2017-2018 Indiana Pacers and Everything NBA Thread

[Bluefire4]

8 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

Optimism is blind and pessimism is accurate? Okay.

 

I dont think anyone can accurately tell how good we are ..all new team

Optimism is blind and pessimism is annoying.

 

Objectivity is accurate. I think we make the playoffs as a 7 or 8 seed or we are one of the first teams out of the playoffs. That is objective. Top 4 seed is blind optimism.

 

I mean you should know optimism is blind with all of the constant excuses you made for last year's team up until the moment they blew the whole thing up after only a year. 

[Bluefire4]

9 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

Nobody serious says we're a Top-4 team...

Understand the message board

What does "understand a message board" mean? When somebody post that they think this team is a top team that can compete with anybody I take it as their real opinion.

 

When I am discussing sports in my house with friends that tell me the Pacers will be a top 4 seed in the East, they really mean that.

 

I've seen no trolls on this thread. People write what they believe.

[BullsColtsFan1]

18 hours ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

He is amazing to watch here jumped right over a dude and scored nearly 30 again 

Weren't you one of the fans not keen on Oladipo when George got traded?  Maybe I am wrong(I know a lot of fans weren't keen on him).  I told all you guys from the start that he'd be a stud.  His stats are identical to Paul George's from last year.  Oladipo, Sabonis and Turner are 3 good building pieces.  Need a stud small forward and maybe a better point guard, but Collison has been solid this year.  Pacers are fun to watch.  I am glad they came back and beat my worthless Bulls, Bulls need to have that #1 pick lol. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

11 minutes ago, BullsColtsFan1 said:

Weren't you one of the fans not keen on Oladipo when George got traded?  Maybe I am wrong(I know a lot of fans weren't keen on him).  I told all you guys from the start that he'd be a stud.  His stats are identical to Paul George's from last year.  Oladipo, Sabonis and Turner are 3 good building pieces.  Need a stud small forward and maybe a better point guard, but Collison has been solid this year.  Pacers are fun to watch.  I am glad they came back and beat my worthless Bulls, Bulls need to have that #1 pick lol. 

Yeah look at the bright side, you may end up with the #1 pick. I wasn't keen on the trade I admit but we haven't lost any production with Dipo + Sabonis has been a nice surprise. I like Bogs as well, he is the type of player every team needs = deadly from 3 like a Korver or Redick. Turner isn't All-Star but he is solid Good. I think Dipo will make the All-Star team, if he doesn't something is wrong.

[Colts_Fan12]

34 minutes ago, BullsColtsFan1 said:

Weren't you one of the fans not keen on Oladipo when George got traded?  Maybe I am wrong(I know a lot of fans weren't keen on him).  I told all you guys from the start that he'd be a stud.  His stats are identical to Paul George's from last year.  Oladipo, Sabonis and Turner are 3 good building pieces.  Need a stud small forward and maybe a better point guard, but Collison has been solid this year.  Pacers are fun to watch.  I am glad they came back and beat my worthless Bulls, Bulls need to have that #1 pick lol. 

Yeah I didn't hate him so much as I just didn't like the trade but yes he sure has shocked me that's for damn sure!!!! Lol

[oldunclemark]

16 hours ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Yes mark people still seriously think PG is this great 2 way player that is a league leading clutch player when in reality he isnt he is a very good role player Vic is clearly out playing him and what he did here last year and it's not even close 

But nobody ever said he was a league leading clutch player.

You're doing Skip Bayless....set up a straw man and then knock it down

[oldunclemark]

8 hours ago, Bluefire4 said:

What does "understand a message board" mean? When somebody post that they think this team is a top team that can compete with anybody I take it as their real opinion.

 

When I am discussing sports in my house with friends that tell me the Pacers will be a top 4 seed in the East, they really mean that.

 

I've seen no trolls on this thread. People write what they believe.

Blue.....

No they don't. They're just riding the wave......Fans do that all the time..

Ask them if they'd bet $100 on it...

