Pats trade Chandler Jones to AZ for Cooper and 2nd rounder

[Superman]

 

[OffensivelyPC]

Yeesh, probably a fair trade.  Personally, I would have kept Jones.

[Yehoodi]

My guess is that they were not planning on resigning him and so they just lost the remainder of his contract.   The pats got AZ 2nd round pick and guard Jonathan Cooper, who was draft 7th overall in the 2013 draft.

 

I will miss Jones, but that is business.

[ReMeDy]

2 minutes ago, Yehoodi said:

I will miss Jones, but that is business.

 

Agreed. Hope you don't mind when the Pats trade Brady in two years with that big attractive contract of his.

[Superman]

I don't like Cooper, but throwing in the draft pick evens it out. 

 

People are talking about how the Pats will be able to whip Cooper into shape, but that's certainly not a given. So far, he's a disappointment.

[Surge89]

Move to fortify the oline in the last year's for Brady to try and prevent the inevitable deterioration of his skills from happening sooner.  And trying to get value on Jones as they won't be able to resign.  Makes a ton of sense.

[Yehoodi]

4 minutes ago, ReMeDy said:

 

Then you won't mind when the Pats trade Brady in two years with that big long contract of his.

 

Actually, I have been thinking the last few years that Brady was very tradable at the end of this year on the prior extension.  Basically, a top of the line QB for under 10 million each of the next two years.  I had thought the pats were lining up a trade will Brady the end of this year or next (which would of given Jimmy G. two years in our system).

 

With the new contract not so sure if he will be traded in the next two years, after say 2017.  In the last two year with the 14 million in dead cap space and salary at 14 mil per year plus 1 mil in roster bonus, its not as attractive of a trade, but it might happen.

 

As for Jones, yes the pats have done this before, Seymour is one good example.  Trade a player that you do not plan to resign and who has some time, here a year, left on his contract.  Basically the pats are trading one year of Jones for a 2nd round pick and one year of Cooper.

 

I would of like to had Jones for this year, and for the longer time, but we do have a lot of guys on our D that we need to sign in the next few years and a team can only have so many playmakers in their second contract.  

  

[Nesjan3]

2nd round pick seems a little much, but hey maybe i just dont want the pats to have more picks

[21isSuperman]

5 minutes ago, Surge89 said:

Move to fortify the oline in the last year's for Brady to try and prevent the inevitable deterioration of his skills from happening sooner.  And trying to get value on Jones as they won't be able to resign.  Makes a ton of sense.

Cooper has been very disappointing so far as a pro.  The thought that he'd step in right away and fortify their offensive line isn't accurate.

[PeterBowman]

2 minutes ago, 21isSuperman said:

Cooper has been very disappointing so far as a pro.  The thought that he'd step in right away and fortify their offensive line isn't accurate.

if Dante Scarnecchia can't whip him into shape, then he's a lost cause.

[Yehoodi]

16 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

Yeesh, probably a fair trade.  Personally, I would have kept Jones.

 

I would of like to keep Jones too, but with Hightower, Collins, Butler, McCourty, Niko, etc., a team can only have so many playmakers on D, and our guesses up here have been we will likely lose one of those players.  So although disappointing, not a major shock, something had to give.  By trading him we get a 2nd round pick.

 

I liked Jones and sorry to see him go.  We went to the same college.

[Hoosiernsavga]

I guess after Jones crazy stunt last season they wasn't sure about a long term deal with him. Jones is an athletic freak.  I would have traded our entire OL for Jones and started over! lol 

[Superman]

1 minute ago, Hoosiernsavga said:

I guess after Jones crazy stunt last season they wasn't sure about a long term deal with him. Jones is an athletic freak.  I would have traded our entire OL for Jones and started over! lol 

 

I forgot about that. Synthetic marijuana...

[Gavin]

My favorite O Lineman from the 2013 draft class. only 11 starts under his belt. I think he gets it turned around. To much talent not to. The mental aspect of the position will come to him. He needs starts under his belt to grow and learn

[Surge89]

28 minutes ago, 21isSuperman said:

Cooper has been very disappointing so far as a pro.  The thought that he'd step in right away and fortify their offensive line isn't accurate.

 

I understand that but the Pats have a long history of bringing the best out in olineman.  And he is talented to begin with.  

[NewColtsFan]

 

I'll be the contrarian.

 

Terrible trade.     Just terrible.      I hate it for the Pats.    And rather than synthetic marijuana, the only thing that makes sense to me is they tried to talk to him about signing a long-term deal and didn't like the numbers that his agent floated.     They decided Jones was too expensive and they were going to trade him.

