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How can you deny Tom Brady as the Greatest QB of all time?


chad72

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37 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

You can't argue it.  Brady is the GOAT.

 

Anyone who would argue otherwise is just talking nonsense.

In reality it reached this point with the last Superbowl win, this one just means there is 0% doubt and no logical argument.  It's over guys, unless we want to look like a bunch of crybabies and a classless fanbase(which we aren't), it's just time to give Tom his nod and move on.  

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I don't care if he's the greatest ever or not, but that was much more of a choke than a great comeback.  Brady played bad enough to lose the game, and should have.  Atlanta's 4th quarter situational play calling was the worst I've ever seen.  I have no idea how you manage to lose that game.

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Peyton I think was a better QB, but Brady is definitely the most successful QB in the postseason/playoffs. He'll be regarded as the goat for that though in the media and many fans eyes.

 

Bill Belichick is hands down the goat coach though.

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6 minutes ago, NannyMcafee said:

You can't argue GOAT for a team accomplishment. Peyton is in GOAT discussion for individual stats. Not team stats. Ridiculous. As if the team has nothing to do with winning the SB. Way to give Brady way too much credit. 

The guy is the best big moment player I've ever seen. 4 GW drives in his 5 SB wins. That is beyond comprehension. He is insane

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49 minutes ago, Imrryr said:

Hes good but anyone that has to cheat to get ahead at any point in your career will always be garbage to me.

The only way ill give Brady props is if he leaves New England, joins another team and wins a superbowl. cause until he does that, hell always be a cheater in my books

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Brady is definitely the most accomplished QB, but greatest ever, I'm a little hesitant to say that. Here are a few reasons why...

 

1. He has had the greatest HC of all time for his entire career.

2. His game consists of predominately a short passing game where the scheme creates mismatches and open spaces for his receivers.

3. He has the benefit of possibly the best front office and coaching staff in the NFL.

 

I still say if I'm starting a team from scratch, I'm still taking Peyton over Brady based on Peyton's ability to make any throw and proven ability to play in multiple schemes. (Peyton has gone to the Superbowl with 4 different HCs - Dungy, Caldwell, Fox, Kubiak)

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To be fair, give credit to the great mind that is Bill Belichick once again. He is definitively the engine that makes the Asterisks go. Atlanta couldn't score a damn thing for what...17min? That's not Tom Brady. That's good defensive schemes/play. Brady has been able to benefit from a great defense and a clutch kicker saving his ass any number of times.

 

Also, as for this year, go back and look at the teams the Patriots played to get where they are now. They played a bunch of bums, average-aging QBs, and he plays in the worst division is football. Ok, AFC South is REALLY bad, but AFC East is like 1B. lol

 

Always remember

 

11-5 without Brady

 

and 3-1 this year without him. It's TEAM sport and the Patriots are THE best team. Any above average QB could replace Brady as long as Belichick was still around.

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Brady had the Lebron James style moment cry feast at the end of the game too tonight.

 

I hope his mom gets better since she looks pretty sick and has been. I think this was a huge drain on him all year too and to be honest yes this was an emotional with for Brady.

 

 

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1 minute ago, TheMarine said:

I will not have a rational discussion about the cheaters on that NE team. Ergo, not GOAT. easily

Yeah. I mean, many of us will always see them is cheaters and there is no changing our mind. I don't care if they win 10 more rings and Brady plays until he's 50. You will not change my mind and this thread is created with the idea that we must accept the OP's post as the gospel. YOU MUST ACCEPT HE IS BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T...WELL DAMN IT HE'S THE BEST lol

 

That's not what he said, but that's how it comes off. Like, if we have have a difference of opinion, we're somehow wrong. The Asterisks will always have this attached to their success *

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He obviously is. That doesn't change the fact that that was one of the worst collapses in sports history. The Refs, Offensive, Defensive, and STs coaches, and the players all collaborated to construct the greatest showing of ineptitude the world has ever seen. 

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The Patriots winning five super bowls is not proof that their quarterback is the greatest of all time. 

 

There are other quarterbacks that would have the same or more success than him if they were put on the Patriots during the same time span Brady has been QB. 

 

Can you imagine Manning with Belichick? 

 

My god.....

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11 minutes ago, Tsarquise said:

The Patriots winning five super bowls is not proof that their quarterback is the greatest of all time. 

