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2017-2018 Indiana Pacers and Everything NBA Thread


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10 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

-So with the Pacers at 27-23 and currently in the 6th Spot, what grade would you give the Pacers on the season so far through 50 games? We are also 3.5 games ahead of the Pistons who are currently 9th so as of now we are comfortably in the Top 8 = Playoff team.

 

 

-Thoughts?

I give us an 'A'

We were forced to trade our leading scorer but we also moved on from our lead guard Jeff Teague, CJ Miles. not to mention Rodney Stuckey and Monta Ellis.

   We were not supposed to be a playoff team and we now may be.

Defensively, we dont rebound well but we get a lot of steals and deflections. Offensively, Oladipo has done very well, even better than he figured to coming back to Indiana.

    I didn't know that OKC was basically playing Sabonis our of position (a stretch 4) and that his footwork and movement would make him a solid center. His 12 point a 8 rebounds a game...is a shock to me.

I want to give our management credit but I wonder if they knew Sabonis would excel as an offensive '5' instead of a '4'.

I cant believe that all; the experts' on TV and radio didn't see that he was being misused.

 

  Also, our trades for Darren Collison and Cory Joseph were strong moves by our management because they certainly DID know what these two could do. 

Again,. I dont know if we'll make the playoffs. Look at our final 2 weeks, who we play and where.

That closing schedule is a serious roadblock to us making the playoffs.

 

But I give us an 'A' for 2 reasons.

1. We constructed a compatible team with some 'present' and some potential.

Three players who can play the point and three posts players.

We have a solid foundation, not counting Victor. The core of our team is set for the next few years.

And if Bogdonavic can rediscover his shot and Glenn Robinson returns we can win a playoff series or two and still be set well going to next year and beyond.  Credit to Nate McMillan and our front office.

 

2. .We have a team that has a relationship with the city.

Our fans sense that our players want to be in Indianapolis  and will give everything they have (at least after they drop behind by 20) every night. Darren Collison agreed to come back here after we let him go. Players like Lance and Victor are not shy about their desire to not just play but to play in Indiana. That means a lot to me. Fans want to root for players who want to be in their town.  

This isn't a championship team but its a special group

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Just now, oldunclemark said:

I give us an 'A'

We were forced to trade our leading scorer but we also moved on from our lead guard Jeff Teague, CJ Miles. not to mention Rodney Stuckey and Monta Ellis.

   We were not supposed to be a playoff team and we now may be.

Defensively, we dont rebound well but we get a lot of steals and deflections. Offensively, Oladipo has done very well, even better than he figured to coming back to Indiana.

    I didn't know that OKC was basically playing Sabonis our of position (a stretch 4) and that his footwork and movement would make him a solid center. His 12 point a 8 rebounds a game...is a shock to me.

I want to give our management credit but I wonder if they knew Sabonis would excel as an offensive '5' instead of a '4'.

I cant believe that all; the experts' on TV and radio didn't see that he was being misused.

 

  Also, our trades for Darren Collison and Cory Joseph were strong moves by our management because they certainly DID know what these two could do. 

Again,. I dont know if we'll make the playoffs. Look at our final 2 weeks, who we play and where.

That closing schedule is a serious roadblock to us making the playoffs.

 

But I give us an 'A' for 2 reasons.

1. We constructed a compatible team with some 'present' and some potential.

Three players who can plat the point and three posts players.

We have solid foundation, not counting Victor. The core of our team is set for the next few years.

And if Bogdonavic can rediscover his shot and Glenn Robinson returns we can win a playoff series or two and still be set well going to next year and beyond.  Credit to Nate McMillan and our front office.

 

2. .We have a team that has a relationship with the city.

Our fans sense that our players want to be in Indianapolis  and will give everything they have (at least aftre they drop behind by 20) every night. Darren Collison agreed to come back here after we let him go. Players like Lance and Victor are not shy about their desire to not just play but to play in Indiana. That means a lot to me. Fans want to root for players who want to be in their town.  

This is a fan friendly team

 

So my B+ isn't being biased at least with you. I have really enjoyed this season.

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17 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

So my B+ isn't being biased at least with you. I have really enjoyed this season.

Oh no, CBE.....

....we were supposed to be a lottery team...you remember, and we're 4-over-.500 with 32 games left.

You correctly suggest that we may be 'playing over our heads' and I agree.

We have gone without Myles Turners for a dozen games and Glenn Robinson for 50 games.

Glenn was supposed to play regularly for us.

I also think we're 27-23 in a stronger Eastern Conference.

 

I thought we'd be .500 and even closing out 14-18 we're there.

I want us to add a vet wing at the trade deadline because it wont hurt our core of young forwards and Victor.

But we have far over achieved considering the roster renovation we had last summer

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10 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

OKC wins 8 in a row.

