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Lucks current Injury: Caused by Indy


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https://amp.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000871706/article/andrew-luck-advised-not-to-throw-for-months-to-focus-on-rehab?networkId=4595&site=.news&zone=story&zoneUrl=url%3dstory&zoneKeys=s1%3dstory&env=&pageKeyValues=prtnr%3dind%3bteam%3dind%3bconf%3dafc%3bdvsn%3dacs&sr=amp

 

 

This article (from Ian Rapport so you know it's reliable) makes it very clear that Lucks current status is on the Colts. He should have never played through the injury; he should have had surgery right away. According to Rapsheet, his current status is a result of playing through the injury. The labrum is repaired, but the shoulder is a mess due to playing with it for two years. 

 

I've resisted the narrative that the colts mishandled Luck... I can't anymore. They absolutely handled this the wrong way, and now his season is over and, in my opinion, career is in jeapordy. 

 

Also - this is why irsay is upset and feels he's being misled. Someone (medical? Grigson?) said he could play through this and delay surgery. And here we are. 

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1 hour ago, Somewhere ovr the Waynebow said:

I've resisted the narrative that the colts mishandled Luck... I can't anymore. They absolutely handled this the wrong way, and now his season is over and, in my opinion, career is in jeapordy. 

 

 

I'm not sure how to categorize this thread as different from the others that blame someone who, in hind sight, clearly should have known better.

 

As I read the article, the 'news' is that now the 'belief' is that the current problems arose from the decision to play through

Quote

 

The belief is that additional issues arose in Luck's shoulder, which are byproducts of playing through the torn posterior labrum for two years. That, not the labrum, has led to the setbacks.

If surgery was the eventual decision, Dr. Marc Safran of Stanford Medicine would go in and clean up those issues.

But everyone hopes that outcome won't be necessary.

 

 

I don't think it's news that things have not gone as expected and in retrospect, perhaps things should have been done differently. 

 

So, the quest continues. Whose fault is this? How do we lay blame clearly on someone for this?

 

I highly doubt that Andrew would make decisions about his own health that were clearly wrong.  He's not a stupid guy.

 

When you discuss the possibility of surgery, nobody gives you any guarantees of any sort.  You have to do the best you can to weigh your odds.

 

I really don't believe that medical professionals would compromise their professional ethics or front office staff would roll the dice on the future of a franchise quarterback.

 

I know some players choose to play through injuries and suffer terrible consequences.  But, Andrew Luck is not a guy fighting for his place in the NFL. So, the narrative that all this was done to him when it was clear that it was the wrong decision just does not make sense, no matter how I look at it.

 

 

 

 

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Yeah, its pretty dumb to play through an injury to a throwing shoulder.  They all said he wouldn't risk further injury, but golly, don't you need every part of the shoulder working properly in order for the other parts to not be stressed?  

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It sounds similar to old time pitchers, Dizzy Dean comes to mind, whose career was shortened by altering his throwing motion due to an injury.

 

With modern medicine, and players in much more secure positions for not rushing back from injury, these type of effects should be eliminated.

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Luck’s a competitive guy, and so is everyone else involved in this mess. 

 

Lots if blame to go around. 

 

The root of the problem was not getting Luck a pass blocking offensive line. Bill Polian got it absolutely right. We tried to be this tough, run it down your throat team, with a generation quarterback.

 

Our entire offensive philosophy with Andrew Luck was a mess from the beginning, and we failed to protect him.

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41 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

Luck’s a competitive guy, and so is everyone else involved in this mess. 

 

Lots if blame to go around. 

 

The root of the problem was not getting Luck a pass blocking offensive line. Bill Polian got it absolutely right. We tried to be this tough, run it down your throat team, with a generation quarterback.

 

Our entire offensive philosophy with Andrew Luck was a mess from the beginning, and we failed to protect him.

I do agree, but I also want to say that Luck holding on to the ball too long should have been "coached away".  The HC, OC and QBC should have called plays that didn't require such long pocket protection. They should have been in Luck's ear about throwing the ball away. 

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1 minute ago, Roger said:

I do agree, but I also want to say that Luck holding on to the ball too long should have been "coached away".  The HC, OC and QBC should have called plays that didn't require such long pocket protection. They should have been in Luck's ear about throwing the ball away. 

