What should Ballard do?

[WoolMagnet]

1 minute ago, southwest1 said:

Rest assured, you answered the question WM. There's really no wrong answer. You either go the infantry route with Barkley or somebody who can get in a QB's face like Chubb. I know I frown on entries which advocate for drafting another QB & I'm not changing my mind on that one because I think fans need to be patient & stop acting like Luck is crippled or something because he's not. 

 

I get why some people wanna trade back & get more picks except there's a difference between quantity & quality & most players within the top 20 are immediate impact players if you've done your homework. Stick with our #3 slot & get a guy who should be a mainstay on our roster for the next 10-12 yrs. I favor Barkley personally since good to great backs always give you short, manageable third downs. 3rd & 4 as opposed to 3rd & 8. 

 

I'm not saying pass rushers aren't important. They are. I just think Barkley is worth it if he's still on the board at 3. If not, then get Chubb. Most teams won't give you a king's ransom unless they are really desperate for a QB like say the Jets. If they gave us a ridiculous offer, we gotta hear the sales pitch. But my intuition tells me we remain steadfast in our spot & get a game changing back. 

 

You didn't dance around my friend. You answered my question just fine. Thank you. 

I live an hour or so from State College so i know Barkely well.

i dont think people are accounting for the energy (the "IT" factor) this young man brings.  Its an excitement and energy that is infectious and would lift the teamand fanbase.  Barkley is a gem of a human eing (besides his athletic ability) that will work extremely hard and set a level of excellence this team sorely needs. I'd be more than ok with him.

  We need to address RB.  Theres really not much in FA. If we can have arguably a top 5 (nfl) RB, at a rookie contract?  Thats value i think, especially in the offense i think Reich wants to run:

 then again , a top pass rusher at a rookie contract is good value too. Those guys are expensive and hard to find.

  But as i go round and round, i just get too excited thinking of Barkley doing those windmill things after multiple scores EVERY WEEK.

[southwest1]

2 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

In your opinion. He done fine last season considering he was the most hit and sacked QB in the league last season. He is tough and that is a trait needed to be a starter.

I appreciate entries like this one because they take into account how much Jacoby Brissett improved since he first arrived in INDY with the Dorsett trade to NE. 

 

Yes, JB is tough as nails & by the time the season ended for us JB was building a good rapport with TE Jack Doyle. Relationships take time. So, does trust between a QB & his WRs & RBs. My point is this: With a whole offseason in INDY & with Frank's expertise as a QB whisperer in Philly, there's no reason why he couldn't get Jacoby prepared to win our division. That's priority number 1--The AFC Crown. I'm not guaranteeing anything right now. Just saying JB is good enough to make a serious run in our division if Luck needs more time. 

 

JB is a smart kid & we all saw improvement as the season progressed. Bill Parcels doesn't praise average QBs who can't cut it. 

 

Now, don't get it twisted wanna QB drafters, Luck will be fine & I expect Chewbacca to start in Sept. I just mean that people need to have more faith in JB's ability to elevate his game & not diss him so quickly. 

[southwest1]

24 minutes ago, WoolMagnet said:

I live an hour or so from State College so i know Barkely well.

i dont think people are accounting for the energy (the "IT" factor) this young man brings.  Its an excitement and energy that is infectious and would lift the teamand fanbase.  Barkley is a gem of a human eing (besides his athletic ability) that will work extremely hard and set a level of excellence this team sorely needs. I'd be more than ok with him.

  We need to address RB.  Theres really not much in FA. If we can have arguably a top 5 (nfl) RB, at a rookie contract?  Thats value i think, especially in the offense i think Reich wants to run:

 then again , a top pass rusher at a rookie contract is good value too. Those guys are expensive and hard to find.

  But as i go round and round, i just get too excited thinking of Barkley doing those windmill things after multiple scores EVERY WEEK.

I like responses like this one because you can give us all a window into Barkley's energy, charisma, work ethic, & ability to make others follow him which fosters chemistry & cohesiveness in the locker room. That is a valid point: Frank wants to run the ball early & often to open up the play action pass just like he did with LeGarrette Blount & Jay Ajayi all yr long. Therefore, it stands to reason that Mack & Barkley would be a nice one two punch if we could grab him up. 

 

It's cool to see a fan familiar with his athleticism that knows what kind of damage he could do working for us in Indianapolis. Sweet. We have better odds landing Barkley at 3 vs say #8 or even #10. 

 

Thanks WM for your additional thoughts & insights on Saquon. Landmark first name too.  

 

Works for me man. I'd love to welcome into the Colts Family on draft night. 

