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Dontari Poe scheduled to visit

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masnerj

masnerj 177

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As most have mentioned, Poe is certainly a risk. However, I trust Ballard as well and especially considering that he was in KC last year I think he will do the right thing. Remember, Ballard has stayed conservative so far in free agency even while targeting top notch free agents. No reason to think he is going to change overnight and sign the guy to a 5 year, 50 million deal. 

 

IF we sign him (which we might not at all), I see a 1 or 2 year prove it type deal that might pay him like 8-9+ BUT it gives us flexibility in terms of being able to cut him after a year or two and not be hurt too much. I would bet money that Ballard will NOT sign the guy to a long term deal where we can't cut him with limited penalty after a year or two. #InBallardWeTrust

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richard pallo

richard pallo 2,972

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22 minutes ago, IinD said:

Another route which I think wouldn't be an insult to Poe is paying him top $$ for two years, but drafting his replacement in rd 1 in this or next draft. 

 

You'd at least be able to allow the young fellow to rotate in and gain confidence before he becomes the man in year 3...just throwing that out there as a possible plan.

 

But no chance I'd be throwing out a 4/5 year type deal.

I'm thinking 3yr. 27M 40% guaranteed.

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IinD

IinD 2,959

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8 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

I'm thinking 3yr. 27M 40% guaranteed.

Would be nice to have a toilet clogger and a force in the middle. We haven't had many over the years. So tired of the light and quick blueprint. 

 

I'd love to get our Wilfork/Siragusa type guy in the middle. We've been soft up the middle for what seems like forever.

 

Also in all honesty if they feel ok with going long-term with him, we're not looking at any huge contracts in the next few years. This team is going to be very young with no big money contracts to cause cap problems.

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AZColt11

AZColt11 1,828

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14 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Likely a Microdiscectomy

 

 

Probably a Microdiscectomy (As opposed to an Endoscopic Discectomy)

 

 

Well, maybe not so much for an NFL player; notably a 350 lb lineman.  What is true is many NFL players in the trenches have herniated discs.  But typically the severity  isn't enough for the player to opt for surgical intervention. Often these resolve themselves with rest too.  (Offseason self repair). And whether they play through it or opt to have intervention, most athletes have an immense capacity to overcome adversity and work through it or the surgery recovery and function at a near normal ability. But just because a guy is 350 pounds doesn’t mean the structure of his spine is twice as big as that of a 175-pound guy. And there's an issue about core strength as two guys or more are pushing on him, and it’s hard on the lower back.

 

This timetable from Dr. Chao seems reasonable to me-

 

“My guess is, the first month (of rehab) — and I haven’t examined him — is more about pain (control), swelling and edema control and trying to maintain a little bit of baseline fitness,” Dr. Chao said. “And the next month is more transitioning into some good, hard rehab. And perhaps the last month, the third month, is (working on) football muscles, football shape, getting field work.”

 

A good while back I explained about the jelly donut, between the vertebra (shock absorber) and the jelly filling getting squished and is leaking out of the donut.  That stuff (nucleus pulposus) is very inflammatory and they have to get that and any protruding material.  The recovery/rehab is as above. I expect if he slowly ramps up his fitness routine this spring, he should not be hindered from his procedure at all getting in football shape and performing well. Mind you, he did not get a new shock absorber, just had his repaired.  Any degeneration (wear and tear) is still there, it's just not 'broken' like it was before the surgery.

 

I would do more than a one year deal for Poe if his base salary was slightly under market value and Likely to be Earned incentives bring the potential pay at or even just over market value.  That way, we pay for results, not expectations.  The better he plays, the more we pays.  Win - Win.

Great explanation!  I think I was back to normal in about 8 weeks.  But as you said I'm not a 350 lb NFL lineman with guys pushing on me either.  I would think 3 months perhaps would be reasonable for a guy like this though, especially at his age (I'm in my 40's).  So I would assume he would be a quick healer.

 

The part that I find concerning is a lot of these seem to be done as a result of problems going down to the leg(s), which is when I decided to have mine done.  So I would be concerned about loss of muscle strength in the leg for him.  But perhaps it was just to alleviate pain, IDK.

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AZColt11

AZColt11 1,828

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I'm good either way.  Ballard seems to have a good head on his shoulders and he would know Poe as well as anybody outside of Kansas City.  So I figure if he's worth signing, he won't leave the Colts facility.  If he does, then Ballard knows more than we do and he wasn't worth it.  

 

I'm at ease either way.  But I don't mind saying that I HOPE he is worth it and is signed.  He would fill a large hole on this team, both figuratively and literally.

