chance of happening. I guess that makes it fiction.

Clever too about not living on a beach.

Seriously - in your heart of hearts, you don't really believe those guys were cut just to be brought back. This is just the ramblings of a frustrated fan but not something you truly believe, right?

Some people just aren't going to let go. Other teams have fans like this too how many years was Barry Sanders going to come back to the Lions after he retired?

[Ramblinwreck7]

Absolutely amazing.

And just simply wrong.

Actually all of it was correct, I guess you misquoted or something...

[Andy]

Actually all of it was correct, I guess you misquoted or something...

Actually, ramblinwreck, he's right. The Colts have released these guys, in a rebuilding mode stage. They ain't coming back, unless they want dirt nothing, which I don't think they would want especially now. This team is in a rebuilding stage, so keeping old players just interferes with that process. I agree with jskinzz; I've learnt to not hold grudge against people, plus he's right in this situation.

[Ramblinwreck7]

Actually, ramblinwreck, he's right. The Colts have released these guys, in a rebuilding mode stage. They ain't coming back, unless they want dirt nothing, which I don't think they would want especially now. This team is in a rebuilding stage, so keeping old players just interferes with that process. I agree with jskinzz; I've learnt to not hold grudge against people, plus he's right in this situation.

Where have I said he is wrong? I already stated it seems like the colts are trying to rebuild the team, what's so hard for jskinzz to understand about that? I said I don't think that's what they should do, and there still is a chance they could go the other direction of reloading. There's a reason why I said I wasn't wrong.

[Andy]

Where have I said he is wrong? I already stated it seems like the colts are trying to rebuild the team, what's so hard for jskinzz to understand about that? I said I don't think that's what they should do, and there still is a chance they could go the other direction of reloading. There's a reason why I said I wasn't wrong.

Ok Im sorry, let me rephrase that: You Are Wrong! I have nothing against you and I like you, but there is no chance they come back to Indy. They've packed their bags, cleaned out their lockers and letting their agents receive calls (according to my LS). Their time in Indy is done, and you could even look at the roster, almost all of those players have heirs. It's not likely they'll bring em back except for cheap cheap cheap, which is highly unlikely. Yes they are in a rebuilding mode, and several things take place. It is completely starting a new chapter which means many vets leave. Look at the Viks, look at the great 90's Cowboys in the later years.

Now, about you're theory. So you're one of those people that believes that the best bet for the Colts is to make a run for the title now, which even with the most talent is tough to do... cough cough Phily, cough cough Jets. Yeah, let's milk 3 more years out of Peyton who's just coming off neck surgery. I love the guy and I wanted him to stay as a fan, but as a writer, looking more into it, it made the most sense to let him go. All these releases were good moves. It's not like these moves came out of nowhere, it wasn't expected to happen, but look how no one was shocked, and look how no one wil be shocked to see Reggie and Pierre go too. It's a new chapter buddy and it looks like you're still stuck on the other page. It's time to move on my friend

[John Dee]

Keep in mind that it was the Redskins and if it were any other team, it would have been a more reasonable deal. You would have gotten the craziest kinds ransom if it were the Redskins trading for the #1 pick. Any other team and you'd still get a lot, but I don't know if it would be the same kind of deal that the skins offered.

Mortenson said the Bronws were beat by "one" pick spot.

[Andy]

Mortenson said the Bronws were beat by "one" pick spot.

Two first round picks sounds reasonable for RG3. Three + 2nd round pick is too much.

[John Dee]

Ok Im sorry, let me rephrase that: You Are Wrong! I have nothing against you and I like you, but there is no chance they come back to Indy. They've packed their bags, cleaned out their lockers and letting their agents receive calls (according to my LS). Their time in Indy is done, and you could even look at the roster, almost all of those players have heirs. It's not likely they'll bring em back except for cheap cheap cheap, which is highly unlikely. Yes they are in a rebuilding mode, and several things take place. It is completely starting a new chapter which means many vets leave. Look at the Viks, look at the great 90's Cowboys in the later years.

Now, about you're theory. So you're one of those people that believes that the best bet for the Colts is to make a run for the title now, which even with the most talent is tough to do... cough cough Phily, cough cough Jets. Yeah, let's milk 3 more years out of Peyton who's just coming off neck surgery. I love the guy and I wanted him to stay as a fan, but as a writer, looking more into it, it made the most sense to let him go. All these releases were good moves. It's not like these moves came out of nowhere, it wasn't expected to happen, but look how no one was shocked, and look how no one wil be shocked to see Reggie and Pierre go too. It's a new chapter buddy and it looks like you're still stuck on the other page. It's time to move on my friend

Oh good Lord... you now have a "league source" ...

seriously.......

