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gurley has been pretty good.  the rams already have a defense too, it wasnt a bad pick

 

the problem is they need a QB and a coach or it wont really matter who or what position they draft

 

gordon had 1400 total yards this year and 12 TDs, while missing 3 games

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24 minutes ago, CheezyColt said:

Whether you care to remember it or not, they were just as hyped as these two guys coming in this year. The fact you don't seem to see the impact they've made only highlights my point.

Gordon has yet to average 4 ypc or reach 1k yards.  Yawn.

 

Gurley has rushed for 100 yards or more exactly once in his last 24 games.

 

maybe we just different definitions of "impact"

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I love Cook as a prospect but i just dont see the value in a first round RB. Remember, that position has the shortest shelf life in the NFL. As great as Edgerrin was, we only had him for 6 years, we had Mathis for 14. Guys like Gore are the exception to the rule, its more typical that you only get about 5-7 elite years out of a RB, then they hit a massive wall. Chris Johnson for example. Im not saying that'll definitely happen to Cook, but the law of averages favors a defensive player making an impact for a longer period of time.

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8 hours ago, aaron11 said:

its not like what we say here matters at all

 

you guys would pass on edge, AP and Marshawn lynch too i guess

Of course we don't have any impact on the decision making and I wouldn't claim we did. I'm just saying that if we keep prioritizing the offence -and we as fans are happy about that - then we deserve to watch the team and suffer the results we do.

 

In our situation and with out defense I would definitely pass on edge, Marshawn or AP.  Not because they aren't amazing players - because they obviously are - and I would love to have watch them in this offence but they wouldn't help us to win while the defense is so shambolic and under resourced. 

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9 hours ago, aaron11 said:

dallas did the same last year, and it worked out fine.  no way they win that many games without elliot

 

i think a RB can impact the games just as much (or more so) than a CB.  despite being a good player, ramsey didnt exactly lift his team to very many victories.  elliot lead the league in rushing, and yards after contact

 

CBs can be avoided, while the offense picks on the weakest link in the secondary

 

opposing defenses cant avoid a running back

You can't liken us to Dallas. 

 

They had invested multiple 1st and 2nd round picks on their defense already - including 2 firsts on CB's.

 

When they picked up Elliot their roster was in a completely different place to ours.

 

Other running backs will come around in the future. When we've built a better defense I'd be fine with taking them.

 

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13 hours ago, ClaytonColt said:

when they picked up Elliot their roster was in a completely different place to ours.

they went 4-12 the year before and had a badly ranked defense when they took elliot

 

their D wasnt that great this year either, but elliot kept them off the field

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9 hours ago, aaron11 said:

they went 4-12 the year before and had a badly ranked defense when they took elliot

 

their D wasnt that great this year either, but elliot kept them off the field

Romo getting injured had an effect on them being 4-12. Whether it was bad or not was not the point I made...they had invested in it whereas we haven't.  At some point we have to.

 

Time of possession of of minimal importance. Even at the top end of the scale the defense is still going to be on the field for 28 minutes a game and it needs to do a job for that time.

 

Just had a look at it seems that their time of possession hasn't really changed. 31.07 last year against 31.23 this year from what I could see.

 

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On 1/24/2017 at 4:20 PM, CheezyColt said:

Only 3-5 every 10 years? So with this year's crop, that makes Gurley, Gordon, Zeke, Fournette, and Cook in 3 years. So after this year there will be 7 straight years without impact RBs? Whoa, mind blown.

LoL http://www.nfl.com/player/melvingordon/2552469/careerstats

Gordon is definitely not part of the 3-5. But anyways can you name 5 RB's before this point that are considered to be as elite as Adrian Peterson? I said 10 years so lets say you have 2006-2015 (Draft gurley came in) anyone draft before 06 can't be used.