Luck needs his version of Tod Hailey from Pit Luck is gonna look to move the ball down field but still needs a a guy who will put a better shot game in his playbook . 

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Just now, B~Town said:

Read several articles doesn't sound good for Luck sounds like a 50 /50 chance he is damaged goods now . 

not a popular opinion right now, but i think there is more than just a small chance that is the case too

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23 minutes ago, Roger said:

 They should have been in Luck's ear about throwing the ball away. 

 

Easier said than done.  This offense is a slow developing, down-the-field offense.  Also, Luck never had a running game and was constantly in 2nd and long and 3rd and long.  Further he never had a defense and was usually behind by 2-3 TDs.  On the rare occasions when this team did play a complete game(2016 Vikings) you saw how easy it is to win with a QB like Luck.  With a real GM and real coach, building a real football team, you would have rings by now.  Instead, Luck is back to rehab and his future is in question 

 

 

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11 minutes ago, B~Town said:

Read several articles doesn't sound good for Luck sounds like a 50 /50 chance he is damaged goods now . 

 

He'll just have to play with pain.  They have been as cautious as they can be and that's understandable, but at some point he and the organization will have to accept that it will never be pain free.  If he played with it torn for a year, he can play with the residual pain.

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At this point I think most people have their minds up on who to blame.

I don't like the "Colts messed up Luck narrative" but I do think mistakes were made. I also don't like to really use the word "blame" in this situation. I don't blame Luck for wanting to try and beast through rehab all year just to try and play, but I also don't think it was a smart decision for his career. The coaching/FO, they were just trying to save their jobs, of course they wanted Luck to play through the pain.

The sad thing to me is if Irsay had just let go of Grigson/Pagano a year earlier, If he had just fired them a year earlier, I seriously doubt Luck would've played through that '16 season. Had Ballard or any other competent GM been here, with an eye toward the future and not saving his job, I doubt he would've let Luck played.

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4 hours ago, Somewhere ovr the Waynebow said:

https://amp.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000871706/article/andrew-luck-advised-not-to-throw-for-months-to-focus-on-rehab?networkId=4595&site=.news&zone=story&zoneUrl=url%3dstory&zoneKeys=s1%3dstory&env=&pageKeyValues=prtnr%3dind%3bteam%3dind%3bconf%3dafc%3bdvsn%3dacs&sr=amp

 

 

This article (from Ian Rapport so you know it's reliable) makes it very clear that Lucks current status is on the Colts. He should have never played through the injury; he should have had surgery right away. According to Rapsheet, his current status is a result of playing through the injury. The labrum is repaired, but the shoulder is a mess due to playing with it for two years. 

 

I've resisted the narrative that the colts mishandled Luck... I can't anymore. They absolutely handled this the wrong way, and now his season is over and, in my opinion, career is in jeapordy. 

 

Also - this is why irsay is upset and feels he's being misled. Someone (medical? Grigson?) said he could play through this and delay surgery. And here we are. 

 

 

This would be IMO the only issue that Irsay could realistically feel he was "misled" on. 

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18 minutes ago, #12. said:

 

Easier said than done.  This offense is a slow developing, down-the-field offense.  Also, Luck never had a running game and was constantly in 2nd and long and 3rd and long.  Further he never had a defense and was usually behind by 2-3 TDs.  On the rare occasions when this team did play a complete game(2016 Vikings) you saw how easy it is to win with a QB like Luck.  With a real GM and real coach, building a real football team, you would have rings by now.  Instead, Luck is back to rehab and his future is in question 

 

 

A "real coach" would have created a different offense. He would not have stuck with the slow developing, downfield offense, because he didn't have the o-line necessary.

 

A real gm would have got players to match the offense.

 

"Easier said than done" is just an excuse. It's a coaching failure to not coach a young player to avoid serious injury.  Sticking to a long developing downfield offense with available personnel was dumb.

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8 minutes ago, OLD FAN MAN said:

if luck is finished we need to build an o-line before we draft another qb, dont draft another and let the same thing happen all over again

i disagree, if we have a chance to get a QB then we need to take it

 

no guarantee we will find one later. 

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9 minutes ago, OLD FAN MAN said:

if luck is finished we need to build an o-line before we draft another qb, dont draft another and let the same thing happen all over again

I hope Colts front office listens to the Old Man.

