Hines Was A Definite Miss.....

[Shadow_Creek]

I gave Hines a pass after the first game because maybe it was just jitters he had which can be understandable playing in your fist NFL game, bright lights, being on the big stage, i mean it could cause anyone to freeze or even fumble a few times like he did. However after these last two games it is clear CB missed when he selected Hines which is kind of disappointing since he has lots of speed and looked like a mismatch from his college film. Now i did read an article stating that Hines had seven fumbles during his college career which sounds a little red flagish but could have easily been coached out of him. Although i fear the hand writing is on the wall and he most definitely wont last on this team. So i really hope CB is able to draft Bryce love in next years draft or find a more decent back to complement Mack and Turbin.

[Case]

Well darn. 

[lollygagger8]

I say move him to WR and get another RB. 

[ColtJ82]

I'll wait to see what our rookie 4th round pick does as the season progresses. Not sure that 3 preseason games are a fair barometer. 

[throwing BBZ]

5 minutes ago, Shadow_Creek said:

I gave Hines a pass after the first game because maybe it was just jitters he had which can be understandable playing in your fist NFL game, bright lights, being on the big stage, i mean it could cause anyone to freeze or even fumble a few times like he did. However after these last two games it is clear CB missed when he selected Hines which is kind of disappointing since he has lots of speed and looked like a mismatch from his college film. Now i did read an article stating that Hines had seven fumbles during his college career which sounds a little red flagish but could have easily been coached out of him. Although i fear the hand writing is on the wall and he most definitely wont last on this team. So i really hope CB is able to draft Bryce love in next years draft or find a more decent back to complement Mack and Turbin.

 

  Maybe.
 We will see what potential Ballard and the coaches see in him.
 It is pure silliness for us to write off a guy now.
  A year of experience and a 2nd off season program should allow for a big jump in his skills and usefulness. Let alone the wisdom of judging a draft class after year 3.
 
 

[Semicolt]

Too early to say he's a wasted pick. Watched the kid in college several times last year and he's a tough kid who runs very hard. He has lost his confidence right now and it will take just a couple of big plays for him to get it back. Hope the Colts don't give up on him at this stage!!!

[1959Colts]

I don't recall the Colts throwing Hines any passes yet this preseason.

Perhaps he will develop as a receiver out of the backfield.

[UKColt13]

After 3 preseason games? 

 

Im not sure I’m quite ready to give up on him yet.

[iuswingman]

definite or probable?

 

definite: clearly stated or decided; not vague or doubtful

probable: likely to be the case or to happen

 

I mean, listen, we're talking about preseason, not a game, not a game, not a game, we talking about preseason. Not a game.

[Yoshinator]

5 minutes ago, iuswingman said:

definite or probable?

 

definite: clearly stated or decided; not vague or doubtful

probable: likely to be the case or to happen

 

I mean, listen, we're talking about preseason, not a game, not a game, not a game, we talking about preseason. Not a game.

So because it's preseason, it doesn't mean he hasn't fumbled all these times? Poof, it magically disappears? He has major fumbling issues at the very least, preseason or not. That's a major reason to be concerned right there. That's not even counting his normal play, which hasn't been good either.

[iuswingman]

More along the lines of it's way too premature to write someone off after the preseason of their rookie year, especially using the word definite.  Nothing is definite after 4 preseason games.

 

That was just a slight edit on Allen Iverson's thoughts on practice.  Preseason games are just practice against other teams.

 

Hines has things he needs to work on.  The only thing I am disagreeing with is writing him off as a definite loss.

[Shadow_Creek]

3 minutes ago, iuswingman said:

More along the lines of it's way too premature to write someone off after the preseason of their rookie year, especially using the word definite.  Nothing is definite after 4 preseason games.

 

That was just a slight edit on Allen Iverson's thoughts on practice.  Preseason games are just practice against other teams.

tell that to jojo Natson who was a stud for us the first 3 preseason games last year in fact he could have been ty 2.0 however on the final game he fumbled 3 or 4 times and was cut immediately 

[Yoshinator]

11 minutes ago, iuswingman said:

More along the lines of it's way too premature to write someone off after the preseason of their rookie year, especially using the word definite.  Nothing is definite after 4 preseason games.

 

That was just a slight edit on Allen Iverson's thoughts on practice.  Preseason games are just practice against other teams.

 

Hines has things he needs to work on.  The only thing I am disagreeing with is writing him off as a definite loss.

Preseason games are definitely not practice against other teams, especially when you are fighting for playing time or even a roster spot. Hines was a fumbler in college, he has fumbled in the preseason. That mirrors his real game habits. It's not some random thing he's doing for fun, it's something he has trouble with. He fumbled 7 times his senior year in college. If he fumbles 8 times this year in the pros, that's once every other game, and he could literally cost us a game or two by himself. Definitely concerned, and he better fix it quick. He's not a definite loss, but he may not make the final 53 at this rate.

