GM Candidates, including Jimmy Raye (merge)

[ColtsBlueFL]

I guess teams must ask permission for front office personnel to interview while the playoffs are still in progress? Otherwise, why ask at all?  Chiefs refused to allow Ballard to interview for the 49'ers.  Wonder if they refuse him a Colts interview as well?

[Andrew Luck fan club]

13 minutes ago, bayone said:

 

I wonder if Raye was the only one not invited back for a 2nd interview. And I also wonder why he wasn't. 

[stitches]

 

[Swan Ronson]

It's daft to think Irsay is going to lose a really great candidate in order to keep a coach he's, in all likelihood, been trying to replace anyway.

[JColts72]

1 minute ago, Majin Vegeta said:

I wonder if Raye was the only one not invited back for a 2nd interview. And I also wonder why he wasn't. 

Maybe not good enough for a horrible 49er team or maybe Jimmy told him Ryan was gonna to be canned?

[JColts72]

1 minute ago, Swan Ronson said:

It's daft to think Irsay is going to lose a really great candidate in order to keep a coach he's, in all likelihood, been trying to replace anyway.

Daft is the key word for sure.

[Fisticuffs111]

I'm just skeptical of these candidates availability. Wolf took himself out of the running for the 49ers job and got a raise, Chiefs blocked Ballard's request for the 49ers. Wouldn't be surprised if the Seahawks block our requests. Really the only guy Irsay is for sure interviewing besides Raye III is George Paton, I think. Obviously that's just right now.

 

I'll take back what I originally said in that this search isn't just for show, but I do think Irsay is leaning heavily toward Raye III.

 

I don't think he'd allow the coaches to go to the Senior Bowl with Raye if he were this open to making major GM changes. Because say what you want about it just being one more year of Pagano, but I can't see these high level candidates very excited about having to possibly start their 1st year off building for a vision that could be changed in a season. And I don't take everything Irsay says as fact, but it's the way he talked about Pagano that had me convinced he'll be back.

[Yoshinator]

55 minutes ago, Superman said:

One side of mouth:

 

Other side of mouth:

 

Which is it? On one hand, you're saying Pagano only wants Jimmy Raye because that will mean he gets to keep his job, and on the other hand, you're saying Chuck doesn't care whether he gets fired, he just wants to delay the inevitable. That makes zero sense. Irsay already said Pagano is the coach this year, and everything Pagano has said and done shows that he wants to continue being the coach. Everyone knows that Irsay wants the team to win, and everyone knows that no one is safe if they don't start winning right away.

 

You've basically made Pagano into a duplicitous, deceitful fraud who is Iago-ing his way around the Colts complex in an effort to keep his job as long as possible, doing everything he can -- besides coaching the team to the best of his ability -- to dupe Irsay into keeping him. And it's become pretty obvious that your viewpoint is entirely slanted by your dislike of Pagano, which explains why your argument is so dissonant. 

He is trying to get Raye in so he gets another year, however, he also knows he's not good enough, so he's just hoping for a miracle at this and really doesn't care either way if he gets fired at the end of the year. Basically saving face by playing til he gets fired, but knows he's not good enough and hoping for a miracle. Next time, quote everything I say and don't cherry pick two sentences to fit your argument.

[PeterBowman]

Impressive list so far....let's see how many he's actually able to interview.

[Superman]

1 minute ago, Jared Cisneros said:

He is trying to get Raye in so he gets another year, however, he also knows he's not good enough, so he's just hoping for a miracle at this and really doesn't care either way if he gets fired at the end of the year. Basically saving face by playing til he gets fired, but knows he's not good enough and hoping for a miracle. 

 

That's completely absurd, through and through. Irsay already committed to Pagano in 2017. 

 

Quote

Next time, quote everything I say and don't cherry pick two sentences to fit your argument.

 

Why not reconcile your argument with the facts? 

[Yoshinator]

4 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

That's completely absurd, through and through. Irsay already committed to Pagano in 2017. 

 

 

Why not reconcile your argument with the facts? 

How often does Irsay tell the truth? The majority of the time he's lying and denying things to cover up other things. I still believe a new GM would can Pagano, and I believe Pagano knows this.

[Iancolts]

We need a new GM no in house.  No one that learned from Grigson.  What about maybe gruden was the GM irsay wanted and not as a HC?