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4 hours ago, aaron11 said:

luck himself probably had the biggest say in that

 

My take is this, he hurt it vs. Titans.  Then he got severely injured a few weeks later in Denver and was shut down for the year.  He had the rest of that year and the offseason to rehab and recover.for the 2016 season.  he decided against shoulder surgery for minimally invasive rehab, but then needed that weekly rehab throughout 2016 to stay on the field, even needing days off.  He'd get better, then get re-injured... slightly worse than before many times throughout the season.  At the year end, he decided to have it operated on after consultation with many doctors.  the team cannot force him to go under the knife... not any more than I can tell you what medical procedure you have to get to fix (fill in the blank).  It doesn't work like that.  That decision is a patient/physician agreement, not a club decision.

 

3 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher said:

Is it known who did the surgery?

There was a thread that the surgeon is not known.

 

Dr. Marc Safran, Stanford Sports medicine.

 

http://ortho.stanford.edu/sports-medicine/marc-safran-profile.html

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9 hours ago, Somewhere ovr the Waynebow said:

https://amp.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000871706/article/andrew-luck-advised-not-to-throw-for-months-to-focus-on-rehab?networkId=4595&site=.news&zone=story&zoneUrl=url%3dstory&zoneKeys=s1%3dstory&env=&pageKeyValues=prtnr%3dind%3bteam%3dind%3bconf%3dafc%3bdvsn%3dacs&sr=amp

 

 

This article (from Ian Rapport so you know it's reliable) makes it very clear that Lucks current status is on the Colts. He should have never played through the injury; he should have had surgery right away. According to Rapsheet, his current status is a result of playing through the injury. The labrum is repaired, but the shoulder is a mess due to playing with it for two years. 

 

I've resisted the narrative that the colts mishandled Luck... I can't anymore. They absolutely handled this the wrong way, and now his season is over and, in my opinion, career is in jeapordy. 

 

Also - this is why irsay is upset and feels he's being misled. Someone (medical? Grigson?) said he could play through this and delay surgery. And here we are. 

 

I've now read the story and would like to know what in the story makes you think that the Colts handled this wrong?

 

Rappaport doesn't say that.    I didn't read anything that even hinted or suggested that.

 

The idea that the Colts made s mess if things is your opinion and I don't know how you arrived at this view?

 

I don't know that anyone is to blame.... seriously, I'm not kidding.    I think it's just unfortunate how it unfolded.

 

Luck has said he didn't have surgery back in 2015 because HE didn't think it was necessary.     So I don't know why you've now decided that it's the teams fault?

 

I don't think this story makes that case...

 

 

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3 hours ago, DougDew said:

Yeah, its pretty dumb to play through an injury to a throwing shoulder.  They all said he wouldn't risk further injury, but golly, don't you need every part of the shoulder working properly in order for the other parts to not be stressed?  

All QBs play though injury...and many have hurt shoulders...like baseball pitchers

We knew he was hurt early in 2015....there's video of when it happened .he played through it.

 

There's no blame..its just the nature of the game

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1 hour ago, OLD FAN MAN said:

if luck is finished we need to build an o-line before we draft another qb, dont draft another and let the same thing happen all over again

OFM..

I dont think you can be 'finished'  at his age.

 

..at some point, he'll be able to throw. What he throws like? I don't know. He may lose some arm strength.

But I don't think a QB is 'finished' at age 28

 

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Just now, oldunclemark said:

All QBs play though injury...and many have hurt shoulders...like baseball pitchers

We knew he was hurt early in 2015....there's video of when it happened .he played through it.

 

There's no blame..its just the nature of the game

I know.  But they are now saying that they seemed surprised that there are other parts of the shoulder that came under stress while the labrum was torn.  Like they didn't figure that would happen by playing on it for two seasons, and they are now surprised he needs to have the other parts checked out. 

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1 minute ago, DougDew said:

I know.  But they are now saying that they seemed surprised that there are other parts of the shoulder that came under stress while the labrum was torn.  Like they didn't figure that would happen by playing on it for two seasons, and they are now surprised he needs to have the other parts checked out. 

Who is this 'they'

Andrew sad he was good to play.....You cant sit your QB when he says he can play, can you?

The surgery was supposed to take care of this but recovery has been slow.

He made need another surgery....I don't know

 

But there's no blame. Andrew was playing through an injury as we would all want him to do

 

 

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1 minute ago, oldunclemark said:

Who is this 'they'

Andrew sad he was good to play.....You cant sit your QB when he says he can play, can you?