They look like they know where the ball should go and they have that firepower I always talk about that you have to have against the top teams.

The pairing of Russell Westbrook and Paul George fits because Paul doesn't need to be (and doesn't want to be) 'the guy' who always has 'the ball'

 

Now they just have to stay healthy the final 2 months..Here's another team that might add a forward in the next 2 weeks

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3 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

They look like they know where the ball should go and they have that firepower I always talk about that you have to have against the top teams.

The pairing of Russell Westbrook and Paul George fits because Paul doesn't need to be (and doesn't want to be) 'the guy' who always has 'the ball'

 

Now they just have to stay healthy the final 2 months..Here's another team that might add a forward in the next 2 weeks

Adams is very important to that team. Everyone talks about the future Hall of Famers in Westy/PG/Melo but Adams can hang with any Center in the league and that is gigantic.

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4 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Adams is very important to that team. Everyone talks about the future Hall of Famers in Westy/PG/Melo but Adams can hang with any Center in the league and that is gigantic.

Very true;

I'm guessing that Adams is the reason they wanted to make Sabonis a '4' and if that's true, I excuse them.

Adams just abuses smaller pivot men including guys like Draymond Green.

I saw him go against Big Val in Washington and just dominate him.

    He's a problem for teams that play small and the two top small ball teams are Houston and GSW

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1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Losing Roberson is a bummer but I think it's something they can overcome to go far in the Playoffs. They cannot lose Westy/PG/Melo/or Adams. If they lose one of those guys they are done.

They will add vet help at the trade deadline.

They are 'all-in' for this year......

 

I wonder if Vince Carter would like to play in SA

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 True..They play well without him but not to the level that they can win the conference.

 

I'd like to see us add someone....

Maybe if a contending team makes a trade and then has to deal someone to open up salary..and that player then gets released by their new team. 

We are so thin at forward...and our payroll is something like 27th in the NBA

I hope we aren't satisfied with 'proving the experts wrong' because we aren't in the playoffs yet.

The majority of our remaining games are on the road...

 

Vey eager to see if Glenn Robinson is coming back....He fills a need for us..or he could if he was playing

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1 minute ago, oldunclemark said:

  By the way, Myles Turner's rookie contract is up after next year. 'How much are we going to pay him?

 

$20 mil,  $25 mil. ?  Is he signing with us again for $15 mil a year?  Just asking

Not sure what we give him but I think he likes it here, he isn't going anywhere IMO. We have a great thing going now, now that Dipo is here.

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3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Not sure what we give him but I think he likes it here, he isn't going anywhere IMO. We have a great thing going now, now that Dipo is here.

I'd like to think what you say is true...but his agent is going to say "Oh yeah!  Myles likes it here. Oh yeah. Vic is cool,.'

But as his representative, I must ask again .

"How much are you going to pay my man?!!"  Specifically. Exactly. For how many years.?

 

 

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3 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

Very true;

I'm guessing that Adams is the reason they wanted to make Sabonis a '4' and if that's true, I excuse them.

Adams just abuses smaller pivot men including guys like Draymond Green.

I saw him go against Big Val in Washington and just dominate him.

    He's a problem for teams that play small and the two top small ball teams are Houston and GSW

That's exactly why they played Sabonis as a stretch. As far as what the front office projected from Sabonis I didn't watch him in OKC but I'd guess he had to flash last year. If you go back and watch his 2 yrs at Gonzaga especially his final year he was at times dominant down low. He went 17.6 & 11.8 in his final season shooting 62%fg and 36% from 3. That's why I was confident he'd be a solid bench piece for us playing in his comfort zone closer to the basket. I didn't expect him to be this good but I knew he was more then a throw in. 

 

He has developed a special bond with Vic through all of this too. The trade is going to look better and better because both of these guys are going to continue to get better. There is going to come a time when we are going to have to figure out if Sabonis and Turner can play alongside each other. I don't think it happens this year but Sabonis is going to want to be a starter at some point. I think his a higher ceiling then Turner. 

 

Hopefully TJ works his butt off to get stronger because he's shown he can score the ball. I don't think he's opposed to contact his body just needs to develop so he can hold his own. The combo of Sabonis/Leaf is very interesting moving forward. Neither protect the rim like Turner can but we aren't a team that's going to go over the cap. There could be some tough choices in the next few years.

 

I'd love to see Pritchard make the Clarkson/Nance for Big Al move that was proposed In a Pacers article. I posted the link a couple of days ago. I hope we see GR3 on the floor this week. We could us a boost in the home stretch. The best teams start playing their best in February 

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4 hours ago, akcolt said:

That's exactly why they played Sabonis as a stretch. As far as what the front office projected from Sabonis I didn't watch him in OKC but I'd guess he had to flash last year. If you go back and watch his 2 yrs at Gonzaga especially his final year he was at times dominant down low. He went 17.6 & 11.8 in his final season shooting 62%fg and 36% from 3. That's why I was confident he'd be a solid bench piece for us playing in his comfort zone closer to the basket. I didn't expect him to be this good but I knew he was more then a throw in. 