[iuswingman]

he was signed as an undrafted free agent and given a tryout to make the team. 

 

Colts didn't spend a draft pick on him.

[iuswingman]

1 minute ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Preseason games are definitely not practice against other teams, especially when you are fighting for playing time or even a roster spot. Hines was a fumbler in college, he has fumbled in the preseason. That mirrors his real game habits. It's not some random thing he's doing for fun, it's something he has trouble with. He fumbled 7 times his senior year in college. If he fumbles 8 times this year in the pros, that's once every other game, and he could literally cost us a game or two by himself. Definitely concerned, and he better fix it quick. He's not a definite loss, but he may not make the final 53 at this rate.

 

Do preseason games count?  Nope.  You are just arguing for the sake of arguing.  My point was that nothing is definite after 4 preseason games.  Yes, he has issues but it's not definite that the Colts brass has already given up on him.

[MacDee1975]

He was definitely a miss.

 

Another in a growing list of Ballard draft misses.

[Yoshinator]

1 minute ago, iuswingman said:

 

Do preseason games count?  Nope.  You are just arguing for the sake of arguing.  My point was that nothing is definite after 4 preseason games.  Yes, he has issues but it's not definite that the Colts brass has already given up on him.

I'm obviously dealing with a casual here. Preseason counts 100% when it comes to evaluating draftees, who makes the roster, and who starts and who sits. In case you didn't realize, we are going to cut this roster down from 90 to 53 very soon, and a 4th rounder who just got drafted with no sample size for us besides preseason is going to be in trouble when he does nothing but fumbles. You also didn't even attempt to refute or debate any of my points, so I'm not going to take you very serious as a knowledgeable fan.

[Surge89]

All I know is I don't want Ballard to make any more 4th round choices.  He's terrible at them.

[csmopar]

12 minutes ago, iuswingman said:

he was signed as an undrafted free agent and given a tryout to make the team. 

 

Colts didn't spend a draft pick on him.

uh... yeah they did...

 

https://coltswire.usatoday.com/2018/04/28/indianapolis-colts-nyheim-hines-2018-nfl-draft-instant-analysis/

 

 

That said, I think its too early to label him a bust or a wasted pick.  Lets see if he at least makes the team first, then we'll go from there.

Just now, Surge89 said:

All I know is I don't want Ballard to make any more 4th round choices.  He's terrible at them.

rather him miss at 4ths than miss on 1sts like his predecessor did.

[csmopar]

7 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I'm obviously dealing with a casual here. Preseason counts 100% when it comes to evaluating draftees, who makes the roster, and who starts and who sits. In case you didn't realize, we are going to cut this roster down from 90 to 53 very soon, and a 4th rounder who just got drafted with no sample size for us besides preseason is going to be in trouble when he does nothing but fumbles. You also didn't even attempt to refute or debate any of my points, so I'm not going to take you very serious as a knowledgeable fan.

While I do agree with you that the fumbles are a HUGE concern, Mack's injury may result in us carrying Hines until Mack is back fully. Otherwise, I'm not sure he makes the team.  Probably stash him on practice squad for a bit

[Surge89]

1 minute ago, csmopar said:

rather him miss at 4ths than miss on 1sts like his predecessor did.

 

The issue is he is showing he wants a draft only makeup of this team. And his first 2 years of drafting are underwhelming.  While I do agree he did great on the first round his picks after are all hit and miss. Without free agent talent this rebuild process is going to take 10 years and Luck will be long gone if he's only hitting on first round prospects and one or 2 others. 

 

But I do agree he is better than his predecessor so I guess I should simmer it down and be patient lol 

[TheMarine]

3 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

You also didn't even attempt to refute or debate any of my points, so I'm not going to take you very serious as a knowledgeable fan. 

 

Since when is that a requirement to post/have opinions? If so, this forum would be deader than the Browns having a shot at winning a game last season.

 

"Looks like a miss" is too soon, IMO, but its not too soon for being concerned. We've yet to see him used in the WR roll, or any of our RBs run behind what should be a full-strength line w/ Castanzo, Earl Grey, Kelly, Slauson, or...? and Doyel/Ebron. We havent seen him used in formations, in motion, etc.

I do think he can make the cut to 53, but it may be a short leash. He has potential, but needs to show improvement and ability to be used elsewhere. 

[Yoshinator]

Just now, csmopar said:

While I do agree with you that the fumbles are a HUGE concern, Mack's injury may result in us carrying Hines until Mack is back fully. Otherwise, I'm not sure he makes the team.  Probably stash him on practice squad for a bit

If he makes the team, that'll be why. I'm literally scared any time Hines touches the ball at this point. He may or may not stick on the practice squad. I'm guessing he would get claimed, but you never know.