[Andy]

Oh good Lord... you now have a "league source" ...

seriously.......

Is there a problem with that? You don't believe me?

[ThatOneColtFan]

Actually I think it wasn't that bad of a move.

[John Dee]

Is there a problem with that? You don't believe me?

Let me guess ... your Adam Schefter... ehehe..

[John Dee]

Actually I think it wasn't that bad of a move.

If he pans out.... It's a stellar move.... If he's Heath Shuler... ughhh. I know one thing.... He ain't Andrew Luck.

[Andy]

Let me guess ... your Adam Schefter... ehehe..

, you caught me...

Anyways, I am a writer for a pretty big newspaper in Canada and for multiple websites online. I have access to a league source in Indianapolis and that's all since most of my articles (75%) are about the Colts. It's really nothing big and if you ever get in the sports journalism business, you'll get one too (not right away). When I say I have a league source and I spoke to him, I'm not trying to impress anyone here. I'm trying to be thoughtful and share the early news with the fans first, look at my thread. If I came off the wrong way, I apologize for that.

[John Dee]

, you caught me...

Anyways, I am a writer for a pretty big newspaper in Canada and for multiple websites online. I have access to a league source in Indianapolis and that's all since most of my articles (75%) are about the Colts. It's really nothing big and if you ever get in the sports journalism business, you'll get one too (not right away). When I say I have a league source and I spoke to him, I'm not trying to impress anyone here. I'm trying to be thoughtful and share the early news with the fans first, look at my thread. If I came off the wrong way, I apologize for that.

This is the internet.... ;)

[Ramblinwreck7]

Ok Im sorry, let me rephrase that: You Are Wrong! I have nothing against you and I like you, but there is no chance they come back to Indy. They've packed their bags, cleaned out their lockers and letting their agents receive calls (according to my LS). Their time in Indy is done, and you could even look at the roster, almost all of those players have heirs. It's not likely they'll bring em back except for cheap cheap cheap, which is highly unlikely. Yes they are in a rebuilding mode, and several things take place. It is completely starting a new chapter which means many vets leave. Look at the Viks, look at the great 90's Cowboys in the later years.

Now, about you're theory. So you're one of those people that believes that the best bet for the Colts is to make a run for the title now, which even with the most talent is tough to do... cough cough Phily, cough cough Jets. Yeah, let's milk 3 more years out of Peyton who's just coming off neck surgery. I love the guy and I wanted him to stay as a fan, but as a writer, looking more into it, it made the most sense to let him go. All these releases were good moves. It's not like these moves came out of nowhere, it wasn't expected to happen, but look how no one was shocked, and look how no one wil be shocked to see Reggie and Pierre go too. It's a new chapter buddy and it looks like you're still stuck on the other page. It's time to move on my friend

Lol, I am not wrong!

Too me, it is plain as day that we should keep a healthy Peyton Manning and trade the #1 pick. Peyton Manning seems to be getting healthier and healthier lately, from the video and other people saying he is looking really good. Dallas Clark and Melvin Bullit do not have heirs who can perform at the same level as them, and Joseph Addai also would still be the #1 running back when he is healthy.

Trading the #1 pick isn't just for a 3-4 year run or until Peyton retires, it also gives us several talented players to build the future on.

[braveheartcolt]

Manning says he is not ready yet. But you think he's good to go. Says it all really.

[Malakai432]

I say we trade Luck for an out fielder, point guard, goalie, punter and a left winger. Maybe someone would also throw in a shortstop.

[Andy]

Lol, I am not wrong! Too me, it is plain as day that we should keep a healthy Peyton Manning and trade the #1 pick. Peyton Manning seems to be getting healthier and healthier lately, from the video and other people saying he is looking really good. Dallas Clark and Melvin Bullit do not have heirs who can perform at the same level as them, and Joseph Addai also would still be the #1 running back when he is healthy. Trading the #1 pick isn't just for a 3-4 year run or until Peyton retires, it also gives us several talented players to build the future on.