 

But....

 

Cooper -- who so far has been a bust -- and a 2nd pick which is 61st over all?   The bottom of the 2nd round?

 

That's it?!?

 

No team made a better offer than that for Chandler Jones?

 

Completely shocking to me.     Completely.

 

I love the trade for Arizona.     They get Jones,   Cooper wasn't even going to start for them.   And it so it really only costs them their #2.    Where do I sign up for that deal!     Good for the Cardinals!

 

 

[richard pallo]

Pretty obvious Bill B. views fixing his OL more important than an Edge rusher.  You protect your franchise QB at all costs.  He doesn't want Brady getting killed like Luck and missing time.  You don't win with your franchise QB on the sidelines no matter how many Edge rushers you have.  Get that OL fixed above everything else, then attend to the defense. Bill knows that.  

[jskinnz]

The Pats have always been very good about getting something for a player who is not in their long term plans. That is the long-term view.  The short-term is that it definitely weakens them but in the long run a good move for them.

[Goatface Killah]

This is what the Pats do best. They know when to gamble and what risks are worth taking. They lost a first rounder so they do a two for one and at least get an additional second to soften the blow, alleviate some of their cap issues in the future while getting a talented OL that should help shore up their biggest weakness. 

 

There is a chance Cooper is just a bust but if they can atleast make him a serviceable starter its a great trade. 

[dgambill]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

I don't like Cooper, but throwing in the draft pick evens it out. 

 

People are talking about how the Pats will be able to whip Cooper into shape, but that's certainly not a given. So far, he's a disappointment.

I think that 2nd is a BIG deal to the Pats....they lost their first rd pick and adding another high pick is important to them in addressing their needs. I think Chandler is OBVIOUSLY the better player but I think they felt they wouldn't be able to pay what the market will demand next year (or want to franchise) and combine that with his recent incidents leading up to the playoffs I think they were ready to move on and try to help Tom out on the OL with a Guard they likely had highly evaluated. Certainly they've had great success grooming O linemen so I'm sure Cooper will turn into a solid addition.

[James]

1 hour ago, Yehoodi said:

My guess is that they were not planning on resigning him and so they just lost the remainder of his contract.   The pats got AZ 2nd round pick and guard Jonathan Cooper, who was draft 7th overall in the 2013 draft.

 

I will miss Jones, but that is business.

 

Cooper being a 7th overall pick doesn mean much. He isn't playing like one. You have to hope he develops quickly. Jones is the better player, and being in a better defense in Arizona he'll look even better. Better hope you hit on that 2nd round pick, otherwise this trade is a win for Arizona.

[Archer]

I don't think it's a bad trade for NE, as Cooper becomes their best OG.  He may be a bust for his draft status, but he is a step towards improving the interior of their line (which was worse than our interior last year).

[bayone]

2 hours ago, Yehoodi said:

My guess is that they were not planning on resigning him and so they just lost the remainder of his contract.   The pats got AZ 2nd round pick and guard Jonathan Cooper, who was draft 7th overall in the 2013 draft.

 

I will miss Jones, but that is business.

 

sorry no link, but what i read was arizona needs an outside rush specialist to help inside rusher campbell , Pats need a steadier OL, and by getting a 2nd round pick it helps since dont have a first , also arizona expects Jones to see more1 on 1 looks & les double teams as a result

 

The issue is Cooper had a bad pre season injury and hopfully with offsesaon will get stronger as was benched by year end after starting 9 games I belive

 

U know pats love to rotate OL in & out & Cooper is hypper athletic if recovers his form & can help protect most valuable assett Brady

 

alos with compensatory 4rd round pick pats now have 4 picks in top 100 # 60, # 61, # 91 & # 96

 

OL couldnt stop Broncos D , this will help and broncos D  have lost players

 

[bayone]

55 minutes ago, bayone said:

 

sorry no link, but what i read was arizona needs an outside rush specialist to help inside rusher campbell , Pats need a steadier OL, and by getting a 2nd round pick it helps since dont have a first , also arizona expects Jones to see more1 on 1 looks & les double teams as a result

 

The issue is Cooper had a bad pre season injury and hopfully with offsesaon will get stronger as was benched by year end after starting 9 games I belive

 

U know pats love to rotate OL in & out & Cooper is hypper athletic if recovers his form & can help protect most valuable assett Brady

 

alos with compensatory 4rd   round pick pats now have 4 picks in top 100 # 60, # 61, # 91 & # 96

