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BProland85

Cornerstone players of the future for Colts

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So looking through this roster, who can you say with confidence will be our cornerstone players for the next 5 plus years?

 

My list is...

 

1. Andrew Luck (He should be back to his pre injury self if he continues to shake the rust off and stay healthy)

2. Quenton Nelson (He could be the best OG in the NFL by year 3)

3. Darius Leonard (I think he has all the potential to be a Telvin Smith type of LB for us)

4. Malik Hooker (Still hopeful he is able to maximize his potential and stay healthy)

5. TY Hilton (He'll be 33 in 5 years, but I'm still hopeful he is still productive and doesn't age quickly)

6. Ryan Kelly (Out of the box selection here, but I think last year he simply dealt with injuries, and people forget he was the best center in the draft a few years ago, and playing next to Nelson will make him so much better.)

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I would add to that list:

 

AC - One of the better LTs in the league, keep the left side set for years to come.

Doyle - A good blocking TE that can also catch and get first downs.

Ebron - Young explosive TE who will be used for mismatches

 

On defense:

I don't know.  I would think Ridgeway, he seems to be perfect for this type of D but he has to get playing time before he can be a cornerstone.

 

I think Matt Adams is going to be a player for the Colts for a lot of years.  Every time that guy is on the field he's impressive.

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im just glad we finally have an athletic freak at LB that can actually hit and cover 

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13 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

I would add to that list:

 

AC - One of the better LTs in the league, keep the left side set for years to come.

Doyle - A good blocking TE that can also catch and get first downs.

Ebron - Young explosive TE who will be used for mismatches

 

On defense:

I don't know.  I would think Ridgeway, he seems to be perfect for this type of D but he has to get playing time before he can be a cornerstone.

 

I think Matt Adams is going to be a player for the Colts for a lot of years.  Every time that guy is on the field he's impressive.

Darius Leonard

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Young guys for the future I would easily add to your list. AC, Smith, Doyle, Ebron, Walker, Franklin, Turay, and i'll venture to say Lewis as well even without a snap.

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Just now, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Where do you begin when there's so many? :applause:

Are you trying to say in a secret way that Basham is the next Reggie White and Mack is the next Barry Sanders :thmup:

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dont see that in year two ballard has even made us competitive in our division his build through the draft method will not let us compete for years remains to be seen if any of his draft picks turn into impact players or cornerstones

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2 hours ago, BProland85 said:

So looking through this roster, who can you say with confidence will be our cornerstone players for the next 5 plus years?

 

My list is...

 

1. Andrew Luck (He should be back to his pre injury self if he continues to shake the rust off and stay healthy)

2. Quenton Nelson (He could be the best OG in the NFL by year 3)

3. Darius Leonard (I think he has all the potential to be a Telvin Smith type of LB for us)

4. Malik Hooker (Still hopeful he is able to maximize his potential and stay healthy)

5. TY Hilton (He'll be 33 in 5 years, but I'm still hopeful he is still productive and doesn't age quickly)

6. Ryan Kelly (Out of the box selection here, but I think last year he simply dealt with injuries, and people forget he was the best center in the draft a few years ago, and playing next to Nelson will make him so much better.)

Subtract Hooker and TY. 

 

TY will be replaced...at least as WR1, and Hooker being good enough to earn a second contract is still speculative (wait and see).

 

Kelly and Nelson proved they were all around good players from day 1.  And after 1 game, I'll say the same thing about Leonard.  I'm confident that those three will earn another contract with the team.

 

I'm not saying that anybody else won't, its just too early to tell

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A large number of these so called cornerstone players are going to come from the 19 and 20 drafts.   Plus the 20 free agency period.  

 

Many building blocks are are not even on the roster right now.

 

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7 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

A large number of these so called cornerstone players are going to come from the 19 and 20 drafts.   Plus the 20 free agency period.  

 

Many building blocks are are not even on the roster right now.

 

 

probably early to call Nelson and Leonard cornerstones I agree, but their heading in the right direction 

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28 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Subtract Hooker and TY. 

 

TY will be replaced...at least as WR1, and Hooker being good enough to earn a second contract is still speculative (wait and see).

 

Kelly and Nelson proved they were all around good players from day 1.  And after 1 game, I'll say the same thing about Leonard.  I'm confident that those three will earn another contract with the team.

 

I'm not saying that anybody else won't, its just too early to tell

 

Barring injury, Hooker will be here on his second deal I think. He is Ballard's 1st draft pick...and he looked like a legit ballhawk before getting hurt. Assuming he can get back from the injury, he should return to that level. He has two seasons until his option needs picked up...plenty of time to solidify himself.

