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Dark_Indy

The Patriots pre-game thread -- Week 6 (merge)

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Over and over again I see this sort of denial from you guys where you talk about that great front seven and then you move on to another topic when I ask why you have given up so much against the run? I seek a straight answer and then you guys flip and start talking about pass rush. The pass rush you have mostly gotten against second tier guys who don't even know how to move in the pocket very well to distribute the football. Guys like Bortles, Tyrod Taylor, Brandon Weeden

 

Bend but don't break my friend. That's what we do. We let teams go on long runs, wasting clock, then ending up with 3. Just ask the Cowboys about that.

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You mean the tight man coverage against Cole Beasley and Kevin Williams? What do you think your guys would have looked like with Dez and Romo out there? Man the Cowboyz offense was handicapped and u know it..

If Dez was out there, they shut him down, just like they will shut down Hilton. They take out the best man and force you to beat them with someone else. Watch Sunday, I'll bet they have over the top help come down on Hilton so he will never really be open after first contact. Hilton had 1 catch for 36 yards last year in the AFCCG. That's the same thing I expect this week. Someone else is going to have to step up.

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Hey Colts fans, I'm gonna give you a heads up. The fans on the Cowboys forum have been complaining the Patriots were cheating all day last week. How? Illegal pick plays. They said the Patriots were called for 1, but got away with about 20. They have no less than two threads on the subject.

 

According to some, the Patriots haven't played a fair game since 1999.

I really don't use the Deflategate stuff as an excuse. You guys just had the better team last season. Do I think something fishy was going on and Tom knew about, sure IMO, but it still didn't affect the outcome of the Championship Game. Honestly I think a lot of people just like bringing the cheating stuff up to get on Patriots fans nerves just to see what they will Post. Pats fans get so overly defensive and some of the Posts are just funny to read. If you guys weren't so uptight about everything the negative Posts would probably stop.

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Ugh the Pats D has been hard to figure out.

Steelers -- they couldn't stop a cold on the ground, and Butler had excellent coverage but brown still got the catches. But only 14 points before the game was over '( a TD w 2 sec left is definition garbage time)

bills -- 3 great quarters of D followed by a 4th quarter that was mind boggling. Completely on the coaches.

Jags -- 10 non garbage time points an excellent game

Dallas 6 total points and total domination.

So the Pats D outside of 1 bad quarter to buffalo has not let up many points.

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If Dez was out there, they shut him down, just like they will shut down Hilton. They take out the best man and force you to beat them with someone else. Watch Sunday, I'll bet they have over the top help come down on Hilton so he will never really be open after first contact. Hilton had 1 catch for 36 yards last year in the AFCCG. That's the same thing I expect this week. Someone else is going to have to step up.

Andre woke up last week and Moncrief has got better. We also have Gore this season compared to Trent and Boom last season. Our talent is a bit better this season. Defensively your talent isn't better, it's worse so I think it should be a much better game this time around.

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This game will be closer then most think. And I don't care if people think I am nuts for saying that.

 

 

come-at-me-bro.gif

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If Dez was out there, they shut him down, just like they will shut down Hilton. They take out the best man and force you to beat them with someone else. Watch Sunday, I'll bet they have over the top help come down on Hilton so he will never really be open after first contact. Hilton had 1 catch for 36 yards last year in the AFCCG. That's the same thing I expect this week. Someone else is going to have to step up.

Ok, good luck with:

 

Coby Fleener

Dwayne Allen

Andre Johnson

Donte Moncrief

Philip Dorsett

Ahmad Bradshaw......

oh  yeah...... AND Frank Gore.

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Looks like we'll have Ahmad Bradshaw and Frank Gore this Sunday.  At least I'm hoping because they may sit him out being that he hasn't played any games this year.

Bradshaw has been solid for you guys in the past. Gore has been running great too. I am really interested to see the Colts offensive approach especially if Luck plays. I have to think passes will be short to keep pressure off of him and then some running to keep the Pats D off balance.

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Bradshaw has been solid for you guys in the past. Gore has been running great too. I am really interested to see the Colts offensive approach especially if Luck plays. I have to think passes will be short to keep pressure off of him and then some running to keep the Pats D off balance.