2006 you got reggie bush (didn't pan out)

2007 you got adrian peterson and marshawn lynch (That's 2 and lynch could argueably be taken away)

2008 you got darren Mcfadden/John stewart (Nope)

2009 you got Knowshon Moreno (Nope)

2010 you got CJ Spiller and Ryan Matthews (Nope)

2011 you got nobody

2012 you got Trent Richardson (def nope)

2013 you got nobody

2014 you got nobody

 

That's only 1-2 so yes RBs like these are RARE and you do not PASS ON THEM! You can even go back further than 2006

2005 you got Ronnie Brown, Cedric Benson, Carnell Williams all NOPE

2004 nobody

2003 nobody

2002 nobody

2001 LaDainian Tomlinson (Def Yes)

2000 Jamal Lewis (Yes)

1999 Edgerrin James (Yes)

Whoa we finally got to 5. It only took me 16 years I'm sure we can pass and wait Luck has time hes only going to be 28. Maybe by the time hes 35 we might get another chance judging by the history. Wake up people. Cook or Fournette is a no brainer.

 

Look colts have taken Marshall Faulk 2nd pick 1994, Edgerrin James 4th pick 1999 Joseph addai #30 2006 (Won Superbowl). Donald Brown #27 2009 the only one to not turn out good for Colts. In drafting Fournette or Cook we will immediately become a legit threat for best offense in NFL. Last year our Offense was #10 overall at 364 yards per game and #8 overall in pts per game with 25.7. #5 overall in passing yards but only #23 overall in rushing yards. Gore is not a threat due to lack of speed/age. Which makes it easier for opponents to defend the passing game. Which will easily be #1 with decent OL/Fournette or Cook. Overall our defense was #30. Our pass defense was #27 and our run defense was #25. Say we draft all defense 7 rounds without knowing what free agents if any we add. We are likely in the same place as last year just with a better future as these defensive guys will need time to develop as we are missing too many key pieces we are not just missing one LB, one CB, and DE we need at every position. Our only hope to make playoffs and have a chance of winning superbowl like the chance we had 2 years ago is drafting Fournette or Cook in the 1st round. Lucks 27 be 28 at the start of next season. We need veterans on defense we need to fill as many holes in free agency as possible draft RB in 1st round if cook or fournette is available then draft defense the rest of the draft. CB, LB/ILB, DE etc.

 

Bottom line passing on fournette or cook would be like passing on Marshall Faulk, Adrian Peterson, Barry Sanders, Edgerrin James, etc...The only reason Cook or Fournette will possible fall to us in the 1st round is because the teams above either need QB desperately or already have a solid RB that would make drafting one in the 1st regardless of how good a waste. This is also why the first team to take one is rumored Panthers because they already have Franchise QB in Cam Newton and guess what Panthers defense against the Pass was worst than ours last year. Their run defense was one of the best though. By picking fournette or cook they become a threat to be best offense as they also have an aging RB. Gore can easily come into this season finished and we would be in for a long season as no run game=more losing.

   
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You're counting your chickens before they hatch, my friend. You're operating under the assumption that Fournette and Cook are guaranteed to have the impact of AP. Just like Gurley and Gordon were. Zeke has had 1 good year. Just because the prospect is hyped or performed well in college, doesn't mean that will translate to the next level. This is especially true of running backs, as evidenced by the long list of non-elite first round running backs you provided. So thank you for proving my point. Every one of those backs was drafted with the hope of being a game changing RB. Your argument that passing on LF or DC is equivalent to passing on AP, Faulk, or Barry Sanders (lol!), is asinine. 

 

I've stated many times that I'd ultimately be ok if we chose one of the backs, but defense would be the smarter choice.

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39 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher said:

 

If Cook or Fournette are there when we pick and the new GM passes that WOULD NOT be a good way to start his tenure, imo.

Yeah all the defensive guys we're interviewing for GM, to build our defense, will surely pick a RB in the first. That will help the defense, that makes sense. 

 

I mean you just can't make this stuff up. 