 

I have to disagree about Kelly. If anything, I would think he is the young guy (on this list) whose second contract is speculative. Ballard didn't draft him...and he is coming off an awful 2nd season (for multiple reasons). We will have to see how he plays this season...as his 5th year option needs to be picked up after the season.

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24 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Subtract Hooker and TY. 

 

TY will be replaced...at least as WR1, and Hooker being good enough to earn a second contract is still speculative (wait and see).

 

Kelly and Nelson proved they were all around good players from day 1.  And after 1 game, I'll say the same thing about Leonard.  I'm confident that those three will earn another contract with the team.

 

I'm not saying that anybody else won't, its just too early to tell

Not sure what Nelson, Kelly and Leonard have proven as opposed to Hooker.

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4 minutes ago, shastamasta said:

 

Barring injury, Hooker will be here on his second deal I think. He is Ballard's 1st draft pick...and he looked like a legit ballhawk before getting hurt. Assuming he can get back from the injury, he should return to that level. He has two seasons until his option needs picked up...plenty of time to solidify himself.

 

I have to disagree about Kelly. If anything, I would think he is the young guy (on this list) whose second contract is speculative. Ballard didn't draft him...and he is coming off an awful 2nd season (for multiple reasons). We will have to see how he plays this season...as his 5th year option needs to be picked up after the season.

Well, who drafted whom shouldn't be an issue.  Unless you're a egotistical narcissist.

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11 minutes ago, BOTT said:

Not sure what Nelson, Kelly and Leonard have proven as opposed to Hooker.

Anybody can get beat, but those three simply seem more fundamentally sound, and yes I'm speculating about Leonard.  I hear reports they are sound.  We never hear about Hooker's fundamentals being sound.  We just gasp over a few splash plays.  I put him a notch below the other three at this point, and probably even Hairston, who has displayed consistent soundness in a couple of roles.

 

Frankly, if you asked me to build a defensive backfield from scratch with the players we have, I'd probably start with Hairston first then Farley, with Hooker, Wilson, and Geathers my last three choices. 

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10 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Well, who drafted whom shouldn't be an issue.  Unless you're a egotistical narcissist.

 

True...but to think it has no bearing would be naive. GMs have players they scout and like and become invested in...just like everybody else.

 

But ultimately, Hooker has the potential to be in much better shape heading into his 3rd season than Kelly...which is signficiant for any 1st round pick.

 

And if Kelly gets banged up again...or doesn't exceed his rookie season performance...then Ballard will have some decisions to make. The 5th year option on all OL positions is the same (in the 12-32 pick range)...and it should be well over $10M next offseason.

 

But I think Kelly can be that guy that sticks around. I am just looking at it from a current standpoint.

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35 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

A large number of these so called cornerstone players are going to come from the 19 and 20 drafts.   Plus the 20 free agency period.  

 

Many building blocks are are not even on the roster right now.

 

any cornerstone players on this team for the future

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28 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Anybody can get beat, but those three simply seem more fundamentally sound, and yes I'm speculating about Leonard.  I hear reports they are sound.  We never hear about Hooker's fundamentals being sound.  We just gasp over a few splash plays.  I put him a notch below the other three at this point, and probably even Hairston, who has displayed consistent soundness in a couple of roles.

 

Frankly, if you asked me to build a defensive backfield from scratch with the players we have, I'd probably start with Hairston first then Farley, with Hooker, Wilson, and Geathers my last three choices. 

 

Not me. If we are talking about playing this current defense...I keep Hooker and draft another S (like Jamal Adams, Derwin James or Minkah Fitzpatrick)...and then I sign another solid S in FA...and then I build out the CBs (targeting very athletic tall CBs that can jump). That gives me three big athletic Ss to run nickel and defend just about any offense...and CBs that can cover the outside.

 

Hairston is a solid player though...I just think he's easier to find than a top flight S. 

 

On that note...did you happen to catch any of the SD or MIA games last week? James and Fitzpatrick are studs. What's done is done...but I definitely would have been down with drafting one of those two (after trading back again). 

 

And speaking of secondaries...it is aggravating that the Colts have a bad one. The NYJ, who were supposed to be "rebuilding," spent some money and draft capital and managed to build what appears to be a top tier secondary in only two offseasons. With all of the resources he has, I would hope Ballard can get the secondary where it needs to be by next offseason. 

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1 minute ago, shastamasta said:

 

Not me. If we are talking about playing this current defense...I keep Hooker and draft another S (like Jamal Adams, Derwin James or Minkah Fitzpatrick)...and then I sign another solid S in FA...and then I build out the CBs (targeting very athletic tall CBs that can jump). That gives me three big athletic Ss to run nickel and defend just about any offense...and CBs that can cover the outside.

 

Hairston is a solid player though...I just think he's easier to find than a top flight S. 

