Caged Animal

[crazycolt1]

20 minutes ago, Aluckiswolverine said:

 

Carry on with your childish mentality. It suits you well.

[BR-549]

10 hours ago, lollygagger8 said:

I guess we'll finally get to see more of him now that Pagano is gone. 

[Defjamz26]

Still a mystery. It’s hard for rookies to get better when they don’t play. Wilson was 20 when they drafted him though. Super young. Some immaturity is expected.

 

I think leadership is to blame here. We were a young team, especially in the secondary. On any other team, the Vets would have grabbed him by the collar and told him to humble himself. Mike Adams wouldn’t have had any of that. He should have been carrying pads everyday at training camp. I think there were other ways to discipline him though, however you can’t fault Pagano for the decision. This is unfortunately one of the issues when you have a young team. 

 

Bringing in Trumaine Johnson would be great not just for our CB depth, but also for Wilson’s maturity and development. Coaches like Toub and Wilks would have him in line as well.

[VaAllDay757]

10 hours ago, Superman said:

 

What does one have to do with the other? Green hardly played corner during the season. Wilson was hurt most of the first half of the season. They weren't competing for playing time.

Not really injury report wise he only missed 3 games due to an injury other than that he was a healthy scratch for the most part and this article here tells it https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2017/11/27/quincy-wilson-still-isnt-sure-why-hes-not-playing/898387001/

What is really sad if melvin never gotten hurt I don't know if we would've seen wilson play at the end of the season

[will426]

So explain how saying he was a caged animal this season is “immature”..despite all the negative said about him this season he not once spoke negatively about it. All he said was I was a caged animal and that’s some sort of insult to a lot of you I assume lol..people can’t speak their minds ever without being called “something”

[B~Town]

Must have missed something other than Wilson looking like a shutdown corner in a blizzard didn't notice him outplay the other CB and most had special teams value . Not sure what all the butt hurt is about when it comes to Wilson . 

[crazycolt1]

19 hours ago, lollygagger8 said:

I guess we'll finally get to see more of him now that Pagano is gone. 

If he earns his spot.

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, will426 said:

So explain how saying he was a caged animal this season is “immature”..despite all the negative said about him this season he not once spoke negatively about it. All he said was I was a caged animal and that’s some sort of insult to a lot of you I assume lol..people can’t speak their minds ever without being called “something”

Him saying being a caged animal is not why he was being called immature. He was being called immature during the season by the coaches.

No one here is insulted at all. Just repeating what was said about him, that's all.

If he earns a starting spot next season we will see more of him.

On a side note, there had to be "something" or he may have had more time on the field. The coaches saw him every day and sure knew a lot more about him and his situation than any forum members.

 

 

[crazycolt1]

9 hours ago, BR-549 said:

That looks like a scene from Once Upon A Time In The West.

[NewColtsFan]

15 hours ago, Aluckiswolverine said:

Yeah one of the many Pagano mysteries. Also when did Pagano become untouchable?

 

He was a turd of a head coach, seemed like a great guy but real crappy head coach.

 

He must have a lot of family members on this forum because if you say anything negative out come people upset. 4-12 folks that’s on the head coach. 

 

You want to put 11-5 on Pagano?

 

Fine.    

 

Just as as long as you're also giving Pagano 11-5 x 3.    Because Pagano also had 3 seasons of 11-5.   Followed by two more seasons of 8-8.    So 5 straight seasons without a losing record until this year.  That's not easy to do in the NFL.

 

So you can't have it both ways.   You can't stick a guy with the bad without also sticking the guy with the good as well.

 

[ty4atd]

56 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

You want to put 11-5 on Pagano?

 

Fine.    

 

Just as as long as you're also giving Pagano 11-5 x 3.    Because Pagano also had 3 seasons of 11-5.   Followed by two more seasons of 8-8.    So 5 straight seasons without a losing record until this year.  That's not easy to do in the NFL.