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8 minutes ago, Majin Vegeta said:

Yeah all the defensive guys we're interviewing for GM, to build our defense, will surely pick a RB in the first. That will help the defense, that makes sense. 

 

I mean you just can't make this stuff up. 

 

I've talked about this in length in other threads and not going to again here.

But I will say briefly, RB & Defense are both needs. We need 1 elite rb to make our offense Balanced & a Force!

WE NEED about 6-7 players on Defense to be about average (4 new lbs, 1 cb, maybe a S. a dominant NT. a pass rushing DE,

Which unit do you think would benefit more with our 1st rd. pick? Lol

 

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8 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher said:

 

I've talked about this in length in other threads and not going to again here.

But I will say briefly, RB & Defense are both needs. We need 1 elite rb to make our offense Balanced & a Force!

WE NEED about 6-7 players on Defense to be about average (4 new lbs, 1 cb, maybe a S. a dominant NT. a pass rushing DE,

Which unit do you think would benefit more with our 1st rd. pick? Lol

 

Ummmmmmm the unit with 7 needs?! The unit that was ranked almost dead last! The unit that doesn't have any stars! 

 

Did we not have a 1000 yard rusher later year? Was the offense not top 10? Was the front 7 ranked dead last? Was the secondary 2nd to last? Is the defense old as dirt? Am I talking to a wall?

 

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54 minutes ago, Majin Vegeta said:

Yeah all the defensive guys we're interviewing for GM, to build our defense, will surely pick a RB in the first. That will help the defense, that makes sense. 

 

I mean you just can't make this stuff up. 

 

Honestly,  while I have banged the drum loudly and longest for defense.... (since 2014)   I would not be surprised if the new GM,  whoever he is,  would take Fournette or Cook over a defensive player.     It all depends on who that defensive player left really is.   

 

Fournette and Cook may just be too good to pass on if one is available.    This defense is not going to get turned around in one draft.     So,  you might as well take the BPA.      Even if it's an offensive player because those guys are special. 

 

That said,   I don't think either one will be there....  a lot depends on how many teams reach dramatically for a QB.      The more teams move up past us to take a QB,  the more talent is forced down our way.    (Yes, please!)

 

So, it depends on who falls.       But don't rule out the two RB's.    They're special.    Most GM's,  even ones are whose background is defense,    do not pass on special on offense.

 

 

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5 hours ago, Jesse Lafantaisie said:

LoL http://www.nfl.com/player/melvingordon/2552469/careerstats

Gordon is definitely not part of the 3-5. But anyways can you name 5 RB's before this point that are considered to be as elite as Adrian Peterson? I said 10 years so lets say you have 2006-2015 (Draft gurley came in) anyone draft before 06 can't be used.

2006 you got reggie bush (didn't pan out)

2007 you got adrian peterson and marshawn lynch (That's 2 and lynch could argueably be taken away)

2008 you got darren Mcfadden/John stewart (Nope)

2009 you got Knowshon Moreno (Nope)

2010 you got CJ Spiller and Ryan Matthews (Nope)

2011 you got nobody

2012 you got Trent Richardson (def nope)

2013 you got nobody

2014 you got nobody

 

That's only 1-2 so yes RBs like these are RARE and you do not PASS ON THEM! You can even go back further than 2006

2005 you got Ronnie Brown, Cedric Benson, Carnell Williams all NOPE

2004 nobody

2003 nobody

2002 nobody

2001 LaDainian Tomlinson (Def Yes)

2000 Jamal Lewis (Yes)

1999 Edgerrin James (Yes)

Whoa we finally got to 5. It only took me 16 years I'm sure we can pass and wait Luck has time hes only going to be 28. Maybe by the time hes 35 we might get another chance judging by the history. Wake up people. Cook or Fournette is a no brainer.

