Who would you give up draft picks for in a trade and at what cost. Bell, Donald, Mack other?

[Coltivated]

Let's say this year the colts make a splash trade. Hypothetically contracts can't be hashed out and the colts are actually in contention for a run. If you were ballard what would u do? 

[coltsfanej]

Mack or Donald. Be happy to give a 1st for either.  Bell is good but he’s got a lot of miles on him and I like a comitee approach. 

[SteelDragon]

Trades are so unpredictable, it's almost not worth doing the mental gymnastics to entertain them

[Alex22]

Definitely Mack or Donald for a first and maybe a second included. They are game changers on defense plus we have the cap space.  

[WoolMagnet]

Well, at this point, we have that extra #2 that we got from the Jets.  In some ways, i feel like we got it "for nothing".  Some pretty good players have been traded for a #2.  Really good players actually.  And we certainly have the $ for a top player.  And actually, i might prefer a proven guy over an unknown in the 2nd.  A tuff call tho for sure.

if we could get a LB like Mack, or a #1 corner, i'd look hard at it.

i would say LB, CB, or edge rusher/DE would be the only positions i'd consider giving a #2 for.  

So then, to move diwn 3 spots and still getting (arguably) the guy we should have taken at #3 anyway, Ballard should walk away with GM of the year fo getting:

3 extra 2nds and getting the LB (who is looking good), a good looking "extra" guard, AND a stud LB, CB, or DE.  Homerun!

the more i look at this draft, the more i am amazed at how it worked out. Time will tell, but i am HIGHLY optimistic.

didnt we get Davis frim miami for a 2nd? Wasnt garrapolo git for a 2nd?  And in some ways, our extra 2nd feels like "free money." 

Blkard also created HUGE capital/value when he traded for Brissett.  I would like to keep him, but if Baklard is smart, he'll trade him before the rookie contract is up because we wont te-sign him.  He'll get paid well by someone.  More than we would on a back-up.

think about it, in a VERY short time Ballard has:

1. Changed the attitude and tone of the organization

2. Created a clear feeling of stabilily thru a difficult time ( Luck issues, weak roster,etc.

3.created draft collateral (trade)

4. Created pkayer collateral (Brissett)

5. Put us in a GREAT cap situation

 

i'm fully on-board.  

 

[SteelCityColt]

It’s funny in some ways how the Mack/Donald contract talks are linked it seems in that it feels like Donald wants Mack to sign and set the market. By all accounts though no talks have happened with Mack.

 

No way the Rams let Donald go anywhere but I’d snap their hand off for a 1st rounder any day. Mack.. not so much.

[Luck 4 president]

Well it depends where our weakness is at the trade deadline.  If our DL rotation works like Reich wants it to then pass on Mack and Donald. Same with our RB Comittee. If it doesn’t we could trade for bell if the Steelers are out of contention. I don’t think it would cost much because it would be a half season rental

[Peterk2011]

I wouldn't trade for a big name for high price right now, and I have my reason why. There are plenty of young, talented, but unproven players on the roster. We need to find out who will (can) be special and who won't. If they traded for Mack right now, and it turns out that for example Turay is special, then it will be a waste, because they will need to let one of them go in 1-2 years. That's a waste, because even with a Donald on board, the Colts wouldn't be a serious contender right now.

 

So, trade for an elite player / sign elite free agent if you have only 1-2 missing pieces - like Denver did in 2013-2014 -, otherwise save your draft capital and build your team through drafts.

[gnet550]

Mack, if any...I feel like RB by committee we have will do fine...Marlong has big plays in him and Wilkins and Turbin will grind out short yardage....I also feel like the interior DL is a strength with Big Al and the rotation of young guys will supplement...if we could get Mack for a 3rd maybe a 2nd..is do it because he’s still young.

[DaColts85]

In the same time Mack has only 1.5 more sacks than Donald. Donlad is a DT that would immediately draw attention and allow for our young DE's to get some 1-on-1's. If your DT can get 10 sacks allowing other guys to get pressure as well you have an immediate difference maker in my eyes based on the defense we are wanting to run.  A trade just like anything else makes since based on your d scheme. Mack would be great but look at the DT position. Lewis has potential but I will take 10 sacks from up the middle all day and let Autry get a smaller amount of reps and keep a smile. That pushes the pocket and forces your QB to move outside their comfort spots and moving towards you DE's. For me clearly Donald would be the guy I go after in this hypothetical scenario.

[K-148]

Sure, Donald is a better 3-tech than Aultry or Lewis. But let's get Luke Kuechly!