[csmopar]

19 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

I guess teams must ask permission for front office personnel to interview while the playoffs are still in progress? Otherwise, why ask at all?  Chiefs refused to allow Ballard to interview for the 49'ers.  Wonder if they refuse him a Colts interview as well?

they have to request permission from ANY team that has the guy they want to interview under contract, playoffs or no playoffs

[Shive]

1 minute ago, Iancolts said:

We need a new GM no in house.  No one that learned from Grigson.  What about maybe gruden was the GM irsay wanted and not as a HC?

Why does everyone think Jimmy Raye learned from Grigson? He has WAY more FO experience than Grigson ever did. Maybe the things Grigs did right were learned from Jimmy Raye?

[krunk]

24 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I'm just skeptical of these candidates availability. Wolf took himself out of the running for the 49ers job and got a raise, Chiefs blocked Ballard's request for the 49ers. Wouldn't be surprised if the Seahawks block our requests. Really the only guy Irsay is for sure interviewing besides Raye III is George Paton, I think. Obviously that's just right now.

 

I'll take back what I originally said in that this search isn't just for show, but I do think Irsay is leaning heavily toward Raye III.

 

I don't think he'd allow the coaches to go to the Senior Bowl with Raye if he were this open to making major GM changes. Because say what you want about it just being one more year of Pagano, but I can't see these high level candidates very excited about having to possibly start their 1st year off building for a vision that could be changed in a season. And I don't take everything Irsay says as fact, but it's the way he talked about Pagano that had me convinced he'll be back.

My feelings are somewhat similar to yours.  I can't see a lot of seriousness in him bringing in an outside Gm with Chuck still in place.  To me if he was really serious about bringing in one of those candidates he'd give them free rein to cut Chuck.  Instead he says you can't throw out the baby with the bath water.  I don't think Ray III would have much of a problem with Chuck being in place because he's been here building for that vision for what 5 years now so not much of an adjustment.   I can kind of see some of what Jared is saying, but there's no recent definitive statement directly from Chuck stating "Hey give me Jimmy Raye so I can keep my job".  It's just theory.

 

Chuck has already stated in more than one place last year "They can fire you , but they can't eat you" so I don't think he has much concern over desperation moves to keep his job.  IF Chuck likes Raye I would think it has way more to do with his knowledge level, resume, how he treats people, personnel knowledge and what not.

[corgi]

 

24 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

I guess teams must ask permission for front office personnel to interview while the playoffs are still in progress? Otherwise, why ask at all?  Chiefs refused to allow Ballard to interview for the 49'ers.  Wonder if they refuse him a Colts interview as well?

"The Chiefs blocked Ballard from interviewing for the opening with the 49ers, but their ability to do that ended once their season ended with a loss to the Steelers in the divisional round of the playoffs" PFT

[Superman]

3 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

How often does Irsay tell the truth? The majority of the time he's lying and denying things to cover up other things. I still believe a new GM would can Pagano, and I believe Pagano knows this.

 

There's a difference between Irsay saying he wasn't trying to hire Gruden -- which he kind of has to say at this point, not just because he wasn't able to and still has Pagano, but also out of respect to the Rooney rule -- and Irsay committing to Pagano in 2017 after he fired his GM -- which he did NOT have to do, but did anyway. 

 

Irsay definitively took a coaching change off the table for 2017, and he repeated himself during his presser. It's possible that things could change, but Irsay just told the world -- including any GM candidates -- that Pagano is staying this year. He did not have to do this.

[Fisticuffs111]

1 minute ago, corgi said:

 

"The Chiefs blocked Ballard from interviewing for the opening with the 49ers, but their ability to do that ended once their season ended with a loss to the Steelers in the divisional round of the playoffs" PFT

I did not know that's how it worked. Awesome.

[OffensivelyPC]

21 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I'm just skeptical of these candidates availability. Wolf took himself out of the running for the 49ers job and got a raise, Chiefs blocked Ballard's request for the 49ers. Wouldn't be surprised if the Seahawks block our requests. Really the only guy Irsay is for sure interviewing besides Raye III is George Paton, I think. Obviously that's just right now.

 

I'll take back what I originally said in that this search isn't just for show, but I do think Irsay is leaning heavily toward Raye III.

