Report: LT Joe Thomas and C Alex Mack on trade block. (Mega-Merge)

[BOTT]

RED FLAG! RED FLAG!

 

If Cleveland is trading them, its because there is something wrong. We learned our lesson with Trent Richardson, lets not do it again. Remember that Grigson's signings have a 50/50 chance of working out with the team.

Only a donkey would have made that trade for TBust. Cleveland actually has some guys that can play.

[BOTT]

Actually, I don't want Grigson doing anything. GM's on the hot seat get desperate and do dumb %.

[Moncrief]

Alex Mack or Joe Haden please

[Phil]

I know that when someone's on the trade block it's a bit of a red flag, but I'd take Joe Thomas in a second. Mack, too, honestly, but Thomas... wow. That'd make me feel so much better about our line. I'd give up a second easily. I might even give up our first, if we looked into it and the red flag is more about fit there and not about Thomas himself. 

[Mr.Debonair]

Alex Mack or Joe Haden please

Joe Haden is overrated IMO but I guess he'd be an upgrade over Toler

[Colts_Fan12]

We have ?! AC has been playing like crap...absolutely crap

for the first time since drafting him

[NewColtsFan]

Castonzo stinks man

 

You know who else stinks man?     Andrew Luck.      You looking to move him?

 

And Castanzo has only struggled this year.      You're ready to dump a huge contract and take the cap hits over a half season?

 

And do it all right before we're trying to sign Luck, Fleener and Allen?

 

And the best years for both Thomas and Mack....   are behind them.   

 

And think this idea stinks man.......

[csmopar]

Only a donkey would have made that trade for TBust. Cleveland actually has some guys that can play.

Actually everyone, and I mean everyone, thought Grigs was a genius for that trade when it happened..... turns out it wasn't what we were expecting. I really wish it'd been a conditional 1st round pick, based in yard per carry but oh well

[Jason_]

Actually everyone, and I mean everyone, thought Grigs was a genius for that trade when it happened..... turns out it wasn't what we were expecting. I really wish it'd been a conditional 1st round pick, based in yard per carry but oh well

 

If you're referring to the TRich trade then you are absolutely wrong.  EVERYONE absolutely did not think Grigson was a genius for that trade.  I had no problem with him bringing Trent in but hated giving up a 1st round pick for him.  There were plenty of others who felt the same way.

[csmopar]

If you're referring to the TRich trade then you are absolutely wrong.  EVERYONE absolutely did not think Grigson was a genius for that trade.  I had no problem with him bringing Trent in but hated giving up a 1st round pick for him.  There were plenty of others who felt the same way.

By everyone, I was referring to the talking heads around the league/broadcasts......

[Superman]

I know that when someone's on the trade block it's a bit of a red flag, but I'd take Joe Thomas in a second. Mack, too, honestly, but Thomas... wow. That'd make me feel so much better about our line. I'd give up a second easily. I might even give up our first, if we looked into it and the red flag is more about fit there and not about Thomas himself. 

 

And play him where?

[Colts_Fan12]

If you're referring to the TRich trade then you are absolutely wrong. EVERYONE absolutely did not think Grigson was a genius for that trade. I had no problem with him bringing Trent in but hated giving up a 1st round pick for him. There were plenty of others who felt the same way.

yeah I liked Trent and was fine but I'm of the belief you just don't use 1st round picks on RBs

[aaron11]

yeah I liked Trent and was fine but I'm of the belief you just don't use 1st round picks on RBs

i have to disagree.  gurley was the best player in his draft class and he was worth it

[Colts_Fan12]

And play him where?

replace AC!! don't ya know he sucks? Atleast that's what I gathered from the thread

[Colts_Fan12]

i have to disagree. gurley was the best player in his draft class and he was worth it

still not worth it they don't last as long as players of other positions. You can also find great backs in the mid to late rounds. You don't need an elite RB you need and elite line

[aaron11]

still not worth it they don't last as long as players of other positions. You can also find great backs in the mid to late rounds. You don't need an elite RB you need and elite line

some guys are an exception to the rules.  gurley wins games for his team when a average back wouldnt.  AP and Walter payton did the same.

 

as for longevity, you never know.  peterson is still running strong for the vikings.  payton played for 12 years!  the average career is less than 4

[RockThatBlue]

Mack has a no-trade clause.

But he can OK a trade.