 

On that note...did you happen to catch any of the SD or MIA games last week? James and Fitzpatrick are studs. What's done is done...but I definitely would have been down with drafting one of those two (after trading back again). 

 

And speaking of secondaries...it is aggravating that the Colts have a bad one. The NYJ, who were supposed to be "rebuilding," spent some money and draft capital and managed to build what appears to be a top tier secondary in only two offseasons. With all of the resources he has, I would hope Ballard can get the secondary where it needs to be by next offseason. 

As far as safeties, Fitz and James are better players than Hooker, IMO.  I'm not a technical guy, but the variety of pre-draft writeups I read from guys who are made Fitz and James sound like elite players who were fundamentally sound in everything...right now... and worthy of a top 10 pick.  Unlike Hooker who was elite at one thing, about average at many things, but had potential. 

 

I'm ok with Hooker, don't hate it.   I think Geathers is a poor fit and I would have sought to replace him in the draft or elsewhere.  Fitz or James would have been nice.

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1 hour ago, CR91 said:

 

probably early to call Nelson and Leonard cornerstones I agree, but their heading in the right direction 

If they’re not, we’re in big trouble.

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1 hour ago, shastamasta said:

 

Not me. If we are talking about playing this current defense...I keep Hooker and draft another S (like Jamal Adams, Derwin James or Minkah Fitzpatrick)...and then I sign another solid S in FA...and then I build out the CBs (targeting very athletic tall CBs that can jump). That gives me three big athletic Ss to run nickel and defend just about any offense...and CBs that can cover the outside.

 

Hairston is a solid player though...I just think he's easier to find than a top flight S. 

 

On that note...did you happen to catch any of the SD or MIA games last week? James and Fitzpatrick are studs. What's done is done...but I definitely would have been down with drafting one of those two (after trading back again). 

 

And speaking of secondaries...it is aggravating that the Colts have a bad one. The NYJ, who were supposed to be "rebuilding," spent some money and draft capital and managed to build what appears to be a top tier secondary in only two offseasons. With all of the resources he has, I would hope Ballard can get the secondary where it needs to be by next offseason. 

 

You’re using another first round pick in a safety?   Don’t know why?

 

Ballard has said it’s the front 7 of this defense that’s the priority.

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5 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

You’re using another first round pick in a safety?   Don’t know why?

 

Ballard has said it’s the front 7 of this defense that’s the priority.

Because the last one was a reach?

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1 hour ago, DougDew said:

As far as safeties, Fitz and James are better players than Hooker, IMO.  I'm not a technical guy, but the variety of pre-draft writeups I read from guys who are made Fitz and James sound like elite players who were fundamentally sound in everything...right now... and worthy of a top 10 pick.  Unlike Hooker who was elite at one thing, about average at many things, but had potential. 

 

I'm ok with Hooker, don't hate it.   I think Geathers is a poor fit and I would have sought to replace him in the draft or elsewhere.  Fitz or James would have been nice.

 

Yeah...we are on the same page regarding the Colts at S. This defense needs 3 good Ss that fit the scheme. I don't think they have it.

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13 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Because the last one was a reach?

Man you would be fired as fast as you got hired.

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2 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

probably early to call Nelson and Leonard cornerstones I agree, but their heading in the right direction 

 

When you use picks 6 and 36 in your rebuild, I don’t think it’s too early to call these guys cornerstones.

 

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19 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

You’re using another first round pick in a safety?   Don’t know why?

 

Ballard has said it’s the front 7 of this defense that’s the priority.

 

I didn't say that...those are just examples of the types of players I would want if I was building a secondary...and how I would prioritize the S and CB positions.

 

So to be fair...what Ballard has said wasn't taken into consideration.

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20 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Because the last one was a reach?

 

He wasn’t....   but you know that.

 

Yiu just can’t help yourself.    You like stirring the pot and being contrary...

 

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3 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Where do you begin when there's so many? :applause:

The use of the word cornerstone sort of puts the current situation into perspective, doesn't it?

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1 hour ago, DaColts85 said:

Man you would be fired as fast as you got hired.

Well, I'm not a Ohio State fan, so I would have gotten blasted by many here for passing him over.

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1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

He wasn’t....   but you know that.

 

Yiu just can’t help yourself.    You like stirring the pot and being contrary...

 

Nah.  I just express my views.  I can't help it that so many others, like you, oppose them.

 

Like who was taken the pick right after Hooker.  Would look good in a Colts Uni.

 

https://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/in-year-2-ravens-marlon-humphrey-is-approaching-elite-status

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15 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Nah.  I just express my views.  I can't help it that so many others, like you, are wrong a lot.