[Tsarquise]

2 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

In your opinion. He done fine last season considering he was the most hit and sacked QB in the league last season. He is tough and that is a trait needed to be a starter.

Lol okay. He is a good starting QB. 

[TdungyW/12]

7 hours ago, Aaron86 said:

I can respect that. I really don't think our defense is far off the mark. With good coaching and some QB pressure O think we would have a pretty good defence.

 

I just want all the help Andrew can get and keep him from taking hits and I think with him TY and Barkley it would be a guessing game for the defenses.

Either way I think the team is better off

[Superman]

6 hours ago, Andrew Luck fan club said:

 

 

But you guys want a RB with subpar vision and decision making lol. 

 

I don't have a problem with his vision, but he does like to bounce outside and reverse field way more than he should, which is the primary complaint people have about Marlon Mack.

 

Barkley is the real deal, IMO, but acting like he's this can't miss prospect who is automatically going to be an all time great is a bit much. 

[crazycolt1]

2 hours ago, Tsarquise said:

Lol okay. He is a good starting QB. 

Hopefully we won't have to find out but writing him off as not having the ability to be a starter is way too premature.

[NewColtsFan]

Just now, crazycolt1 said:

Hopefully we won't have to find out but writing him off as not having the ability to be a starter is way too immature.

 

I assume you meant.....     premature?

 

[crazycolt1]

1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I assume you meant.....     premature?

 

Yes, yes I did. lol                    

[WoolMagnet]

10 hours ago, Superman said:

 

What if "Player X" not named Barkley winds up setting league records for the next decade? 

 

You're the one peddling "what ifs." And long shot "what ifs," by the way. I don't think any back has hit 1400 yards five seasons in a row since Barry Sanders, 20 years ago. I'll spot you LaDanian Tomlinson, who had five years out of six of 1400+, with a sixth year mixed in there of over 1300. But the list of great backs who didn't come close to achieving this statistical accomplishment includes guys like Curtis Martin, Terrell Davis Priest Holmes, Larry Johnson, Clinton Portis, Jerome Bettis, Arian Foster, MJD, AP, Ray Rice, Chris Johnson, Jamaal Charles, Marshawn Lynch, Matt Forte, Lesean McCoy, Tiki Barber, Shaun Alexander, Edgerrin James, Marshall Faulk (never hit 1400, surprisingly), etc. There's five MVPs in there in the last 20 years.

 

So your "what if" supposes that Barkley is going to be one of the absolute best RBs of the last 20 years, maybe of all time. It's at times like this that I feel like he's becoming somewhat overrated.

 

And to answer your "what if," if Barkley goes 1400 five years in a row, and we win a SB in there, it's most likely coincidental. Having a feature back who churns a lot of yardage isn't a cause of winning SBs. Perhaps there's a correlation, but it would be a loose one, given how many teams win SBs without relying on a feature back.

 

I'm talking about probabilities. A) The probability that Barkley goes for 1400, five years in a row, is very low.  B) The probability that he's able to maintain a high level of production beyond his first five years is low. And C) the probability that he is the missing piece that makes any team a SB contender is also low. This is based on A) the fact that no back, including the greats listed above, has done this in 20 years; B) the fact that most backs don't produce at a high level into their second contracts, and C) the fact that most SB winning teams in the last 20 years don't rely on one great back. 

 

To add to C, the teams that have won the SB in the last 10-15 years while relying on one lead back have mostly had a back that wasn't drafted in the first round, or was acquired via free agency. I think you have to go back to the Saints to find a SB winner that even rostered a first round RB, and Reggie Bush was their #3 back by yardage and carries.

 

The draft -- especially high picks in the first round -- should yield foundational players for 8-10 years. In the light of recent history and the way the game is played now, the likelihood of a RB being that player is low. Even if Barkley has a great rookie season, what about the next 7+ years? 

 

Like others have said, I have nothing against Barkley, but I don't think taking a RB at #3 is a wise use of an immensely valuable resource. We can conjure up all kinds of scenarios, but I'd rather talk about what we know to be true already.

I think this is how i feel.

at the moment,at least.

who do the jets and broncos have at LB or CB that they could sweeten a deal at #5 or #6?  I think i might be bummed if we traded to the teens.  But i aleo see alot of good players in rounds 2 and 3.

[lance_m8]

what if chubb goes #1 to the Browns and they try to build the best defense 

[Maniac]

I'd like to think we can trade down and still get Chubb. I'm happy with Chubb or Nelson, though I'm warmed more to Chubb after watching more footage of him play. I think he's what we need.