[Yoshinator]

1 minute ago, TheMarine said:

 

Since when is that a requirement to post/have opinions? If so, this forum would be deader than the Browns having a shot at winning a game last season.

 

"Looks like a miss" is too soon, IMO, but its not too soon for being concerned. We've yet to see him used in the WR roll, or any of our RBs run behind what should be a full-strength line w/ Castanzo, Earl Grey, Kelly, Slauson, or...? and Doyel/Ebron. We havent seen him used in formations, in motion, etc.

I do think he can make the cut to 53, but it may be a short leash. He has potential, but needs to show improvement and ability to be used elsewhere. 

The point is, he literally has no point in anything he's saying. He keeps repeating that preseason doesn't count, when in reality, it is the thing destroying Hines. It matters in everything except the W and the L. The quality of the O-Line or the position Hines is being used at doesn't effect his fumbling issues. That's on him 100% and he's always had that problem. It's very difficult to fix.

[DaveA1102]

Are we really calling a draft pick a bust before the season starts?! 

 

Come on guys, the drops are concerning, but with a young guy like that, it is experience of mistakes under the lights in a meaningless game that the coaches can use to coach him up.

 

I think we need to take him off returns for now, and just spend time working on his ball protection.  Ball protection and retention is a skill that can be taught (although not easy), his speed and athleticism is not.  Lets give the boy a bit more time.

[csmopar]

2 minutes ago, Surge89 said:

 

The issue is he is showing he wants a draft only makeup of this team. And his first 2 years of drafting are underwhelming.  While I do agree he did great on the first round his picks after are all hit and miss. Without free agent talent this rebuild process is going to take 10 years and Luck will be long gone if he's only hitting on first round prospects and one or 2 others. 

 

But I do agree he is better than his predecessor so I guess I should simmer it down and be patient lol 

What evidence do you have that Ballard didn't at least TRY to sign some of the bigger FA.  Heck, everyone criticizes him for letting Melvin go but then it came out that Melvin took LESS money and a shorter deal than Ballard offered.  This isn't Madden where you just pay the most money and longest term and the FA signs. I think the uncertainty of Luck's shoulder, combined with the McDaniels fallout and a new Head coach all played AGAINST Ballard in FA this year. 

 

And to be honest, there was not a large amount of significant upgrades available in the FA pool this year.  Now, next year, I think things get a little more interesting.  The three year window where Ballard has to spend the 90% of cap I believe will be in its final window.  Right now, we are way under that so he'll be forced to make some moves.  Patience.

[Luck 4 president]

I wouldn’t be surprised if he is cut especially if there is a decent RB on the waiver. Remember, Ballard missed on that 4th round tackle last year and he was cut pretty quick. Ballard may not be great at drafting but at least he knows when to cut ties with someone.

[Yoshinator]

9 minutes ago, Luck 4 president said:

I wouldn’t be surprised if he is cut especially if there is a decent RB on the waiver. Remember, Ballard missed on that 4th round tackle last year and he was cut pretty quick. Ballard may not be great at drafting but at least he knows when to cut ties with someone.

The good news is that we are 3rd in waiver priority, so we'll have top choice at all these guys being cut. At the very least, we can build a nice practice squad. At best, we can gain some depth players, and possibly a starter or two for our team in the regular season. I hope Ballard abuses that waiver wire priority like crazy.

[richard pallo]

Maybe Ballard can package Hines and Basham in a trade and find a RT.  Grab a RB on cutdown day. 

[Yoshinator]

4 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Maybe Ballard can package Hines and Basham in a trade and find a RT.  Grab a RB on cutdown day. 

Lane Johnson has 3 years left on his deal if I remember right. I wouldn't mind trading a 2nd rounder and Basham for him.

[richard pallo]

3 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Lane Johnson has 3 years left on his deal if I remember right. I wouldn't mind trading a 2nd rounder and Basham for him.

There is also the RT from Miami that was available around draft time but nothing happened.  He had the high cap hit and was a former 1st. rd. pick.  Maybe he's still available. 

[jameszeigler834]

1 hour ago, lollygagger8 said:

I say move him to WR and get another RB. 

Move him to DB he cant catch a cold either.

1 hour ago, ColtJ82 said:

I'll wait to see what our rookie 4th round pick does as the season progresses. Not sure that 3 preseason games are a fair barometer. 

From the 3 games I have seen him in he sucks.

[Jason_]

47 minutes ago, csmopar said:

uh... yeah they did...

