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Finball

Spending a top-20 pick on a RB is one of the worst decisions a team can make

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See if I would've quit posting in this thread it would've been dull haha :sarcasm:. I am just joking, I need to quit dwelling on the Draft because in reality I will be happy with Chubb or even Nelson.

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2 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Well I am on record saying if we take Chubb I would be ok with it. I just think Barkley is by far the best player in the Draft. If the Browns or Giants don't take Barkley I would be shocked but they may both go QB's.

I am not trying to be argumentative with you I just think we need pass rushing over a RB at this point. I have no doubt Barkley will have a great career and in no way down grading his abilities.

In my own personal opinion I think Barkley will go to the Browns or Giants. To me that would work in the Colts favor by making the 3rd pick very valuable for a trade down. I have no problem with picking up a few extra picks with the amount of positions we need to fill. Ballard said he is building through the draft and that falls right into his hands.

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Just now, Superman said:

I'll just start talking about Chubb like he's the next Reggie White, that seems to be the key.

Not the key at all, if you don't believe that. I believe Barkley has Hall of Fame potential, I don't with Chubb. If we take Chubb I hope he makes me eat my words.

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2 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

I am not trying to be argumentative with you I just think we need pass rushing over a RB at this point. I have no doubt Barkley will have a great career and in no way down grading his abilities.

In my own personal opinion I think Barkley will go to the Browns or Giants. To me that would work in the Colts favor by making the 3rd pick very valuable for a trade down. I have no problem with picking up a few extra picks with the amount of positions we need to fill. Ballard said he is building through the draft and that falls right into his hands.

We will probably trade down so all this debating is worthless lmao 

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2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Not sure I agree with every point, but, on balance,  I agree with the vast majority if this.

 

That said....  I suspect we know a poster or two who might try to argue/debate this...

 

In 3.... 2....  1.....         :peek:

I'm tired of the Barkley debate...You will see soon enough, rather if he is a Colt or not, which he probably won't be...He will be a Giant or wearing orange now that the Browns have a competent front office..

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3 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

This thread is dumb...I will take another Marshall Faulk or Edgerrin James everyday of the week...

I know I got suckered again Posting on a Thread that I said I wouldn't. Barkley is the best player in the Draft and if he's there at 3 and we don't take him than I will just do a belly flop in my pond.

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3 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

This thread is dumb...I will take another Marshall Faulk or Edgerrin James everyday of the week...

 

And in other news from the 1990's......

 

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2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Please notice your two examples, Smith and Sanders, are not only two Hall of Famers...  they were both drafted in the early 90's...    that's 25 years ago.

 

The NFL has changed dramatically since then with rules favoring passing over running.

 

Sorry....    but this is not a relevant argument...

 

Which is why Barkley is different than Gurley, Elliot, and Fournette.....He is an elite RB who also has elite receiving ability...He can make gamechanging plays on the ground, and through the air..

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1 hour ago, JMichael557 said:

If a RB is irrelevant then why do teams put 8 men in the box to stop the run

 

Why do play action passes work? 

They don't understand and NEVER will..lol..Glad someone sees it..

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Just now, jshipp23 said:

They don't understand and NEVER will..lol..Glad someone sees it..

I see it too. He could easily be like a Marshall Faulk because he's even stronger, can catch besides running and Marshall played in the 2000's.

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17 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

I'm tired of the Barkley debate...You will see soon enough, rather if he is a Colt or not, which he probably won't be...He will be a Giant or wearing orange now that the Browns have a competent front office..

 

I've said it several times...   but I'll say it again..

 

If Ballard takes Barkley I will support the move only because I believe in Ballard.

 

Barkley would likely not be my choice if I were the GM and I'm sure there are many who are very happy that I'm not running the show...

 

I think Barkley is great.   Perhaps the best player in the draft.    But a great RB is not how teams are winning in the modern NFL...    and many of the best RBs are drafted after the first round.   So you can win without a great RB...   that's a proven fact. 

 

My my choice would be Nelson or defense with a possible trade back to collect more picks.

 

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1 hour ago, crazycolt1 said:

Just the sheer amount of good running backs out number the amount of good pass rushers tremendously. The chances of getting a good pass rusher are a lot less that a good RB.

It's not a point of countering anything. You bring up Sanders and Smith and they don't have any bearing on today's NFL.