[Str8himalaya]

I tend to look at it from a value perspective. In our current situation, I think we will probably be picking in the middle of the rounds next year (Luck has never gone worse than .500 in a season that he started all year). Do I think there is ANY player in next years draft at the 14-18th pick in the first as good as Mack or Donald? Nope. Maybe a few years younger, but those guys are proven difference makers. Adding Donald to our front 7 on defense would be HUGE. Donald, Sheard, Woods, and whoever else as a front 4 would be dominant in getting after the QB. He would be a bigger impact and a perfect fit for our scheme. Mack is a little more interesting. I would be on the fence giving a first for him only because of our unknowns at the DE position with Turay and Basham. I would certainly give a first for Donald.

[TKnight24]

Aaron Donald easily 

 

 

[Matabix]

Mack and there 2nd for our 1st. 

[DonnieDarko1023]

The clear answer is Donald.......best defensive player in the league.....definitely in the system we Colts run now 

[Devildog]

Mack Donald

 

"I'm Loving It!"

[Lucky Colts Fan]

28 minutes ago, Devildog said:

Mack Donald

 

Had a farm...

[richard pallo]

I would take Donald over Mack and give them our 1st and 2nd. this year.  The consensus on the street is we will not be good this year so they might really want those picks.  We already have the Jets 2nd. so it's not like we are not picking in the 1st. two rounds.  There is even a chance we trade Brisett for a high rd. pick.  We have already received a couple of offers for him.  So it's not out of the question.  If Luck gets through the season and our line looks good we could be okay with an older veteran backup again.  

[Hark]

We need to win up front on both sides of the ball. Aaron Donald is a game changer in that regard. No problem giving up a first for that kind of talent.

[ColtStrong2013]

2 hours ago, K-148 said:

Sure, Donald is a better 3-tech than Aultry or Lewis. But let's get Luke Kuechly!

Donald is the better pick over Mack, because I think Sheard is solid and will be even better in his natural position... and Basham, Turay combo could be real good in time.

 

But.  I agree with you wholeheartedly. We need a strong Mike backer in this organization. Walker could be that guy. But we need it. 

[ColtStrong2013]

50 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

I would take Donald over Mack and give them our 1st and 2nd. this year.  The consensus on the street is we will not be good this year so they might really want those picks.  We already have the Jets 2nd. so it's not like we are not picking in the 1st. two rounds.  There is even a chance we trade Brisett for a high rd. pick.  We have already received a couple of offers for him.  So it's not out of the question.  If Luck gets through the season and our line looks good we could be okay with an older veteran backup again.  

The consensus from the media... Front offices throughout the league might not take that bet with what could be an offense with #12 that puts up 30+ a game... 

[richard pallo]

Just now, ColtStrong2013 said:

The consensus from the media... Front offices throughout the league might not take that bet with what could be an offense with #12 that puts up 30+ a game... 

I agree.  That's why I don't think our pick is going to be a top 10 pick but they might think so and would like to have it.  The Jets on the other hand could have a top 10 pick and we would have their 2nd. 

[Hoose]

2 hours ago, DonnieDarko1023 said:

The clear answer is Donald.......best defensive player in the league.....definitely in the system we Colts run now 

Totally agree. The compensation would likely have to be next year’s 1st and a future 2nd. Donald is a game changer. Very few of them around. He’s worth it. 

[aaron11]

cant see the rams ever making donald available in a trade, they are going to pay him.  i doubt two firsts would get their attention and i wouldnt want to give up more 

 

mack is in an interesting spot, but it will take more than just a pick or two to get him, unless things really break down between him and the team

 

its hard to trade draft picks for two of the best players in the league 

[richard pallo]

Both Donald and Mack are interesting cases.  Donald has to be upset other guys on his team are getting paid and he is not.  Then his GM publicly says they don't agree on the value his camp has placed on him.  Mack's ,on the other hand, hasn't had any talks since February or even a phone call from his new coach.  How does a player react to that?  Not an Earl Thomas situation yet but it is looking like it could get worse before they are both resolved one way or the other. 

[ColtStrong2013]

2 hours ago, richard pallo said:

I agree.  That's why I don't think our pick is going to be a top 10 pick but they might think so and would like to have it.  The Jets on the other hand could have a top 10 pick and we would have their 2nd. 

Trading players for picks preseason, or even early to mid-season is a gamble... some are willing to take a chance, some are not. If they are looking to unload those guys, they might not care much to where the picks might end up as long as they are getting what they are asking. 

[Four2itus]

No

[The Peytonator]

It came out yesterday that Aaron Donald is looking for elite QB money. The Rams have supposedly offered the highest contract for a defensive player ever, and he’s turning it down. Don’t get me wrong, he’s a generational talent, but he is not worth that kind of money. So not only would we have to trade multiple first round picks, we’d also have to break the bank to keep him otherwise risk these lengthy holdouts that he’s done two years straight. I wouldn’t want the headache that he or Bell are causing their respective teams. 

