on JMV today / Peyton Manning rumors (merge)

[Superman]

Just now, ar7 said:

Guys of Peyton's stature (usually) do not take the traditional path of paying their dues before becoming in charge of a team.

 

For example?

 

Quote

Experience is overrated. Experienced coaches/front office people from Patriots, and other successful organizations, often experience failure.

 

So because experienced guys have failed, experience doesn't matter? 

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/black-or-white

 

Show me the inexperienced GMs who succeeded.

[CF4L]

1 minute ago, Superman said:

All these people complaining about how 'GRIGSON IS GOING TO WASTE LUCK'S PRIME!!!' but want to hire someone with zero front office experience and let him learn on the job???

 

Very objective...

 

 

Considering the person being discussed here was the guy Luck replaced why were you expecting objectivity?

 

That being said this is speculation at this point I really have a hard time believing this is true because having something like this out there this early isn't Manning's style.

 

Plus I don't see him wanting to return to the Colts beyond celebrating the 2006 team. I don't see this great love he has for the Colts that others insist he has. 

[braveheartcolt]

If true, sounds like a desperate ploy from Jim to 'prove' that Peyton is a Colt, not a Bronco. Ridiculous idea in all fairness. Although, maybe free pizza's could lure some top talent......

[Gramz]

1 minute ago, braveheartcolt said:

If true, sounds like a desperate ploy from Jim to 'prove' that Peyton is a Colt, not a Bronco. Ridiculous idea in all fairness. Although, maybe free pizza's could lure some top talent......

   yeah that would do it... 

[Gramz]

I guess time will tell.   Who knows if Peyton would even be interested.

 

 

[CF4L]

3 minutes ago, braveheartcolt said:

If true, sounds like a desperate ploy from Jim to 'prove' that Peyton is a Colt, not a Bronco. Ridiculous idea in all fairness. Although, maybe free pizza's could lure some top talent......

 

That ship sailed when Irsay kicked him to the curb and lamented how it was a disappointment that he only won 1 ring. Like it or not his legacy is tied to both franchises.

 

I accept it Jimbo needs to do the same. Plus I can't imagine Manning wanting to put himself in a position where Irsay has to fire him again(or Irsay having to do it again). This seems to be ignored why would Jimbo open that possible can of worms(or Peyton for that matter he's not desperate enough to be a GM when he can be a possible owner)

[mahagga73]

12 minutes ago, Superman said:

All these people complaining about how 'GRIGSON IS GOING TO WASTE LUCK'S PRIME!!!' but want to hire someone with zero front office experience and let him learn on the job???

 

Very objective...

Just because he was a great player, oh yeah sure, give him the GM job. Defies common sense. 

[CF4L]

Just now, mahagga73 said:

Just because he was a great player, oh yeah sure, give him the GM job. Defies common sense. 

 

And if he doesn't do a good job or its not quick enough people will want him fired. I really find it hard to believe Peyton would open himself up to that possibility. 

[Coltsman1788]

2 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher said:

while Kravitz was on, JMV said  he heard Irsay interested in bringing Peyton Manning as GM !!!

 

a)... Do you think it's true and it will happen?

 

b)... Would you like it or hate it?

 

btw, JMV says he's not just throwing out stuff. It's what he has been hearing.

Ugh...love Peyton but not as GM...he has zero experience. If this is true then the Colts are in the hands of an owner slowly losing his mind.   

[mahagga73]

2 minutes ago, Coltsman1788 said:

Ugh...love Peyton but not as GM...he has zero experience. If this is true then the Colts are in the hands of an owner slowly losing his mind.   

The fact he gave those 2 contract extensions tells me he might already have lost it. 

[Superman]

11 minutes ago, CF4L said:

Considering the person being discussed here was the guy Luck replaced why were you expecting objectivity?

 

That being said this is speculation at this point I really have a hard time believing this is true because having something like this out there this early isn't Manning's style.

 

Plus I don't see him wanting to return to the Colts beyond celebrating the 2006 team. I don't see this great love he has for the Colts that others insist he has. 

 

I don't know what your first paragraph means. Most people -- especially here -- don't have a problem with Luck replacing Manning, and I'm not sure what that has to do with Manning being GM. 

 

The report itself has nothing to do with what Manning wants, it's what Irsay is rumored to be considering. Doesn't have to be Manning's style.

 

I disagree with your last point. Some are bitter about Manning being cut. I don't believe he is.