OMG! Half the things you say are wrong!! That's your opinion on Manning, and who knows Luck may come in and play better than Manning. Your first point is something we'll see at the end of next year, but the point is Luck is healthy and Manning isn't. I'm not saying this, but Manning may not never be the same again, and it's going to be very different to play in a different scheme. Now, this is where you are 100% wrong:

Dallas Clark has a heir and his name is Jacob Tamme. Jacob Tamme was the most productive tight end in the 2nd half of the 2010 season. He was great and as productive as Clark. He may not be as skillful as Clark, but if he puts up the same numbers at a cheaper price, who cares who's out there. Clark being gone opens up so much space, which is great going forward. Tamme is performing at the same level as Clark. Melvin Bullitt wasn't that great to start with, but you're right there is no one on this roster that is as good as him. Im starting to think that even if he were on the roster the Colts would spend a pick on a S which means that he has a heir and a probably replacement. Now that he's gone, the Colts will definitely draft a S. We have a heir for him, just not a proven one but one that is probably better than Bullitt. Agree on Addai, but the injuries are effecting him when he's healthy. He goes through long stretches and then comes back with no practice which makes him bad in games and gets him put on the bench a lot. A 2006-2007 Addai is the best running back on the team, and even with Addai healthy, the team was moving in a new direction with the emergence of Donald Brown and the drafting of Delone Carter.

Trading Andrew Luck (essentially) is trading the future at the quarterback position. You could have the most talented freagin offense, but with a bad QB, you're not going anywhere. Now you may say that the Colts would draft someone after Manning retires, but odds are, it wont be with the first overall pick and it wont be a guy the same caliber of Andrew Luck. Look at the Redskins, Jets and 49ers. Alex Smith is getting better however. Look at that talented team the Redskins have: a solid defense and an okay offense, and all that's missing the QB. Now it's looking like it's too late with Fletcher and Landry on their way out. RG3 is going to have a tough time trying to save that team. Sanchez has a good running back, a good O-line and 2 good receivers, but he still Fs up that offense. The quarterback spot is the most important position on that team, and long term stability is better than short term success. If it takes the QB 3 years to be good and be good for 10 years, that's always better than a great QB for 3 years. It could make us revolve around that good QB. Andrew Luck won't be as good as Peyton Manning, but he will be good in this league and will be good for 12 years. Manning will be (who knows) great for 3-4 years. Is it really worth spending 28M on a QB that we haven't seen throw besides a 27 second video. That's way too little to make a 28M dollar decision on.

So, to answer your question, I think you're saying you're facts are right... too bad you're standpoint is wrong. (I'm genuinely not trying to make fun of you, but trying to open your eyes). As my 7th and 8th grade teacher told me when I was younger, a lot of crap is still crap, and crap in a pink dress is still crap. All you're facts supporting your wrong point, doesn't make your point better, it doesn't help it at all. 40 x 0 = 0. I'm sorry but you're wrong.

[Ramblinwreck7]

OMG! Half the things you say are wrong!! That's your opinion on Manning, and who knows Luck may come in and play better than Manning. Your first point is something we'll see at the end of next year, but the point is Luck is healthy and Manning isn't. I'm not saying this, but Manning may not never be the same again, and it's going to be very different to play in a different scheme. Now, this is where you are 100% wrong:

Dallas Clark has a heir and his name is Jacob Tamme. Jacob Tamme was the most productive tight end in the 2nd half of the 2010 season. He was great and as productive as Clark. He may not be as skillful as Clark, but if he puts up the same numbers at a cheaper price, who cares who's out there. Clark being gone opens up so much space, which is great going forward. Tamme is performing at the same level as Clark. Melvin Bullitt wasn't that great to start with, but you're right there is no one on this roster that is as good as him. Im starting to think that even if he were on the roster the Colts would spend a pick on a S which means that he has a heir and a probably replacement. Now that he's gone, the Colts will definitely draft a S. We have a heir for him, just not a proven one but one that is probably better than Bullitt. Agree on Addai, but the injuries are effecting him when he's healthy. He goes through long stretches and then comes back with no practice which makes him bad in games and gets him put on the bench a lot. A 2006-2007 Addai is the best running back on the team, and even with Addai healthy, the team was moving in a new direction with the emergence of Donald Brown and the drafting of Delone Carter.

Trading Andrew Luck (essentially) is trading the future at the quarterback position. You could have the most talented freagin offense, but with a bad QB, you're not going anywhere. Now you may say that the Colts would draft someone after Manning retires, but odds are, it wont be with the first overall pick and it wont be a guy the same caliber of Andrew Luck. Look at the Redskins, Jets and 49ers. Alex Smith is getting better however. Look at that talented team the Redskins have: a solid defense and an okay offense, and all that's missing the QB. Now it's looking like it's too late with Fletcher and Landry on their way out. RG3 is going to have a tough time trying to save that team. Sanchez has a good running back, a good O-line and 2 good receivers, but he still Fs up that offense. The quarterback spot is the most important position on that team, and long term stability is better than short term success. If it takes the QB 3 years to be good and be good for 10 years, that's always better than a great QB for 3 years. It could make us revolve around that good QB. Andrew Luck won't be as good as Peyton Manning, but he will be good in this league and will be good for 12 years. Manning will be (who knows) great for 3-4 years. Is it really worth spending 28M on a QB that we haven't seen throw besides a 27 second video. That's way too little to make a 28M dollar decision on.

