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McShay: Several teams have taken M.Hurst off their board

Defjamz26
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Defjamz26

Defjamz26 2,148

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https://www.maizenbrew.com/2018/4/24/17274916/todd-mcshay-reports-teams-nfl-draft-taken-maurice-hurst-off-draft-board-michigan-wolverines

 

For the Colts sake, I hope it’s true. I’d jump all over Hurst in the 2nd round. He’s a perfect fit for the new scheme. If it’s the same condition Loutelei had, and he’s enjoyed a fine NFL career, then I have no reservations.

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NewColtsFan

NewColtsFan 9,329

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37 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

https://www.maizenbrew.com/2018/4/24/17274916/todd-mcshay-reports-teams-nfl-draft-taken-maurice-hurst-off-draft-board-michigan-wolverines

 

For the Colts sake, I hope it’s true. I’d jump all over Hurst in the 2nd round. He’s a perfect fit for the new scheme. If it’s the same condition Loutelei had, and he’s enjoyed a fine NFL career, then I have no reservations.

 

Not only does McShay report that Hurst has been removed from the boards of several teams.....   he also notes that Hurst could fall all the way to Day Three.

 

So WHEN you take Hurst becomes even more interesting and difficult to figure out...

 

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ColtsBlitz

ColtsBlitz 399

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2 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Not only does McShay report that Hurst has been removed from the boards of several teams.....   he also notes that Hurst could fall all the way to Day Three.

 

So WHEN you take Hurst becomes even more interesting and difficult to figure out...

 

Our third 2nd round pick would be as long as I’d like to wait for someone like Hurst. It only takes one brave team

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dgambill

dgambill 1,173

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DT is pretty strong again in this draft imo. I am very sure he has fallen to at least late 2nd round. There are a lot of good DTs in this draft that would naturally move ahead based on his medical. Given DL is not the biggest need on this team (but good players are) I could see us taking one possibly with our 3rd rd pick. We just have so many needs and only so many picks unfortunately. It would be hard to risk a high pick on him because we have so many other needs to take a risk on him.

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ColtsBlitz

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9 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

I'd nab him if he's there at our 4th pick unless a better option was available.  I would not pass on him with our 5th round pick.  If he's gone in the 3rd, I'd be okay with not having him at all.

Since he’s more talented than anyone in the 3rd (or near the top) I’d take him without hesitation. 

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jskinnz

jskinnz 1,889

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I understand the desire that everyone has to get a high level player at a bargain.  But why do you think there are teams taking him off their board?  The possibility of something tragic happening has to scare teams half to death.

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NewColtsFan

NewColtsFan 9,329

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41 minutes ago, DaColts85 said:

Yea if he makes it to us in the 2nd you grab him.  He is not sliding to round 3 let alone day 3. 

 

You realize fans have the least amount of accurate info, right?    Especially about medical information, right?

 

I'm not saying McShay is right...   but odds are he's got better info than you and I do..

 

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NewColtsFan

NewColtsFan 9,329

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9 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

I understand the desire that everyone has to get a high level player at a bargain.  But why do you think there are teams taking him off their board?  The possibility of something tragic happening has to scare teams half to death.

 

If the worry was something tragic happening then he wouldn't have been cleared by pretty much everybody.

 

I think the worry is that he'll never be quite the same and he'd be a wasted pick...

 

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OffensivelyPC

OffensivelyPC 1,121

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31 minutes ago, ColtsBlitz said:

Since he’s more talented than anyone in the 3rd (or near the top) I’d take him without hesitation. 

Yeah, I get that and I wouldn't be disappointed if we took him in the 3rd.  But to me, third round picks are still a really high commodity and I shirk at taking guys with serious red flags in the first two days of the draft.  He may well get drafted in the 3rd and all that really says to me is that they are more willing to take certain red flags in the third whereas I wouldn't.  To be fair, I would start considering taking him in the 3rd.  He grades out based on the tape alone as a high second rounder up to a mid-first, depending on who you're asking.  He's a bargain in the third, no doubt about it.  But his heart condition could take him off the field permanently, particularly because we don't even know what it is - it hasn't been disclosed to my knowledge.

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DaColts85

DaColts85 512

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40 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

You realize fans have the least amount of accurate info, right?    Especially about medical information, right?

 

I'm not saying McShay is right...   but odds are he's got better info than you and I do..

 

As do the many other "experts" saying the complete opposite of him.  I respect you putting information out there, but at no means do I have to agree.

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chad72

chad72 7,570

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1 hour ago, OffensivelyPC said:

I'd nab him if he's there at our 4th pick unless a better option was available.  I would not pass on him with our 5th round pick.  If he's gone in the 3rd, I'd be okay with not having him at all.

 

I'd be fine with the 3rd round, to be honest, to take a flier on him but not before that. There are nice 1-gap DT options for us in this draft though, even into the 4th round.