[Coltsman1788]

Just now, mahagga73 said:

The fact he gave those 2 contract extensions tells me he might already have lost it. 

True dat.  But to follow that up with a Peyton GM hire would confirm his need for immediate commitment to the ward.  Lol. 

[DougDew]

And how hard would it be to fire GM Manning?

[CF4L]

Just now, Superman said:

 

I don't know what your first paragraph means. Most people -- especially here -- don't have a problem with Luck replacing Manning, and I'm not sure what that has to do with Manning being GM. 

 

The report itself has nothing to do with what Manning wants, it's what Irsay is rumored to be considering. Doesn't have to be Manning's style.

 

I disagree with your last point. Some are bitter about Manning being cut. I don't believe he is.

 

My first paragraph means that Manning is a Colts icon of course people aren't going to be objective about him just like there are Dolphins fans that wanted Marino to run the team.

 

I'm sure Manning isn't bitter about being cut(why would he clearly he got the better end of that deal) but I think its rather naive to think he's forgotten what Jim Irsay said about how only winning 1 ring was a disappointment and that he only wants players who want more than one ring. Being cut is a part of pro sports but those comments were rather ungrateful.

 

 

[mahagga73]

8 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I don't know what your first paragraph means. Most people -- especially here -- don't have a problem with Luck replacing Manning, and I'm not sure what that has to do with Manning being GM. 

 

The report itself has nothing to do with what Manning wants, it's what Irsay is rumored to be considering. Doesn't have to be Manning's style.

 

I disagree with your last point. Some are bitter about Manning being cut. I don't believe he is.

Anyone who thinks it wasn't the right move doesn't want to deal with facts. The fact he won a SB with Denver , doing virtually nothing because his arm was shot, with a great D, has led some misinformed fans to think they screwed up. When they let him go they had the 1 pick and a chance to draft a once in forever prospect and be good for years and it was questionable with that neck injury if he would ever play again. The fact they have horribly mismanaged and failed to take advantage of Luck rookie contract or draft properly is on Grigson. The Colts weren't even close to SB caliber when Peyton left. They did him a huge solid , got him a second  ring. 

[mahagga73]

If your serious about winning you go to who you want and make an offer they can't refuse. If that means Harbaugh , you go to him, offer him ridiculous money and a voice on personnel decisions. I don't care what he says, he doesn't want to be in college, he's a pro coach . The NFL is the pinnacle of football . 

[braveheartcolt]

Peyton as GM, Blue as HC. Status Quo it is then......

[aReggie7]

35 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

For example?

 

 

So because experienced guys have failed, experience doesn't matter? 

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/black-or-white

 

Show me the inexperienced GMs who succeeded.

 

 

 

Example = Michael Jordan...different sport I know. John Elway did have experience in the Arena Football League but it was as a co-owner.

 

I just don't see Peyton, or players of his stature, taking on a role where he isn't a top guy in the organization.

 

I said experience is overrated...not that it doesn't/never matters.

[jskinnz]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

The bolded is not really true. Elway had a ton of experience in business, he owned and ran an AFL team for a decade, and was eventually chairman of the AFL executive committee. Even when he joined the Broncos, he worked his way into the GM spot; Brian Xanders was the actual GM for several years. Fourteen years between his retirement and his becoming GM in Denver. He understands business, including sports business, and he spent a lot of time learning the business side of the NFL. He didn't just get bored, wake up and decide "I think I'll be a GM today." 

 

Let Peyton work his way into a front office role, if he actually wants it. Can't just slap the title on him and let him fumble his way through it.

 

I am pretty sure I heard them talking Manning today in context of a front office position but not necessarily as the GM, at least not now.  Further I think Manning, being the perfectionist that he is, would not think he could come in and do the GM job with absolutely no experience.  IMO, I believe he would think that an affront to Polian and others who paid their dues and did the job very well for a long time.

 

There does seem to be some smoke around this rumor.  Maybe there is a fire somewhere.  

[RockThatBlue]

1 hour ago, NorthernBlue said:

As a Colts fan that enjoys cheering and supporting the franchise, I would love it. Indy's biggest sport icon and arguably the GOAT coming back to the franchise, and instead of leading from the field, leading from the

offices? Sign me up. That would be so fun and exciting not gonna lie. 