 

There are other quarterbacks that would have the same or more success than him if they were put on the Patriots during the same time span Brady has been QB. 

 

Can you imagine Manning with Belichick? 

 

My god.....

Would have been no contest every year it woukd make brady's accomplishments look like child's play  

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Nobody claims Bart Starr or Terry Bradshaw or Troy Aikman are the greatest.  Why not?  They have the championships or rings.  Brady played like crap in the 1st half.  Why?  Because Atlanta got pressure on him and he was rattled.  He isn't a playmaker.  Rodgers would have gotten out of the pocket and made plays.  In the 2nd half, Pats made adjustments and Brady saw little pressure, short passes, quick, etc same old same old.  That's doing your job.  If Ryan did his job, he wouldn't have taken a sack and lost the game for his team.  Pats don't beat themselves.  They just wait it out till other teams do.

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1 hour ago, NannyMcafee said:

You can't argue GOAT for a team accomplishment. Peyton is in GOAT discussion for individual stats. Not team stats. Ridiculous. As if the team has nothing to do with winning the SB. Way to give Brady way too much credit. 

Literally everyone does this it is stupid 

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I don't see how Atlanta doesn't run the ball.

 

You just got the ball back after unsuccessful onside kick and are in New England territory at the 41, up NINETEEEEEEEN points late 3rd

 

First down: 9 yard gain, pass.

Second down: run, holding

2nd and 11 at the 42 RUN THE BALL. You've ran relatively well all game. Ryan throws incomplete pass.

3rd and 11 Ryan takes a sack and out of field goal range.

 

Fast forward to next drive, 8:31 left 3rd and 1 at your own 36. Up SIXTEEEEEEEEEEN. You just ran for 8 yards. RUN THE BALL. Ryan strip sacked and recovered by New England.

 

Fast forward to next drive, 4:40 left at New England 22 yard line up 8 points. Julio Jones has just put the entire city of Atlanta on his back for the culture. RUN THE BALL. They run and lose one yard on first down.

Second down, 3:56 left at the New England 23. RUN THE BALL. We are in the process of depleting the clock and kicking a field goal to gain a two score lead. Atlanta passes and Ryan takes a terrible sack at the 35 yard line. You cannot take this sack, but that is a story for a different day. 3rd down run the ball, take another of New England's timeouts and kick the field goal, you aren't picking up 23 yards for the first down. Atlanta again passes. This time a holding penalty is thrown knocking you out of field goal range. Now it's third and forever and an incomplete pass is thrown. Atlanta punts and Tom goes on his money drive to end regulation. You do not see the ball again on offense with a legitimate chance of getting points.

 

The second half play calling was atrocious in this game for Atlanta. 

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Watched the SB, and it was probably the best one in a long time. Having said that, Brady made the biggest comeback in NFL history. He came back and crushed the Falcons in the 2nd half. There's no denying it anymore, Brady is the best QB of all time. It doesn't matter that Belichick is his coach, it doesn't matter that there are theories on here that Manning would of done the same or better. The fact is, Brady did it, period.

 

Maybe in some alternate universe, Manning has Belichick as his coach, but in this universe, he doesn't. Manning has been Brady's punching bag for 15 years. He's had a lot of 1 and done's in the playoffs. Brady is 5-2 in the SB, Manning is 2-2. It's not close. The playoff record makes an even bigger argument for brady. Manning is a great regular season QB, he rarely got it done in the playoffs. Brady may end up beating Manning's regular season records as well if he does play 3-5 more years.

 

There's nothing to argue anymore. We're rivals of Brady but that and being Colts fans are the only reason that we think Manning is better today.

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3 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Watched the SB, and it was probably the best one in a long time. Having said that, Brady made the biggest comeback in NFL history. He came back and crushed the Falcons in the 2nd half. There's no denying it anymore, Brady is the best QB of all time. It doesn't matter that Belichick is his coach, it doesn't matter that there are theories on here that Manning would of done the same or better. The fact is, Brady did it, period.

 

Uhh, Brady did it with Belichick's coaching and McDaniels play-calling. It's not like Brady did it all on his own. That's what good coaching does for a QB. Let's see Brady get five Superbowls with Jim Caldwell.