Folks say ANYTHING during a sports debate.  You know that

 

Want an example? How about you.

You said optimism is blind......I know you don't mean that because it doesnt make sense..

Optimism is the reverse of pessimism.....and I am sure know you know that

You are welcome to either......but I dont think you live your live thinking that optimism is being blind.

You dont believe what you said on a message board.

That's what I mean about 'understanding a message board'

 

What I dont understand, I admit,  is why folks come on an Indianapolis Pacers section on an Indianapolis Colts web site and repeatedly call Pacers fans blind and stupid because they are optimistic about the Indianapolis team...when they win a couple of games and play better than expected.

 

  What's the 'end game' ? What's the point?

 

 

 

 

 

[Colts_Fan12]

28 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

But nobody ever said he was a league leading clutch player.

You're doing Skip Bayless....set up a straw man and then knock it down

People on here still over value PG every day don't act like they don't 

[akcolt]

23 hours ago, Bluefire4 said:

I think we are overachieving and teams like the Raptors, Wizards (When John Wall gets back), Pistons, Bucks and 76ers are better than us and maybe even the Heat as well. 

 

There were certain times last year where people thought we were going to be a top 4 seed too. I just don't believe it.

I'm not saying we are going to be a top 4 seed. If I was predicting the East Toronto and the Wiz fill the 3/4 seeds. We have shown we can play with the Raptors. 

 

I'm not ready to say the Pistons or Sixers are a better teams. They have just as much to prove. The Bucks are really light in the front court losing Parker didn't help but they probably get the 5 seed. 

 

The Sixers are losing at home to the Lakers as I type this. I don't see what the opinion that the Sixers Pistions or any team outside the top 4 are definitely a better team is being based on.  It's not our records and it's not history. Those things say we have a dog in the fight. 

 

. 

[oldunclemark]

      I'm very encouraged by what I've seen but I think this home stand (and Friday's game) are big.

 

If we sweep this home stand (again, I know that's optimistic) I think we are a playoff team. We have Glenn Robinson coming back to help the bench.

...and Victor O  wants to be the star of the Indiana Pacers...I cant say enough how much that means.

I looked at Wednesday's game as a positive because we werent ready to play and our older players rescued us...

 

The Cavs did the same thing Wednesday against Sacramento. Its what good teams do.

[oldunclemark]

16 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

People on here still over value PG every day don't act like they don't 

I think again you're talking for the sake of argument but more power to you.

  Paul is in West so I dont really care anymore, do you?

[Colts_Fan12]

Just now, oldunclemark said:

I think again you're talking for the sake of argument but more power to you.

  Paul is in West so I dont really care anymore, do you?

My point is he's not nearly as good as people thought he would be or how good they think he is end of story 

[oldunclemark]

4 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

My point is he's not nearly as good as people thought he would be or how good they think he is end of story 

But the question still stands.

 He's in the west. What difference does it make now?.  Who are you trying to convince and, more importantly, why?

[Colts_Fan12]

Just now, oldunclemark said:

But the question still stands.

 He's in the west. What difference does it make now?.  Who are you trying to convince and, more importantly, why?

When my whole point to begin with was how Vic is a better player this season then it's pretty important. who cares what conference he's in vic is better this year better scorer better leader and more clutch end of story mark 

[Bluefire4]

5 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

Blue.....

No they don't. They're just riding the wave......Fans do that all the time..

Ask them if they'd bet $100 on it...

Folks say ANYTHING during a sports debate.  You know that

 

Want an example? How about you.

You said optimism is blind......I know you don't mean that because it doesnt make sense..

Optimism is the reverse of pessimism.....and I am sure know you know that

You are welcome to either......but I dont think you live your live thinking that optimism is being blind.

You dont believe what you said on a message board.

That's what I mean about 'understanding a message board'

 

What I dont understand, I admit,  is why folks come on an Indianapolis Pacers section on an Indianapolis Colts web site and repeatedly call Pacers fans blind and stupid because they are optimistic about the Indianapolis team...when they win a couple of games and play better than expected.