 

 

Yes that's what I'm thinking.  Focus will be on establishing rhythm and maintaining drives with the full intent of scoring on every drive.  Whether it be 3 or 7 just focus on scoring on each drive.  It's not one of those deals where it's a bad offensive team that just sits on the clock knowing they don't have any weapons.  We have weapons out of the wazoo,  just need to get some rhythm going and establish some drives with the Drive Ending In Points.  We were like that a lot last year but got away from it once we couldn't run the football anymore when Bradshaw got hurt.  We are pretty good at this type of football when the run is working, and I expect it to work on Sunday night so we'll see.   If we can hold to that model we won't need to see Brady but a limited amount of times so we'll just need a few stops here and there I think.

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Yes that's what I'm thinking.  Focus will be on establishing rhythm and maintaining drives with the full intent of scoring on every drive.  Whether it be 3 or 7 just focus on scoring on each drive.  It's not one of those deals where it's a bad offensive team that just sits on the clock knowing they don't have any weapons.  We have weapons out of the wazoo,  just need to get some rhythm going and establish some drives with the Drive Ending In Points.  We were like that a lot last year but got away from it once we couldn't run the football anymore when Bradshaw got hurt.  We are pretty good at this type of football when the run is working, and I expect it to work on Sunday night so we'll see.   If we can hold to that model we won't need to see Brady but a limited amount of times so we'll just need a few stops here and there I think.

I think from the Pats side, you will see Brady airing it out because of the Colts secondary. Is it looking like Vontae will play? If he is out then I think the aerial show goes full bore. Of course, would not surprise me to see Blount get the rock all night either but have to think Brady takes advantage of the secondary ...

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I think from the Pats side, you will see Brady airing it out because of the Colts secondary. Is it looking like Vontae will play? If he is out then I think the aerial show goes full bore. Of course, would not surprise me to see Blount get the rock all night either but have to think Brady takes advantage of the secondary ...

We will see. I don't know if there's as much to be had in the secondary as it appears. We haven't had our man cover corners on the field all together at one time for most of the season. We played the Jets game with all of our starting corners out. It's been so bad we had to switch the scheme to a zone defense just to make up for the lack of talent out there and that is not our forte. We finally got everybody back against Houston but Vontae had a new foot injury and Toler had not played any regular season games. I'd say because of Vontaes foot injury we were forced to continue the zones. Now that we've had some time off and guys are more healthy I'm expecting us to get back to some press man coverage with some blitz mixed in. I still think we will continue to play some zones but less of it. I'm more concerned about us generating pressure on Brady. Oh and yes Vontae did practice.

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Ok, good luck with:

 

Coby Fleener

Dwayne Allen

Andre Johnson

Donte Moncrief

Philip Dorsett

Ahmad Bradshaw......

oh  yeah...... AND Frank Gore.

 

Yup....no team has been able to defend against that juggernaut yet... ... ...

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What happened to hope?

 

It just seemed to flutter out of the window... I wonder how we would have reacted to the Colts of the 90s on here...

 

I look at like this: almost every Cubs fan I know, has always had hope, regardless of how futile it seemed. If they can weather all of those years of playoff and championship drought, then I think I can too.

 

In the end of all things, it really is just a game.

I don't know why you think we don't have hope.   Of course we will tune in and hope the Colts pull it out.   We are being realistic though.   Hope doesn't count in it.    Same as asking you to put $100 of the Colts to win.   Wouldn't you rather have that $100 on the Pats to win?  

 

Of course the Colts have a chance.   That's why they play the game, right?  It's just that looking at what each team has looked like up till this game certainly puts the Pats as the major favorite.

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Over and over again I see this sort of denial from you guys where you talk about that great front seven and then you move on to another topic when I ask why you have given up so much against the run? I seek a straight answer and then you guys flip and start talking about pass rush. The pass rush you have mostly gotten against second tier guys who don't even know how to move in the pocket very well to distribute the football. Guys like Bortles, Tyrod Taylor, Brandon Weeden

I haven't looked at the game stats, but I'd bet a good portion of the yards on the ground occur after the Pats a 14pt plus lead. At that point, why not let the other team run the ball?

 

A couple teams did it, including the jags, where they had an 8 minute drive in the 4th. When you're up by 20 - 30, that works just fine for the Pats.

 

The Pats almost always allow a lot of yardage. As long as they keep the scoring to a minimum, who cares?

