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lance_m8

Barkley a Bust? We should pass

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I am not sure if anyone feel the same as I do but I just feel like he wont live up to the hype that is put on his shoulders we have seen rookie RBs tear up the league the past few years Gurley, Elliot, Kamara/Fournette but I do not see the same with Saquon Barkley and if he is there with our pick we should trade back or straight up pass on him many will argue with me but a year from now people are gonna ask me for Powerball numbers after I predict correctly that he will not perform highly.

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I've been in two minds about whether we should get him.

 

He looks so good, but we have more pressing needs. Indy has Mack and Turbin at HB and they need a guy like Chubb, Nelson or Fitzpatrick much more than they need Barkley.

 

Taking a running back in the first round is always pretty iffy to me anyway. I think we should pass, not because he'll be a bust but because we need other guys more.

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i doubt/hope we wont take him if chubb is there

 

i wont be shocked if the giants take chubb though, in that case we might get barkley 

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4 minutes ago, lance_m8 said:

I am not sure if anyone feel the same as I do but I just feel like he wont live up to the hype that is put on his shoulders we have seen rookie RBs tear up the league the past few years Gurley, Elliot, Kamara/Fournette but I do not see the same with Saquon Barkley and if he is there with our pick we should trade back or straight up pass on him many will argue with me but a year from now people are gonna ask me for Powerball numbers after I predict correctly that he will not perform highly.

it just depends on the type of system he plays behind to determine if hes a bust or not.

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6 minutes ago, PrincetonTiger said:

Not sure what it is that scares me away but I feel the same way

I just have a weird gut feeling

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Isn't there an entire page devoted the draft and free agency to discuss this?

 

I'm almost positive I've seen it and maybe even posted on it once or twice?     :thmup:

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1 minute ago, lance_m8 said:

I just have a weird gut feeling

I think it might be the ghosts of KiJana Carter and Trent Richardson

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IMHO he's as sure of a thing as far as running backs go. From the moment I first saw him I was impressed. Does well in traffic and good vision. Catches out of the back field and does a good job of blocking. I'm not sure I've seen another back put their foot in the ground and accelerate like he does

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Just now, SanDiegoColt8 said:

Chubb has more bust potential than Barkley

edge rushers are rare though, and running backs are not

 

we have tried late round backs many times and they never did much though.  we should be due soon 

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3 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Isn't there an entire page devoted the draft and free agency to discuss this?

 

I'm almost positive I've seen it and maybe even posted on it once or twice?     :thmup:

Get it moved then the barkley or chubb thread never got moved 

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His only flaw is that he is human. Much like how Alabama bottled up Fournette, Washington held Barkley in check basically the entire game in their bowl match-up until he broke a run off for 92 yards. Other than that he has no real flaws. However, he's not the safest prospect in the draft. That honor belongs to Nelson. I read on B/R today that a scout said Nelson has no chance of busting. Of course you can't prove that scientifically, but he's the one player scouts feel is a guaranteed hit. Barkley is close though, so I don't understand the concern some have with him. He's a better prospect than Elliot and Fournette. Penn State doesn't have a stout O-Line either.

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My only dig is sometimes he tries to break it outside too much...won’t stick with the play and grind out tough yards. Home run hitter could do better to get up in there and pound out yards. Obviously he had some huge games and then some poor ones...big boom or bust. Talented though I just value guys like Gore that can grind out those tough yards. My preference with being this high is to get a pass rusher or left tackle...but if Chubb isn’t that franchise piece and since I don’t see a slam dunk tackle I guess he might be the best option.

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Chubb helps our LBs and DBs in protection by being able to apply pressure and with a young secondary that is needed with Barkley I just do not feel he is needed if we get a bigger back to compliment Mack like Philly had with blount and Ajaji we  will be fine

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He's really good but there are parts of his game I dont like. He's a space player. A scat back in a power backs body. He doesn't like to pound the ball up the middle as much as he likes to get to the edge. For as weight room strong as he is, he is not a tackle breaker and gets dropped behind the line way too much. He is however a phenominal pass catcher and blocker. While I dont see him as a hard yardage 1500 yd rusher who can ice a game away on the ground, he can easily be David Johnson who gets a ton of total yards.