 

Look colts have taken Marshall Faulk 2nd pick 1994, Edgerrin James 4th pick 1999 Joseph addai #30 2006 (Won Superbowl). Donald Brown #27 2009 the only one to not turn out good for Colts. In drafting Fournette or Cook we will immediately become a legit threat for best offense in NFL. Last year our Offense was #10 overall at 364 yards per game and #8 overall in pts per game with 25.7. #5 overall in passing yards but only #23 overall in rushing yards. Gore is not a threat due to lack of speed/age. Which makes it easier for opponents to defend the passing game. Which will easily be #1 with decent OL/Fournette or Cook. Overall our defense was #30. Our pass defense was #27 and our run defense was #25. Say we draft all defense 7 rounds without knowing what free agents if any we add. We are likely in the same place as last year just with a better future as these defensive guys will need time to develop as we are missing too many key pieces we are not just missing one LB, one CB, and DE we need at every position. Our only hope to make playoffs and have a chance of winning superbowl like the chance we had 2 years ago is drafting Fournette or Cook in the 1st round. Lucks 27 be 28 at the start of next season. We need veterans on defense we need to fill as many holes in free agency as possible draft RB in 1st round if cook or fournette is available then draft defense the rest of the draft. CB, LB/ILB, DE etc.

 

Bottom line passing on fournette or cook would be like passing on Marshall Faulk, Adrian Peterson, Barry Sanders, Edgerrin James, etc...The only reason Cook or Fournette will possible fall to us in the 1st round is because the teams above either need QB desperately or already have a solid RB that would make drafting one in the 1st regardless of how good a waste. This is also why the first team to take one is rumored Panthers because they already have Franchise QB in Cam Newton and guess what Panthers defense against the Pass was worst than ours last year. Their run defense was one of the best though. By picking fournette or cook they become a threat to be best offense as they also have an aging RB. Gore can easily come into this season finished and we would be in for a long season as no run game=more losing.

   

 

Look at YOU!?!       Now this is how you come in and make a splash!     Heckuva post and it's only your 9th?!

 

Nicely done!      Well played, Sir!      Bravo!!         :applause:          :thmup:

 

Well researched, thought out and presented!       Way to impress!

 

My favorite post of the day!             :colts:

 

Looking forward to more......

 

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7 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Honestly,  while I have banged the drum loudly and longest for defense.... (since 2014)   I would not be surprised if the new GM,  whoever he is,  would take Fournette or Cook over a defensive player.     It all depends on who that defensive player left really is.   

 

Fournette and Cook may just be too good to pass on if one is available.    This defense is not going to get turned around in one draft.     So,  you might as well take the BPA.      Even if it's an offensive player because those guys are special. 

 

That said,   I don't think either one will be there....  a lot depends on how many teams reach dramatically for a QB.      The more teams move up past us to take a QB,  the more talent is forced down our way.    (Yes, please!)

 

So, it depends on who falls.       But don't rule out the two RB's.    They're special.    Most GM's,  even ones are whose background is defense,    do not pass on special on offense.

 

 

I mean I see your point. And I see how great Cook is. (Not a fan of Fournette at all)

But I just feel like the new GM is going to try and build a defense here first thing. It's not about time, it's overdue.  Even one of the six candidates said the defense needed fixed, said it was a good situation but the defense needs fixed.  I honestly don't see a new GM taking a skill position. I just don't. I've said that and I'm gonna keep saying it lol. I'll eat crow if we do draft a RB, and I'll be sad as # too.

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29 minutes ago, Majin Vegeta said:

I mean I see your point. And I see how great Cook is. (Not a fan of Fournette at all)

But I just feel like the new GM is going to try and build a defense here first thing. It's not about time, it's overdue.  Even one of the six candidates said the defense needed fixed, said it was a good situation but the defense needs fixed.  I honestly don't see a new GM taking a skill position. I just don't. I've said that and I'm gonna keep saying it lol. I'll eat crow if we do draft a RB, and I'll be sad as # too.