 

So you can't have it both ways.   You can't stick a guy with the bad without also sticking the guy with the good as well.

 

To be fair he really was 2-2 in year 1 and was "given" 6 wins a season the next 2 years by playing in the AFCS while it was brutal. All of our problems weren't on Chuck but he was certainly not a good HC.  

[Smonroe]

5 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Him saying being a caged animal is not why he was being called immature. He was being called immature during the season by the coaches.

No one here is insulted at all. Just repeating what was said about him, that's all.

If he earns a starting spot next season we will see more of him.

On a side note, there had to be "something" or he may have had more time on the field. The coaches saw him every day and sure knew a lot more about him and his situation than any forum members.

 

 

 

Immature and not in great shape, according to the coaches.  Yet he was a ‘caged animal ‘.

 

Sure sounds like an entitled athlete who wasn’t doing the work but expected to play anyway.  

 

He’s obviously a very good player.  I just hope the new coaches get everything out of him this coming season.   

[will426]

6 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Him saying being a caged animal is not why he was being called immature. He was being called immature during the season by the coaches.

No one here is insulted at all. Just repeating what was said about him, that's all.

If he earns a starting spot next season we will see more of him.

On a side note, there had to be "something" or he may have had more time on the field. The coaches saw him every day and sure knew a lot more about him and his situation than any forum members.

 

 

I get where you’re coming from but this coaching staff makes Every excuse in the book when asked about not playing or playing someone who shouldn’t have been playing under Pagano he’s been known not to play rookie playmakers  period for a while.. Hilton Mack Wilson  I give him credit for forcing Werner to play but he overdid that when he knew he was garbage  he continued to allow T-Rich to play  Andre Johnson /DHB/Landry and he had an excuse every time for why he played them so much..cool Wilson isn’t living up to expectations in “practice” well Green Milton Moore  weren’t living up to anything but getting burned in games that actually Mattered and yes Wilson was hurt but he also was a healthy scratch for 5 games while Pagano let those atrocious players play ahead of him till injuries played a factor 

[crazycolt1]

21 minutes ago, will426 said:

I get where you’re coming from but this coaching staff makes Every excuse in the book when asked about not playing or playing someone who shouldn’t have been playing under Pagano he’s been known not to play rookie playmakers  period for a while.. Hilton Mack Wilson  I give him credit for forcing Werner to play but he overdid that when he knew he was garbage  he continued to allow T-Rich to play  Andre Johnson /DHB/Landry and he had an excuse every time for why he played them so much..cool Wilson isn’t living up to expectations in “practice” well Green Milton Moore  weren’t living up to anything but getting burned in games that actually Mattered and yes Wilson was hurt but he also was a healthy scratch for 5 games while Pagano let those atrocious players play ahead of him till injuries played a factor 

Calling reasons excuses is a very good way to twist words to fit your narrative.

[2006Coltsbestever]

3 hours ago, ty4atd said:

To be fair he really was 2-2 in year 1 and was "given" 6 wins a season the next 2 years by playing in the AFCS while it was brutal. All of our problems weren't on Chuck but he was certainly not a good HC.  

I don't think Chuck was Great or was he Bad though. I would just say Average. The whole we were given 6 wins a season in 2013 and 2014 because of our Division is just bologna and several people say that. I guess the Pats have had that luxury then 90% of the time over the last 15 years? Houston was actually Good in 2014 by the way as they went 9-7. It's funny people say we benefitted from a weak Division those 2 seasons but yet when the Jags win the Division it's because they have a dominant Defense by some in here. The Division this season was by far the worst than it has been in a long time. The Colts and Texans were out of the equation by mid season because neither had their starting QB's, the Titans are an Average team in reality. Jags won it by default in reality. Chuck has had his solid moments and not so solid moments, it is what it is. He has accomplished more as a Coach than many other Coaches I will say that though. No other Coach coaching in our Division has ever made the AFC Title Game as HeadCoach, Chuck did.