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The "Revenge" story is being pumped by the talk shows as expected with the majority of hosts snickering as if it will be yet another one-sided slaughter (45-7 was the last score). Brady was sacked five times against Dallas and that was a first. but there are facts to look at: in the deflate game NE scored 28 points in the second half after the balls were checked / The Colts added four free agents over 30 yrs. of age./ The Colts look bad so far this year while the Pats are ranked #1 in offense averaging 37.2 points per game. / The Pats lost two draft picks because of deflate gate. / The Pats have beat the Colts four times since 2012 by a total of 189 to 73 a difference of 116 points! / The Colts have won by the skin of their teeth over Jacksonville and Houston.  So as a Colt fan I am sadly a realist and we are in for a possible humiliation this coming Sunday. I hope Pagano being the passionate coach he is will tell his guys humiliation is worse than defeat and we will see the best performance of the entire season by our guys and if they do it watch the media say is was a freak game instead of a great performance by a huge underdog.

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Bend but don't break my friend. That's what we do. We let teams go on long runs, wasting clock, then ending up with 3. Just ask the Cowboys about that.

 

Is that a serious answer?

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Bend but don't break my friend. That's what we do. We let teams go on long runs, wasting clock, then ending up with 3. Just ask the Cowboys about that.

 

Brandon Weeden isn't breaking any defense, especially without Dez Bryant. They were able to devote themselves to Witten with basically no other threats on the field. The Pats haven't played a good offense yet. I hope they play one Sunday night.

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Brandon Weeden isn't breaking any defense, especially without Dez Bryant. They were able to devote themselves to Witten with basically no other threats on the field. The Pats haven't played a good offense yet. I hope they play one Sunday night.

Colts offense has all the potential be a record setting offense with the talent on it. That said they have IMO vastly underperformed. Will that change Sunday night (shrug) I don't know, I think a better chance would be the next game after that IF Luck plays because I am sure he is rusty and whatever issue he had/has is not fully healed yet.

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Colts offense has all the potential be a record setting offense with the talent on it. That said they have IMO vastly underperformed. Will that change Sunday night (shrug) I don't know, I think a better chance would be the next game after that IF Luck plays because I am sure he is rusty and whatever issue he had/has is not fully healed yet.

 

Yeah, I don't know what Luck we'll get. But even if he's fine and has no restrictions, he just has to play better than he did the first three weeks. If that happens, this will probably be the best offense the Pats have seen this season, and maybe the best they will see. The Broncos offense isn't playing well, the Dolphins are a mess but have potential, same for the Eagles, then there's the Giants. The Colts should be better than all of them, but they haven't been so far.

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One thing I feel that is getting underrated is how do our receivers perform? They were horrible last season vs the Pats and got absolutely no separation. Moncrief, Dorsett, and Johnson have to beat 1 on 1 coverage assuming Hilton will be double teamed like last season. 

 

I feel Moncrief is much improved from last season and has had a really good season as the #2 behind Hilton, and hopefully Johnson picks up where he left off from Houston and Dorsett can bring some big plays to the game. 

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Yup....no team has been able to defend against that juggernaut yet... ... ...

You better believe they are going to be coming out guns blazing on Sunday.

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Ok, good luck with:

 

Coby Fleener

Dwayne Allen

Andre Johnson

Donte Moncrief

Philip Dorsett

Ahmad Bradshaw......

oh  yeah...... AND Frank Gore.

 

Go look at the game info from last game. Some of those guys were there, didn't do much. I expect the Patriots to play the game of the year (for them). I don't see Colts doing much. I may be wrong, but I can easily see a 50 burger this week. They should have had 50 in Buffalo, but Brady got a bit carried away going for the throat on 4th rather than converting. Last week, it was a quiet 30, and 3rd down conversion hurt them (3 of 10). I don't expect the same this week.

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Is that a serious answer?

You apparently haven't watched the Patriots over the years. Yes, bend don't break is my serious answer. Teams have always been able to get down the field, but often come away with nothing or 3 points. However, since this game is going to get out of hand early, whomever is the QB will be passing mostly, and you won't be going for field goals. If this gets to be 21-0, it could be a shutout as you'll be passing every time.

 

Yes, final answer.

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One thing I feel that is getting underrated is how do our receivers perform? They were horrible last season vs the Pats and got absolutely no separation. Moncrief, Dorsett, and Johnson have to beat 1 on 1 coverage assuming Hilton will be double teamed like last season.

I feel Moncrief is much improved from last season and has had a really good season as the #2 behind Hilton, and hopefully Johnson picks up where he left off from Houston and Dorsett can bring some big plays to the game.