 

He has developed a special bond with Vic through all of this too. The trade is going to look better and better because both of these guys are going to continue to get better. There is going to come a time when we are going to have to figure out if Sabonis and Turner can play alongside each other. I don't think it happens this year but Sabonis is going to want to be a starter at some point. I think his a higher ceiling then Turner. 

 

Hopefully TJ works his butt off to get stronger because he's shown he can score the ball. I don't think he's opposed to contact his body just needs to develop so he can hold his own. The combo of Sabonis/Leaf is very interesting moving forward. Neither protect the rim like Turner can but we aren't a team that's going to go over the cap. There could be some tough choices in the next few years.

 

I'd love to see Pritchard make the Clarkson/Nance for Big Al move that was proposed In a Pacers article. I posted the link a couple of days ago. I hope we see GR3 on the floor this week. We could us a boost in the home stretch. The best teams start playing their best in February 

Turner isn't going anywhere he will be signed long term when his contract is up. The team along with tons of people across the NBA think the sky is the limit for Turner.

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15 hours ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Turner isn't going anywhere he will be signed long term when his contract is up. The team along with tons of people across the NBA think the sky is the limit for Turner.

But the question still stands and it needs to be answered this off-season.

How much.

If Myles Turner asks for $20 mil for 5 years....a $100 mil deal..would you pay him that?

There is risk...but I think I would.....

 

My concern is if he asks for $25-$30 mil

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3 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

But the question still stands and it needs to be answered this off-season.

How much.

If Myles Turner asks for $20 mil for 5 years....a $100 mil deal..would you pay him that?

There is risk...but I think I would.....

 

My concern is if he asks for $25-$30 mil

Yes I would pay him that 

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33 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

But the question still stands and it needs to be answered this off-season.

How much.

If Myles Turner asks for $20 mil for 5 years....a $100 mil deal..would you pay him that?

There is risk...but I think I would.....

 

My concern is if he asks for $25-$30 mil

We're going to have to give him max dollars or someone else will take him. We're not in position to get other max players anyway.

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9 minutes ago, Bluefire4 said:

We're going to have to give him max dollars or someone else will take him. We're not in position to get other max players anyway.

We have to be realistic. Is he a max player. And, even if we think he will be (I do)

It should be noted what guys like Mike Conley make...Conley is an outstanding player...but he makes $35 mil

Blake Griffin's final year of his deal is $37 mil.... the Clippers are celebrating that they unloaded that disaster deal.

 

I wouldn't pay Myles a lot more than Victor makes ($21 mil)

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9 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

We have to be realistic. Is he a max player. And, even if we think he will be (I do)

It should be noted what guys like Mike Conley make...Conley is an outstanding player...but he makes $35 mil

Blake Griffin's final year of his deal is $37 mil.... the Clippers are celebrating that they unloaded that disaster deal.

 

I wouldn't pay Myles a lot more than Victor makes ($21 mil)

I think the most Myles can make on this upcoming contract is $27 million. There's no one in free agency we will be able to get that has a higher upside than Myles Turner. There are plenty of players making that kind of money that may not be completely worth it including Victor Oladipo until this year.

 

I think Turner will only get better and if we have to pay the full 27 million than that's what we have to do. 

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2 minutes ago, Bluefire4 said:

I think the most Myles can make on this upcoming contract is $27 million. There's no one in free agency we will be able to get that has a higher upside than Myles Turner. There are plenty of players making that kind of money that may not be completely worth it including Victor Oladipo until this year.

 

I think Turner will only get better and if we have to pay the full 27 million than that's what we have to do. 

Again, we don't have to pay him max dollars if we don't think he'll be a max player. Upside doesst matter if you never get there.   But we wont get him for $15 mil..not long term. And the time to sign him is this off-season.

 

I dont want Mike Conley or Blake Griffin or Nichols Batum's contract ($25 mil a year for an average player) holding us back. I want to see Myles contribute more than he has this year.

..and I want to see him in the post-season...But in the end, we're just guessing.

Nobody knows what Myles will be like when he;s 25 just like nobody knew what Victor would be like.

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Pacers win again! Now 28-23 on the season, comfortably in a Playoff spot. I see where the Pistons traded for Blake Griffin, they gave up a lot though to get him. Not sure how much they will improve but they are currently 22-26 so as of now not a threat to make the Playoffs. They would have to go 19-15 the rest of the way just be a .500 team.