[ColtStrong2013]

1 hour ago, The Peytonator said:

It came out yesterday that Aaron Donald is looking for elite QB money. The Rams have supposedly offered the highest contract for a defensive player ever, and he’s turning it down. Don’t get me wrong, he’s a generational talent, but he is not worth that kind of money. So not only would we have to trade multiple first round picks, we’d also have to break the bank to keep him otherwise risk these lengthy holdouts that he’s done two years straight. I wouldn’t want the headache that he or Bell are causing their respective teams. 

He's not worth that kind of money to a smart cap-minded team... but he may be to a small market team needing the boost he will deliver. Teams do stupid things when they are desperate. Ballard will not, unless he sees that he is worthy and the team needs the defensive line boost. Even with a God-awful season on the defensive line this season, I still would anticipate him to address it in next years draft, where defensive tackle is top heavy... And I happen to think the new scheme / rotating several quality players will be much improved compared to years past for us, so I would be dumbfounded if he tried to pull something. He values the draft too much to give top picks away for a position he may draft next year on a cheap contract (comparatively) anyways. 

[The Peytonator]

36 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

He's not worth that kind of money to a smart cap-minded team... but he may be to a small market team needing the boost he will deliver. Teams do stupid things when they are desperate. Ballard will not, unless he sees that he is worthy and the team needs the defensive line boost. Even with a God-awful season on the defensive line this season, I still would anticipate him to address it in next years draft, where defensive tackle is top heavy... And I happen to think the new scheme / rotating several quality players will be much improved compared to years past for us, so I would be dumbfounded if he tried to pull something. He values the draft too much to give top picks away for a position he may draft next year on a cheap contract (comparatively) anyways. 

 

Yeah I’m really hoping for a DT in the first round next year. It’s strong on the dline. I’m a little pessimistic with this year’s dline for us but we’ll see how it goes. 

[richard pallo]

1 hour ago, The Peytonator said:

It came out yesterday that Aaron Donald is looking for elite QB money. The Rams have supposedly offered the highest contract for a defensive player ever, and he’s turning it down. Don’t get me wrong, he’s a generational talent, but he is not worth that kind of money. So not only would we have to trade multiple first round picks, we’d also have to break the bank to keep him otherwise risk these lengthy holdouts that he’s done two years straight. I wouldn’t want the headache that he or Bell are causing their respective teams. 

If the Rams did offer him a contract making him the highest paid defensive player ever and he turned it down then I can see Ballard staying away.  I don't see Ballard going overboard on the that one.   Although that said there is no guarantee next years draft is going to get us a major talent on the DL.  Especially since I don't see us drafting that high again.  Donald and Mack are proven young major talent.  Now if Mack would be receptive to being the highest paid defensive player and the Raiders are receptive to a trade then it's a discussion worth having.  We haven't had a major talent on defense since Freeney in his prime.  Either player would elevate our defense in a major way.  I can see Ballard paying if he feels the player is worth it but not going overboard.

[Surge89]

9 hours ago, Str8himalaya said:

I tend to look at it from a value perspective. In our current situation, I think we will probably be picking in the middle of the rounds next year (Luck has never gone worse than .500 in a season that he started all year). Do I think there is ANY player in next years draft at the 14-18th pick in the first as good as Mack or Donald? Nope. Maybe a few years younger, but those guys are proven difference makers. Adding Donald to our front 7 on defense would be HUGE. Donald, Sheard, Woods, and whoever else as a front 4 would be dominant in getting after the QB. He would be a bigger impact and a perfect fit for our scheme. Mack is a little more interesting. I would be on the fence giving a first for him only because of our unknowns at the DE position with Turay and Basham. I would certainly give a first for Donald.

 

Um... You might wanna rethink this statement.  

 

This next class of defensive linemen are going to be pretty dang special. 

[richard pallo]

1 minute ago, Surge89 said:

 

Um... You might wanna rethink this statement.  

 

This next class of defensive linemen are going to be pretty dang special. 

I have to say I don't think there would be a player as good as Donald or Mack at 14-18.  We're talking Donald or Mack here.  Not a regular 1st rd, NFL starter.  As always is the case if that position is loaded there will be an early run especially since the QB class is not strong.  The odds are pretty long there.  I would have the conversations if either one was suddenly to become available. 

[ColtStrong2013]

4 hours ago, richard pallo said:

If the Rams did offer him a contract making him the highest paid defensive player ever and he turned it down then I can see Ballard staying away.  I don't see Ballard going overboard on the that one.   Although that said there is no guarantee next years draft is going to get us a major talent on the DL.  Especially since I don't see us drafting that high again.  Donald and Mack are proven young major talent.  Now if Mack would be receptive to being the highest paid defensive player and the Raiders are receptive to a trade then it's a discussion worth having.  We haven't had a major talent on defense since Freeney in his prime.  Either player would elevate our defense in a major way.  I can see Ballard paying if he feels the player is worth it but not going overboard.