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Jesse Lafantaisie

Jesse Lafantaisie 28

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On 3/10/2017 at 10:13 PM, Beizy317 said:

Pay the man 8-10 million all guaranteed with 2 more million in incentives. 2 year contract. With the second year being a team option for 12-13 million year (if he pans out to be what we expect). And if he does pans out, give him a the contract he deserves.

ah if only signing a NFL player or any athlete to such a deal was this easy. Dude is 26 yrs old #11 overall in 2012. He signed a 4yr/11.3 previously. Hes going to likely be looking for a 4-5 year deal. Would be awesome to get the contract above but never going to happen.

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Jesse Lafantaisie

Jesse Lafantaisie 28

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26 minutes ago, AZColt11 said:

I'm good either way.  Ballard seems to have a good head on his shoulders and he would know Poe as well as anybody outside of Kansas City.  So I figure if he's worth signing, he won't leave the Colts facility.  If he does, then Ballard knows more than we do and he wasn't worth it.  

 

I'm at ease either way.  But I don't mind saying that I HOPE he is worth it and is signed.  He would fill a large hole on this team, both figuratively and literally.

Also possible he doesn't want to risk spending the money on him if he doesn't sign with Colts. If ballard though he wasn't worth signing he wouldn't be visiting in the first place.

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RockThatBlue

RockThatBlue 8,434

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7 hours ago, AZColt11 said:

I'm good either way.  Ballard seems to have a good head on his shoulders and he would know Poe as well as anybody outside of Kansas City.  So I figure if he's worth signing, he won't leave the Colts facility.  If he does, then Ballard knows more than we do and he wasn't worth it.  

 

I'm at ease either way.  But I don't mind saying that I HOPE he is worth it and is signed.  He would fill a large hole on this team, both figuratively and literally.

I agree. Even with the risk, he is easily better than any other NG on our team. I hope Ballard reels him in.

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Crunked

Crunked 429

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Poe for me is not a superstar, and not a JAG.....but somewhere better than a JAG, and short of a super star. At any rate a vast improvement over what we have. As long as his pay is commensurate with his talent level, I would be happy to have him. If we can somehow get Butler in the fold, it looks like the Colts draft list is going to be much clearer position wise Pass rush/LB'er  DB's/S on defense. RB, OT/OG, TE/WR on offense.......

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CR91

CR91 10,773

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ESPN NFL Insider Josina Anderson reported that owner Jim Irsay may send his private jet to pick up Poe. If so, Irsay likely doesn't plan to have the defensive lineman leave Indianapolis without completing a deal.

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csmopar

csmopar 10,251

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Which could be a bad thing....... given his back issues.  Dont get me wrong, I want Poe, but I only want him with some health related incentives too that give us an out if they turn out to be worse than publicly known

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CR91

CR91 10,773

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1 minute ago, csmopar said:

Which could be a bad thing....... given his back issues.  Dont get me wrong, I want Poe, but I only want him with some health related incentives too that give us an out if they turn out to be worse than publicly known

 

obviously the team doctor will give him a physical before any talks of a deal is even started

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csmopar

csmopar 10,251

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1 minute ago, CR91 said:

 

obviously the team doctor will give him a physical before any talks of a deal is even started

i know but most physicals dont consists of MRIs to actually see the damage.....

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CR91

CR91 10,773

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1 minute ago, csmopar said:

i know but most physicals dont consists of MRIs to actually see the damage.....

 

wouldnt ballard know first hand the servery of poe's back issues from his time in KC

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Fisticuffs111

Fisticuffs111 2,436

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At first I was worried about signing Poe long term, still am if we're just talking about his injury/his play the past year or two, but I'm not so worried because of the money aspect of it.

It's not like Ballard has to worry about re-signing too much young defensive talent any time soon. Geathers and Anderson, I guess. But Poe would be at least halfway through his deal by then probably. Plus there's usually an out to those huge contracts by at least year 3.

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bananabucket

bananabucket 903

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On 3/12/2017 at 11:05 AM, backshoulderfade said:

Just seen that. Hopefully bodes well for us. In spite of all the potential issues, it is so exciting having a player with that kind of upside in the house.

 

Even if he ends up being 50% of what we think we're getting, it's better than what we have now lol

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ColtsBlueFL

ColtsBlueFL 7,507

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9 hours ago, AZColt11 said:

Great explanation!  I think I was back to normal in about 8 weeks.  But as you said I'm not a 350 lb NFL lineman with guys pushing on me either.  I would think 3 months perhaps would be reasonable for a guy like this though, especially at his age (I'm in my 40's).  So I would assume he would be a quick healer.

 

The part that I find concerning is a lot of these seem to be done as a result of problems going down to the leg(s), which is when I decided to have mine done.  So I would be concerned about loss of muscle strength in the leg for him.  But perhaps it was just to alleviate pain, IDK.