 

OL couldnt stop Broncos D , this will help and broncos D  have lost players

 

 

Thats compensatory 3rd round pick I Errored above, sorry

[COLTS449]

LOL at this move. 1st up If Grigson knew he was available why didn't we offer up a 1st rounder for him? I know the Pats wouldn't want to trade him to us, but I mean come on. They would for the 18th pick of the draft and don't say they wouldn't have. 2nd. How in the holy freaking heck can a young premier pass rusher not be in your long term plans. This kid is what? 25-26? He's a double digit sack EDGE rusher IN - HIS - PRIME!!!!! This is the absolute dumbest move I've seen in a while. LOL It's like "Oh here Arizona, we don't want our young top tier EDGE rusher" "You guys can have him for that 1st round bust Jonathan Cooper and a late 2nd round pick" LOL. Just wow. Watch and see. He'll be a top 5 EDGE rusher next year as a stand up 34 OLB. Now come on with it Usual crowd. Tell me how everything I said is wrong when its obviously right. Either way you spin it. This is a bad move. You know unless Cooper becomes an All-Pro top tier guard, and that 2nd round pick is another EDGE rusher who can give them the same production Jones did NEXT YEAR.

[throwing BBZ]

3 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I'll be the contrarian.

 

Terrible trade.     Just terrible.      I hate it for the Pats.    And rather than synthetic marijuana, the only thing that makes sense to me is they tried to talk to him about signing a long-term deal and didn't like the numbers that his agent floated.     They decided Jones was too expensive and they were going to trade him.

 

But....

 

Cooper -- who so far has been a bust -- and a 2nd pick which is 61st over all?   The bottom of the 2nd round?

 

That's it?!?

 

No team made a better offer than that for Chandler Jones?

 

Completely shocking to me.     Completely.

 

I love the trade for Arizona.     They get Jones,   Cooper wasn't even going to start for them.   And it so it really only costs them their #2.    Where do I sign up for that deal!     Good for the Cardinals!

 

 

 

 So you are certain that Cooper was not going to win the starting center job? Of course you aren`t.
 And Jones is in the last year of his deal and a ? mark as a weird drug offender.
  The 2nd round pick should become a quality starter and Cooper should compete for a starting spot.
 No, this was a good deal for the Pats, who also seem to have several good edge prospects already on their roster.

[buccolts]

21 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

LOL at this move. 1st up If Grigson knew he was available why didn't we offer up a 1st rounder for him? I know the Pats wouldn't want to trade him to us, but I mean come on. They would for the 18th pick of the draft and don't say they wouldn't have. 2nd. How in the holy freaking heck can a young premier pass rusher not be in your long term plans. This kid is what? 25-26? He's a double digit sack EDGE rusher IN - HIS - PRIME!!!!! This is the absolute dumbest move I've seen in a while. LOL It's like "Oh here Arizona, we don't want our young top tier EDGE rusher" "You guys can have him for that 1st round bust Jonathan Cooper and a late 2nd round pick" LOL. Just wow. Watch and see. He'll be a top 5 EDGE rusher next year as a stand up 34 OLB. Now come on with it Usual crowd. Tell me how everything I said is wrong when its obviously right. Either way you spin it. This is a bad move. You know unless Cooper becomes an All-Pro top tier guard, and that 2nd round pick is another EDGE rusher who can give them the same production Jones did NEXT YEAR.

 

Have I ever told you how much I appreciate you being around to tell us all what's right from wrong, and what's really going on in the 'In' crowd?

[buccolts]

24 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

[BOTT]

4 hours ago, PeterBowman said:

if Dante Scarnecchia can't whip him into shape, then he's a lost cause.

Sucks the pats hired him back

[Yehoodi]

2 hours ago, James said:

 

Cooper being a 7th overall pick doesn mean much. He isn't playing like one. You have to hope he develops quickly. Jones is the better player, and being in a better defense in Arizona he'll look even better. Better hope you hit on that 2nd round pick, otherwise this trade is a win for Arizona.

 

Time will tell.  I never get too worried about trades if in my heart I feel that the Pats were not going to resign the player.  And if so, then all we lost was 16 games of Jones in exchange for a 2nd rounder pick and a flyer on a 1st round draft pick that has been injured for a good portion of his career.

 

Perhaps there is a chance he may turn it around, and we resign him.  As we have a need on OL, this guy will likely be better than what we got and we have some spares on the DL.  Yes Jones was a solid DL, but when one looks at it as a even trade of 16 games for each player (both are FA at then end of the year), we are giving up a perhaps better player on the other side of the ball where we have depth and filling in a need with a player that is not as good, but we get a 2nd round draft pick on top of this exchange.