[AZColt11]

That's kinda silly. If the colts whiff on another 1st rounder should they stop drafting in the first round? Plus, these guys are in a totally different class than the marginal players Grigson has signed.

I would respectfully disagree and I don't think what you said was silly.  It's your opinion and you are entitled to it.  I just see a lot of the guys Grigs has signed not working out and I question his eye for FA talent.  I think he has done a little better via the draft, although not so much with the OL.  I don't see the Colts doing as well this year due to a littany of reasons and I think they will have some higher draft picks next year.  What they choose to do with those will be VITALLY important to building this franchise further.  

 

We all want the same thing, an awesome Colts team, right?

[RockThatBlue]

Castonzo stinks man

No he doesn't.

[Kyle]

delete

[Kyle]

why are people so high on Castanzo?  OLine has been our biggest issue over the last 5 years and he is the leader of the OLine.  He isn't real fast, not real strong, not great at run blocking, not great at pass blocking... I feel we may have made a mistake in resigning him for as much as we did.  He is pretty good but we paid him like he is elite.

 

Polian did the same thing when he resigned Hayden, Clark, Saturday, and Brackett as the highest paid at their position.  Shortly after we were in salary cap hell.

[Valpo2004]

Would rather spend the first round pick in the draft on a tackle.  

 

At this rate we will be drafting fairly highly.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

Would rather spend the first round pick in the draft on a tackle.  

 

At this rate we will be drafting fairly highly.

 

How would you feel about trading them a '17 draft pick? Could be the best of both worlds: address a huge area of need, Center, and get another touted OL prospect in the first round of the '16 draft.

[The Lucky Neck Beard]

Would rather spend the first round pick in the draft on a tackle.  

 

At this rate we will be drafting fairly highly.

Correct me if I am wrong but we will pick in the high 20s if we make the play-offs...  even if we have a terrible season.  If we continue to lose I almost hope one of our division rivals steps up so we can draft higher ;) 

[Steamboat_Shaun]

I'm on mobile so I can't provide a direct link, but NFL.com and PFT are both running the story.

I'm not sure how it would affect our long term cap situation, but would it be worth trading our 2016 1st round pick for both players? This would give us a top notch OL if we moved Costanzo to RT and Reitz to RG, and we would have the rest of the draft/FA period in the off-season to focus exclusively on the defense.

What do you think?

 

Yes.

[csmopar]

Well if it happens, we have 24 hours to get it done...

[Valpo2004]

Correct me if I am wrong but we will pick in the high 20s if we make the play-offs...  even if we have a terrible season.  If we continue to lose I almost hope one of our division rivals steps up so we can draft higher ;) 

 

Oh I think you are right, a playoff berth automatically puts us down lower on the draft board.  

 

Still I think I'd rather spend the first round pick on drafting a tackle in the actual draft.

 

Both of these guys are up there, Joe Thomas is 30 and they are both commanding huge salaries.

 

Draft a good OL and he's young (usually around 22) and you have him on the cheap for 4 years.  Shoot I think I'd rather trade up in the 1st to do this then trade away picks for aging vets.

 

We're like the oldest team in the league and building this team via free agency and trades isn't working.  We need to go young and cheap not old and expensive.  

[a06cc]

This is about not have the correct offensive lineman to run a power scheme. We have mostly zone personel. Look up each one of our guys fits for schemes when you get the chance. I posted it last year.

[Zoltan]

What I'm seeing as the problem is that we keep going with the mentality that if we get this one guy then were super bowl champs and usually in this process we get an aging star instead of young talent that may take a year to develop.

[Phil]

And play him where?

Anywhere he wants, honestly. Let him be LT and move Castonzo to RT. Put him at RT. 

We need to improve that line somehow. Does best player available only work for you when drafting? Thomas is a stud to be available on the market, unless there's some deep dark secret we're not seeing. 

[Phil]

Would rather spend the first round pick in the draft on a tackle.  

 

At this rate we will be drafting fairly highly.

 

I would agree if we weren't still destined to win the division and draft in that position. Our division is garbage in a stick. I don't think there will be a lineman of that quality at our pick. Plus-- what if the "best player" on the board is a short, fast WR?  

 

I'd rather build with drafted youth, but right now anything that could fix this line seems like goal one for us. If we don't fix the line, we're going to end up truncating the career of our franchise QB. He's already dealing with a shoulder injury that could be chronic and trying to push through broken ribs to will us to win games. He deserves better than the protection we're giving him. 