 

But as a Colts fan that wants to see the team win? Nah. At least not yet. He's got no experience as many have stated. Yes Peyton has one of, if not the best football IQ in the biz, but reading defenses is different than evaluating talent, managing salaries, hiring coaches, and what not. He needs to know what he's doing before being given the job.

 

I'm not saying no forever. Just not now. You can't just point at Elway and say Peyton is gonna be similar. 

Pretty much spot on how I feel. Any Colts fan would love to have Peyton back in Indy in a role, but I'm not sure GM is the right one. Also, what if Peyton ended up being bad and Irsay had to fire him? I don't think anybody would want that situation to arise.

[oldunclemark]

2 hours ago, TDewar1987 said:

The real question is would Peyton even want to?

Exactly right..

I sometimes forget that Peyton isn't from Indianapolis.

He's from New Orleans and his wife, I beiieve is from Tennessee..

I think he still lives in Denver but he may be tired of moving his family around I would be,.

 

I dont think he's moving back to Indiana for any reason....and I'd be surprised if he wanted to work for Mr. Irsay again.

[jshipp23]

You can't compare Peyton to anyone else...I would never bet against Peyton, I think he would be able to spot talent and would change the culture here immediately. ..He doesn't need to be a cap wizard or financial guru..All teams have guys that control that...He needs to pick the right coach and draft well, and pick impact free agents..I think he would study harder than anyone and do his due dilligence..His presence here would instantly change the culture and breath new life into the franchise..He would turn Luck into the monster he was ordained to be in short order as well..

[oldunclemark]

28 minutes ago, DougDew said:

And how hard would it be to fire GM Manning?

That's such a good point, Dog.

 

Amd Peyton is loved in this state.

His popularity could only fall......and when you're the GM or coach fans don't care how great a player you used to be.

[New Zealands #1 Colts Fan]

what is a JMV???

[oldunclemark]

2 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

You can't compare Peyton to anyone else...I would never bet against Peyton, I think he would be able to spot talent and would change the culture here immediately. ..He doesn't need to be a cap wizard or financial guru..All teams have guys that control that...He needs to pick the right coach and draft well, and pick impact free agents..I think he would study harder than anyone and due his due dilligence..His presence here would instantly change the culture and breath new life into the franchise..He would turn Luck into the monster he was ordained to be in short order as well..

We'd have to create a position..where he judges talent..and doesn't do the rest of those things
Peyton and Eli have run a QB camp for 2 decades..they are experts on QB talent....which means they can judge WRs, TEs and DBs, safeties and the like..

[oldunclemark]

48 minutes ago, braveheartcolt said:

If true, sounds like a desperate ploy from Jim to 'prove' that Peyton is a Colt, not a Bronco. Ridiculous idea in all fairness. Although, maybe free pizza's could lure some top talent......

It sound s like a 'desperate ploy' from a guy who's watched his team go 8-8 two years in a row

[Superman]

32 minutes ago, CF4L said:

 

My first paragraph means that Manning is a Colts icon of course people aren't going to be objective about him just like there are Dolphins fans that wanted Marino to run the team.

 

Which has nothing to do with Luck... Careful, your agenda is showing.

 

Quote

I'm sure Manning isn't bitter about being cut(why would he clearly he got the better end of that deal) but I think its rather naive to think he's forgotten what Jim Irsay said about how only winning 1 ring was a disappointment and that he only wants players who want more than one ring. Being cut is a part of pro sports but those comments were rather ungrateful.

 

That's not what Irsay said. If anyone should feel slighted by those comments, it's Bill Polian, not Peyton Manning. No reason for you to project your hurt feelings onto other people.

[oldunclemark]

8 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

That's such a good point, Doug.

 

And Peyton is loved in this state.

His popularity could only fall......and when you're the GM or coach fans don't care how great a player you used to be.

 

[BigQandTheManiac]

IMO..he couldn't be any worse then Grigson, let's be honest. 

[jshipp23]

8 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

We'd have to create a position..where he judges talent..and doesn't do the rest of those things
Peyton and Eli have run a QB camp for 2 decades..they are experts on QB talent....which means they can judge WRs, TEs and DBs, safeties and the like..

He played for 16 seasons, and studied more film than anyone...I think he can spot a good player at any position..I also think he will lead from the top and we would have much more disclipline and accountability from coaches and players...He will expect everyone to work as hard as he did, and would bring in more guys with this mentality and it will spread. .

[BOTT]

31 minutes ago, ar7 said:

 

Example = Michael Jordan...different sport I know. John Elway did have experience in the Arena Football League but it was as a co-owner.