Mistakenly quoted this rather than another... sorry pallo

 

[ColtStrong2013]

13 hours ago, Str8himalaya said:

I tend to look at it from a value perspective. In our current situation, I think we will probably be picking in the middle of the rounds next year (Luck has never gone worse than .500 in a season that he started all year). Do I think there is ANY player in next years draft at the 14-18th pick in the first as good as Mack or Donald? Nope. Maybe a few years younger, but those guys are proven difference makers. Adding Donald to our front 7 on defense would be HUGE. Donald, Sheard, Woods, and whoever else as a front 4 would be dominant in getting after the QB. He would be a bigger impact and a perfect fit for our scheme. Mack is a little more interesting. I would be on the fence giving a first for him only because of our unknowns at the DE position with Turay and Basham. I would certainly give a first for Donald.

Value in terms of production

overall, yes. Value in terms of production to cap number, not necessarily. This is the moneyball game. If you want to pay a defensive tackle quarterback money, go for it. But you can potentially get a great producer in the first round next year for a fraction of the money... And that is what makes professional sports FUN

[UKColt13]

Id send our 1 & 1 of our 2s this year for Donald. 

 

Bell is great and so is Mack but I like the young talent we have at those positions to develop.

 

Donald is a game-wrecked at a position where we have Al Woods who isn’t a great scheme for and Autry/Stewart. Donald fixes that for years to come.

[Lawrence Owen]

I wouldn't trade for any of them.

1: Money Money Money.  We have a lot tied into Luck already, we'll need the remaining cap to redo contracts for our own 'homegrown' talents when they come up.

 

2: As mentioned in #1, I am a firm believer in the "homegrown' philosophy Ballard is preaching.  Yeah, I drank his cool-aid.  You draft them, you teach them, you know what you have when contract time is up.

 

3: I don't want anyone who'll sit out a training camp because they haven't gotten a contract extension.  period.

 

4: Don't get me wrong, Donald is a great player, and if anyone it would be him.  But i'd stick to my guns and see what 'I've put together' so far this season is I were Ballard and 'confident & excited' about the d-line as much as he is.

[ColtStrong2013]

53 minutes ago, Lawrence Owen said:

I wouldn't trade for any of them.

1: Money Money Money.  We have a lot tied into Luck already, we'll need the remaining cap to redo contracts for our own 'homegrown' talents when they come up.

 

2: As mentioned in #1, I am a firm believer in the "homegrown' philosophy Ballard is preaching.  Yeah, I drank his cool-aid.  You draft them, you teach them, you know what you have when contract time is up.

 

3: I don't want anyone who'll sit out a training camp because they haven't gotten a contract extension.  period.

 

4: Don't get me wrong, Donald is a great player, and if anyone it would be him.  But i'd stick to my guns and see what 'I've put together' so far this season is I were Ballard and 'confident & excited' about the d-line as much as he is.

Donald is the best defensive tackle in the game. But bringing someone like him in would limit your opportunity to build a young player we might already have on roster that could produce for a fraction of the longterm cost that Donald will bring to whoever he ends up with. 

 

I agree with all 4 of your points wholeheartedly. 

[richard pallo]

1 hour ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

Donald is the best defensive tackle in the game. But bringing someone like him in would limit your opportunity to build a young player we might already have on roster that could produce for a fraction of the longterm cost that Donald will bring to whoever he ends up with. 

 

I agree with all 4 of your points wholeheartedly. 

All well and good but the counterpoint is the word "might".  Might already have on our roster.  Donald is already the best defensive tackle in the game.  We paid Andrew Luck.  There is nothing wrong with paying Aaron Donald.  Then we definitely have two of the best players in the game.  Just sayin. 

[ColtStrong2013]

27 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

All well and good but the counterpoint is the word "might".  Might already have on our roster.  Donald is already the best defensive tackle in the game.  We paid Andrew Luck.  There is nothing wrong with paying Aaron Donald.  Then we definitely have two of the best players in the game.  Just sayin. 

Until they both go down with injury and we are left with 80% of the total cap to work with... Look at Houston last season. Can you imagine what their roster would have looked like had Watson been a $25 mil caphit when he and Watt both went down? I'd be curious to know many superbowl winning teams over the past 10 years have had such a large percentage of the cap in 2 or 3 players? I'm not a big advocate of having large cap hits outside of the quarterback position. Spread the wealth and create serious depth across the roster. That's championship building strategy... and what Ballard is working to accomplish.