 

For me, I like the trade.  Maybe Cooper will turn it around, or maybe he will be serviceable to solid and we can resign him at a reasonable rate, he will not demand a second contract level pay of a first round talent if he is only serviceable to solid next year and we might be able to have that level talent on the team for reasonable pay.  Whereas Jones was gone regardless.

 

Time will tell.

 

A few years ago we traded Seymour (9 games left on contract) for no player and Oakland's first round pick, which turned into Nate Solder who is still on the team.  So 9 games of Seymour in 2009 (when we were not going anywhere anyways in 2009) and we got Nate Solder for 4 years of his rookie contract and we resign him.

 

As such, we lose Jones 16 games, but get a player for 16 games and a 2nd round pick.  So bottom line its a player for 16 games and a 2nd round pick for 4 years of his rookie contract.    

[BOTT]

3 hours ago, GoatBeard said:

This is what the Pats do best. They know when to gamble and what risks are worth taking. They lost a first rounder so they do a two for one and at least get an additional second to soften the blow, alleviate some of their cap issues in the future while getting a talented OL that should help shore up their biggest weakness. 

 

There is a chance Cooper is just a bust but if they can atleast make him a serviceable starter its a great trade. 

Who is going to replaces jones' pass rush?

[oldunclemark]

Real good deal for Arizona..

 

He could go free agent in 2017 but they';re going for it all THIS year

[Goatface Killah]

4 minutes ago, BOTT said:

Who is going to replaces jones' pass rush?

 

Good question.

 

They might be looking for an OLB in the draft now.

 

Bill has a plan I'm sure.

[Yehoodi]

3 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I'll be the contrarian.

 

Terrible trade.     Just terrible.      I hate it for the Pats.    And rather than synthetic marijuana, the only thing that makes sense to me is they tried to talk to him about signing a long-term deal and didn't like the numbers that his agent floated.     They decided Jones was too expensive and they were going to trade him.

 

But....

 

Cooper -- who so far has been a bust -- and a 2nd pick which is 61st over all?   The bottom of the 2nd round?

 

That's it?!?

 

No team made a better offer than that for Chandler Jones?

 

Completely shocking to me.     Completely.

 

I love the trade for Arizona.     They get Jones,   Cooper wasn't even going to start for them.   And it so it really only costs them their #2.    Where do I sign up for that deal!     Good for the Cardinals!

 

 

 

I hope you said "terrible" with a Charles Barkley twang.  .

 

I have a few thoughts but most are in my prior post to James if you wish to read.

 

I see where you are coming from, but bottom line for me, we were not going to be able to resign Jones, Hightower, Collins, Butler, with McCourty contract on the books and if we want to keep Ryan and Niko.  One can only have so many playmakers and someone was going to have to go. 

 

In light of that the Pats realized that Jones was the odd man out (which many here in NE were thinking) and so why not get in exchange for the remaining 16 games of his contract a serviceable OL and a 2nd round pick.   Like with our Seymour trade in '09, we have a high draft pick which should give us a solid player for 4 years.

 

With our need on the OL and depth on DL, I am comfortable with the trade.  

[NewColtsFan]

12 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 So you are certain that Cooper was not going to win the starting center job? Of course you aren`t.
 And Jones is in the last year of his deal and a ? mark as a weird drug offender.
  The 2nd round pick should become a quality starter and Cooper should compete for a starting spot.
 No, this was a good deal for the Pats, who also seem to have several good edge prospects already on their roster.

 

Yes,  NE has loads of pass rushing talent.    So they traded from a position of strength.

 

But Jones is a proven difference maker.     Neither Cooper or the 61st pick are.

 

I'm just stunned that NE couldn't get a better offer than this.....?

 

[throwing BBZ]

23 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

LOL at this move. 1st up If Grigson knew he was available why didn't we offer up a 1st rounder for him? I know the Pats wouldn't want to trade him to us, but I mean come on. They would for the 18th pick of the draft and don't say they wouldn't have. 2nd. How in the holy freaking heck can a young premier pass rusher not be in your long term plans. This kid is what? 25-26? He's a double digit sack EDGE rusher IN - HIS - PRIME!!!!! This is the absolute dumbest move I've seen in a while. LOL It's like "Oh here Arizona, we don't want our young top tier EDGE rusher" "You guys can have him for that 1st round bust Jonathan Cooper and a late 2nd round pick" LOL. Just wow. Watch and see. He'll be a top 5 EDGE rusher next year as a stand up 34 OLB. Now come on with it Usual crowd. Tell me how everything I said is wrong when its obviously right. Either way you spin it. This is a bad move. You know unless Cooper becomes an All-Pro top tier guard, and that 2nd round pick is another EDGE rusher who can give them the same production Jones did NEXT YEAR.