 

Interesting to see what we do.

[NextGenerationLuck]

Honestly, whatever scenario gets us Bradley Chubb I’m 100% on board with. He’s going to be a difference maker and I want him! 

[jskinnz]

15 hours ago, VaAllDay757 said:

No it's not you draft the best person available in the position needed most

 

Lots wrong with that statement.

 

1) It's a bad draft strategy overall and if you listen at all to Ballard, nothing close to what he believes in.

 

2) How appreciably better is Nelson than than say, the 5th rated guard?  I would estimate the difference it would make in a team would not be that much.

 

 

[Andrew Luck fan club]

7 hours ago, Superman said:

 

I don't have a problem with his vision, but he does like to bounce outside and reverse field way more than he should, which is the primary complaint people have about Marlon Mack.

 

Barkley is the real deal, IMO, but acting like he's this can't miss prospect who is automatically going to be an all time great is a bit much. 

It’s not bad vision, but it’s not Zekes or Gurleys either. And he will ignore/not see a big hole and bounce it outside, yeah just like Mack. He also avoids contact like the plague. 

[BProland85]

I think most are on board with trading down and getting extra picks. Some want Nelson like myself, others want Chubb. I think Nelson is the more sure thing player and would instantaneously alter the perception of this OL. I see many All-Pros in his future, whereas I think Chubb will be a very good player, but not great. 

[coltsfeva]

   FA will affect what the Colts do. If they get a guy like Lawrence and/or Norwell, needs/selections may change.

    A lot can happen between now and the draft.

[Barry Sears]

It all depends on what we do in Free Agency, so how about we post topics like this as we get close to the draft?  By then, our needs will be much clearer, as well as the likely picks for the teams ahead of us in the draft.

 

Although this is interesting reading, it's way too early to guess what Ballard will do in the draft.  Depending on our situation, we may want to take that #3 pick, or we may want to trade down to acquire extra picks to fill needs and add depth.

 

I agree it's a great spot to be in, although we don't want this situation again in the future, but let's leverage this to maximize the draft this year.

 

I'd love to be drafting toward the end of the first round in 2019.

[jshipp23]

2 hours ago, Andrew Luck fan club said:

It’s not bad vision, but it’s not Zekes or Gurleys either. And he will ignore/not see a big hole and bounce it outside, yeah just like Mack. He also avoids contact like the plague. 

I have seen him run up the middle for tough yards plenty...Not worried a bit..He tried to bounce it at PSU because he was a 1 man team and had to break big runs for them to win..

[Andrew Luck fan club]

16 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

I have seen him run up the middle for tough yards plenty...Not worried a bit..He tried to bounce it at PSU because he was a 1 man team and had to break big runs for them to win..

I’ve seen Marlon Mack run up the middle for tough yards also. Doesn’t mean it’s their m.o.

[jshipp23]

1 hour ago, Andrew Luck fan club said:

I’ve seen Marlon Mack run up the middle for tough yards also. Doesn’t mean it’s their m.o.

I have zero doubt Barkley will be the best running back in NFL even behind our line...If we draft him I say 1,500 yards 10 + tds year 1...I can't say the same for Chubb production wise, I don't want to spend #3 pick on edge setter, run stopping defensive end..The position value argument is overrated in my opinion..So Chubb may have a 10 year career instead of 7..With roster turnover in NFL i don't see it as being that important, and I think Barkley is built and has work ethic for long career much like Gore has had... LEVEON BELL is a another example entering his 2nd contract and hasn't lost a step, is still as good as ever..Good chance you can get an Ansah or Lawrence in free agency who are proven and will give you better production then Chubb would first few years most likely..Where are the top 5 RB's in free agency? Bell will be franchised if not signed..Only way Barkley busts is serious injury and that can happen to anyone..

[Andrew Luck fan club]

22 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

I have zero doubt Barkley will be the best running back in NFL even behind our line...If we draft him I say 1,500 yards 10 + tds year 1...I can't say the same for Chubb production wise, I don't want to spend #3 pick on edge setter, run stopping defensive end..The position value argument is overrated in my opinion..So Chubb may have a 10 year career instead of 7..With roster turnover in NFL i don't see it as being that important, and I think Barkley is built and has work ethic for long career much like Gore has had... LEVEON BELL is a another example entering his 2nd contract and hasn't lost a step, is still as good as ever..Good chance you can get an Ansah or Lawrence in free agency who are proven and will give you better production then Chubb would first few years most likely..Where are the top 5 RB's? Bell will be franchised if not signed..Only way Barkley busts is serious injury and that can happen to anyone..