 

Here is a nice article: 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/2018-nfl-draft-rankings-hand-use-one-gap-vs-two-gap-and-everything-to-know-about-dts/

 

However, it evaluates only ability and not availability. The true concern with Maurice Hurst is availability due to medical reasons at this point. Otherwise, we all know he was a sure fire first rounder. Cowboys took the same kind of risk with Jaylen Smith, not sure how long it will take for us to find out how good he is.

 

Any other examples of such cases in the draft? Marcus Lattimore, he never amounted to much after the 49ers took a flier on him in round 3. Willis McGahee's injury in the Fiesta Bowl led him to drop to the end of the first round, if I remember correct, he had a decent career. Not sure if we have any DL examples.

 

EDIT: Found another article about draft history with injured players:

 

https://www.musiccitymiracles.com/2017/4/6/15164198/nfl-draft-injury-history

 

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1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Not only does McShay report that Hurst has been removed from the boards of several teams.....   he also notes that Hurst could fall all the way to Day Three.

 

So WHEN you take Hurst becomes even more interesting and difficult to figure out...

 

If he is on our board at all... you don't let him go past 37... you just don't! I can't think of a scenario where there will be multiple players better than Hurst at 36-37 for us to select. 

 

If he's not on our board... oh well... We will have to find a way to get Ed Oliver next year. :P 

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NewColtsFan

NewColtsFan 9,329

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2 minutes ago, DaColts85 said:

As do the many other "experts" saying the complete opposite of him.  I respect you putting information out there, but at no means do I have to agree.

 

Im not asking you to agree...  only acknowledge that what you and I have are opinions....

 

What McShay has is access to the opinion makers.   He's talking to sources with teams and the NFL.  His info is far more likely to be right than ours is...

 

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chad72

chad72 7,570

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Just now, NewColtsFan said:

 

Im not asking you to agree...  only acknowledge that what you and I have are opinions....

 

What McShay has is access to the opinion makers.   He's talking to sources with teams and the NFL.  His info is far more likely to be right than ours is...

 

 

Heart condition - the one that comes closest is D.J.Hayden, right?

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OffensivelyPC

OffensivelyPC 1,121

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26 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

I'd be fine with the 3rd round, to be honest, to take a flier on him but not before that. There are nice 1-gap DT options for us in this draft though, even into the 4th round.

 

Here is a nice article: 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/2018-nfl-draft-rankings-hand-use-one-gap-vs-two-gap-and-everything-to-know-about-dts/

 

However, it evaluates only ability and not availability. The true concern with Maurice Hurst is availability due to medical reasons at this point. Otherwise, we all know he was a sure fire first rounder. Cowboys took the same kind of risk with Jaylen Smith, not sure how long it will take for us to find out how good he is.

 

Any other examples of such cases in the draft? Marcus Lattimore, he never amounted to much after the 49ers took a flier on him in round 3. Willis McGahee's injury in the Fiesta Bowl led him to drop to the end of the first round, if I remember correct, he had a decent career. Not sure if we have any DL examples.

 

EDIT: Found another article about draft history with injured players:

 

https://www.musiccitymiracles.com/2017/4/6/15164198/nfl-draft-injury-history

 

One of the more recent examples as far as Colts history is Josh Chapman who played most of his final season with Alabama with a torn ACL.  I think it hurt him in the long run as he was never able to really deliver or develop, I'm assuming, because he didn't take care of it when he was should have and perhaps it even caused some permanent damage.  But as I'm sure you know, knee and heart obviously come with separate issues and don't really compare.

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DaColts85

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44 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Im not asking you to agree...  only acknowledge that what you and I have are opinions....

 

What McShay has is access to the opinion makers.   He's talking to sources with teams and the NFL.  His info is far more likely to be right than ours is...

 

Oh my comment is 100% my opinion.  Every one here should know that.

 

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jskinnz

jskinnz 1,889

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2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

If the worry was something tragic happening then he wouldn't have been cleared by pretty much everybody.

 

I think the worry is that he'll never be quite the same and he'd be a wasted pick...

 

 

He'll never be quite the same as what?  As he was before his heart diagnosis?  

 

Teams are taking him off the board precisely because of health concerns.  

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Hoose

Hoose 1,197

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So I guess the teams that have dumped him off their Boards aren’t willing to take any chances at all. This guy doesn’t have terrible injury history nor does he have any character issues. He played like a demon in college. He has to be a minor risk at worst. I take him in the 2nd round and don’t look back. He’s precisely what the Colts are looking for in a DT. You get a sure fire first rounder handed to you on a platter. Life is good. 

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MikeCurtis

MikeCurtis 2,372

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We do need to get a penetrating DT in this draft if at all possible

 

Phillips

Hurst

T Btyan

 

I would be happy if we somehow got one of these 3

 

Watch the tape on Philips, that guy has a killer swim move.....

and from a DT position gets a TON of tackles..... rare for the position

 

But.....Hurst is my favorite of the three

 

To me, he either is healthy enough to play in the NFL or not. It would seem that something like a heart issue, is it a problem or not...