 

  What's the 'end game' ? What's the point?

 

 

 

 

 

I value objectivity and I don't care if you're the biggest fan ever of a team you still need to be realistic. 

 

Optimism may be the reverse of pessimism, but optimism is also contrasted with realism which is what many fans of sports teams lack and I'm going to talk about it no matter what site I'm on.

 

I can say what I want on this message board like everybody else. That's the point of this board. We share opinions and defend points when challenged. Just like how people called me out for my post after the Pacer's came back in Wednesday's game.

 

Just like how many people (including yourself) that said there was no way PG was getting traded, I believed the opposite but I guess since there's nothing wrong with being an optimist I shouldn't have argued with you about that point.

 

Message boards are not just here for optimism and you know that very well by just looking in the Colts sections.

[oldunclemark]

6 hours ago, Bluefire4 said:

I value objectivity and I don't care if you're the biggest fan ever of a team you still need to be realistic. 

 

Optimism may be the reverse of pessimism, but optimism is also contrasted with realism which is what many fans of sports teams lack and I'm going to talk about it no matter what site I'm on.

 

I can say what I want on this message board like everybody else. That's the point of this board. We share opinions and defend points when challenged. Just like how people called me out for my post after the Pacer's came back in Wednesday's game.

 

Just like how many people (including yourself) that said there was no way PG was getting traded, I believed the opposite but I guess since there's nothing wrong with being an optimist I shouldn't have argued with you about that point.

 

Message boards are not just here for optimism and you know that very well by just looking in the Colts sections.

You spend 5 sentences here debating something that isn't in debate.

You say your pessimism is objectivity. Fine. You say the Colts portions are more pessimistic. Fine.

As I stated, you are welcome to either pessimism or optimisim but again....but the question still stands.

 

You are on an Indianapolis Pacers portion of an Indianapolis Colts web site....

,.....telling fans of the Indianapolis team how blind and foolish they are to be optimistic about the Indianapolis team.

when they have won a few games in a row..and are unexpectedly over the .500 mark.

 

Why? What purpose does it deserve, What is the end game? 

By your rules,  I can ask you whatever I want on a message board. Right?

So, why bad talk ("stupid, blind')   the fans of a team that's winning a few games? I can tell its a hard question for you and you can avoid it if you want to.

But still,  why?  Honestly, what do you get out of it.?

 

I'm rooting for the Pacers tonight against Cleveland and I am optimistic think they can win..

I think a few of us are

...I hope that doesnt upset you again that we're being 'blind' and 'stupid'.

Edited December 8, 2017 by oldunclemark
spell

[oldunclemark]

10 hours ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

When my whole point to begin with was how Vic is a better player this season then it's pretty important. who cares what conference he's in vic is better this year better scorer better leader and more clutch end of story mark 

..and you can say Victor is better than Paul.   I dont disagree 'this season'

But why call the Pacers fans blind and stupid because the don't agree...

 

.....Is that objective?

 

[oldunclemark]

18 hours ago, BullsColtsFan1 said:

Weren't you one of the fans not keen on Oladipo when George got traded?  Maybe I am wrong(I know a lot of fans weren't keen on him).  I told all you guys from the start that he'd be a stud.  His stats are identical to Paul George's from last year.  Oladipo, Sabonis and Turner are 3 good building pieces.  Need a stud small forward and maybe a better point guard, but Collison has been solid this year.  Pacers are fun to watch.  I am glad they came back and beat my worthless Bulls, Bulls need to have that #1 pick lol. 

I don't think the Bulls will get the No.1 pick because they have injured players coming back and they're going to win some games.

But, as we saw last year, there's not much difference between the No1 and numbers 1-thru-5.

 

But they dominated the Pacers and then folded....Its hard times up here for the Bulls

[Colts_Fan12]

11 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

..and you can say Victor is better than Paul.   I dont disagree 'this season'

But why call the Pacers fans blind and stupid because the don't agree...

 

.....Is that objective?