[Phil]

What is with Cleveland all the sudden? 

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/11/browns_willing_to_deal_barkevi.html 

 

I'd take Mingo, too. I hope we're at least talking to them about this fire sale. Sure, T-Rich was a bad move, but if we were to pick up a couple guys from them for a pick, we could come out way ahead. I'd give our first for one of the two linemen and Mingo and never think twice.

[Superman]

Anywhere he wants, honestly. Let him be LT and move Castonzo to RT. Put him at RT. 

We need to improve that line somehow. Does best player available only work for you when drafting? Thomas is a stud to be available on the market, unless there's some deep dark secret we're not seeing. 

 

Yeah, BPA is about drafting young, relatively cheap talent. Because there's a salary cap. Your move would have us paying $11m/year to a RT who has never played RT. 

 

As for the 'deep, dark secret,' it's not deep or dark. Joe Thomas is a $10m/year player, and would presumably cost a pretty penny to trade for. It's a very risky proposition, particularly for a player at a position where we're already pretty good.

[Phil]

Yeah, BPA is about drafting young, relatively cheap talent. Because there's a salary cap. Your move would have us paying $11m/year to a RT who has never played RT. 

 

As for the 'deep, dark secret,' it's not deep or dark. Joe Thomas is a $10m/year player, and would presumably cost a pretty penny to trade for. It's a very risky proposition, particularly for a player at a position where we're already pretty good.

 

Yeah-- the BPA thing was me being playful . 

I realize it's a financial risk. I would advocate for letting him play LT and juggling what we have, since it's not working. I'd rather have Mack if we're going just by position, since we could use a center much more. But I don't agree that any part of our line is "already pretty good." If you honestly think anyone on the line has shown and proved, I salute you, but in my mind good would mean that we have time to pass. 

[Superman]

Yeah-- the BPA thing was me being playful . 

I realize it's a financial risk. I would advocate for letting him play LT and juggling what we have, since it's not working. I'd rather have Mack if we're going just by position, since we could use a center much more. But I don't agree that any part of our line is "already pretty good." If you honestly think anyone on the line has shown and proved, I salute you, but in my mind good would mean that we have time to pass. 

 

We have time to pass. The passing game has a lot of issues, and the OL is just one of them. Go back to the way we played in the second half of the Titans game, and I think we're plenty good enough. I'm not dodging obvious opportunities to get better, but the play calling and execution are the major issues, and even the great Joe Thomas doesn't fix those things.

 

AC is actually really good. Whatever he has going on right now should pass in time. Hopefully it has already. I'm confident he could play RT if necessary, but I wouldn't want to move him over there in the middle of the season, while introducing a new player at the critical LT spot.

 

I'd take Mack for the right price. Same for Mingo and Haden.

[BOTT]

Actually everyone, and I mean everyone, thought Grigs was a genius for that trade when it happened..... turns out it wasn't what we were expecting. I really wish it'd been a conditional 1st round pick, based in yard per carry but oh well

I ripped him for it....on this forum. But not everyone praised him for it, but yes, most believed it was at least a win win. I wouldn't have given more than a 5th based on his Cleveland tape.

[csmopar]

I ripped him for it....on this forum. But not everyone praised him for it, but yes, most believed it was at least a win win. I wouldn't have given more than a 5th based on his Cleveland tape.

Yeah maybe I should change that to 99 percent

[BOTT]

I would respectfully disagree and I don't think what you said was silly.  It's your opinion and you are entitled to it.  I just see a lot of the guys Grigs has signed not working out and I question his eye for FA talent.  I think he has done a little better via the draft, although not so much with the OL.  I don't see the Colts doing as well this year due to a littany of reasons and I think they will have some higher draft picks next year.  What they choose to do with those will be VITALLY important to building this franchise further.  

 

We all want the same thing, an awesome Colts team, right?

Well, if you believe he has questionable eye for free agent talent then we more or less agree. He reminds me of me when I draft in fantasy football.....I wanna win, but I also wanna show you how smart I am lol. And it never works.

[BOTT]

Yeah maybe I should change that to 99 percent

I think a lot of people went off his college career and only saw a few highlights of him in Cleveland.

[csmopar]

I think a lot of people went off his college career and only saw a few highlights of him in Cleveland.

I admit...I was one of them. Boy was I fooled