 

 They already have Sheard (with 8 sacks playing 51% of their snaps) and 2 2nd year edge rushers coming along to add depth.
 And the guy is in his last year of his deal.
 And you love his weird drug issue to boot. Ya, we can take him for one year, for our 1st that can be on our roster for 4 years for about $2.4M per. Good grief kid!
  And Sadly you don`t get it that one guy doesn`t make a defense. Watch Belicheck and learn kid.

[NewColtsFan]

1 minute ago, Yehoodi said:

 

I hope you said "terrible" with a Charles Barkley twang.  .

 

I have a few thoughts but most are in my prior post to James if you wish to read.

 

I see where you are coming from, but bottom line for me, we were not going to be able to resign Jones, Hightower, Collins, Butler, with McCourty contract on the books and if we want to keep Ryan and Niko.  One can only have so many playmakers and someone was going to have to go. 

 

In light of that the Pats realized that Jones was the odd man out (which many here in NE were thinking) and so why not get in exchange for the remaining 16 games of his contract a serviceable OL and a 2nd round pick.   Like with our Seymour trade in '09, we have a high draft pick which should give us a solid player for 4 years.

 

With our need on the OL and depth on DL, I am comfortable with the trade.  

 

I don't think you can compare this trade to the Seymor trade.

 

In that trade NE got TWO #1's.

 

That's WAY more than what you got today.....

 

 

[COLTS449]

8 minutes ago, buccolts said:

 

Have I ever told you how much I appreciate you being around to tell us all what's right from wrong, and what's really going on in the 'In' crowd?

 

No, But thank you buc. That really means a lot to me......

 

 

Dude. This is a NFL fan forum. More specifically a Colts forum. So we all are fellow Colts fans. We're all on the same side. But....We're going to have different opinions. Most of us are anyway. What I say is how I feel. Nobody's opinion is right or wrong on here. Its just their opinion. Unless that say something that isn't factual like, you know for example "Clayton Geathers is a cornerback LOL. That would be wrong. But that's a different type of thing. If its my opinion that this was an incredibly dumb move then that's fine. That's how I feel. If somebody says its a good move then that's their opinion. We wont know who's right about it until the season starts and we see how that 2nd rounder and Cooper are performing.

[Yehoodi]

36 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

LOL at this move. 1st up If Grigson knew he was available why didn't we offer up a 1st rounder for him? I know the Pats wouldn't want to trade him to us, but I mean come on. They would for the 18th pick of the draft and don't say they wouldn't have. 2nd. How in the holy freaking heck can a young premier pass rusher not be in your long term plans. This kid is what? 25-26? He's a double digit sack EDGE rusher IN - HIS - PRIME!!!!! This is the absolute dumbest move I've seen in a while. LOL It's like "Oh here Arizona, we don't want our young top tier EDGE rusher" "You guys can have him for that 1st round bust Jonathan Cooper and a late 2nd round pick" LOL. Just wow. Watch and see. He'll be a top 5 EDGE rusher next year as a stand up 34 OLB. Now come on with it Usual crowd. Tell me how everything I said is wrong when its obviously right. Either way you spin it. This is a bad move. You know unless Cooper becomes an All-Pro top tier guard, and that 2nd round pick is another EDGE rusher who can give them the same production Jones did NEXT YEAR.

 

I see where you are coming from COLTS449.  But we need to look beyond Jones and look at the entire picture of the pats team.

 

Surely in isolation Jones is a great player and any team would want him.  But we have a lot of playmakers on our team that are up for contract next year and given some of our existing contracts we very likely were not going to be able to keep all of them and someone had to go.

 

The pats FO figured it would be Jones and wanted to get something for him before he left for FA.

 

I elaborate more on the above in my two prior post to James and NewColtsFans if you more detail on my points.

 

[Yehoodi]

7 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't think you can compare this trade to the Seymor trade.

 

In that trade NE got TWO #1's.

 

That's WAY more than what you got today.....

 

 

 

No, we only go one #1 in that trade. .

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4450767

 

I stand corrected, I thought he was traded near the end of September, I forgot.  He play all 16 games in Oakland.