[NewColtsFan]

4 hours ago, ty4atd said:

To be fair he really was 2-2 in year 1 and was "given" 6 wins a season the next 2 years by playing in the AFCS while it was brutal. All of our problems weren't on Chuck but he was certainly not a good HC.  

No....   I don't view that as FAIR at all.

 

I view that as the position that people who don't like Pagano like to take.

 

Because you certainly didn't cut him any slack thus year when he didn't have Andrew Luck.   When good teams lose their top level QB their season typically goes to Hell.   That's why Green Bsy had such a disappointing season, they lost Aaron Rodgers.

 

The Pagano haters really work overtime trying to build a case that he wasn't good. And the arguments all wind up collapsing on themselves like this one does.

 

Sorry, there is no agreement here....

 

[aaron11]

ive been critical of wilson, but i do think he finished the season well

 

i dont blame chuck either, QW had a lot to work on early in the year

 

i liked that he got his first int too, that should be a confidence booster

[ty4atd]

57 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

No....   I don't view that as FAIR at all.

 

I view that as the position that people who don't like Pagano like to take.

 

Because you certainly didn't cut him any slack thus year when he didn't have Andrew Luck.   When good teams lose their top level QB their season typically goes to Hell.   That's why Green Bsy had such a disappointing season, they lost Aaron Rodgers.

 

The Pagano haters really work overtime trying to build a case that he wasn't good. And the arguments all wind up collapsing on themselves like this one does.

 

Sorry, there is no agreement here....

 

This season again the division was garbage because of the injuries last year was the first year it was average. I don't think the team was as bad as the record especially with Luck. But the team has never shown improvements in the same areas that have always been horrible, outside of Luck, TY and 2-3 others he hasn't been able to develop players most have had their best year in Indy year 1 then regressed, the D has never been able to stop a TE or running back on a pass and of course refusing to go to a quicker passing game. Not all of that is Pagano's fault the OC calls the plays but after seeing Luck get hit the most almost every year you'd think he would make a point of it to one of the 3 OCs during his time.Grigs and injuries handicapped him but he couldn't adjust when things didn't go just right. And for Green Bay there's a reason McCarthy is on the hot seat even with his SB and going 7-9 with Rodgers missing most 9 games, he's made enough questionable moves and hasn't had the success with the best QB in the league. There are Pagano haters who will blame him for everything I'm not trying to do that but we can/need to find a better HC. If it wouldn't have been a PR nightmare we should have stayed with Arians as the HC after his interim stint IMO.

[BOTT]

2 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I don't think Chuck was Great or was he Bad though. I would just say Average. The whole we were given 6 wins a season in 2013 and 2014 because of our Division is just bologna and several people say that. I guess the Pats have had that luxury then 90% of the time over the last 15 years? Houston was actually Good in 2014 by the way as they went 9-7. It's funny people say we benefitted from a weak Division those 2 seasons but yet when the Jags win the Division it's because they have a dominant Defense by some in here. The Division this season was by far the worst than it has been in a long time. The Colts and Texans were out of the equation by mid season because neither had their starting QB's, the Titans are an Average team in reality. Jags won it by default in reality. Chuck has had his solid moments and not so solid moments, it is what it is. He has accomplished more as a Coach than many other Coaches I will say that though. No other Coach coaching in our Division has ever made the AFC Title Game as HeadCoach, Chuck did.