So, to answer your question, I think you're saying you're facts are right... too bad you're standpoint is wrong. (I'm genuinely not trying to make fun of you, but trying to open your eyes). As my 7th and 8th grade teacher told me when I was younger, a lot of crap is still crap, and crap in a pink dress is still crap. All you're facts supporting your wrong point, doesn't make your point better, it doesn't help it at all. 40 x 0 = 0. I'm sorry but you're wrong.

Come on Andy246... I'm starting to think that your just trolling me or something . My points are correct! Jacob Tamme can put up great numbers with Peyton Manning throwing too him, but he isn't as talented as Dallas Clark. He's a good backup who can come in and play well, but he won't have the same impact as Dallas Clark would.

It is important to have a good quarterback, but it is more important to have a great team. The quarterback position may be the most important position on the team, but the defense is more important than the offense. You can list good teams with suspect quarterback play and I can list subpar teams with good quarterback play. It still holds true that offense wins games, and defense wins championships. I've said that way to many times lately on this website, but it proves the point very well.

And of course you wouldn't base your decision just off a short video. We don't know the exact information that the colts have, but there are guys like Tom Moore (that's what someone on here said) and Archie Manning saying he is looking good.

[SanAntonioColt]

This is a fantasy. The Colts would never get as much as the Rams, because there was only one team willing to overpay for that pick. The Redskins made a mistake. A good front office would never have made that trade. Teams are not "more desperate", the Colts are stuck with Luck. Too bad the Colts don't have more draft picks to rebuild sooner. This is a very deep draft.

90% of what's posted on here is fantasy. This forum is a gathering of people who love FB and like to play coach, GM, and/or owner. Having said that, the Colts should have traded the #1 pick for a boatload of lower, but quality, picks. If the Colts could have got the extra picks and RGIII that would have been great. The ideal would have been a healthy Peyton, the draft picks and three more years of runs at a championship. I've noticed that a lot of people are downplaying RGIII as just an athlete. He is a QB who happens to be a great athlete. He's smart (has his degree--listen to him speak), is an accurate passer, plays well under pressure, and throws a better deep pass than Luck. The guy from USC will also be available in the 2013 draft. Lot's of options by trading the Luck pick. If there was a team willing to overpay for the RGIII pick, even more teams would overpay for the Luck pick.

[braveheartcolt]

90% of what's posted on here is fantasy. This forum is a gathering of people who love FB and like to play coach, GM, and/or owner. Having said that, the Colts should have traded the #1 pick for a boatload of lower, but quality, picks. If the Colts could have got the extra picks and RGIII that would have been great. The ideal would have been a healthy Peyton, the draft picks and three more years of runs at a championship. I've noticed that a lot of people are downplaying RGIII as just an athlete. He is a QB who happens to be a great athlete. He's smart (has his degree--listen to him speak), is an accurate passer, plays well under pressure, and throws a better deep pass than Luck. The guy from USC will also be available in the 2013 draft. Lot's of options by trading the Luck pick. If there was a team willing to overpay for the RGIII pick, even more teams would overpay for the Luck pick.

Like Jerry Hughes? Gonzo? Ugoh? Not liking that gamble one little bit.....

[Andy]

Come on Andy246... I'm starting to think that your just trolling me or something . My points are correct! Jacob Tamme can put up great numbers with Peyton Manning throwing too him, but he isn't as talented as Dallas Clark. He's a good backup who can come in and play well, but he won't have the same impact as Dallas Clark would. It is important to have a good quarterback, but it is more important to have a great team. The quarterback position may be the most important position on the team, but the defense is more important than the offense. You can list good teams with suspect quarterback play and I can list subpar teams with good quarterback play. It still holds true that offense wins games, and defense wins championships. I've said that way to many times lately on this website, but it proves the point very well. And of course you wouldn't base your decision just off a short video. We don't know the exact information that the colts have, but there are guys like Tom Moore (that's what someone on here said) and Archie Manning saying he is looking good.