 

Like who was taken the pick right after Hooker.  Would look good in a Colts Uni.

 

https://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/in-year-2-ravens-marlon-humphrey-is-approaching-elite-status

 

You're a funny guy, Doug!

 

Now I'm wrong a lot?!?     The only place where that's true is in Dew-ville,  Population 1.

 

Are you going to cherry pick every draft pick Ballard makes? 

 

Why didn't Ballard draft Kareem Hunt?     We needed a starting RB and Hunt was ranked higher than Mack by pretty much everyone.     You realize this isn't how you judge drafts?    Especially this early.

 

Ballard said his number one priority was to create more turnovers on defense.   Hooker, who was new to football, so his upside was tremendouss   Hooker led the nation in interception in his first full year starting at the position.    And you've been criticizing the pick since draft night.

 

Your criticisms are graffitti by now.     If I had a dollar for every time you've made the criticism I could retire rich and happy.      But you're not going to change.   If a meteor is about to hit earth and we're all about to die, I expect your final words will be.....

 

"Ballard shouldn't have drafted Hooker.    He should have bought one for a wild night and drafted someone else!"

 

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5 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

You're a funny guy, Doug!

 

Now I'm wrong a lot?!?     The only place where that's true is in Dew-ville,  Population 1.

 

Are you going to cherry pick every draft pick Ballard makes? 

 

Why didn't Ballard draft Kareem Hunt?     We needed a starting RB and Hunt was ranked higher than Mack by pretty much everyone.     You realize this isn't how you judge drafts?    Especially this early.

 

Ballard said his number one priority was to create more turnovers on defense.   Hooker, who was new to football, so his upside was tremendouss   Hooker led the nation in interception in his first full year starting at the position.    And you've been criticizing the pick since draft night.

 

Your criticisms are graffitti by now.     If I had a dollar for every time you've made the criticism I could retire rich and happy.      But you're not going to change.   If a meteor is about to hit earth and we're all about to die, I expect your final words will be.....

 

"Ballard shouldn't have drafted Hooker.    He should have bought one for a wild night and drafted someone else!"

 

I actually wanted Kareem Hunt and said he was the best RB in the draft, Damn :funny:

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23 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

You're a funny guy, Doug!

 

Now I'm wrong a lot?!?     The only place where that's true is in Dew-ville,  Population 1.

 

Are you going to cherry pick every draft pick Ballard makes? 

 

Why didn't Ballard draft Kareem Hunt?     We needed a starting RB and Hunt was ranked higher than Mack by pretty much everyone.     You realize this isn't how you judge drafts?    Especially this early.

 

Ballard said his number one priority was to create more turnovers on defense.   Hooker, who was new to football, so his upside was tremendouss   Hooker led the nation in interception in his first full year starting at the position.    And you've been criticizing the pick since draft night.

 

Your criticisms are graffitti by now.     If I had a dollar for every time you've made the criticism I could retire rich and happy.      But you're not going to change.   If a meteor is about to hit earth and we're all about to die, I expect your final words will be.....

 

"Ballard shouldn't have drafted Hooker.    He should have bought one for a wild night and drafted someone else!"

 

Cherry pick?  I said we should have picked Humphrey the moment everybody was cheering the Hooker pick.  Cherry pick is a wrong concept.

 

Criticsm? The question is simply who do you consider a cornerstone.  I said that I would not include Hooker or TY and gave the reasons.  I didn't say the guy is incompetent.  Criticism is a wrong word.  

 

You know, people around here love Hooker, so he's mentioned a lot.  He's mentioned in this "who is a cornerstone" thread.  And called out for stinking in the Venturi thread. 

 

How is it that I'm now responsible for bringing up the concept of an over rated pick out of thin air?  That's a wrong observation.

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Even though they haven't proved this yet I think the following 2 players will make very good players and get a second contract:

 

Marlon Mack: Might not be a prototypical between-the-tackles RB, but he is a great weapon on offense and will suit Reich's style of offense. He will be a good part of our RBBC for the future.

 

Kenny Moore III: I'm one of his biggest fans and I think he is developing into a fine slot corner. He has played a bit on the outside too but he is best in the slot as he undersized. The dude breaks real hard on the ball, is tenacious, fearless and has talent. I love his attitude, and I think most would agree he is playing the best football of all our DB's right now. 

 

My foundational players are: Luck, TY, Doyle, Nelson, Kelly Costanzo, Mack on offense and Leonard, Hooker and Moore III (slot) on defense.

 

There is a number of young players that could make the step this year on defense like Ridgeway, Turay, Wilson, Skai Moore while if I was making this list a year ago I would have Geathers, so hopefully he can get back to his 2016 form or better. But ultimately we are still early in the rebuild of our defense so we must be patient.

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