Indianapolis Colts trade #3 overall pick to New York Jets (merge)

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 hour ago, OffensivelyPC said:

Yeah, Chubb at 6 is unlikely. But a man can hope! Lol.

What do you think about Edmunds at 6 if Chubb is gone. He is very fast and a Great tackler but a LB. We do need LB's.

[JColts72]

17 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I don't want Chubb or Nelson at #6.  I'd rather trade out again, but if I had to pick at 6, today I'd pick Edmunds.

Why would u not want either player?

[DougDew]

4 hours ago, JColts72 said:

Why would u not want either player?

Look at Ryan Jensen.  Its easier to have a mid round G play better than his drafted position than a LB, IMO. 

 

I think Chubb has bust potential to not live up to hype.

[Colt Overseas]

From Ballard:

 

"It gives us a chance to really replenish our young talent and start building a core of young talent like we need to do.”

 

Excited about the long term future of this franchise now. Im feeling hopeful.

[dgambill]

2 hours ago, DougDew said:

I don't know if a few weeks mattered, but I think both teams needed to do this before draft day.  They needed to be in position to execute their strategy (the Jets need a QB and we don't need the third best player in the draft) before something happens that might change things significantly.

 

Too many possible trade-ups from various teams for the Jets to risk, and the NYG are sitting there at #2 to hog all of the trade offers on draft day and that would be bad for us.

This. We were sandwiched between two teams that were likely to take trade offers as well. Once we felt comfortable the guys  at 6 would be one of our guys and we probably went back and forth on compensation we decided get it done so we can plan. It was unlikely the compensation would have been greater draft night once people start coming off the board Jets might have realized their guy could fall to them. Bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

[JColts72]

15 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Look at Ryan Jensen.  Its easier to have a mid round G play better than his drafted position than a LB, IMO. 

 

I think Chubb has bust potential.

I doubt that.

[rockywoj]

I had talked up / posted my dream scenario of three trade-backs ending up at the 6th overall ... and getting three 2nd rounders, with two of them in this draft and one in next year’s draft.  Well, CB accomplished that with just one trade, but effectively taking the same haul ... GREAT job, Chris!  I totally approve this trade.  Now we just have to nail it on all the picks.  No misses!

[#12.]

30 minutes ago, Colt Overseas said:

From Ballard:

 

"It gives us a chance to really replenish our young talent and start building a core of young talent like we need to do.”

 

 

Of course you have to hit on the picks and the picks have to stay healthy.  In 2017, we got very little out of our top 4 picks.

[Peterk2011]

2 hours ago, WoolMagnet said:

Question:

who does it benefit to do this deal now vs waitibg until closer to draft vs last minute?

do we think the Jets were pushing?  Do we think Ballard should have let oressure build?

i'm just wondering why NOW?  And who the timing mostbenefits.  

 

Trades involving 1/1 or 1/2 usually organized well before drafts. The reason is simple. If you pick lets say at #10, you don't know what team will do with the first 9 picks. There are a lot of possible variation and outcomes. You only want to trade up if the draft goes the way you like, so you can grab your guy. 

 

Trading up for the #1, #2 (#3) pick is unique in a number of ways. First, these picks cost a lot, so teams very rarely move up to grab a non QB. These trades are almost exclusively done by teams to get a franchise QB. So there are much less variables and outcomes to consider. If you go for the number one pick, you don't need to consider anything. You get the #1 pick, you will pick first, you can get your guy. If you go for the #2 pick, then there are at least 2 quarterbacks you like, so whoever the #1 team will take, you can take the other guy. You can go ahead and pull the trigger on the trade in march, because there will be no variables added. (Unless something disastrous happen to one of the two guys. But you take that risk if there are other teams you know of who are interested in trading up.)

 

The Jets were in this situation. They probably like 3 (or more) guys, and they are OK to take any of the three. They knew that Denver, the Bills and probably the Cardinals are also heavily interested in picking a QB, and possibly also trying to trade up. So they acted first and made sure they have that #3 pick and not one of their rivals.

 

(Regarding the #6 pick, if a Colts will trade further back, that will happen on draft day. Whoever will want to trade up, they will want to know what happened with the first five picks before they pull the trigger.)

[BOTT]

1 hour ago, GwinnettColt said:

I wonder if Ballard was told, at first, to "enjoy his pancakes," when he talked about the trade.  (See Draft Day).

 

Though I would have liked to have seen more activity in FA, I like this draft move. 

Don't see draft day, it's a horrible movie.

[GwinnettColt]

7 minutes ago, BOTT said:

Don't see draft day, it's a horrible movie.

 

[BOTT]

Just now, GwinnettColt said:

 

 Now that's a great movie....in a horrible, unintentionally funny way.