 

If he is still on MY board, I am looking deeply into the heart issue..... BEFORE

the draft.........  

 

I would trust the Colts doctors to decide.....  

 

I hope he is fully healthy, AND...... he is wearing the SHOE.

 

Deano

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NewColtsFan

NewColtsFan 9,329

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1 hour ago, jskinnz said:

 

He'll never be quite the same as what?  As he was before his heart diagnosis?  

 

Teams are taking him off the board precisely because of health concerns.  

Yes...   that he'll never be the same as before his heart diagnosis.

 

Some teams, a few teams have taken Hurst off the board.   Just as some teams take a player off for all sorts of medical reasons --- it doesn't have to be life and death.

 

He's been cleared by the NFL...   Hurst was NOT asked to come back for the medical re-check in Indianapolis in Mid-April.    So the NFL has signed off on what two different groups of doctors came up with when they recently examined Hurst and cleared him.

 

This isn't life and death.   This is...   is his health going to impact his ability to be a quality player in the NFL?   A couple of team doctors have said yes...   and for all we know that came from an order from the owner of a team who doesn't want to mess with a player with a heart issue?  

 

Hey...   for all we know, the Colts are a team that is not considering Hurst?   Who knows?   

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Jared Cisneros

Jared Cisneros 3,945

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If Chris Ballard has any info that Hurst's heart issue will hinder him in any way, then I hope he completely removes him from our board. We can't afford to take a chance on him if he has any medical issues. Nothing is more serious than your heart. I might not take Bradley Chubb in the 2nd if he had heart issues let alone Maurice Hurst. Absolute trap to take him in the 2nd unless he's completely checked out. Maybe day 3 at the earliest, but I wouldn't like that either.

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Defjamz26

Defjamz26 2,148

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1 minute ago, Jared Cisneros said:

If Chris Ballard has any info that Hurst's heart issue will hinder him in any way, then I hope he completely removes him from our board. We can't afford to take a chance on him if he has any medical issues. Nothing is more serious than your heart. I might not take Bradley Chubb in the 2nd if he had heart issues let alone Maurice Hurst. Absolute trap to take him in the 2nd unless he's completely checked out. Maybe day 3 at the earliest, but I wouldn't like that either.

It’s been confirmed by Hurst that it’s the same issue that Loutelei has. And Star has had a fine NFL career with no issues that I’ve heard of.

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Jared Cisneros

Jared Cisneros 3,945

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2 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

It’s been confirmed by Hurst that it’s the same issue that Loutelei has. And Star has had a fine NFL career with no issues that I’ve heard of.

Well, no two human bodies react the same. If they did, then everybody with the same conditions would be able to be cured, given the same medication, or just react the same to them. The human body is very volatile, and what happens with one person could be a whole different experience for someone else. Doctors and surgeons wish everyone reacted the same and medicine would be extremely easy. 

 

I don't like it, and the earliest I'd take him is on day 3. Heart issues scare me to death. Not only do you have to worry about the medical concerns, you have to worry about the player succeeding in the NFL and not being a bust. It's an uphill battle.

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stitches

stitches 8,444

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21 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Which of the 3 are you surprised about?

Hurst day 3. I'm having hard time to figure out why? Like... I get that he has the heart issue, but from what I understand it's an issue that you either clear him for and think he can play with it and don't worry about it or you don't and he's not even on your board. If you clear him, I see no reason why he should drop past 2nd round. If I'm one of the teams that clear him I would have very hard time passing on him at 36 or 37 for example. 

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Jared Cisneros

Jared Cisneros 3,945

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1 minute ago, stitches said:

Hurst day 3. I'm having hard time to figure out why? Like... I get that he has the heart issue, but from what I understand it's an issue that you either clear him for and think he can play with it and don't worry about it or you don't and he's not even on your board. If you clear him, I see no reason why he should drop past 2nd round. If I'm one of the teams that clear him I would have very hard time passing on him at 36 or 37 for example. 

It's all about minimizing risk. The teams that are interested in him still want him, but on day 3 at a lesser risk. If a 4th rounder fails, it doesn't kill the draft, if a 2nd rounder busts, that hurts your draft (and the other teams don't have three 2nd round picks like us). He probably won't leave the 2nd round because it takes only 1 team to take a risk, but a lot of teams have him as a day 3 pick just in case there is some small chance he falls, then they can take a top talent on day 3 that falls. They are minimizing the risk this way too. If they don't get him, they got a normal 2nd rounder without medical issues and can take BPA in the 4th and move on.

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http://draftanalyst.com/nfl-draft-notes-april-25

 

Quote

* Since last night, two separate sources tell me that they believe Maurice Hurst will fall out of the first round due to medical concerns and could drop as far as the third. Our most recent mock draft has Hurst landing with the Minnesota Vikings in Round 1.

 

Damn, I hope he falls to us in the second. This could be a tremendous draft for us. 

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