Why haven't we been able to find a good RB in the draft or free agency last 10 years?...Don' t say Gore either, yes he can turn 2 yd gains into 4 yds, but also makes makes potential 30 yd gains 6 yard gains...No defense fears Gore, they will gladly double Hilton instead of bringing an extra man in the box...

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3 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Move said it several times...   but I'll say it again..

 

If Ballard takes Barkley I will support the move only because I believe in Ballard.

 

Barkley would likely not be my choice if I were the GM and I'm sure there are many who are very happy that I'm not running the show...

 

I think Barkley is great.   Perhaps the best player in the draft.    But a great RB is not how teams are winning in the modern NFL...    and many of the best RBs are drafted after the first round.   So you can win without a great RB...   that's a proven fact. 

 

My my choice would be Nelson or defense with a possible trade back to collect more picks.

 

I am ok with Chubb or Nelson too. If we ran a team and you told me 2006 lets take Chubb I wouldn't argue it much. I would be ok with it.

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4 hours ago, Finball said:

 

1. Rushing carries little value in the modern NFL

2. Highly-drafted RBs are not any better at rushing

3. First-round RBs have high bust rates

4. We are bad at evaluating running backs

5. RB rookie contracts are bad values

6. RBs are fragile

7. RBs have short shelf lives

8. RBs don’t change the fortunes of a franchise

 

1. nonsense

2. nonsense

3. Don't care, we're talking about a single prospect.  

4. Speak for yourself

5. Not for an elite one

6. Meaningless

7. Shorter, not short.

8. nonsense

 

 

Next?

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1 hour ago, 21isSuperman said:

This is some really flawed logic.  I could say that Bruce Smith and Joe Greene were top 5 picks and are among the best DLs of all time, which would counter your argument.

 

I can also list several RBs that got drafted in the top 20 that stunk.  Trent Richardson, Ron Dayne, William Green

Well last 2 pass rushers Colts took in 1st were Jerry Hughes and Bjorn Werner so there is that...2 RB's we drafted top 5 were Faulk and James..

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1 hour ago, 21isSuperman said:

My point is that you saying "a couple great RBS were early first round picks" isn't a strong counter to the points posted in the article above

How about that Bust rate for the RB's taken high lately? You will say Richardson, I will counter with Gurley, Elliot, and Fournette..

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It's funny how people say RB's don't change a franchise but yet we get Eric Dickerson and go 9-6 and win the mighty AFC East by beating Dan Marino, and the Pats who were Great back then too. Colts were 0-13 in 1986 before going 3-13, then with Dick we go 9-6 with freakin Jack Truduea at QB in 1987.

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9 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

Why haven't we been able to find a good RB in the draft or free agency last 10 years?...Don' t say Gore either, yes he can turn 2 yd gains into 4 yds, but also makes makes potential 30 yd gains 6 yard gains...No defense fears Gore, they will gladly double Hilton instead of bringing an extra man in the box...

 

Well....

 

The Colts spent a one on Addai AND Brown, so it's not like we didn't try...

 

Polian didn't believe in free agency...

 

Grigson spent a one on Trent then invested in Gore and Bradshaw...

 

I'm sure I'm missing someone...

 

But that's your last 10 years...

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

It's funny how people say RB's don't change a franchise but yet we get Eric Dickerson and go 9-6 and win the mighty AFC East by beating Dan Marino, and the Pats who were Great back then too. Colts were 0-13 in 1986 before going 3-13, then with Dick we go 9-6 with freakin Jack Truduea at QB in 1987.

Eric Dickerson was a monster!! 

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17 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I see it too. He could easily be like a Marshall Faulk because he's even stronger, can catch besides running and Marshall played in the 2000's.

The problem he could also be Trent Richardson

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2 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Well....

 

The Colts spent a one on Addai AND Brown, so it's not like we didn't try...

 

Polian didn't believe in free agency...

 

Grigson spent a one on Trent then invested in Gore and Bradshaw...

 

I'm sure I'm missing someone...

 

But that's your last 10 years...

 

 

 

Brown was drafted 9 years ago, and Addai 13 years ago..smh..How bout last 9 years then?? Say Richardson 1 more time...

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Just now, PrincetonTiger said:

The problem he could also be Trent Richardson

How on earth is Barkley mentioned in same sentence as Trent Richardson??Chubb could be Bjorn Werner, Nelson could be Womack or Cooper...

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Just now, NewColtsFan said:

 

Well....

 

The Colts spent a one on Addai AND Brown, so it's not like we didn't try...