I'm not trolling you, and if you really don't like what I'm doing to you, I can't stop replying to your posts in this thread. But I need to respond to this:

Jacob Tamme isn't as talented as Clark, but not only is he 5 years younger, but he's just as productive as Clark. Tamme was great with PM throwing to him, but you could say the same about Dallas Clark. Tamme is also cheaper. When Tamme came in this year, he looked better on the field and was running much better routes than Clark. Clark was lost this year and it showed he's not that great without Manning.

The QB spot on the team is the most important position on the team, and it's good you understand that. Now, is it better to have a great overall team with a bad QB? No. Their have been SB champs that have won with subpar quarterbacks. But, a great defense does matter if you want to make a run. With that being said, the Colts are working on their defense. Just hired a defensive minded head coach, changed their defensive scheme, they have a ton of young talent and they're probably going to use some high draft picks on the defense. I should point it out though, the Colts for many years, went to the playoffs with subpar defenses and a great QB. Now this was a phenomenal QB in Manning, but it goes to show you it's possible. The Colts are not the only team like this, the Pats in recent years were like this. I'm one of the people that stands behind that logic of offense wins games and defense wins championships. I wrote an article about that and I even posted it here, go look for it. Going forward, I rather the Colts have a sure bet at the QB spot then take it from there. Having a great QB is a great starting point. Build up the D then help him out.

They say he's looking good, but is he looking Peyton Manning good? No! He hasn't played for a year, you don't think he'll have a little rust. Look at the 2008 season where it took him 5-6 games to find his groove after that knee surgery. No player can shake an injury like this off.

[Ramblinwreck7]

I'm not trolling you, and if you really don't like what I'm doing to you, I can't stop replying to your posts in this thread. But I need to respond to this:

Jacob Tamme isn't as talented as Clark, but not only is he 5 years younger, but he's just as productive as Clark. Tamme was great with PM throwing to him, but you could say the same about Dallas Clark. Tamme is also cheaper. When Tamme came in this year, he looked better on the field and was running much better routes than Clark. Clark was lost this year and it showed he's not that great without Manning.

The QB spot on the team is the most important position on the team, and it's good you understand that. Now, is it better to have a great overall team with a bad QB? No. Their have been SB champs that have won with subpar quarterbacks. But, a great defense does matter if you want to make a run. With that being said, the Colts are working on their defense. Just hired a defensive minded head coach, changed their defensive scheme, they have a ton of young talent and they're probably going to use some high draft picks on the defense. I should point it out though, the Colts for many years, went to the playoffs with subpar defenses and a great QB. Now this was a phenomenal QB in Manning, but it goes to show you it's possible. The Colts are not the only team like this, the Pats in recent years were like this. I'm one of the people that stands behind that logic of offense wins games and defense wins championships. I wrote an article about that and I even posted it here, go look for it. Going forward, I rather the Colts have a sure bet at the QB spot then take it from there. Having a great QB is a great starting point. Build up the D then help him out.

They say he's looking good, but is he looking Peyton Manning good? No! He hasn't played for a year, you don't think he'll have a little rust. Look at the 2008 season where it took him 5-6 games to find his groove after that knee surgery. No player can shake an injury like this off.

No , I don't mind you responding, I just don't see how you think my points are wrong.

http://www.washingto...C95sR_blog.html

Archie Manning said Peyton looked like Peyton. I don't know if he's back to Peyton Manning good yet, but he seems to be getting a lot healthier and better lately.

And the year Peyton had to shake off rust after coming back from knee surgery? I would love Peyton to have another year like that, he won the MVP award and the colts went 12-4, except for losing in the playoffs.

[Andy]

No , I don't mind you responding, I just don't see how you think my points are wrong.

http://www.washingto...C95sR_blog.html

Archie Manning said Peyton looked like Peyton. I don't know if he's back to Peyton Manning good yet, but he seems to be getting a lot healthier and better lately.

And the year Peyton had to shake off rust after coming back from knee surgery? I would love Peyton to have another year like that, he won the MVP award and the colts went 12-4, except for losing in the playoffs.

Archie may say he looks like Peyton, but PM may not feel 100% and I doubt he is 100%. He does look good though, but no one knows until PM says he feels good.

That's because he was in his prime and the Colts won 9 games in a row when he found his grove. I wouldn't want the Colts to start the season 3-4, and then be forced to win out just to get in the playoffs. Times have changed a lot since then, and if the Colts start 3-4 with Manning this year, odds are they don't win the division. Rust is never good. It's not worth the risk.