 

What are you even taking about I haven't said that once. your getting mixed up with your posts with bluefire

[oldunclemark]

21 hours ago, Bluefire4 said:

Optimism is blind and pessimism is annoying.

 

Objectivity is accurate. I think we make the playoffs as a 7 or 8 seed or we are one of the first teams out of the playoffs. That is objective. Top 4 seed is blind optimism.

 

I mean you should know optimism is blind with all of the constant excuses you made for last year's team up until the moment they blew the whole thing up after only a year. 

And you should know pessimism after you said we got robbed on the Paul George trade when we got two solid  players including an all-star.

 So your objectvity/pessimism was 100% blind, right?

You an admit it.    Its okay.

 

 

[RockThatBlue]

On 12/7/2017 at 3:59 AM, oldunclemark said:

Bottom line...we stole this game

We did but good teams steal games like that. We probably don't win this game a year ago. 

[BullsColtsFan1]

20 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Yeah look at the bright side, you may end up with the #1 pick. I wasn't keen on the trade I admit but we haven't lost any production with Dipo + Sabonis has been a nice surprise. I like Bogs as well, he is the type of player every team needs = deadly from 3 like a Korver or Redick. Turner isn't All-Star but he is solid Good. I think Dipo will make the All-Star team, if he doesn't something is wrong.

I agree with you!  I still think you guys need a stud small forward.  You get one of those and your team will be right there.  There is absolutely no way Oladipo doesn't make the all star team if he continues to average 23 5 and 5.  I am hoping the Bulls get the #1 pick, but the problem still exists(the front office).  I wish they would get fired.  It's tough to watch the Bulls this year.  I pretty much watch games occasionally and check the box scores.  I root for Lauri, Valentine and Dunn to put up good numbers because the team is awful lol.  I may tune in a little more when LaVine comes back. 

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, BullsColtsFan1 said:

I agree with you!  I still think you guys need a stud small forward.  You get one of those and your team will be right there.  There is absolutely no way Oladipo doesn't make the all star team if he continues to average 23 5 and 5.  I am hoping the Bulls get the #1 pick, but the problem still exists(the front office).  I wish they would get fired.  It's tough to watch the Bulls this year.  I pretty much watch games occasionally and check the box scores.  I root for Lauri, Valentine and Dunn to put up good numbers because the team is awful lol.  I may tune in a little more when LaVine comes back. 

Sooner or later ESPN and NBA.com are going to have to give Oladipo some attention. After the Pacer game over the Bulls later that late evening I was curious as to what was being said about the Pacers on Sportscenter so tuned in. I sat there the whole hour waiting for the Pacer highlights but the Pacer-Bulls game wasn't even mentioned. I understand we are a small market but c-mon.  Even on the all star talk Oladipos name wasn't even mentioned. I just figured the game would be covered along with the other NBA games.

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Sooner or later ESPN and NBA.com are going to have to give Oladipo some attention. After the Pacer game over the Bulls later that late evening I was curious as to what was being said about the Pacers on Sportscenter so tuned in. I sat there the whole hour waiting for the Pacer highlights but the Pacer-Bulls game wasn't even mentioned. I understand we are a small market but c-mon.  Even on the all star talk Oladipos name wasn't even mentioned. I just figured the game would be covered along with the other NBA games.

If we beat the Cavs tonight and end their streak and Dipo puts up 30, they will have no choice to give us attention then.

[crazycolt1]

3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

If we beat the Cavs tonight and end their streak and Dipo puts up 30, they will have no choice to give us attention then.

Tough to do but not out of the question.

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, crazycolt1 said:

Tough to do but not out of the question.

I think it will take that type of win by us and Dipo playing great against an elite team before the media takes us serious. Right now ESPN and the media are looking at us as a nice story, an over achieving team but cant hang with the Elite teams in the East like the Cavs, Celtics, etc..

[Myles]

26 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I think it will take that type of win by us and Dipo playing great against an elite team before the media takes us serious. Right now ESPN and the media are looking at us as a nice story, an over achieving team but cant hang with the Elite teams in the East like the Cavs, Celtics, etc..