 

Polian didn't believe in free agency...

 

Grigson spent a one on Trent then invested in Gore and Bradshaw...

 

I'm sure I'm missing someone...

 

But that's your last 10 years...

 

 

 

We were able to win it all with RB by committee because we had Peyton. Do you think Dallas would be Good without Zeke? I don't, I think Dak is Good but far from Great and even with that Great O.Line they aren't the same without Zeke. Last season proved that and that is an example of todays game not my 80's special stuff :thmup:

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3 minutes ago, PrincetonTiger said:

The problem he could also be Trent Richardson

If he ends up like Trent then I will stick to my beloved Baseball Thread and apologize to everyone here that said taking Barkley was a mistake if we do take him.

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In today’s NFL, RBs are not the straw that drives the drink and therefore are not a Draft priority for most teams

 

 If the Colts did not have other priorities a SB pick would be fine but they do so picking him would not be smart

 

 

    Reminder from TigerTown     

      Many Experts said Ryan Leaf would be better than PM

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4 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

How on earth is Barkley mentioned in same sentence as Trent Richardson??Chubb could be Bjorn Werner, Nelson could be Womack or Cooper...

TR was a top 10 pick that most said would not be a bust

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Just now, PrincetonTiger said:

In today’s NFL, RBs are not the straw that drives the drink and therefore are not a Draft priority for most teams

 

 If the Colts did not have other priorities a SB pick would be fine but they do so picking him would not be smart

 

 

    Reminder from TigerTown     

      Many Experts said Ryan Leaf would be better than PM

Well then Chubb is the pick, right?

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Just now, PrincetonTiger said:

TR was a top 10 pick that most said would not be a bust

Trent isn't near the prospect that Barkley is. Have you watched Barkley play? He is so much faster and he doesn't go to buffet every day either.

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3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

We were able to win it all with RB by committee because we had Peyton. Do you think Dallas would be Good without Zeke? I don't, I think Dak is Good but far from Great and even with that Great O.Line they aren't the same without Zeke. Last season proved that and that is an example of todays game not my 80's special stuff :thmup:

It couldn't be anymore plain or obvious either..Where were them Dallas running backs that are so EASY to find this year when Zeke was out? I thought they had best oline in league? How about how bad Prescott struggled without the benefit of Zeke keeping defenses honest??Gurley was healthy and Jags drafted Fournette and suddenly Rams and Jags are contenders??

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1 hour ago, JMichael557 said:

If a RB is irrelevant then why do teams put 8 men in the box to stop the run

 

Why do play action passes work? 

Best post in this thread I've read yet.

 

Somebody should send the link to the story that the RB position is irrelevant in the modern day NFL to Curtis Martin, Marshall Faulk, Terrell Davis, & Walter Payton's children. I'd love to read their feedback on this. 

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Just now, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Well then Chubb is the pick, right?

Before FA it looks that way but it will depend on who the Colts add in FA and how CB, FR and etc build the draft board

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3 minutes ago, lance_m8 said:

Barkley will be a bust.

From the guy who said Moncreif will be elite and deserving a 10 million dollar contract, and we better sign him..

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7 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

Brown was drafted 9 years ago, and Addai 13 years ago..smh..How bout last 9 years then?? Say Richardson 1 more time...

 

You asked about the last TEN years and you're complaining about Brown who was drafted NINE years ago!?!

 

I included Addai because it impacted decisions made within your 10 year window.

 

What the hell is the matter with you?!?

 

 

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4 minutes ago, lance_m8 said:

Barkley will be a bust.

So who do you want at 3 then. I am not going to debate you, just asking. We will probably take Chubb or trade down is my guess anyway.

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32 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

We were able to win it all with RB by committee because we had Peyton. Do you think Dallas would be Good without Zeke? I don't, I think Dak is Good but far from Great and even with that Great O.Line they aren't the same without Zeke. Last season proved that and that is an example of todays game not my 80's special stuff :thmup:

 

Alfred Morris had better YPC than Zeke last year.

 

Cowboys went 3-3 when Zeke was out (and averaged 30+ against in those losses). In ATL and PHI losses, they were without Tyron Smith. He comes back, they go 3-1 in the rest of the games without Zeke.

 

They also went 1-4 when Sean Lee didn't play.

 

Edit. Sean Lee went down early in the ATL game. So in the ATL and PHI losses, they weren't only missing Zeke, they were also missing their best offensive and defensive players.

 

 

 

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