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1 hour ago, runthepost said:

Wrong answer. 

He easily is. Chubb was only a 10 sack a year guy in college. If we are putting a #3 overall pick I want someone who has shown a lot of production not just measurables. Nelson and Barkley have shown production for at least 2 years.

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16 minutes ago, twfish said:

He easily is. Chubb was only a 10 sack a year guy in college. If we are putting a #3 overall pick I want someone who has shown a lot of production not just measurables. Nelson and Barkley have shown production for at least 2 years.

10 sacks/21 TFL as a junior and 10 sacks/23 TFLas a senior isnt production?

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There is no way Saquan Barkley will be a bust. Not a chance. The kid is special.

 

However, I don't think this team can afford to take him right now. We need linebackers, corners, and offensive lineman much more than a running back. And this draft is so deep at running back that I think we'd regret passing on Chubb much more than passing on Barkley.

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RB is a need, pass rusher is a need, but surely our greatest need is to protect #12--trade back a couple spots (Jets or Broncos) and take Nelson and then McGlinchey

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2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Isn't there an entire page devoted the draft and free agency to discuss this?

 

I'm almost positive I've seen it and maybe even posted on it once or twice?     :thmup:

That is why I wasn't even going to comment on this topic on this thread and I am not after this. My only comment is - No Barkley will not be a bust, not even close.

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2 hours ago, lance_m8 said:

I am not sure if anyone feel the same as I do but I just feel like he wont live up to the hype that is put on his shoulders we have seen rookie RBs tear up the league the past few years Gurley, Elliot, Kamara/Fournette but I do not see the same with Saquon Barkley and if he is there with our pick we should trade back or straight up pass on him many will argue with me but a year from now people are gonna ask me for Powerball numbers after I predict correctly that he will not perform highly.

I don't see a bust in barkley but I would agree with everyone that says we have more pressing needs than a RB.

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I don’t think he will bust either. He is too good out of the backfield and in space  to bust. The problem I have with him is he does not play to his size. He does not grind out the tough yards and take what is there. He does not finish runs. He is dynamic in space and has incredible lateral agility, but he’s not sticking his nose in there and pushing the pile. He reminds me of a bigger, faster Christian McCafrey.

 

For comparison, Derrius Guice who is likely the second rb off the board does a much better job in confined space, pushing the pile and fighting for extra yards. Guice is a physical runner who loves contact, but is not nearly as dynamic as Barkley in the receiving game or in space. 

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Why wouldn’t the NY Giants select Chubb or Barkley, especially if Eli Manning has at least two more years in him? It wouldn’t surprise me if the Giants take Barkley at two and surround Eli with a top notch running back and they will be getting Odell Beckham back too. 

 

As as far as the Colts go, I hope we trade the pick to the highest bidder. 

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5 hours ago, Jaredfor3 said:

Why wouldn’t the NY Giants select Chubb or Barkley, especially if Eli Manning has at least two more years in him? It wouldn’t surprise me if the Giants take Barkley at two and surround Eli with a top notch running back and they will be getting Odell Beckham back too. 

 

As as far as the Colts go, I hope we trade the pick to the highest bidder. 

 

  The NYG Pick determines on what the brass decides to do with EM

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1 hour ago, DraftMaster said:

Hey guys, I have a great idea! Let's debate about Saquon Barkley for the next two months and do nothing else!

 

:sarcasm:

Please create a new topic so that we can discuss this further!

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11 hours ago, BOTT said:

10 sacks/21 TFL as a junior and 10 sacks/23 TFLas a senior isnt production?

Not much different the Barnett who went #14...

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There is always a chance, however, I do think he will be a good back in the league. I would pump the brakes a little on the whole Adrian Peterson talk though, I don't think he has the tenacity that Peterson has. Peterson seems to finish EVERY single run, he plays like he truly believes not a single person can take him down one on one and happens to be a phenomenal athlete. Barkley doesn't seem to have that mentality, he is a very shifty runner with damn good vision. I think he will do great. That being said, I would still draft Chubb and Fitzpatrick over him only because they are not far off from a talent standpoint and their position weighs heavily for me. Nelson is by far the most "can't miss" prospect in the draft IMO. Any of those 4 players I would be thrilled to see wearing the horseshoe!