I agree.   I don't blame the national media for not paying much attention to the Pacers beating the Bulls.   The 7th best team in the East beating the worst team in the East.    Not really much to say about it. 

[Bluefire4]

5 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

You spend 5 sentences here debating something that isn't in debate.

You say your pessimism is objectivity. Fine. You say the Colts portions are more pessimistic. Fine.

As I stated, you are welcome to either pessimism or optimisim but again....but the question still stands.

 

You are on an Indianapolis Pacers portion of an Indianapolis Colts web site....

,.....telling fans of the Indianapolis team how blind and foolish they are to be optimistic about the Indianapolis team.

when they have won a few games in a row..and are unexpectedly over the .500 mark.

 

Why? What purpose does it deserve, What is the end game? 

By your rules,  I can ask you whatever I want on a message board. Right?

So, why bad talk ("stupid, blind')   the fans of a team that's winning a few games? I can tell its a hard question for you and you can avoid it if you want to.

But still,  why?  Honestly, what do you get out of it.?

 

I'm rooting for the Pacers tonight against Cleveland and I am optimistic think they can win..

I think a few of us are

...I hope that doesnt upset you again that we're being 'blind' and 'stupid'.

You are putting words in my mouth like you do on here every time you try and argue with people just like last year with the Paul George trade situation.

 

I said the fans that think we will be a top 4 seed are blind, not fans that like the team's future and not fans who think we have a shot at the playoffs. 

 

If I called them stupid than I shouldn't have but I do not remember saying stupid. I said blind which was not trying to insult people, it was just saying their love for the team had transcended realistic expectations. If you find where I said stupid then quote it to me, but if not there's another instance of you putting words in my mouth.

 

I'm not a troll. I'm not only here to laugh at the Pacers when they lose. I am here for the good and the bad. I share my honest opinions and debate people like you are suppose to. 

 

My overall point was that most of the "optimists" Colts and Pacers fans expect too much and then overreact at the end of the season and want to get rid of coaches, players, executives etc. How many wanted to get rid of Nate McMillan last year after that disappointing season? Now he's looking like a coach of the year candidate.

[Bluefire4]

5 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

And you should know pessimism after you said we got robbed on the Paul George trade when we got two solid  players including an all-star.

 So your objectvity/pessimism was 100% blind, right?

You an admit it.    Its okay.

 

 

First of all, you said yourself that you had no idea Oladipo would be an all star. If we only got two solid players in exchange for a superstar, it's a dumb trade. Oladipo's emergence made it a good trade.

 

Secondly if you want to call that pessimistic than that is fine. I've never claimed to be 100% right about anything. I'm just saying I am one of many who thought that trade was bad so that is not being blind.

 

The Pacers being a top 4 seed is blind and that is all my original post was talking about; not that it was delusional to think the Pacers would be good or make the playoffs.

 

If a Browns fan came up to me before the season talking about how their team was going to make the playoffs, I'd say they were a blind optimist as well. 

 

For me Pacers top 4 seed=Browns playoffs. Some think different. We will see.

[BullsColtsFan1]

3 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Sooner or later ESPN and NBA.com are going to have to give Oladipo some attention. After the Pacer game over the Bulls later that late evening I was curious as to what was being said about the Pacers on Sportscenter so tuned in. I sat there the whole hour waiting for the Pacer highlights but the Pacer-Bulls game wasn't even mentioned. I understand we are a small market but c-mon.  Even on the all star talk Oladipos name wasn't even mentioned. I just figured the game would be covered along with the other NBA games.

Yea he should be an all star for sure.  I watched him a lot in college and watched him a lot (1 time in person) in Orlando and quite a bit in OKC.  He's a really good player.  Hopefully Indy can lock him up when he becomes a free agent. 

[crazycolt1]

2 hours ago, Bluefire4 said:

First of all, you said yourself that you had no idea Oladipo would be an all star. If we only got two solid players in exchange for a superstar, it's a dumb trade. Oladipo's emergence made it a good trade.