Unfortunately, Chuck could also write a book titled "how to ruin a young quarterback's career"

[NewColtsFan]

20 minutes ago, ty4atd said:

This season again the division was garbage because of the injuries last year was the first year it was average. I don't think the team was as bad as the record especially with Luck. But the team has never shown improvements in the same areas that have always been horrible, outside of Luck, TY and 2-3 others he hasn't been able to develop players most have had their best year in Indy year 1 then regressed, the D has never been able to stop a TE or running back on a pass and of course refusing to go to a quicker passing game. Not all of that is Pagano's fault the OC calls the plays but after seeing Luck get hit the most almost every year you'd think he would make a point of it to one of the 3 OCs during his time.Grigs and injuries handicapped him but he couldn't adjust when things didn't go just right. And for Green Bay there's a reason McCarthy is on the hot seat even with his SB and going 7-9 with Rodgers missing most 9 games, he's made enough questionable moves and hasn't had the success with the best QB in the league. There are Pagano haters who will blame him for everything I'm not trying to do that but we can/need to find a better HC. If it wouldn't have been a PR nightmare we should have stayed with Arians as the HC after his interim stint IMO.

 

I'm completely fine moving on from Pagano....    and I've been posting that view here for a year.

 

The entire franchise is ready for a new voice.    

 

But arguments like he was only 2-2 in the first year and was gifted with easy wins in the other years are lame.   They show a complete lack of understanding of just how hard it is to win in the NFL.

 

There's no recognition of the 2015 season, which most posters here think was a bad job by Pagano.    I think it was one of his best seasons.   No Andrew Luck for 9 games.   Needing 5 QBs for the season.   Using TWO QBs the last game to win.   And almost no one here gives Pagano any credit for that season.

 

Very smart people have lost their minds on Pagano.   There are some terrible posts in this thread over Wilson.   People jump to one astonishing negative conclusion after another.   They ignore facts that are well known to stick with their own opinions.

 

If I could push a button and make this thread disappear I would in a heartbeat.  It's an embarrassing thread.   And I don't say that lightly.

 

This website has been FANTASTIC for a week.   One great thread after another.  But when it comes to Pagano people have just lost their minds...   

 

I look forward to a new head coach...  

 

 

 

 

[crazycolt1]

6 hours ago, ty4atd said:

To be fair he really was 2-2 in year 1 and was "given" 6 wins a season the next 2 years by playing in the AFCS while it was brutal. All of our problems weren't on Chuck but he was certainly not a good HC.  

To be fair? Rally? There are no wins in the NFL that are given.

[OLD FAN MAN]

On 1/5/2018 at 9:04 AM, Smonroe said:

 

If you want to be honest, he wasn’t going to start back then, and didn’t deserve to start.  So you don’t keep him active and sit a guy who’s been practicing STs all week.  

 

Also, his position coach is watching him practice and reporting to the HC. He’s the one recommending who should play/sit.  I know it’s contrary to all the conspiracy theories but no coach is going to sit a player who can help him win unless there’s a really good reason. 

 

You guys have to get over blaming everything on Pagano.  Let it go.

i concur

[OLD FAN MAN]

9 hours ago, aaron11 said:

ive been critical of wilson, but i do think he finished the season well

 

i dont blame chuck either, QW had a lot to work on early in the year

 

i liked that he got his first int too, that should be a confidence booster

hard for a rookie corner to start

[Valpo2004]

On 1/5/2018 at 3:07 PM, NewColtsFan said:

 

They didn't pick Green over Wilson.   They don't even play the same position.

 

Wilson was benched because he was getting out worked in practice...   on and off the field.    It's hard to reward someone who is not putting out when everyone else is working their tail off and Wilson was not.    That's how you lose the locker room.   You reward the wrong guy.

 

The thing is this...  the story on season long snaps shows Wilson received the third most snaps for the year.    Hopefully the kid has figured it out and will be a professional.    He's got great talent.

 

Last thought:  If Ballard  objected he could have stepped in at any time.    And he didn't.   That should tell you Pagano was doing the right thing.......

 

 

Umm they did try Green out at CB for like one game and he predictably failed miserably.  I believe in that game Wilson was a healthy scratch.  So they did pick Green over Wilson for one game.  

[rock8591]

On 1/5/2018 at 9:04 AM, Smonroe said:

 

If you want to be honest, he wasn’t going to start back then, and didn’t deserve to start.  So you don’t keep him active and sit a guy who’s been practicing STs all week.  