 

To be clear,  I agree with most of this post.     I don't think you have to worry about the new GM picking any other offensive player in the first round other than the two RB's.     There's no one else worth the Colts picking them there.    No WR,  no OL,  no TE or QB.     Just those two RB's.     And I think Fournette will be gone,  but I'd put the chances on Cook at nearly 50/50.     Just my view here in late January.    This could all change over the next 3 months.     

 

By the way,  I think the draft is 3 months from TODAY,  Thursday, Jan 26.     The draft starts on the last Thursday in April.     Tick, tick, tick, tick!   

 

:thmup:

 

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1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Honestly,  while I have banged the drum loudly and longest for defense.... (since 2014)   I would not be surprised if the new GM,  whoever he is,  would take Fournette or Cook over a defensive player.     It all depends on who that defensive player left really is.   

 

Fournette and Cook may just be too good to pass on if one is available.    This defense is not going to get turned around in one draft.     So,  you might as well take the BPA.      Even if it's an offensive player because those guys are special. 

 

That said,   I don't think either one will be there....  a lot depends on how many teams reach dramatically for a QB.      The more teams move up past us to take a QB,  the more talent is forced down our way.    (Yes, please!)

 

So, it depends on who falls.       But don't rule out the two RB's.    They're special.    Most GM's,  even ones are whose background is defense,    do not pass on special on offense.

 

 

 

Yes, my thoughts too. I'll also add to the bolded that this Defense will not get turned around on one draft pick,

But our offense could improve very much.

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1 hour ago, Majin Vegeta said:

1 or 2 FA's, a stud 1st rounder, and a solid 2nd rounder. Maybe even the 3rd could start some time.  Thats how you start building the worst part of your team. 

Your talking about 5 players (2 FA"s & 3 draft picks). We were only talking about our 1st rd.pick.

IF Fournette/Cook are there, we draft them. We can get defensive players in rounds 2,3,4,and 5 AND we have plenty of $$ to sign 3 good defensive FA's or more.

 

This way we address our needs on both sides of the ball.

Defense's will play more honest, Luck will get hit less and better chance of staying healthy. Along with better run game our passing also improves, more sustained drives and less 3 and outs, our D is more rested and benefits too.

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On ‎1‎/‎25‎/‎2017 at 1:57 PM, aaron11 said:

they went 4-12 the year before and had a badly ranked defense when they took elliot

 

their D wasnt that great this year either, but elliot kept them off the field

Exactly. Everybody wants a strong D and a tough running game BUT Don't want to invest in top RB's.

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On 1/23/2017 at 2:15 PM, Defjamz26 said:

Lawson was one of the few pass rushers who gave Tunsil trouble.

Lawson did more than give him trouble. He abused him if not for the injuries he'd be a top 10 pick. After he tests off the charts at the combine he will still go late day 1. 

 

Hall and Smoot are helping themselves at the Senior Bowl. I like both. Smoot could be a steal. Hall from Wake is a sleeper at ILB I like day 3. 

 

If there isn't a player we really like at 15. I would try to trade back pick up an extra pick before taking a RB. If Cook is there and we don't have a trade partner you take the BPA. It's is certainly a possibility that Cook is a pick. You don't reach in the 1st. 

 

A guy that could be there I haven't seen mentioned is Hooker. I'm not clowning TJ but I grab that kid at 15  

 

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6 hours ago, akcolt said:

Lawson did more than give him trouble. He abused him if not for the injuries he'd be a top 10 pick. After he tests off the charts at the combine he will still go late day 1. 

 

Hall and Smoot are helping themselves at the Senior Bowl. I like both. Smoot could be a steal. Hall from Wake is a sleeper at ILB I like day 3. 

 

If there isn't a player we really like at 15. I would try to trade back pick up an extra pick before taking a RB. If Cook is there and we don't have a trade partner you take the BPA. It's is certainly a possibility that Cook is a pick. You don't reach in the 1st. 