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Just now, ReMeDy said:

 

Uhh, Brady did it with Belichick's coaching and McDaniels play-calling. It's not like Brady did it all on his own. That's what good coaching does for a QB. Let's see Brady get five Superbowls with Jim Caldwell.

Of course he did, you do it with the coaches you are given. Manning has had plenty of opportunities to change plays at the line of scrimmage. In fact, he was responsible for a lot of the play calling on offense. Brady doesn't have to win 5 with Caldwell, in an alternate universe maybe him and Manning were switched, in this one, Brady was much better in the playoffs consistently in 15 years. He may break Peyton's regular season records too. Even if Brady was coached by Caldwell, I doubt he goes 1 and done like we did as many times as we did.

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Not much for me add that hasn't been said but how many times in big games has Peyton had the lucky breaks go his way like Tom has? Seattle and Atlanta not running the ball for starters. Last night, Brady is hit as he throws, ball floats in the air and somehow it lands in Bennetts hands! In SB 48, the same thing happens to Peyton, pick 6 and game over. Then the catch on the game-tying drive by Edelman...I mean c'mon! Then the game-tying play two point conversion, the Patriots only have 6 players on the LOS but no flag is thrown...

Sure he played great and willed them to the win in this game, but in many other playoff games he was carried after playing poorly. No one ever mentions this because they win. Even with his Superbowl heroics, he has now had the lower passer rating in 5 of 7 SB appearances. 

Manning has 8 playoff's with a 90+ PR, but Brady and Montana have only 5 each. That say's a lot. 

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15 minutes ago, 19colt said:

Not much for me add that hasn't been said but how many times in big games has Peyton had the lucky breaks go his way like Tom has? Seattle and Atlanta not running the ball for starters. Last night, Brady is hit as he throws, ball floats in the air and somehow it lands in Bennetts hands! In SB 48, the same thing happens to Peyton, pick 6 and game over. Then the catch on the game-tying drive by Edelman...I mean c'mon! Then the game-tying play two point conversion, the Patriots only have 6 players on the LOS but no flag is thrown...

 

I don't know about that, Peyton had lucky breaks too...Peyton had a 10-0 lead against New Orleans. While this board loves to scream onside kick, onside kick, he still only put up 7 points in the second half of that game and they proceeded to be outscored 31-7 after having a 10-0 start. 

 

Peyton also got extremely lucky in the 2012 playoff game against Baltimore where his special teams put 14 points on the board, and some how some way, Denver still couldn't win that game with that much help. 

 

Last year, Peyton got ALL the lucky breaks to win a Super Bowl with the absolute worst stats posted by a SB winning QB in NFL history. Even in the Super Bowl, thank god the defense put up 14 points to get that win, cause Peyton sure didn't do much in that game. 

 

 

 

3 hours ago, OneNation said:

I don't see how Atlanta doesn't run the ball.

 

You just got the ball back after unsuccessful onside kick and are in New England territory at the 41, up NINETEEEEEEEN points late 3rd

 

First down: 9 yard gain, pass.

Second down: run, holding

2nd and 11 at the 42 RUN THE BALL. You've ran relatively well all game. Ryan throws incomplete pass.

3rd and 11 Ryan takes a sack and out of field goal range.

 

Fast forward to next drive, 8:31 left 3rd and 1 at your own 36. Up SIXTEEEEEEEEEEN. You just ran for 8 yards. RUN THE BALL. Ryan strip sacked and recovered by New England.

 

Fast forward to next drive, 4:40 left at New England 22 yard line up 8 points. Julio Jones has just put the entire city of Atlanta on his back for the culture. RUN THE BALL. They run and lose one yard on first down.

Second down, 3:56 left at the New England 23. RUN THE BALL. We are in the process of depleting the clock and kicking a field goal to gain a two score lead. Atlanta passes and Ryan takes a terrible sack at the 35 yard line. You cannot take this sack, but that is a story for a different day. 3rd down run the ball, take another of New England's timeouts and kick the field goal, you aren't picking up 23 yards for the first down. Atlanta again passes. This time a holding penalty is thrown knocking you out of field goal range. Now it's third and forever and an incomplete pass is thrown. Atlanta punts and Tom goes on his money drive to end regulation. You do not see the ball again on offense with a legitimate chance of getting points.

