Colts noise?

[CheezyColt]

Wouldn't it be smarter to grab lower cost free agents this year (the year that the 2013 draft class, widely regarded as weak, is coming off of their rookie contracts) and save that money to sign some players from the "better" 2014 class next year?  We also didn't have a first rounder that year so here's our chance,  (I guess excluding those first rounders who have 5th year options picked up)

[Jason_]

6 minutes ago, jameszeigler834 said:

League rules state you have to spend a certain percentage of the cap every season so we will have to sign somebody to a deal at some point.

 

[#12.]

Don't worry, Chuck will coach up and get the most out of the guys we have.

[Vinatieri4]

6 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

No they don't.

 

The 89% rule does not apply to a single season, but rather a span of four years. Therefore, it doesn't matter if the Colts  spend less than 89% in 2017, or if they spend less than 89% in 2018. By the end of the 2020 season, though, the cumulative spending from 2017-2020 must be at least 89%. Therefore, if the Colts spend very little in 2017 and 2018, in order to meet the requirement in 2020, they would have been basically forced to spend a lot of money in 2019 and 2020.

[jvan1973]

Just now, Vinatieri4 said:

 

The 89% rule does not apply to a single season, but rather a span of four years. Therefore, it doesn't matter if the Colts  spend less than 89% in 2017, or if they spend less than 89% in 2018. By the end of the 2020 season, though, the cumulative spending from 2017-2020 must be at least 89%. Therefore, if the Colts spend very little in 2017 and 2018, in order to meet the requirement in 2020, they would have been basically forced to spend a lot of money in 2019 and 2020.

That's what superman has been trying to explain

[#12.]

2 minutes ago, CheezyColt said:

Wouldn't it be smarter to grab lower cost free agents this year (the year that the 2013 draft class, widely regarded as weak, is coming off of their rookie contracts) and save that money to sign some players from the "better" 2014 class next year?  We also didn't have a first rounder that year so here's our chance,  (I guess excluding those first rounders who have 5th year options picked up)

 

I doubt there was any concrete plan - srtictly adhering to the Green Bay model, looking toward next year or whatever.  Ballard looked at some players and was outbid.  I'm sure he'll sign someone.

[Shive]

11 minutes ago, jameszeigler834 said:

League rules state you have to spend a certain percentage of the cap every season so we will have to sign somebody to a deal at some point.

I'd listen to Superman. He's by far the most knowledgeable on this forum when it comes to the salary cap and how it all works.

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, Vinatieri4 said:

 

The 89% rule does not apply to a single season, but rather a span of four years. Therefore, it doesn't matter if the Colts  spend less than 89% in 2017, or if they spend less than 89% in 2018. By the end of the 2020 season, though, the cumulative spending from 2017-2020 must be at least 89%. Therefore, if the Colts spend very little in 2017 and 2018, in order to meet the requirement in 2020, they would have been basically forced to spend a lot of money in 2019 and 2020.

 

I'm glad you get it.

 

I'll add two other things: 1) It's cash spending, so your signing bonuses over those years will count toward the 89%, even if they're prorated to years beyond 2020;

 

2) Even if you don't meet the 89% floor, you're not forced to sign anyone. You just have to cut a check to the union. I'd rather spend the money on players than send it to the union just for accounting purposes.

 

In all, I don't think a well run team will be making decisions for the sake of meeting the 89% floor. Draft well, keep your own, dabble in free agency, and the 89% will take care of itself. 

[OffensivelyPC]

6 minutes ago, Colts1324 said:

I agree to an extent. I'm not asking the colts to pay someone 30 million dollars. But if you want a good player, you have to pay for them. Hightower, Poe, Williams, Wagner, Jeffery(I would have offered 3,36 million) and Gilmore were all worth what they got IMO. 

You are confusing two different principles. He got paid market value based on what he has done prior to today. He has yet to prove that he is worth that deal and I can't do that until he set foot on the field with his new team. But at the end of the day players often don't live up to Big contracts when it is with a different team.

[jvan1973]

Just now, Superman said:

 

I'm glad you get it.

 

I'll add two other things: 1) It's cash spending, so your signing bonuses over those years will count toward the 89%, even if they're prorated to years beyond 2020;

 

2) Even if you don't meet the 89% floor, you're not forced to sign anyone. You just have to cut a check to the union. I'd rather spend the money on players than send it to the union just for accounting purposes.

 

In all, I don't think a well run team will be making decisions for the sake of meeting the 89% floor. Draft well, keep your own, dabble in free agency, and the 89% will take care of itself. 

If they have to cut a check to three union,  What happens to that money?  I didn't know about that.   Why would a team ever let that happen

[Superman]

1 minute ago, Shive said:

I'd listen to Superman. He's by far the most knowledgeable on this forum when it comes to the salary cap and how it all works.

 

Thank you for the kind words. I'm not a guru, I just do research.