 

Secondly if you want to call that pessimistic than that is fine. I've never claimed to be 100% right about anything. I'm just saying I am one of many who thought that trade was bad so that is not being blind.

 

The Pacers being a top 4 seed is blind and that is all my original post was talking about; not that it was delusional to think the Pacers would be good or make the playoffs.

 

If a Browns fan came up to me before the season talking about how their team was going to make the playoffs, I'd say they were a blind optimist as well. 

 

For me Pacers top 4 seed=Browns playoffs. Some think different. We will see.

What you took from what one or two forum member said and then turned it into all of us being blind is exactly how your impression came off. Most all but a couple said we could compete with pretty much anyone in the league only if star was traded for or signed. I even added in the owner of the Pacers will have to go over the cap for that to happen. There lies the problem. We have an owner who hasn't went over the cap and the Pacers are only one of eight teams under the cap. Our owner does not seem to agree to pay the NBA to win a championship.

Right now the Bulls have the cheapest owner in the league and their record shows it.

Not every team was able to have a super star on their roster like Jordan did for the Bulls. He was grossly under paid for years while the Bulls reaped the rewards of that.

[Bluefire4]

45 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

What you took from what one or two forum member said and then turned it into all of us being blind is exactly how your impression came off. Most all but a couple said we could compete with pretty much anyone in the league only if star was traded for or signed. I even added in the owner of the Pacers will have to go over the cap for that to happen. There lies the problem. We have an owner who hasn't went over the cap and the Pacers are only one of eight teams under the cap. Our owner does not seem to agree to pay the NBA to win a championship.

Right now the Bulls have the cheapest owner in the league and their record shows it.

Not every team was able to have a super star on their roster like Jordan did for the Bulls. He was grossly under paid for years while the Bulls reaped the rewards of that.

If it came off that way to you than whatever. I never said everybody. I wasn't even talking about people on here solely. I have a life outside of this forum where sports are discussed. 

 

But it looks like we are in the same boat, we have a bright future but cannot compete with the best teams this year. My original point wasn't aimed at people with this viewpoint.

[crazycolt1]

12 minutes ago, Bluefire4 said:

If it came off that way to you than whatever. I never said everybody. I wasn't even talking about people on here solely. I have a life outside of this forum where sports are discussed. 

 

But it looks like we are in the same boat, we have a bright future but cannot compete with the best teams this year. My original point wasn't aimed at people with this viewpoint.

We all have lives outside of this forum. What exactly does that have to do with anything?

Look, you come into this Colts-Pacer forum and start by telling us we are blind if we think the Pacers will do anything in the playoffs. What do you expect? You got the responses you were looking for.

[Bluefire4]

1 minute ago, crazycolt1 said:

We all have lives outside of this forum. What exactly does that have to do with anything?

Look, you come into this Colts-Pacer forum and start by telling us we are blind if we think the Pacers will do anything in the playoffs. What do you expect? You got the responses you were looking for.

I said top 4 seed! But OK I'm done talking about this crap.

[Bluefire4]

If we want to beat this team we definitely cannot let them out rebound us. It's not a good look for Crowder to get offensive rebounds.

[Colts_Fan12]

32 minutes ago, Bluefire4 said:

If we want to beat this team we definitely cannot let them out rebound us. It's not a good look for Crowder to get offensive rebounds.

They don't box out worth a crap 

[Colts_Fan12]

Offensive basket interference is the dumbest thing ever invinted

[crazycolt1]

53 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Offensive basket interference is the dumbest thing ever invinted

How do you figure that?

[oldunclemark]

11 hours ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

What are you even taking about I haven't said that once. your getting mixed up with your posts with bluefire

When the debate switches from..I'm making the argument..to I agree with him but I didn't say what he said..

 

...well..that's what I'm talking about when I say 'understand the message board'

[oldunclemark]

11 hours ago, RockThatBlue said:

We did but good teams steal games like that. We probably don't win this game a year ago. 

Gotta steal some