You’re just soo far off from reality man lol. In FA and the draft. 

[Superman]

10 hours ago, WoolMagnet said:

I think this is how i feel.

at the moment,at least.

who do the jets and broncos have at LB or CB that they could sweeten a deal at #5 or #6?  I think i might be bummed if we traded to the teens.  But i aleo see alot of good players in rounds 2 and 3.

 

I'd take Brandon Marshall from the Broncos. 

[jshipp23]

44 minutes ago, Andrew Luck fan club said:

You’re just soo far off from reality man lol. In FA and the draft. 

We will see...

[Superman]

1 hour ago, jshipp23 said:

LEVEON BELL is a another example entering his 2nd contract and hasn't lost a step, is still as good as ever

 

Wanna bet? Bell just hit 400 touches in the regular season. History says he'll regress significantly starting in 2018, and continuing for the rest of his career. Already in 2017, his yards/touch were notably lower than in 2016. At best, he has one more year of top level production.

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, jshipp23 said:

LEVEON BELL is a another example entering his 2nd contract and hasn't lost a step, is still as good as ever..

Did you know as great as you build Bell up to be the most TDs he has run for in a season is 9?

2017 RB stats

Murray-8TDs

Hyde-8TDs

Gordan-8Tds

Howard-9TDs

Ingram-12TDs

Bell averaged 4.02 Yds per carry.

There were 15 other RBs in the league who averaged better than him in average Yds per game.

Bells longest run of the season was 27 yards. That is telling me he is not a good as runner in open space than 95% of all the runners in the NFL. Only Gore and Miller's longest runs were shorter than 27 yards.

Is he really going to be worth breaking the bank for the Steelers?  

 

 

[chad72]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

I'd take Brandon Marshall from the Broncos. 

 

That Corey Nelson guy is not that bad either for a coverage LB.

[jshipp23]

6 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Did you know as great as you build Bell up to be the most TDs he has run for in a season is 9?

2017 RB stats

Murray-8TDs

Hyde-8TDs

Gordan-8Tds

Howard-9TDs

Ingram-12TDs

Bell averaged 4.02 Yds per carry.

There were 15 other RBs in the league who averaged better than him in average Yds per game.

Bells longest run of the season was 27 yards. That is telling me he is not a good as runner in open space than 95% of all the runners in the NFL. Only Gore and Miller's longest runs were shorter than 27 yards.

Is he really going to be worth breaking the bank for the Steelers?  

 

 

Lets see how the Steelers feel about it..LeVeon is a major threat in the passing game and pass pro too...More to being a great RB than just running..My guess is he will be FRANCHISED or signed in the neighborhood of 14 million per year..

[crazycolt1]

5 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

Lets see how the Steelers feel about it..LeVeon is a major threat in the passing game and pass pro too...More to being a great RB than just running..My guess is he will be FRANCHISED or signed in the neighborhood of 14 million per year..

You are probably right. My point I was trying to make is the running back position is not what it used to be in the NFL. More teams that advance into the playoffs and win in the playoffs do not depend on one RB to carry the load. I think there is always room for great RBs but those teams who put their faith in just one RB are mostly disappointed come playoffs time.

[jshipp23]

2 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

You are probably right. My point I was trying to make is the running back position is not what it used to be in the NFL. More teams that advance into the playoffs and win in the playoffs do not depend on one RB to carry the load. I think there is always room for great RBs but those teams who put their faith in just one RB are mostly disappointed come playoffs time.

I think the Reason for that is because most RB's aren't capable or have every tool...Gurley, Elliot, Bell, Peterson level backs are extremely rare..Barkley has every tool in the box, no character issues, and the work ethic to maintain a high level for many years..

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

I think the Reason for that is because most RB's aren't capable or have every tool...Gurley, Elliot, Bell, Peterson level backs are extremely rare..Barkley has every tool in the box, no character issues, and the work ethic to maintain a high level for many years..

 

Do you think it's pure coincidence that those backs have become more rare in the last 10-15 years?

[crazycolt1]

1 minute ago, jshipp23 said:

I think the Reason for that is because most RB's aren't capable or have every tool...Gurley, Elliot, Bell, Peterson level backs are extremely rare..Barkley has every tool in the box, no character issues, and the work ethic to maintain a high level for many years..

You may be 100% correct but with pick #3 it is imperative we find a player who can make the most impact on the team.

We have suffered at the linebacker and pass rush position for so long it's understandable for some to feel that is the direction we need to go. Even below average QBs we face put up huge numbers and most the fan base are sick and tired of that.