 

The timeline Dr. Chao gave is right in line with what you experienced.  You said 8 weeks.  Dr. Chao said 4 weeks for pain/swelling, and 4 weeks hard rehab/recovery (get in shape and normal routines). Seems you both hit that target.  Good for you, and Poe (assuming he has).  The third month is getting on the football field and working on the muscle groups these elite athletes use in their weekly practice/game day responsibilites.  These are the items that allow them to play this game so much better than the rest of us.  They have to recover that ability too.  Again, some atrletes go through the process faster than others do  (Adrian Peterson ACL anyone?)

 

But it is important for everyone to remember, recovery is more like 0-60 times in a car (acceleration), not like a light switch (off, then on instantly).  Some are quicker healers than others, but nobody heals instantly.  Which makes me laugh about something else I see, and Dr. Chao summed up my feelings about fantastically recent;y.  Having someone announce a surgical procedure a success immediately post operation is like declaring your draft choice a success right after choosing him. :jump:  Ok, maybe just medical humor, but I got a chuckle...

 

49 minutes ago, csmopar said:

i know but most physicals dont consists of MRIs to actually see the damage.....

 

That may or may not be true.  On the other hand, how do we know Poe hasn't had (any) follow up MRI's performed since his procedure?  In addition, If there were issues or complications apparent at any time (And I see no reason that there were, either), wouldn't one have been ordered as a post OP check?  These tests and records are readily available to Indy's medical team, without question.  Ballard won't be in the dark...

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Defjamz26

Defjamz26 4,760

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25 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

At first I was worried about signing Poe long term, still am if we're just talking about his injury/his play the past year or two, but I'm not so worried because of the money aspect of it.

It's not like Ballard has to worry about re-signing too much young defensive talent any time soon. Geathers and Anderson, I guess. But Poe would be at least halfway through his deal by then probably. Plus there's usually an out to those huge contracts by at least year 3.

Precisely. There's a bunch of future cap room due to the lack of talent. There isn't a player who we'd have to break the bank for either unless Geathers or Anderson just smash through their ceilings. Poe would be fine.

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AZColt11

AZColt11 1,828

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18 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

The timeline Dr. Chao gave is right in line with what you experienced.  You said 8 weeks.  Dr. Chao said 4 weeks for pain/swelling, and 4 weeks hard rehab/recovery (get in shape and normal routines). Seems you both hit that target.  Good for you, and Poe (assuming he has).  The third month is getting on the football field and working on the muscle groups these elite athletes use in their weekly practice/game day responsibilites.  These are the items that allow them to play this game so much better than the rest of us.  They have to recover that ability too.  Again, some atrletes go through the process faster than others do  (Adrian Peterson ACL anyone?)

 

But it is important for everyone to remember, recovery is more like 0-60 times in a car (acceleration), not like a light switch (off, then on instantly).  Some are quicker healers than others, but nobody heals instantly.  Which makes me laugh about something else I see, and Dr. Chao summed up my feelings about fantastically recent;y.  Having someone announce a surgical procedure a success immediately post operation is like declaring your draft choice a success right after choosing him. :jump:  Ok, maybe just medical humor, but I got a chuckle...

 

 

That may or may not be true.  On the other hand, how do we know Poe hasn't had (any) follow up MRI's performed since his procedure?  In addition, If there were issues or complications apparent at any time (And I see no reason that there were, either), wouldn't one have been ordered as a post OP check?  These tests and records are readily available to Indy's medical team, without question.  Ballard won't be in the dark...

Yeah I was lucky.  I actually felt immediate relief after surgery.  And the healing time, even though I'm "over the hill" wasn't too bad.  I got back to the gym on a light basis about 8 weeks after, which is when my doc said I could and no problems since (mine was 2014).  

 

Yeah I would agree that Ballard would most likely already have medical info he would need.  How many of these high dollar athletes do you think DON'T have some kind of follow-up well after the surgery just to be sure it is healing correctly?  Like ZERO.  They all do of course.  The only question would be if he has re-injured it since (was done in 2015).  I'm not in the know but I would suspect most of these guys also get routine "check-ups" for known issues in the off-season as well just to make sure they haven't re-injured a known issue.  And I would assume Poe is no different.  And if everything is OK, and the interest is mutual, then there is really no reason he doesn't sign with Indy.

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BlueShoe

BlueShoe 3,904

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It is always possible we talk him into a 1-year deal (which has become popular), but I think we are looking at a long term deal here. 

 

I am thinking 5 years and 75 million (first two years - 30 million - guaranteed).

 

Just my two cents of how this might turn out. 

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WoolMagnet

WoolMagnet 4,943

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1 hour ago, CR91 said:

ESPN NFL Insider Josina Anderson reported that owner Jim Irsay may send his private jet to pick up Poe. If so, Irsay likely doesn't plan to have the defensive lineman leave Indianapolis without completing a deal.

Anyone else think Josina Anderson looks like the joker ?

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