 

I don't think he'd allow the coaches to go to the Senior Bowl with Raye if he were this open to making major GM changes. Because say what you want about it just being one more year of Pagano, but I can't see these high level candidates very excited about having to possibly start their 1st year off building for a vision that could be changed in a season. And I don't take everything Irsay says as fact, but it's the way he talked about Pagano that had me convinced he'll be back.

The fact that Pagano is staying is a notable drawback.  I don't think it will be such a deterrent that it will be the primary reason for a rejection.  It can eb seen as getting a free year that if it doesn't work out, you can hire who you want.  Maybe I'm overselling it.  

 

The bigger setback in my mind is the spectre of Manning being somehow involved - potentially anyway.  I'd be concerned that I'm a stop-gap until Manning gets experience under his belt.  

[Yoshinator]

5 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

There's a difference between Irsay saying he wasn't trying to hire Gruden -- which he kind of has to say at this point, not just because he wasn't able to and still has Pagano, but also out of respect to the Rooney rule -- and Irsay committing to Pagano in 2017 after he fired his GM -- which he did NOT have to do, but did anyway. 

 

Irsay definitively took a coaching change off the table for 2017, and he repeated himself during his presser. It's possible that things could change, but Irsay just told the world -- including any GM candidates -- that Pagano is staying this year. He did not have to do this.

I'll believe it when I see it. Everything could always change, which is Irsay's way of saying, I'll say one thing, I'll do another, then I'll change it later. The only things I believe right now are that Grigson is fired, and he has a list of GM's ready to interview. Nothing else can be believed as fact at this time.

[Andrew Luck fan club]

Irsay basically said the new GM can fire Pagano if he doesn't perform well after the 2017 season. So I don't think having to work with an average coach for a year will "scare away candidates". 

[Superman]

Oh, by the way -- and I hate to bring this up, honestly -- Jimmy Raye is the only candidate so far that satisfies the Rooney rule. 

[Fisticuffs111]

1 minute ago, Superman said:

Oh, by the way -- and I hate to bring this up, honestly -- Jimmy Raye is the only candidate so far that satisfies the Rooney rule. 

Yeah, I forgot the rule had extended to GM's.
 

[Defjamz26]

11 minutes ago, krunk said:

My feelings are somewhat similar to yours.  I can't see a lot of seriousness in him bringing in an outside Gm with Chuck still in place.  To me if he was really serious about bringing in one of those candidates he'd give them free rein to cut Chuck.  Instead he says you can't throw out the baby with the bath water.  I don't think Ray III would have much of a problem with Chuck being in place because he's been here building for that vision for what 5 years now so not much of an adjustment.   I can kind of see some of what Jared is saying, but there's no recent definitive statement directly from Chuck stating "Hey give me Jimmy Raye so I can keep my job".  It's just theory

I think the only reason he committed to Chuck was either because 

 

A. He knew he waited too long so getting a coach was out of the question 

 

B. He couldn't get the coach he wanted 

 

By the time he actually hires a GM it'll be February. It would be weird to change coaches so late. I think he is basically leaving Pagano as a lame duck for the new GM. It'll look better when he fires him because it'll look like it was just because it was a new GM who wanted his own guy.

[Fisticuffs111]

30 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

The fact that Pagano is staying is a notable drawback.  I don't think it will be such a deterrent that it will be the primary reason for a rejection.  It can eb seen as getting a free year that if it doesn't work out, you can hire who you want.  Maybe I'm overselling it.  

 

The bigger setback in my mind is the spectre of Manning being somehow involved - potentially anyway.  I'd be concerned that I'm a stop-gap until Manning gets experience under his belt.  

I see what you're saying.

 

I agree with the Manning situation and it's part of why I wouldn't be surprised if Raye III gets the job. Because if anybody knows what's going on, at least a vague idea, it's him. Like you kind of said, Irsay could potentially have plans for Peyton already and for all we know Raye III is cool with it.

[Superman]

18 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I'll believe it when I see it. Everything could always change, which is Irsay's way of saying, I'll say one thing, I'll do another, then I'll change it later. The only things I believe right now are that Grigson is fired, and he has a list of GM's ready to interview. Nothing else can be believed as fact at this time.

 

That's fine. There are a lot of people who question whether Irsay will change his mind on Pagano. I think there's a very slight chance, but I doubt he will.