[WoolMagnet]

14 minutes ago, Peterk2011 said:

 

Trades involving 1/1 or 1/2 usually organized well before drafts. The reason is simple. If you pick lets say at #10, you don't know what team will do with the first 9 picks. There are a lot of possible variation and outcomes. You only want to trade up if the draft goes the way you like, so you can grab your guy. 

 

Trading up for the #1, #2 (#3) pick is unique in a number of ways. First, these picks cost a lot, so teams very rarely move up to grab a non QB. These trades are almost exclusively done by teams to get a franchise QB. So there are much less variables and outcomes to consider. If you go for the number one pick, you don't need to consider anything. You get the #1 pick, you will pick first, you can get your guy. If you go for the #2 pick, then there are at least 2 quarterbacks you like, so whoever the #1 team will take, you can take the other guy. You can go ahead and pull the trigger on the trade in march, because there will be no variables added. (Unless something disastrous happen to one of the two guys. But you take that risk if there are other teams you know of who are interested in trading up.)

 

The Jets were in this situation. They probably like 3 (or more) guys, and they are OK to take any of the three. They knew that Denver, the Bills and probably the Cardinals are also heavily interested in picking a QB, and possibly also trying to trade up. So they acted first and made sure they have that #3 pick and not one of their rivals.

 

(Regarding the #6 pick, if a Colts will trade further back, that will happen on draft day. Whoever will want to trade up, they will want to know what happened with the first five picks before they pull the trigger.)

Agree but i was just referring to WHEN it was done.

someone can still jump ahead of the Jets.

if anything, i think it helps us more now, because on draft day, teams would look at trade above #3 before #3. Unless they have 3 QBs rated the same, which is doubtful.

 I dont know how Ballard could have got any more from Buffalo or Denver or any team really.  I initially wasnt crazy about trading down. I was worried the talent level would drop and we wouldnt get a playmaker, elite type.  I may have fell for some of the hype of Barkley,chubb, nelson also.

but still picking (for the moment) at six, and having those two at the top of 2nd round (that almost feel like 1sts), plus the rest makes me excited.

  If we get lucky and "ballards guy" falls to six, we can get 3 SOLID guys in the 2nd.  We could EASILY be sitting at the end of the 2nd round with 2 GOOD OL , and a very good RB.  Or a very good OL, LB and RB.

the possibilities are endless!  There is some real talent in those first 2 rounds.

[oldunclemark]

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

What do you think about Edmunds at 6 if Chubb is gone. He is very fast and a Great tackler but a LB. We do need LB's.

Chubb or Nelson should still be there at '6'

Browns and Jets will definetly take a QB....and somebody takes Barkley.

Denver wont take a defensive end

 

I think Chubb is very much there at '6'\\..and if he is, this is a very good trade for us

 

 

[w87r]

7 hours ago, aaron11 said:

thats not what im getting going by this chart.  the first pick in the second is only 580 points

 

http://walterfootball.com/draftchart.php

Thats what you get when you add 580 to 2540. You get 3120?

 

All semantics anyway. Bottom line is it was a great move by CB. It was also the best time to make the deal. No reason to wait, especially with a late 1st/early 2nd over pay now. 2019 2nd rounder is actually valued at 16th pick of next round. So really 2019= 190. Since its a year away. That's just trade value though, because in actuality when next year rolls around it will be value from 580-270.

 

Saying that, to the point. No matter what the Jets do next year the value of that pick will go up. 190<270-580.

 

And saying that, it was still a good deal for the Jets, because they are coming away with their new franchise QB. Whoever it may be, however good they end up. It still will pump live into the organization and fan base to uave hope he is their QB next 10+ yrs.

[oldunclemark]

54 minutes ago, BOTT said:

Don't see draft day, it's a horrible movie.

I loved 'Draft Day'...Jennifer Garner...yum

[Crush22]

44 minutes ago, BOTT said:

 Now that's a great movie....in a horrible, unintentionally funny way.

That movie is horrible. As soon as he started stitching up his own wound, I checked out.

[aaron11]

3 minutes ago, w87r said:

Thats what you get when you add 580 to 2540. You get 3120?

 

All semantics anyway. Bottom line is it was a great move by CB. It was also the best time to make the deal. No reason to wait, especially with a late 1st/early 2nd over pay now. 2019 2nd rounder is actually valued at 16th pick of next round. So really 2019= 190. Since its a year away. That's just trade value though, because in actuality when next year rolls around it will be value from 580-270.

 

Saying that, to the point. No matter what the Jets do next year the value of that pick will go up. 190<270-580.