 

Also, his position coach is watching him practice and reporting to the HC. He’s the one recommending who should play/sit.  I know it’s contrary to all the conspiracy theories but no coach is going to sit a player who can help him win unless there’s a really good reason. 

 

You guys have to get over blaming everything on Pagano.  Let it go.

 

More like EVERY coach does that.

 

We all know about office politics in the workplace, the NFL is no different.

 

Coaches don't care if they win or lose, they have money. If they lose a job, they'll just get another one.

Just look at Gruden; 1 good year in Tampa Bay, rest of his career was a boatload of nothing but broadcasting...then gets a big contract after not coaching forever.

[jskinnz]

5 minutes ago, rock8591 said:

 

More like EVERY coach does that.

 

We all know about office politics in the workplace, the NFL is no different.

 

Coaches don't care if they win or lose, they have money. If they lose a job, they'll just get another one.

Just look at Gruden; 1 good year in Tampa Bay, rest of his career was a boatload of nothing but broadcasting...then gets a big contract after not coaching forever.

 

The lack of deep thought in the bolded is staggering.

[Four2itus]

On 1/6/2018 at 9:49 AM, BOTT said:

Unfortunately, Chuck could also write a book titled "how to ruin a young quarterback's career"

Chuck could write one? Curious...as an observer...or as the one who caused it?

[Four2itus]

7 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

 

The lack of deep thought in the bolded is staggering.

You're being kind. I pictured a descriptive narrative that included the word, unfathomable. 

[Four2itus]

On 1/6/2018 at 5:38 PM, OLD FAN MAN said:

hard for a rookie corner to start

Maybe they should include a case of Aloe Vera to put on all those burns a CB gets his rookie season...

 

[Smonroe]

38 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

 

The lack of deep thought in the bolded is staggering.

 

Wait, that was a serious comment?  I just thought he was drunk.  

[Superman]

16 hours ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Umm they did try Green out at CB for like one game and he predictably failed miserably.  I believe in that game Wilson was a healthy scratch.  So they did pick Green over Wilson for one game.  

 

Green only played corner in the preseason. Other than that, he maybe got lined up at corner once or twice all year.

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, rock8591 said:

 

More like EVERY coach does that.

 

We all know about office politics in the workplace, the NFL is no different.

 

Coaches don't care if they win or lose, they have money. If they lose a job, they'll just get another one.

Just look at Gruden; 1 good year in Tampa Bay, rest of his career was a boatload of nothing but broadcasting...then gets a big contract after not coaching forever.

 

Come on now....

 

You're a good poster,  a smart guy.       I don't believe you sincerely believe this.  

 

I have to believe in the light of day with a clear head you would not have written this.    Or even thought this.

 

You have to know there is almost zero truth to what you wrote.

 

Coaches are HUGELY competitive.    They think if all things are equal,  their team will beat your team because of their coaching.    INSANELY competitive.      And they're also hugely protective of their coaches.    Because the HC came up through the ranks and knows how difficult life for a coach and their family is.     And they know if they lose their job,  there's a good chance that all of the assistant coaches will lose their jobs too.    So, all coaches move heaven and earth not go get fired.

 

I'm sure you know that coaches often work 80-100 hours during the season.    And 50-60 hours in the off-season.   Most of them sleep at the office multiple times a week.    Many new facilities have rooms built in with beds so the coach has a comfortable place to sleep for a few hours and not just collapse at a desk.    That's not a life you live without some serious thinking.     And part of that thinking is that the job is incredibly important to you --- money or not.

 

Gruden is an exception to the rule.    He is an example of nothing. 

 

I hope you'll wake up,  take a look at some of the responses here,   and re-think this post.     You're much better than this.....     this is not like you at all......

 

And I'm saying all of this with respect,  not to give you a hard time....

 

[BOTT]

3 hours ago, Four2itus said:

Chuck could write one? Curious...as an observer...or as the one who caused it?

Caused it