 

-Regarding Turner, we will pay him and have to pay him. He is our 2nd best player and is young. He likes being here as he and Dipo click and get along well. We cant break this nucleus up of Dipo/Turner/Sabonis/and Lance - all young guys, they play too Good off of 1 another. We already lost PG-13/traded him, luckily that has paid off.

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12 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

Again, we don't have to pay him max dollars if we don't think he'll be a max player. Upside doesst matter if you never get there.   But we wont get him for $15 mil..not long term. And the time to sign him is this off-season.

 

I dont want Mike Conley or Blake Griffin or Nichols Batum's contract ($25 mil a year for an average player) holding us back. I want to see Myles contribute more than he has this year.

..and I want to see him in the post-season...But in the end, we're just guessing.

Nobody knows what Myles will be like when he;s 25 just like nobody knew what Victor would be like.

Your last sentence is exactly why we and other teams sign promising players to those kinds of deals. The NBA pays for future performance and upside. If we let Myles go, he can be like Victor Oladipo on another team and we'd be missing out. 

 

And I don't know how signing Myles would hold this team back... nobody as good is going to come here as a free agent especially if Myles doesn't work out. We'd have to build a big 3 through the draft before any max level free agents would want to sign here. 

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14 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Myles had 22 points in 21 mins had a block and 4 rebounds dude is good when he will only be getting better with age 

I think that a lot of Pacers fans forget that the guy is 21 years old. It took players like Deandre Jordan and Hasaan Whiteside 5 or 6 years to play at an all-star level but they ended up getting there. I think next year Myles will be a 18 and 12 guy if he stays healthy.

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5 minutes ago, Bluefire4 said:

And I don't know how signing Myles would hold this team back... nobody as good is going to come here as a free agent especially if Myles doesn't work out. 

nothing to add but i agree with this

 

no reason to not sign him, who else is walking in the door?

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9 hours ago, Bluefire4 said:

Your last sentence is exactly why we and other teams sign promising players to those kinds of deals. The NBA pays for future performance and upside. If we let Myles go, he can be like Victor Oladipo on another team and we'd be missing out. 

 

And I don't know how signing Myles would hold this team back... nobody as good is going to come here as a free agent especially if Myles doesn't work out. We'd have to build a big 3 through the draft before any max level free agents would want to sign here. 

Blue...if we let Myles go, he could also be like Joakim Noah. We don't know.

And we just picked up 2 starters and two future max players in a trade last summer.

Please stop saying that 'nobody good is ever going to come to Indianapolis'  That's not true

"Weacquired 2 all-stars (Sabonis is a 'future star')for one all-star last summer

 

 

....you can only pay players so much....we aren't going over the salary cap. That's just the way it is

Myls coud be Victor Oladipo and Myles could also be Nicholas Batum. We have to guess.

I say again...Mike Conley makes $35 mil...Blake Griffin's final season (which someone must pay) is $37 mil.

If Myles wants 'Victor money, $20-$25 mil)' we sign him...If he wants Blake Griffin money ($37 mil at the end of his deal" you know we wont do that.   I hope his demands are in the 'Victor' range but he hasnt been so good that I would never consider dealing him.... I disagree with you there.

 

.and this summer is the time we must make that decision..

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9 hours ago, aaron11 said:

nothing to add but i agree with this

 

no reason to not sign him, who else is walking in the door?

Domatas Sabonis just walked in the door, Aaron..  Him and Myles play the same position.

..and you have to pay him, too. If Myles wants a contract that ends in a $30 mil season, he's going to have to go someplace else to get that.  What you give Myles, you will have to match in 2 years with Sabonis.

And we aren't going miles above the salary cap like Cleveland has. 

You know our management.

 

....don't you want to see Myles excel in the post-season before I give him 5 years and $125 mil.?

I do.

 

.

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9 hours ago, Bluefire4 said:

I think that a lot of Pacers fans forget that the guy is 21 years old. It took players like Deandre Jordan and Hasaan Whiteside 5 or 6 years to play at an all-star level but they ended up getting there. I think next year Myles will be a 18 and 12 guy if he stays healthy.

That's a big 'if' ....

...I don't want him gone but we don't have time to see what he'll be. That's my point.

We have to decide this summer...and are you satisfied with what Myles has done this season.?

Are you willing to lock in $25 mil a year based on this season? 

I'd like to see him contribute significantly in these final 30 games and (hopefully)) the playoffs.

Because we have to make the decision this summer. 

Myles is signed for next season but it wont be good for him or us if we don't make a decision this summer.

 

I may be wrong about what he'll ask for. Maybe he'll sign a 3 or 4 year deal at something like $15 mil....

with a 'player option' (he can be a free agent after 2 years)

so he can cash in if he improves..  That wouldbe good for both sides.

 

 

 

 

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