 

And saying that, it was still a good deal for the Jets, because they are coming away with their new franchise QB. Whoever it may be, however good they end up. It still will pump live into the organization and fan base to uave hope he is their QB next 10+ yrs.

future picks are not worth the full chart value

[Calmack]

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

What do you think about Edmunds at 6 if Chubb is gone. He is very fast and a Great tackler but a LB. We do need LB's.

Want absolutely no part of Edmunds. Something about taking a raw project, albeit extremely gifted, doesn't sit well with me at the 6th overall pick. 

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, JColts72 said:

I doubt that.

Not a total bust.  I meant he might end up playing like the 36th or 46th best player and not the 6th best.  I guess I still get nervous about taking any player so high when a trade back to 11 or 12 is my comfort zone.

[coach kline]

Giving up chubb is like choosing Ryan Leaf over Manning

 

[NorthernBlue]

Fitzpatrick is (imo) the best overall player in the draft. I would love to have him at 6 (especially if he can play Corner). Hooker, Wilson, Fitz, Hairston is a secondary oozing with talent.

 

I'm also coming around to Endmunds. His speed can be asset that could keep him on the field past second down. Plus he's just 19.

[New Zealands #1 Colts Fan]

17 minutes ago, NorthernBlue said:

Fitzpatrick is (imo) the best overall player in the draft. I would love to have him at 6 (especially if he can play Corner). Hooker, Wilson, Fitz, Hairston is a secondary oozing with talent.

 

I'm also coming around to Endmunds. His speed can be asset that could keep him on the field past second down. Plus he's just 19.

I have read a lot of articles stating nelson (offense) and fitzpatrick (def) are the top 2 cant miss players in this years draft.

[w87r]

8 hours ago, SteelCityColt said:

Side note - For all those moaning about not getting FA or that FA. The Osweiler pick up by the Texans is really haunting them in this draft.

To be fair they did it to themselves. They compounded a big mistake by making another big mistake just to get rid of their big mistake.

 

Quite the mistake, if I'm not mistaken.

 

[w87r]

8 hours ago, Indyfan4life said:

You complain and complain and complain every year. Why don't you just go find another team?

Or if you are a Dwight Freeney fan, at least spell his name right.

 

Obv not meant for you IF4L, just quoted your response to said poster.

[philba101]

This is no doubt the right move for the Colts. If you have not noticed during the recent free agency frenzy, there has been no "frenzy in Indy." Free agents are choosing Jacksonville, Houston, and even Cleveland over the Colts. I believe this is because of the uncertainty with Luck. Top free agents don't want to go to a team unless they are sure their star quarterback will be playing. If you have the third most amount of cap space starting free agency, but nobody will sign with your team, then you have to build through the draft.

[w87r]

1 hour ago, aaron11 said:

future picks are not worth the full chart value

Thats exactly what I said in my post. 

 

I said 2019 2nd is worth a mid 3rd in this trade. 

 

That is trade value now. Now in a year the pick will be worth more than that because, well it will be a 2nd round pick.

 

Saying that it is still an early 2nd round pick (based on mid 3rd value of 2019 pick) over pay.

 

+530pts

[southwest1]

10 hours ago, chad72 said:

 

If both Nelson and Chubb are gone by 6, I bet we move down with Buffalo.

 

I just hope Ballard gets it on the dotted line and faxes the paperwork to NY, dots the i-s and crosses the t-s  

I was gonna laugh at this line & then said to myself, I'm sure Ballard got all his ducks in a row Chad. Then, I remembered about how AJ Mccaron was supposed to be a Brown last yr & how Denver lost Elvis Dumervil to the Ravens. Uh oh...I'm worried now. Just Kidding! 

10 hours ago, Fluke_33 said:

For inactivity in free agency then this:

 

 

I love the last line in that movie "Girls, the town is that way!" Yeah, someday we'll catch our break buddy." That's the Jets. Always going the wrong direction. 

10 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Looked at a Jets forum, and they are furious! Well done Ballard! That's how you know you've done your job!

Yep, putting Gang Green behind the 8 ball sounds a okay to me. 

8 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Yup!

 

I think the key would be to get more Day 2 picks this year AND next.

 

By the way, there is an interview with Ballard up on the website NOW.   He's talking about what he did, why he did it and what he might still be willing to do.

 

Check it out.   It'll make your heart race!

Now, you have peaked my curiosity NCF. Be right back...

8 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

You're clueless.

 

Completely and totally clueless.

 

Good luck to you....

 

Exactly man, INDY has so many holes on this roster. There's no way we're moving up. Well said. 

6 hours ago, shakedownstreet said:

The Jets now have the opportunity to draft the next Mark 'Butt Fumble' Sanchez!!

 Well, in Mark's defense, he did bring back a resurgence to the "Benny Hill Show" theme song. 

 

 

Thanks a million Sanchez! 