If we had Revis and browner still I call this game a sure blow out we don't so i am not sure.

The one thing I NOTICE about Luck is he forces a lot of balls into Hilton, that would be a mistake and produce numerous TO in this game. (IMO of course)

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You better believe they are going to be coming out guns blazing on Sunday.

Don't you think they come out blazing every game? Lol if either team has additional motivation it MAY be the pats with the hole team saying "we got win this one for Brady to show the league/world" yaaa yada from the fiasco this off season?

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Brandon Weeden isn't breaking any defense, especially without Dez Bryant. They were able to devote themselves to Witten with basically no other threats on the field. The Pats haven't played a good offense yet. I hope they play one Sunday night.

Pitt was a very good offense even without Bell. But I agree, Colts present more threats at the skill spots ..

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Brandon Weeden isn't breaking any defense, especially without Dez Bryant. They were able to devote themselves to Witten with basically no other threats on the field. The Pats haven't played a good offense yet. I hope they play one Sunday night.

 

Matchup wise, I just don't see Luck (or any replacement) having any better luck, no pun intended, than Colts have had during the last several matchups. For whatever reason, the Patriots just have their number. I prefer to play Colts when they are playing at a high level, and I don't want to just see a practice session out there. That's what I got with the Jacksonville game. Practice.

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Matchup wise, I just don't see Luck (or any replacement) having any better luck, no pun intended, than Colts have had during the last several matchups. For whatever reason, the Patriots just have their number. I prefer to play Colts when they are playing at a high level, and I don't want to just see a practice session out there. That's what I got with the Jacksonville game. Practice.

 

I don't think past matchups determine what happens in future matchups. Just because the Colts haven't played well in the past doesn't mean they never will. All the Colts need to do to have more success is play better. And on paper, the Colts have a better rushing attack and a deeper and more diverse receiving corps than they have in the past, so theoretically, playing better is a distinct possibility. 

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Pitt was a very good offense even without Bell. But I agree, Colts present more threats at the skill spots ..

 

Bell is only the best RB in the league, and a HUGE part of the Steelers offense. And they were without their #2 receiver, and their best OL. Brown still took them apart, and Miller and Williams had good games. But yeah, that's the best offense they've faced. They qualify as a good offense.

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Bell is only the best RB in the league, and a HUGE part of the Steelers offense. And they were without their #2 receiver, and their best OL. Brown still took them apart, and Miller and Williams had good games. But yeah, that's the best offense they've faced. They qualify as a good offense.

I kind of throw out week 1 anyways as there is no film on anyone and the teams are rusty and not in the groove. The pats defense has been better since that game and the Pitt offense is obviously better too back when Ben was there.

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I don't think past matchups determine what happens in future matchups. Just because the Colts haven't played well in the past doesn't mean they never will. All the Colts need to do to have more success is play better. And on paper, the Colts have a better rushing attack and a deeper and more diverse receiving corps than they have in the past, so theoretically, playing better is a distinct possibility. 

How do you feel about the Colts Oline and Dline in this game?  That seems to be where the domination of the Pats has been the past four games.

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How do you feel about the Colts Oline and Dline in this game?  That seems to be where the domination of the Pats has been the past four games.

 

Dline will handle the run much better this year. However, it gets zero pressure on opposing QBs, so Brady will probably have a field day and throw for 350+ yards.

 

Oline has looked solid, not great, the last couple of weeks since the offensive play-calling has changed. If Luck (I am assuming he plays barring anything else we weren't told about his injury) can get the ball out quickly as Matt has done the past couple of games, I think they should hold up fine.

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How do you feel about the Colts Oline and Dline in this game?  That seems to be where the domination of the Pats has been the past four games.

 

The Colts OL is run blocking reasonably well. Not without flaws, but if they can finally run on the Pats, then maybe the offense can get going. You'll remember that we couldn't pick up a first down for most of the second half last year, and three possessions later, we were down 4+ scores. If we hit hot receivers and use some play action, I think the protection will be more than adequate.

 

As for the DL, the last two games the gap play has gotten away from us, for various reasons. Go back to the 2013 playoff game, and up until the long TD by Blount, the run defense was okay. Last year, though, we got out of gaps and the ILBs were getting dominated by 2nd level blocks by the Pats OL. They also did a lot of wham blocking, and that's something I don't think will work as well this year, because Anderson and Parry will penetrate and nullify those wham blocks. So it comes to the ILBs doing a better job, which they have been this year against the run, aside from the Bills game, and then having Langford and whoever else plays that side containing and making plays when they come his way.