 

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16 hours ago, PrincetonTiger said:

Not sure what it is that scares me away but I feel the same way

I know right? It’s just a feeling I have, similar to how I think Baker Mayfield will not succeed, I don’t think Barkley is a sure fire draft prospect. I would be much happier with Derrius Guice in the 2nd round. 

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14 hours ago, Bluefire4 said:

There is no way Saquan Barkley will be a bust. Not a chance. The kid is special.

 

 

Famous last words...

 

I don't think Barkley will bust, I expect him to be a very good player. But there's always an unknown with draft prospects.

 

I do think he's moved into "overhyped" territory. This comment is an example of that. There's no such thing as a bust-proof prospect. 

 

That said, my reasons for not wanting to draft Barkley have nothing to do with fear of him being a bust.

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3 hours ago, twfish said:

Not much different the Barnett who went #14...

 

Barnett didn't last to #14 due to a lack of production.

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8 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Famous last words...

 

I don't think Barkley will bust, I expect him to be a very good player. But there's always an unknown with draft prospects.

 

I do think he's moved into "overhyped" territory. This comment is an example of that. There's no such thing as a bust-proof prospect. 

 

That said, my reasons for not wanting to draft Barkley have nothing to do with fear of him being a bust.

IMO we have more pressing needs

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1 hour ago, PrincetonTiger said:

IMO we have more pressing needs

Protect the damn franchise Quarterback!

Add talent around number 12.

Help Andrew Luck.

That will always be our #1 need.

 

Luck is our most valuable asset. Not Bradley Chubb.

Bradley Chubb can't pass protect for Luck.

 

I'm all in for drafting Quenton Nelson.

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13 hours ago, Jaredfor3 said:

Why wouldn’t the NY Giants select Chubb or Barkley, especially if Eli Manning has at least two more years in him? It wouldn’t surprise me if the Giants take Barkley at two and surround Eli with a top notch running back and they will be getting Odell Beckham back too. 

 

As as far as the Colts go, I hope we trade the pick to the highest bidder. 

 

Because Eli doesn't have at least two more years. He has one more year...and then the NYG can save $17M in cap space...which conveniently is about what they will need to afford to keep OBJ. Add in other large contracts on the books (or soon will be) and it's imperative that they get a franchise QB on a rookie deal. Grabbing one at #2 and having Webb as the backup accomplishes that.

 

And Shurmur just hired Mike Shula to be his OC...who is known (outside of his last name) for helping develop David Garrard in JAC and more recently Cam Netwon in CAR. They now have the #2 pick in the NFL draft...and are in the prime spot to get their guy. I think them drafting a QB (probably Rosen) is the worst-kept secret in the NFL.

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19 hours ago, lance_m8 said:

I am not sure if anyone feel the same as I do but I just feel like he wont live up to the hype that is put on his shoulders we have seen rookie RBs tear up the league the past few years Gurley, Elliot, Kamara/Fournette but I do not see the same with Saquon Barkley and if he is there with our pick we should trade back or straight up pass on him many will argue with me but a year from now people are gonna ask me for Powerball numbers after I predict correctly that he will not perform highly.

 

18 hours ago, PrincetonTiger said:

I think it might be the ghosts of KiJana Carter and Trent Richardson

 

PT, you got my thoughts...  So do some believe he is Ki-jana Carter 2.0?

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On 2/12/2018 at 9:17 PM, PrincetonTiger said:

I think it might be the ghosts of KiJana Carter and Trent Richardson

Yipes, don't make me think of Trent Richardson, because that makes me think of Ryan Grigson, which, in turn, makes me think of Chuck Pagano, which makes me think of the repetitive playing of Trent Richardson when everyone already knew he was a bust, over and over and over.  It's like drinking your last beer on a hot beach and knowing that it's empty but continuing to tilt the bottle up in hopes that there is one drop left, but really you know there isn't.

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10 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

 

PT, you got my thoughts...  So do some believe he is Ki-jana Carter 2.0?

Not sure just thinking of Top RBs who busted for some reason 

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