The surgery was supposed to take care of this but recovery has been slow.

He made need another surgery....I don't know

 

But there's no blame. Andrew was playing through an injury as we would all want him to do

 

 

It sound as if they, the doctors, didn't at first take into account the fact that Luck may have to rehab other parts of the shoulder that became weakened when compensating for the poorly functioning labrum.  That only now, when it stares them in the face, have they figured out that all parts of a throwing shoulder need to be a 100% in order to play QB.

 

I always question when I hear teams say that the player can't "damage the shoulder any further" by playing with a damaged shoulder.  I think the other parts in fact get stressed.  Its common sense to me, but I haven't had medical training.

 

And now Irsay is claiming to have been misled.

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A subsequent second surgery is not a new thing. Peyton had to have it done on his bursa sac, if I remember right, before the 2008 season. What a season 2008 was, with Brady on IR and Peyton starting with his bursa sac issues, with an inceremonious defeat vs the Bears to open Lucas Oil Stadium.

 

Here is a read up on Brady's left knee surgery, he had to have a second procedure done as well:

 

http://articles.latimes.com/2009/jun/02/sports/sp-tom-brady2

 

http://articles.latimes.com/2009/aug/09/sports/sp-tom-brady9

 

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

Who is this 'they'

Andrew sad he was good to play.....You cant sit your QB when he says he can play, can you?

The surgery was supposed to take care of this but recovery has been slow.

He made need another surgery....I don't know

 

But there's no blame. Andrew was playing through an injury as we would all want him to do

 

 

 

Luck is an employee, if the Colts felt the best decision was to sit Luck then Luck's word shouldn't matter. Of course they wanted Luck to play hurt, there were at least 2 guys trying to save there jobs every single week for the last 2 years. Sure am glad we trotted Luck out there to beat the Jags last year and worsen our draft spot in the process. This organization is a joke and can't be trusted to handle any situation properly it seems.

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52 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

All QBs play though injury...and many have hurt shoulders...like baseball pitchers

We knew he was hurt early in 2015....there's video of when it happened .he played through it.

 

There's no blame..its just the nature of the game

Most MLB pitchers will shutdown rather than pitch with injury. There is too much money at stake.  Agents are proactive in protecting the longevity.  They have nothing to lose, unless it's a contract year.  Guaranteed contracts.

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2 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

OFM..

I dont think you can be 'finished'  at his age.

 

..at some point, he'll be able to throw. What he throws like? I don't know. He may lose some arm strength.

But I don't think a QB is 'finished' at age 28

 

if there is nerve damage he is done age is not a factor

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2 minutes ago, OLD FAN MAN said:

if there is nerve damage he is done age is not a factor

    The only thing that would end his career would be if he could not throw at all.

You don't have to have a strong arm to play QB..it just helps...  

    Nerve damage would not end his career...Remember Peyton Manning lost strength I his arm but it did not end his career.  And Luck was throwing very well in practice...

Lets not get paranoid

 

If you consider that a QB can play until he's 39 or 40....there just aren't many football injuries that would keep a QB from playing for a decade

 

   

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16 minutes ago, austriancolt said:

Colts looking at 2018 QB class. It would be hilarious to see them draft a QB with an early pick only to get him hurt behind that horrible Offensive Line! 

The Colts aren't drafting a qb early next year

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23 hours ago, chad72 said:

I'd get any scar tissue removed now with another surgery instead of waiting months again to realize there may be another setback, just my two cents. 

exactly i dont know or get whats the hold up. 

The hope is that with only rehab he would be able to be just fine and if not then they will open again. He is not throwing anyways for ac ouple of months, his season is over. Get Certainty. Open him up again check everything is fine and if there is an issue correct it NOW. 

 

If there isnt anything, then he will only have to stop rehab for 3+- weeks, which i guess its frustrating but i mean seriously, is 3 weeks worth it?

I dont get it.

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On 11/5/2017 at 7:14 AM, braveheartcolt said:

The need to blame someone for his injury is childish. Forum.Colts.com, football's best kangaroo court. Give us all a break from the constant finger pointing.

This isn't finger pointing, it's accountability. Colts allowed Luck to play through the injury, and as a result it's messed up his entire shoulder, not just the labrum. 

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