 

https://coltswire.usatoday.com/2018/04/28/indianapolis-colts-nyheim-hines-2018-nfl-draft-instant-analysis/

 

I think when he said the Colts didn't spend a draft pick on him, that poster was referring to Jojo Natson, not Hines.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

To early to tell yet on Hines. Lets see him as the season progress's. Now Basham if you had said him I might be more inclined to possible agree.

[SteelCityColt]

1 hour ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I'm obviously dealing with a casual here. Preseason counts 100% when it comes to evaluating draftees, who makes the roster, and who starts and who sits. In case you didn't realize, we are going to cut this roster down from 90 to 53 very soon, and a 4th rounder who just got drafted with no sample size for us besides preseason is going to be in trouble when he does nothing but fumbles. You also didn't even attempt to refute or debate any of my points, so I'm not going to take you very serious as a knowledgeable fan.

 

It’s a bit rich saying this when you yourself were unaware they don’t gameplan for preseason. Maybe lay off calling out people as “casuals”?

 

I believe his point was there is a greater sample than just the games but by all accounts he’s done nothing in practice in either. 

 

Are we really losing our minds over a 4th round RB? 

8 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

I think when he said the Colts didn't spend a draft pick on him, that poster was referring to Jojo Natson, not Hines.

 

Jojo should have been on the roster for his name alone.

[Yoshinator]

3 minutes ago, SteelCityColt said:

 

It’s a bit rich saying this when you yourself were unaware they don’t gameplan for preseason. Maybe lay off calling out people as “casuals”?

 

I believe his point was there is a greater sample than just the games but by all accounts he’s done nothing in practice in either. 

 

Are we really losing our minds over a 4th round RB? 

When we are used to Grigson missing on 9/10 of his picks, the frustration builds up when players look like busts before the season start, so yes, we are losing our minds, lol. It's the nature of being an NFL fan. 

 

Also, show me somewhere where they announce it on tv or somewhere else in the media that teams don't gameplan for the preseason. Most people don't realize that until they are told so. Common sense says you would have a gameplan going into a game, whether it's preseason or not, to prepare the team for the real thing come the regular season. You didn't know it coming out of the womb either. 

 

Ask 10 fans next time you go to a game, and more people than not will not realize that teams don't gameplan for preseason. You want to talk about irrelevant, that's irrelevant for a fan to know.

[Fisticuffs111]

I'm one of Hines' least enthusiastic fans, wasn't big on the Turay/Lewis/Hines picks, but even I think it's way too early to judge him. You can make observations about him but to say anybody is a bust right now is over the top.

He, along with Ebron, are guys I'm really hoping can excel in Reich's offense. Ebron obviously has the better tools/more talent, but hopefully Hines can find a niche in this offense. I don't think he'll ever do that well at RB but hopefully just enough so that he can get a chance to get some receptions out of the backfield, get him into open space. Because even though I don't think he plays like his 40 time, he still is fast.

[crazycolt1]

8 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

When we are used to Grigson missing on 9/10 of his picks, the frustration builds up when players look like busts before the season start, so yes, we are losing our minds, lol. It's the nature of being an NFL fan. 

 

Also, show me somewhere where they announce it on tv or somewhere else in the media that teams don't gameplan for the preseason. Most people don't realize that until they are told so. Common sense says you would have a gameplan going into a game, whether it's preseason or not, to prepare the team for the real thing come the regular season. You didn't know it coming out of the womb either. 

 

Ask 10 fans next time you go to a game, and more people than not will not realize that teams don't gameplan for preseason. You want to talk about irrelevant, that's irrelevant for a fan to know.

Patience Grasshopper. It will all work out.

[Yoshinator]

1 minute ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I'm one of Hines' least enthusiastic fans, wasn't big on the Turay/Lewis/Hines picks, but even I think it's way too early to judge him. You can make observations about him but to say anybody is a bust right now is ridiculous.

He, along with Ebron, are guys I'm really hoping can excel in Reich's offense. Ebron obviously has the better tools/more talent, but hopefully Hines can find a niche in this offense. I don't think he'll ever do that well at RB but hopefully just enough so that he can get a chance to get some receptions out of the backfield, get him into open space. Because even though I don't think he plays like his 40 time, he still is fast.

My biggest turnoff for an RB is fumbling, and Hines has it in spades. That'll get you cut quicker than anything, and it costs us games if it happens in the regular season. It's hard to fix as well. If he does fix it, then we have to hope he becomes a good RB, so there's two obstacles to overcome.

[jvan1973]

Just now, Jared Cisneros said:

My biggest turnoff for an RB is fumbling, and Hines has it in spades. That'll get you cut quicker than anything, and it costs us games if it happens in the regular season. It's hard to fix as well. If he does fix it, then we have to hope he becomes a good RB, so there's two obstacles to overcome.

Adrian Peterson used to have fumbling issues as well.   It can be fixed.