 

And to your point about listening to other people, it was two posters on this very site -- back in 2012 when the Manning stuff was getting ready to happen -- that helped me get a good handle on the way the cap works. Since then, I've been a junkie, but without those two guys, who don't even post here anymore, I probably wouldn't understand what I do about the cap. 

[Superman]

Just now, jvan1973 said:

If they have to cut a check to three union,  What happens to that money?  I didn't know about that.   Why would a team ever let that happen

 

I believe it gets distributed evenly to the players who were on the roster during that period. It's a waste, for sure.

[OLD FAN MAN]

,i trust ballard to put a winning team on the field next season, i am trying to be patient and watch him work his magic

[Shive]

1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

Thank you for the kind words. I'm not a guru, I just do research.

 

And to your point about listening to other people, it was two posters on this very site -- back in 2012 when the Manning stuff was getting ready to happen -- that helped me get a good handle on the way the cap works. Since then, I've been a junkie, but without those two guys, who don't even post here anymore, I probably wouldn't understand what I do about the cap. 

I appreciate those that take time to learn then post thought out, insightful information instead of blurting nonsense. I remember there was one guy in particular that was an absolute whiz, but can't place the name to save my life.

[OffensivelyPC]

6 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Thank you for the kind words. I'm not a guru, I just do research.

 

And to your point about listening to other people, it was two posters on this very site -- back in 2012 when the Manning stuff was getting ready to happen -- that helped me get a good handle on the way the cap works. Since then, I've been a junkie, but without those two guys, who don't even post here anymore, I probably wouldn't understand what I do about the cap. 

It is a shame that those two guys don't frequent. It would have been right before I joined. By the way you know who else I haven't seen much of lately, especially in terms of prospect scouting reports is Dustin. It's like he finally got what he wanted when Grigson got fired and then he disappeared.

[deedub75]

Look where Ballard came from. He will more than likely not make a big splash in free agency.  I'm not sure we will even have a very competitive team next season. I expect us to get our players through the draft and sign some lower level free agents and try to groom them for the future. Ballard is going to be the anti-Grigs and build this team the right way. 

[Superman]

12 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

It is a shame that those two guys don't frequent. It would have been right before I joined. By the way you know who else I haven't seen much of lately, especially in terms of prospect scouting reports is Dustin. It's like he finally got what he wanted when Grigson got fired and then he disappeared.

 

They knew their stuff. I wish they still posted.

 

As for Dustin, I'm sure he's been busy. He was less and less frequent last year as the season went on. I like how he showed up to post the Grigson news, though.

[Shive]

9 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

It is a shame that those two guys don't frequent. It would have been right before I joined. By the way you know who else I haven't seen much of lately, especially in terms of prospect scouting reports is Dustin. It's like he finally got what he wanted when Grigson got fired and then he disappeared.

I just remember freshly being on the forums and having my mind blown by one dude talking about the the cap, contract structure, and all of the intricacies.

 

I've been wondering where Dustin has been. He was huge on the scouting side and I really miss his insight..

[rockywoj]

1 hour ago, Track Guy said:

With Zeitler, Leary, and Worford already off the market... Lang is still there but reportedly being pursued by Seattle and Detroit (no mention of the Colts). I'm worried about our O-line again. No upgrade? Seriously? So we're rolling in with the 2 relatively unproven second year guys on the right side inked in starters? Don't like it. 

I was disappointed the Colts didn't go for Chance Warmack.  I will be really interested to see how he performs for the Eagles to see if I was right or wrong about him.

[jvan1973]

5 minutes ago, Shive said:

I just remember freshly being on the forums and having my mind blown by one dude talking about the the cap, contract structure, and all of the intricacies.

 

I've been wondering where Dustin has been. He was huge on the scouting side and I really miss his insight..

He will be around when the draft is approaching I hope.

[colts52761]

DJ  Fluker?

[coltsfanmilyman]

31 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Thank you for the kind words. I'm not a guru, I just do research.

 

And to your point about listening to other people, it was two posters on this very site -- back in 2012 when the Manning stuff was getting ready to happen -- that helped me get a good handle on the way the cap works. Since then, I've been a junkie, but without those two guys, who don't even post here anymore, I probably wouldn't understand what I do about the cap. 

I remember them too.  Everybody would come to them with cap related questions.  They would break it down in normal terms too.  i'll think of their names randomly sometime while i'm at work this week and post em

[Shive]

5 minutes ago, colts52761 said:

DJ  Fluker?

Only on a vet minimum deal. He's been absolutely terrible, but I'd take a flier for a dirt cheap contract.

[coltsfanmilyman]

It funny how yesterday we made moves and everybody was so happy, now that "nothing" is being said people are chomping at the bit questioning whats going on.  Its like this every season though.  I'd rather be prudent then be like the browns or jags and win free agency every year.

 

I feel like we are going back to the ways of Polian (in a sense) less big splashes and more building from the draft.  Polian did good things that way.

[Superman]

4 minutes ago, coltsfanmilyman said:

I remember them too.  Everybody would come to them with cap related questions.  They would break it down in normal terms too.  i'll think of their names randomly sometime while i'm at work this week and post em

 

I remember their names, I just decided not to post them, for reasons. 