 

With the pass rush, our rushers won't matter unless we can slow down Brady's time to attempt with some tight initial coverage. The Pats will run stacks and bunches and motion, so we can't just smother your receivers with press, and Brady will put one 8 feet in the air for Gronk right at the snap, where it's harder to contest. But if we can force him to hold on to the ball longer than normal on 10+ plays, and control the run game, then we'll have some opportunities to get some pressure. I don't think anyone you have can stop Mathis, even if he's not 100%, and Anderson and Parry will get some push up the middle, even if it's not immediate pressure, but it will compromise the pocket.

 

Again, none of this matters if we can't run the ball and stop the run. The Pats haven't been great in the run game on either side of the ball, but they've still found a way to win these matchups in the past.

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I kind of throw out week 1 anyways as there is no film on anyone and the teams are rusty and not in the groove. The pats defense has been better since that game and the Pitt offense is obviously better too back when Ben was there.

 

Back to my initial point, the Pats defense hasn't played anyone since that first game. We'll see if the Colts offense can give them some noteworthy competition.

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The Colts OL is run blocking reasonably well. Not without flaws, but if they can finally run on the Pats, then maybe the offense can get going. You'll remember that we couldn't pick up a first down for most of the second half last year, and three possessions later, we were down 4+ scores. If we hit hot receivers and use some play action, I think the protection will be more than adequate.

 

As for the DL, the last two games the gap play has gotten away from us, for various reasons. Go back to the 2013 playoff game, and up until the long TD by Blount, the run defense was okay. Last year, though, we got out of gaps and the ILBs were getting dominated by 2nd level blocks by the Pats OL. They also did a lot of wham blocking, and that's something I don't think will work as well this year, because Anderson and Parry will penetrate and nullify those wham blocks. So it comes to the ILBs doing a better job, which they have been this year against the run, aside from the Bills game, and then having Langford and whoever else plays that side containing and making plays when they come his way.

 

With the pass rush, our rushers won't matter unless we can slow down Brady's time to attempt with some tight initial coverage. The Pats will run stacks and bunches and motion, so we can't just smother your receivers with press, and Brady will put one 8 feet in the air for Gronk right at the snap, where it's harder to contest. But if we can force him to hold on to the ball longer than normal on 10+ plays, and control the run game, then we'll have some opportunities to get some pressure. I don't think anyone you have can stop Mathis, even if he's not 100%, and Anderson and Parry will get some push up the middle, even if it's not immediate pressure, but it will compromise the pocket.

 

Again, none of this matters if we can't run the ball and stop the run. The Pats haven't been great in the run game on either side of the ball, but they've still found a way to win these matchups in the past.

Thanks for your detailed response. It looks to me like the Colts run D has improved. And the team has built some momentum the last couple of weeks too. I do hope Luck plays as it won't be the same without him. Just like Dallas was not the same without Romo.

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Why are people saying its disrespectful to say the Pats are gonna kill us? Sure, the fan in me is saying its gonna be a good game, but look at it logically. The Pats not only beat teams the Colts have lost to (Buffalo) or barely beat (Jax), but they WALLOPED them. They dropped 40+ on Buffalo. They dropped 51 on Jacksonville. And in our last meeting, they absolutely murdered us 45-7. Not only that, but we've never even beaten them in the Luck era! And it hasn't even been close in each game. Every game they come in and stomp us into the ground until we bleed to death!

There no logical reason to think we WONT get killed by the Pats! Only fan logic says we have a chance, which is why I'm saying: GO COLTS!!!!

Respect isn't given, it's earned! And so far we haven't even earned being able to say Colts and Pats in the same sentence!

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Yeah, I don't know what Luck we'll get. But even if he's fine and has no restrictions, he just has to play better than he did the first three weeks. If that happens, this will probably be the best offense the Pats have seen this season, and maybe the best they will see. The Broncos offense isn't playing well, the Dolphins are a mess but have potential, same for the Eagles, then there's the Giants. The Colts should be better than all of them, but they haven't been so far.

 

 

I'm that all that confident Luck will even play Sunday. Even if he does ...it won't matter . Just listened to the guys on the NFL network saying "it wouldn't surprise me if Tom Brady threw for 600 yards." Went on to add that he will be really mad cause the Colts "snitched" on him. Lord....

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