[jshipp23]

2 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Do you think it's pure coincidence that those backs have become more rare in the last 10-15 years?

I think they have always been rare...Even in the run heavy era...The league has changed to more of a passing league now obviously, there is a shortage of quality olinemen that are NFL ready because of spread offense being prevalent in college now, and rules have changed to encourage more passing..So now only the cream of the crop get showcased and drafted high..There is still a place for the truly elite RB, and it's not out of the normal recently for a team to draft them in top 10.. Their value is being rediscovered...The impact guys like Elliot, Gurley, Bell, Fournette have had on their teams is bringing it back in vogue..Barkley is even more worthy because of his pass catching ability as well, unlike a guy like Fournette for example...I don't think it's an accident Barkley is getting the hype he is getting..Of course if a GREAT defensive end was there for us it's a different conversation..I just don't think Chubb is GREAT..Some do,  and if Colts take him I hope they are right..

[jshipp23]

11 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

You may be 100% correct but with pick #3 it is imperative we find a player who can make the most impact on the team.

We have suffered at the linebacker and pass rush position for so long it's understandable for some to feel that is the direction we need to go. Even below average QBs we face put up huge numbers and most the fan base are sick and tired of that.

I'm sick and tired of not having a RB, Barkley will make Luck's life so much easier and prolong his career..

[crazycolt1]

7 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

I'm sick and tired of not having a RB, Barkley will make Luck's life so much easier and prolong his career..

You see there is a catch 22 with your opinion and mine as well.

Wouldn't the Colts having a couple of pass rushers make Luck's life much easier too? He wouldn't have to score 30 points a game to get a win.

We have seen first hand at what having a power house offense does without a defense that can't hold leads. Especially in the playoffs. If we don't get some defense we are not going to win games. This out scoring other teams in regular season may be fun to watch but the disappointment come playoff time lingers way past the games.

Personally it still bothers me to remember those losses and think to myself if only we had a defense. The one time the defense did step up we got the hardware.

 

[jshipp23]

^^^^^^^Well, of course we need to improve our defense...Taking Barkley in 1st isn't an argument against that..We will have many opportunities not only this year, but next couple years to build a great defense and build a powerhouse all around team..I just think Barkley is the best, most impactful piece that will possibly be availablewe can if we stay at 3..Now if we flip that into multiple picks, and still draft Chubb, Fitzpatrick, or Nelson ok I can live with it..

[crazycolt1]

3 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

^^^^^^^Well, of course we need to improve our defense...Taking Barkley in 1st isn't an argument against that..We many opportunities not on this year, but next couple years to build a great defense and build a powerhouse all around team..I just think Barkley is the best most impactful piece we can add if wr stay at 3..Now if we flip that into multiple picks and still draft Chubb, Fitzpatrick, or Nelson ok I can live with it..

That is the catch 22 I was talking about.

This pick #3 has so many scenarios that can be played out it is mind boggling. No matter what Ballard does there is going to be plenty of doubters who will disagree no matter what he does.

IMO the Giants are going to take Barkley if the Browns don't. If the Browns do get a trade for McCarron without giving up the #1 IMO they will take Barkley.

[jshipp23]

4 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

That is the catch 22 I was talking about.

This pick #3 has so many scenarios that can be played out it is mind boggling. No matter what Ballard does there is going to be plenty of doubters who will disagree no matter what he does.

IMO the Giants are going to take Barkley if the Browns don't. If the Browns do get a trade for McCarron without giving up the #1 IMO they will take Barkley.

Highly probable that happens..McCarron is a free agent and Hue Jackson likes him a lot so I'd say 95% he goes to Browns..Still think Dorsey will take a QB with 1 or 4 though..Good chance the Giants take Chubb as well..

[aaron11]

i know people argue running backs dont last long and have the data to back it up

 

heres the reason id be ok with barkley anyway

 

our window with luck isnt going to last another 10 years  either.  a young barkley with luck in his late 20s and early 30s could be our chance to make a run

 

i doubt luck plays past 35

[Solon]

I love Barkley and Chubb, but I'll definitely take Nelson. Guard will be solidified for the next 15 years barring injury. He'll give us more than consistent play. He'll give us 1st Team All Pro play. Barkley's a great RB prospect, but a RB is dependent on the offensive line. Our line took a major step back from the 2016 season. Went from one of the best running offensive lines to one of the worst. Chubb could turn out to be that 12+ sack a year guy, but pass rushers usually take a year or two. Nelson immediately makes our offensive line better and tougher.