[dgambill]

I don't know why people expect us to sign all these big name free agents. Look at the two quietest teams today. KC and Indy....coincidence. We will sign mid tier guys to friendly deals. Get our guys back we like and draft well. After we draft well we will reward those guys with franchise contracts. Not sure what the cap floor is but we are certainly over it...we can roll this money forward if we like. We aren't going to benefit paying premium prices for a used car. The draft is how this guy will be evaluated. That's all that matters to me.

[funktacious2]

Yep, things are quiet, but there is still time. I doubt we come away with just re-signing Doyle. Let's have some patience.

[Coltsfanforlife12]

1 hour ago, austriancolt said:

I'm just wondering how Ballard want to fix all that holes in the Colts roster. I'm not a fan of overpaying for players in free agency but relying on some average free agents and just hoping to nail the draft is what we had the last years.

The route Ballard is taken is a more well thought out approach than Grigson.  Grigson went for the "splash" free agent signings and ended up signing crap!  Ballard is signing people to deals that will expire when we want to resign our own.  

[Coltsfanforlife12]

2 minutes ago, funktacious2 said:

Yep, things are quiet, but there is still time. I doubt we come away with just re-signing Doyle. Let's have some patience.

There will be other signings and possibly some extensions done this year.  It's an NFL mandate that you have to spend a certain percentage of the cap.

[Coltsfanforlife12]

2 minutes ago, funktacious2 said:

Yep, things are quiet, but there is still time. I doubt we come away with just re-signing Doyle. Let's have some patience.

There will be other signings and possibly some extensions done this year.  It's an NFL mandate that you have to spend a certain percentage of the cap.

[Track Guy]

Mingo? Great

[OffensivelyPC]

35 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

They knew their stuff. I wish they still posted.

 

As for Dustin, I'm sure he's been busy. He was less and less frequent last year as the season went on. I like how he showed up to post the Grigson news, though.

I definitely noticed that as well LOL. Fitting, really.

[OffensivelyPC]

37 minutes ago, Shive said:

I just remember freshly being on the forums and having my mind blown by one dude talking about the the cap, contract structure, and all of the intricacies.

 

I've been wondering where Dustin has been. He was huge on the scouting side and I really miss his insight..

I know enough about how the salary cap works to hold my own in just about any conversation, but because I've never really done an entire mock offseason with free agent signings, I wouldn't be the one to go to on here when it comes to strategizing an entire group of contracts over the entire offseason and in future years the way of that Superman does.

[Colts1324]

1 hour ago, #12. said:

Don't worry, Chuck will coach up and get the most out of the guys we have.

Lol yeah wish we had a coach like that. 

[Colts1324]

12 minutes ago, Coltsfanforlife12 said:

There will be other signings and possibly some extensions done this year.  It's an NFL mandate that you have to spend a certain percentage of the cap.

Only personal I would consider extending is Mewhort if he signs for around $6.5 million a year. Moncrief won't get extended or we wouldn't of had been trying so hard to get Jeffery.

[Colts1324]

29 minutes ago, coltsfanmilyman said:

It funny how yesterday we made moves and everybody was so happy, now that "nothing" is being said people are chomping at the bit questioning whats going on.  Its like this every season though.  I'd rather be prudent then be like the browns or jags and win free agency every year.

 

I feel like we are going back to the ways of Polian (in a sense) less big splashes and more building from the draft.  Polian did good things that way.

I like that philosophy. But we could at least give Poe a 1 year contract and had given Jeffery a 1 year contract because it won't affect that philosophy. 

[jvan1973]

1 minute ago, Colts1324 said:

I like that philosophy. But we could at least give Poe a 1 year contract and had given Jeffery a 1 year contract because it won't affect that philosophy. 

14 million for jeffrey for one season?   

[Shive]

7 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

I know enough about how the salary cap works to hold my own in just about any conversation, but because I've never really done an entire mock offseason with free agent signings, I wouldn't be the one to go to on here when it comes to strategizing an entire group of contracts over the entire offseason and in future years the way of that Superman does.

I don't even know where to start with contracts, which is probably why I don't do offseason mocks. I love scouting players and doing mock drafts, but contracts just aren't my forte..

[KB]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

Thank you for the kind words. I'm not a guru, I just do research.

 

And to your point about listening to other people, it was two posters on this very site -- back in 2012 when the Manning stuff was getting ready to happen -- that helped me get a good handle on the way the cap works. Since then, I've been a junkie, but without those two guys, who don't even post here anymore, I probably wouldn't understand what I do about the cap. 

Shall we call them Johnathan and Martha Kent, or are they kryptonian Jor-El and Lara? 

[Shive]

4 minutes ago, Colts1324 said:

I like that philosophy. But we could at least give Poe a 1 year contract and had given Jeffery a 1 year contract because it won't affect that philosophy. 

The 14 mil for Jeffery goes directly against what Ballard preached. I'm fine not spending that on an often injured WR.