 

Where I take issue is with you attributing all this conspiracy to Pagano. There's no evidence for it, and it's unfair. He's not a very good coach, he probably does want to save his job, but is he a lazy, selfish, duplicitous, deceitful back-stabber? I highly doubt it. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

33 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

How often does Irsay tell the truth? The majority of the time he's lying and denying things to cover up other things. I still believe a new GM would can Pagano, and I believe Pagano knows this.

 

I believe it would be easier to believe Irsay would make a condition of and write into the GM's contract that HC decisions are off limits for any Colts GM in 2017, only determined by the owner, as a condition to get the Colts  GM job. Take it or leave it. Now after 2017, everything goes because course change discussions with said owner and other F.O. personnel would have occurred all throughout the year and a unified plan agreed upon to move in a different direction as the case may be.

 

The GM's job this year will be on Free Agency, and the Draft.  Extremely important the GM does not whiff on this, or he may be out...

 

Some will say what if Pags goes 1 - 5 to open the season?  Irsay isn't the type to fire mid-season, I don't believe.  But if he did, he would likely promote Philbin to interim HC, leave Chud O.C., and wait until the end of the year to decide with the GM on a new HC.  This is how I think Jim would / will handle this.

[OffensivelyPC]

22 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I see what you're saying.

 

I agree with the Manning situation and it's part of why I wouldn't be surprised if Raye III gets the job. Because if anybody knows what's going on, at least a vague idea, it's him. Like you say, Irsay could have even have tentative plans already and for all we know Raye III knows and is cool with the idea.

It's obviously impossible to say at this point.  I like Raye III about as much as any other candidate.  I don't know what my heirarchy is, but of the guys linked to us so far, I like him, Paton, Ballard.  If we go out of house, I think I'm leaning towards Paton.  I like what they've done since he's been deemed assistant GM.  

 

I'm really curious about Wolfe.  But he's about as old as I am.  It's encouraging that he's lasted through a lot of evolution in NFL schematics and player personnel and picked up at an early age.  But he's moved up ranks pretty fast and that can also mean immaturity/inexperience.  He's a wildcard and sifting through the minutia is something we'll never be privy to.

[stitches]

 

This is new!!!! I hope we get the interview... He's a bit of a pipe dream, but... oh well, one can dream...

[Mr. Irrelevant]

1 minute ago, stitches said:

 

This is new!!!!

Irsay means business!

[OffensivelyPC]

2 minutes ago, stitches said:

 

This is new!!!!

That's one to follow, but I'm not holding my breath given some of what's already been discussed about him.

[Colts_Fan12]

1 minute ago, stitches said:

 

This is new!!!!

If DeCosta accepts the interview I see no way he isn't our GM guy has been wanted by everyone!!

[JColts72]

2 minutes ago, stitches said:

 

This is new!!!!

. Lets see how many requests lead to actual interviews.

[OffensivelyPC]

2 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

If DeCosta accepts the interview I see no way he isn't our GM guy has been wanted by everyone!!

lol you know how Irsay does when he wants someone - keeps them on lockdown till they say yes.  He'd be in uber-Irsay mode if DeCosta steps foot in here.

[Colts_Fan12]

Just now, OffensivelyPC said:

lol you know how Irsay does when he wants someone - keeps them on lockdown till they say yes.  He'd be in uber-Irsay mode if DeCosta steps foot in here.

Definitely I hope he gets this as a real possibility!

[CheezyColt]

Jeez, why did we move from Baltimore if we're just going to keep taking things from there anyway! 

[Superman]

19 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

That's one to follow, but I'm not holding my breath given some of what's already been discussed about him.

 

Yeah, let's see how this one goes. I expect him to decline just like he has every request the last five years, but if not, he's at the top of my list.

[RockThatBlue]

Its pretty obvious by the names floating around is that Irsay is wanting a better defense. Most of the people being interviewed are on teams that have good defenses.

[Andrew Luck fan club]

Just now, RockThatBlue said:

Its pretty obvious by the names floating around is that Irsay is wanting a better defense. Most of the people being interviewed are on teams that have good defenses.

That's why I want one of those candidates honestly. (Fitterer or Paton)

[OffensivelyPC]

1 minute ago, RockThatBlue said:

Its pretty obvious by the names floating around is that Irsay is wanting a better defense. Most of the people being interviewed are on teams that have good defenses.

Except Wolfe (Green Bay).