 

A guy that could be there I haven't seen mentioned is Hooker. I'm not clowning TJ but I grab that kid at 15  

 

Everything I've seen has Hooker/Adams both gone by the Chargers pick. If either are available I'd grab them in a heartbeat, but I think that's even more unlikely than one if the RBs being there for us.

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7 hours ago, akcolt said:

Lawson did more than give him trouble. He abused him if not for the injuries he'd be a top 10 pick. After he tests off the charts at the combine he will still go late day 1. 

 

Hall and Smoot are helping themselves at the Senior Bowl. I like both. Smoot could be a steal. Hall from Wake is a sleeper at ILB I like day 3. 

 

If there isn't a player we really like at 15. I would try to trade back pick up an extra pick before taking a RB. If Cook is there and we don't have a trade partner you take the BPA. It's is certainly a possibility that Cook is a pick. You don't reach in the 1st. 

 

A guy that could be there I haven't seen mentioned is Hooker. I'm not clowning TJ but I grab that kid at 15  

 

Yeah I think it's possible that a team that needs pass rush help late might scoop Lawson up before the 2nd round.

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11 hours ago, Majin Vegeta said:

Did we not have a 1000 yard rusher later year? Was the offense not top 10? Was the front 7 ranked dead last? Was the secondary 2nd to last? Is the defense old as dirt? Am I talking to a wall?

 

gore wont be here much longer.  as for the talking to a wall comment, you are not open to changing your mind either.  i guess everyone here is talking to a wall

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20 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

gore wont be here much longer.  as for the talking to a wall comment, you are not open to changing your mind either.  i guess everyone here is talking to a wall

I've actually said, if we have an amazing FA(bring in multiple starters on defense) I'd probably be okay with taking Cook. Would much rather get a defender in the 1st though obviously. 

 

But yeah I am very firm on my opinion, atleast I have good arguments for my opinion. Like the ones you just quoted. And out of all those great points, all you can say is Gore won't be here much longer? ... Okay great then we'll draft a RB higher next year? Once we  have some pieces on defense? You know the unit that ranked last? Unlike the offense that ranked 10th with a 1k yard rusher?

 

 

 

Walls. Walls everywhere. 

 

 

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29 minutes ago, Majin Vegeta said:

I've actually said, if we have an amazing FA(bring in multiple starters on defense) I'd probably be okay with taking Cook. Would much rather get a defender in the 1st though obviously. 

 

But yeah I am very firm on my opinion, atleast I have good arguments for my opinion. Like the ones you just quoted. And out of all those great points, all you can say is Gore won't be here much longer? ... Okay great then we'll draft a RB higher next year? Once we  have some pieces on defense? You know the unit that ranked last? Unlike the offense that ranked 10th with a 1k yard rusher?

gore wont be here much longer, and one draft pick wont fix the defense. 

 

i am firm in my opinion that cook or LF would be fine

 

those are the only arguments i need to make.  i dont believe the good pass rushers will last until our pick either

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8 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

gore wont be here much longer, and one draft pick wont fix the defense. 

 

i am firm in my opinion that cook or LF would be fine

 

those are the only arguments i need to make.  i dont believe the good pass rushers will last until our pick either

 

6 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

this thread is about a specific mock draft too, where cook is the best player on the board. 

Lol okay im done trying to educate you. :hat:

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8 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

this thread is about a specific mock draft too, where cook is the best player on the board. 

 

You could easily argue Lattimore and Sidney Jones are better prospects on the board.

 

I wouldn't mind Cook assuming we pick up a couple defensive starters in FA. But as it currently stands, I'm definitely taking one of the two CB there if given the opportunity. 

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29 minutes ago, Majin Vegeta said:

 

Lol okay im done trying to educate you. :hat:

you didnt tell me anything i didnt already know.  stop acting like you're so smart for mandating a defensive player with the first pick no matter what the board looks like

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