 

The second half play calling was atrocious in this game for Atlanta. 

 

 

The Falcons did this all year long. 

 

They were not a well coached team. This happened on multiple occasions. 

 

Falcons led the league in first half scoring the entire season. They were a first half team, not a second half team. In the second half, they just sat on their leads and more often than not, allowed teams to come back into games (hence why they had to run up scores). 

 

 

They were awful with adjustments and substitutions. Not once in this game did they make proper adjustments while having a big lead, just as they didn't all year long. 

 

This game actually played identical to their loss to the Chargers in the regular season - jumped to a 27-10 lead....then just run the ball a bit trying to sit on the lead. As soon as SD got a TD, the Falcons stopped running the ball and went pass happy. San Diego stormed a comeback and won in OT. 

 

The Falcons did this a lot in the regular season. They usually had a big lead by half time, but as soon as their opponent started to score again in garbage time, they would abandon the run and go pass happy. Matt Ryan is not a QB who wins games all on his arm. See 2012 and 2010 for fine examples of Matty Hype being nothing but hype...

 

Kyle Shanahan was crowned an "offensive guru" long before he should've been. I look forward to the Falcons collapsing without him and Ryan going back to an obscure mediocre name that no one cares about.

 

 

Biggest choke job in NFL history. Couldn't have happened for a more deserving franchise and the cherry on top of the sundae is that it had to be New England of all teams: Brady getting that 5th ring to cement his legacy in history as the GOAT. RISE UP!

 

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Synthetic said:

 

I don't know about that, Peyton had lucky breaks too...Peyton had a 10-0 lead against New Orleans. While this board loves to scream onside kick, onside kick, he still only put up 7 points in the second half of that game and they proceeded to be outscored 31-7 after having a 10-0 start. 

 

Peyton also got extremely lucky in the 2012 playoff game against Baltimore where his special teams put 14 points on the board, and some how some way, Denver still couldn't win that game with that much help. 

 

Last year, Peyton got ALL the lucky breaks to win a Super Bowl with the absolute worst stats posted by a SB winning QB in NFL history. Even in the Super Bowl, thank god the defense put up 14 points to get that win, cause Peyton sure didn't do much in that game. 


Peyton has a 17-0 vs NO lead if Garcon catches a ball that hits him on the chest. Wayne dropped a TD late in the game too. There was also Dwight Freeney not being available in the second half when NO took over the game.

As for that Baltimore game. Peyton played decently in frigid weather. Baltimore had a pick 6 on blatant PI against Decker. What happened to Brady once he started struggling vs Atlanta? Flag, flag, flag, flag. 6 men on the LOS, sure - no problem!

Agree Peyton got a nice break last year in the Superbowl. Still, he out played Brady the week before, despite playing from a wheelchair with no OL to speak of. His OL also gave up the most sacks per drop backs in Superbowl history. As for worst numbers ever in a Superbowl, John Elway won with similar numbers but no one holds that against him.  

Anyway, we saw Denver this year without Peyton's leadership in an AFC that was overall weaker than last year. Let's not also forget the reason he left Indy in the first place...the #1 draft pick a year removed from Peyton carrying a terrible team to the playoffs. Matt Cassell made millions off his season as Pats QB, while Garoppolo would have comfortably taken the Pats to the AFCCG this year. 

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2 hours ago, 19colt said:

Not much for me add that hasn't been said but how many times in big games has Peyton had the lucky breaks go his way like Tom has?

 

1) Playing the worst team to ever make a Super Bowl (Jay Cutler's Bears) was a pretty lucky break

2) Riding the coat-tails of one of the top 5 defenses last year was a pretty lucky break

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15 minutes ago, Bad Morty said:

 

1) Playing the worst team to ever make a Super Bowl (Jay Cutler's Bears) was a pretty lucky break

2) Riding the coat-tails of one of the top 5 defenses last year was a pretty lucky break

Is Bad Morty from Rick and Morty? Just curious. Also, I'll be a big man and say congrats on your SB win. Just don't troll us too hard lol.

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2 minutes ago, backshoulderfade said:

Thought this would be an unpopular opinion here. It is true though.

It'll be more of an unpopular opinion here than most other places. I think everyone knows it, but not all will admit it. Manning is still a top 3 QB of all time. His playoff success leaves a lot to be desired though.

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