 

I just don't see Peyton, or players of his stature, taking on a role where he isn't a top guy in the organization.

 

I said experience is overrated...not that it doesn't/never matters.

MJ doesn't help your argument

[oldunclemark]

2 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

He played for 16 seasons, and studied more film than anyone...I think he can spot a good player at any position..I also think he will lead from the top and we would have much more disclipline and accountability from coaches and players...He will expect everyone to work as hard as he did, and would bring in more guys with this mentality and it will spread. .

Guys like Jeff Saturday? 

What does director of player personell do?  Isnt that the job we're describing.

He wouldn't be lost. Obviously, he could pick up the phone and call Bill Polian in 5 seconds.

 

The idea that he would be around Andrew Luck in his prime is exciting.

But he's a southern boy....he;s not from here

 

 

[BOTT]

22 minutes ago, New Zealands #1 Colts Fan said:

what is a JMV???

Local sports radio host and star of tv show "Air Wolf" and movies such as "Hooper"

[chrisfarley]

11 minutes ago, Luck12-to-Hilton13 said:

IMO..he couldn't be any worse then Grigson, let's be honest. 

Grigson had front-office experience with Philly and look where we are, it would be a major risk to get someone green in that area, especially with our roster and coaching issues.  As it has been stated (Superman, etc), a lessor role, perhaps.  Let's get this coaching thing figured out, then Irsay should see what Grigson's business plan looks like (SWOT Analysis, etc.)... separation of the Siamese Twins is the first order of business

[oldunclemark]

This is an odd coincidence, everyone..

but I'm listening to ESPN 1000 in Chicago today (Wednesday) and they had a long debate over whether someone like Peyton Manning could come into Chicago and be the director for Football operations ..

....working with John Fox and their GM

 

really.

[chad72]

24 minutes ago, New Zealands #1 Colts Fan said:

what is a JMV???

 

John Michael Vincent, local sports talk radio host, have met him in person at the St. Vincent's Sports Performance Center, call into his talk radio show all the time.

 

I trust that guy, he is not the kind who baits for air time like others do, like web page clicks. He must have some sources suggesting that to even be mentioned as a possibility.

 

However, personally, I feel it would be like a "hometown hero Larry Bird" type move and it would be a hard sell to fire him if they do end up hiring him on a whim, which I still find it appalling. I'd be more inclined to have Bill Polian back rather than Peyton, to be honest, for the GM position.

[oldunclemark]

sometimes ESPN stations all get the same morning notes

[Superman]

19 minutes ago, ar7 said:

Example = Michael Jordan...different sport I know.

 

That worked out well, right? 

 

Quote

John Elway did have experience in the Arena Football League but it was as a co-owner.

 

He was the CEO and de facto GM. He ran the team, hired and fired coaches and staff, and personnel decisions and business level decisions. He was eventually chairman of the executive committee. They were also pretty doggone good, making the playoffs 5/6 seasons and winning a championship in Year 3. He got a lot of experience in sports business.

 

He had previous experience running businesses, successfully.

 

Quote

I just don't see Peyton, or players of his stature, taking on a role where he isn't a top guy in the organization.

 

It's not up to me, but I wouldn't hire someone with zero experience to run my entire program.

 

Quote

I said experience is overrated...not that it doesn't/never matters.

 

You supported your argument by saying 'sometimes people with experience fail,' as if that means experience isn't important. 

 

Elway seems to be the model that people are pointing to for why Peyton Manning would be a good GM. I'm pointing to the fact that he had 14 years of business and sports administration experience prior to becoming GM, and Peyton has zero. 

 

I'm also asking for an example of a successful NFL GM/exec who had as little experience as Peyton. You'd be setting the man up for failure.

[aReggie7]

Just now, BOTT said:

MJ doesn't help your argument

 

How does it not? I said that guys of Peyton's stature do not typically go down this traditional path of building their resume and getting experience. I never said that MJ was a great executive. I also never said Peyton is going to make a great executive if he chooses to do that some day. I said none of us know if Peyton would be good/is ready to be a President/GM.

[Superman]

6 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

This is an odd coincidence, everyone..

but I'm listening to ESPN 1000 in Chicago today (Wednesday) and they had a long debate over whether someone like Peyton Manning could come into Chicago and be the director for Football operations ..

....working with John Fox and their GM

 

really.

 

The Chicago story is at least a day old.