[southwest1]

2 hours ago, BOTT said:

 Now that's a great movie....in a horrible, unintentionally funny way.

So, does that mean you don't like polar bears falling on you or you don't like taking out the trash nicely? 

 

Just messing with ya BOTT. 

 

I liked the Jeff Healey songs & Sam Elliot. Nobody talks like him man. Great voice & great stash [moustache] man.

 

Okay, the female strip tease was memorable too. I can't lie.

[i am yoda]

2 hours ago, Calmack said:

Want absolutely no part of Edmunds. Something about taking a raw project, albeit extremely gifted, doesn't sit well with me at the 6th overall pick. 

 

Seems to me you want the 6th overall to be a starter.  Otherwise you must trade out of the pick. 

[southwest1]

Just to get serious for a second, I figured INDY would be picking at 3. But, I'm glad we got more draft ammo from the Big Apple. So, Ballard made the right move sliding down. I'm no draft guru. I leave that to guys like krunk, Dustin, JC, JS23, Superman, CBE, & others more skilled at that then I will ever be...

 

I slam the Jets a lot, but they had to do this, Bridgewater isn't a franchise QB either. We all know that. Bravo Ballard! 

[Defjamz26]

11 hours ago, deedub75 said:

 

We will have a team full of rookies. I still don’t expect us to really compete next year. We should definitely be able to set a good foundation though. 

That’s fine. The shortsighted fans won’t understand it, but I do. Ballard is basically trying to catch the Colts back up after being about 7 years in the hole. Bad drafts and FA signings since 2011 have left the Colts with Luck, Hilton, Castonzo, and Kelly. That’s what Ballard had in 2017 when he got the job. 

 

We should be applauding this man for fixing this train wreck left by his predecessors, and not quitting because it’s worse than he thought. This is a multi-year thing. The Colts never really started the re-build like they were supposed to in 2012. So 6 years later it’s finally happening. He’s not going to rush because Luck won’t be around forever. He’s taking it one day at a time. 

[richard pallo]

3 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

That’s fine. The shortsighted fans won’t understand it, but I do. Ballard is basically trying to catch the Colts back up after being about 7 years in the hole. Bad drafts and FA signings since 2011 have left the Colts with Luck, Hilton, Castonzo, and Kelly. That’s what Ballard had in 2017 when he got the job. 

 

We should be applauding this man for fixing this train wreck left by his predecessors, and not quitting because it’s worse than he thought. This is a multi-year thing. The Colts never really started the re-build like they were supposed to in 2012. So 6 years later it’s finally happening. He’s not going to rush because Luck won’t be around forever. He’s taking it one day at a time. 

I'm fine with the rebuild and the approach.  I just don't want Luck injured or on IR again. It can happen fast in this league.  I can't believe anyone feels good about our OL right now.  There is still plenty of time and many approaches he can take to address it.  So let's take one day at a time and see how he tries to fix it.  It's still priority number 1 for me. 

[horseshoecrabs]

10 hours ago, BOTT said:

He obviously made this trade to quell the criticism from this forum.....and mike silver.

 

likes he gives a damn about this forum

[horseshoecrabs]

1 minute ago, horseshoecrabs said:

 

likes he gives a damn about this forum

 

i know you were being sarcastic Bott

 

[Defjamz26]

9 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

I'm fine with the rebuild and the approach.  I just don't want Luck injured or on IR again. It can happen fast in this league.  I can't believe anyone feels good about our OL right now.  There is still plenty of time and many approaches he can take to address it.  So let's take one day at a time and see how he tries to fix it.  It's still priority number 1 for me. 

I agree. I wouldn’t expect a guy who puts as much stock into the draft as he does to not have plans to find answers there. Aside from LT’s, starting OL can be found all throughout the draft. It’s about scheme and coaching. Ballard said repeatedly that he wanted a staff of teachers. I’m willing to bet he’s betting on finding some gems and the staff getting them ready quickly. If there’s one thing that the McDaniels ordeal taught me, it’s that Ballard always has a plan.

[Dark Superman]

Colts made out like bandits with this trade.

[horseshoecrabs]

Just now, DarkSuperman said:

Colts made out like bandits with this trade.

Ballard might be targeting Nelson at 6th to help protect luck. If he is unavailable he might trade down for more draft picks  

[horseshoecrabs]

Just now, horseshoecrabs said:

Ballard might be targeting Nelson at 6th to help protect luck. If he is unavailable he might trade down for more draft picks  

he did say he wants to keep a high pick but he is still open to  trade down again  if the price is right.

 

[Four2itus]

11 hours ago, BOTT said:

He obviously made this trade to quell the criticism from this forum.....and mike silver.

Possibly the best response posted all day. If I could, I would pour you a tall shot.

 

Prost!....