What To Do With The First Overall Pick [Mega-merge]

[haseo15]

We get more then one pick in the draft you can build around multiple players in the same draft, if we had a great draft possibly 3-4 players you could build around for the future, if you can find the talent late like some teams do.

[JoKeR]

If Manning is cleared to play in March, I promise you that if we draft Luck we will be sorry, because he

won't come here and sit, why should he.

Luck said he would accept being drafted by the Colts and I take him for his word. Colts could always trade him afterwards as I don't see them keeping both long term, just short term. If Irsays concerns over Manning's health is relieved, I can see a trade happening this this year.

[jedi.creech]

Kinda on subject, can someone find the winning ratio of QB's drafted in top 15 compaired to QB's drafted after 15th pick? Just wondering what the ratio of QB are I think of Brady, and Rodgers, and well hard to count him Ben (think that's more his team then him, but he has to count) I know there is going to be a lot of slop QB after the 15th pick, was just wondering about the house hold named QB's after 15th pick verses top 15 picked. In the situation of trading down just wondering what the percentage was.

[WSO]

Kinda on subject, can someone find the winning ratio of QB's drafted in top 15 compaired to QB's drafted after 15th pick? Just wondering what the ratio of QB are I think of Brady, and Rodgers, and well hard to count him Ben (think that's more his team then him, but he has to count) I know there is going to be a lot of slop QB after the 15th pick, was just wondering about the house hold named QB's after 15th pick verses top 15 picked. In the situation of trading down just wondering what the percentage was.

I dont think this exists BUT assuming you're talking about winning percentage, you could just look at the most winningest(if thats a word) QB's of all time, like the top 15 or 20, and look at where they were drafted.

But to add onto that I think winning percentage isn't exactly a great way to measure how good a QB is due to some QBs have played on teams with great defenses or overall very good teams vs. those who were still elite but never had a great supporting cast. Something like career QB rating would be better IMO.

[skadura]

Luck will be drafted by indianapolis with the first pick. i hate to say it but all the owners care about is making money, regardless of winning or not. they tote the company line of "we need to rebuild this franchise and get back to winning" bla bla bla luck will put people in the stands for another 15 years and maybe the colts get luck-y and he turns out to be as good as everyone says he is. win-win for irsay.

[jedi.creech]

I dont think this exists BUT assuming you're talking about winning percentage, you could just look at the most winningest(if thats a word) QB's of all time, like the top 15 or 20, and look at where they were drafted.

But to add onto that I think winning percentage isn't exactly a great way to measure how good a QB is due to some QBs have played on teams with great defenses or overall very good teams vs. those who were still elite but never had a great supporting cast. Something like career QB rating would be better IMO.

Very true... And like I said Ben can he really be given full credit for the Steelers? Okay yeah that was a bad question, was just wondering how that stood.

[Case]

Lol yeah it is with these present circumstances.. funny you think its not.

Lol funny just because we draft luck doesnt mean the new gm will do the same as polians did. Several teams build there teams around their qb.

[ruksak]

Then that is having both... and even with rookie wage scale constraints, I don't think it makes sense to have over $20 million invested in a position where the Colts do not have a need... Let's face it, if Manning was healthy, we wouldn't be having this debate, we would assume he would have four more years! But if he returns healthy, why wouldn't he finish out his contract? With that being said you can't have both, its either Manning or Luck..

I am assuming he will return to full health. I cannot see that it makes sense to approach this issue in any other way. By the time the draft rolls around, I'm sure everyone will have a solid idea of Manning's status, as the Colts FO will keep their fingers tight on the pulse of his recovery effort.

I believe the inherent fear of who plays QB after Manning retires is going to have to be ignored like background noise. If Manning is in full health, then we'll cross that bridge when we get to it.

[smittywerb]

I am for whatever does'nt involve keeping them both for 3 years, it won't work, noway possible, in a peaceful way at least.

Why wouldn't it? Has either said they would not? Or are you predicting it won't?

[ruksak]

Why wouldn't it? Has either said they would not? Or are you predicting it won't?

It solves one big problem; Who our QB is after Manning. However it creates some serious logistical and financial problems.

One of the problems for Luck I have not even heard brought up yet. If he intended to be patient, learn the game from the best and wait behind Manning, his career stats are going to take a wallop. Statistics are a players legacy in black and white. The greats, like Manning, are stat hounds. If Luck spent 3 years behind Manning, he would be throwing away a modest figure of 8,000+ yards and 60+TD's for his career.

[LUVTHESHOE]

Why wouldn't it? Has either said they would not? Or are you predicting it won't?

If you were Luck would you be willing to sit three years, he is a competition junkie, all guys at his level are. He is not Jim Sorgi or Curtis Painter, he is a player and twice the player Andy Dalton is and he is in the playoffs. I watched him being interviewed about it last night, his tone was a I am not into being lackey for three years, nor would any of us!

[jedi.creech]

It solves one big problem; Who our QB is after Manning. However it creates some serious logistical and financial problems.

One of the problems for Luck I have not even heard brought up yet. If he intended to be patient, learn the game from the best and wait behind Manning, his career stats are going to take a wallop. Statistics are a players legacy in black and white. The greats, like Manning, are stat hounds. If Luck spent 3 years behind Manning, he would be throwing away a modest figure of 8,000+ yards and 60+TD's for his career.

Darn good point... I'm sure he wants to be in some record books... sitting first 3 year or 4... would really hurt his attempt of getting in some record books.

[PeytonIsTheOne]

Are there any trade down scenarios where we could get RG3 and Blackmon? I would be happy to trade down if we were to get those two players.

[LUVTHESHOE]

Are there any trade down scenarios where we could get RG3 and Blackmon? I would be happy to trade down if we were to get those two players.

Blackmon, is a beast.and I would be thrilled to get him. The bad part about this whole is it won't be settled until Mannings status is determined.Maybe they should do us all a favor and shut the board down for a month. LOL!

[Bleedin Blue]

This new FO would be CRIMINALLY STUPID to pass Luck for picks in this year's draft.

For those who saw last night's game you saw a hint of what this kid will become. He is already breaking down defenses, changing plays at the line, and putting his team in position to make first downs every play. He throws accurately on the run, can maintain accuracy with rushers in his face...he is quite frankly the most NFL ready quarterback this league has seen since Manning.

For those who say we are drafting to win now by picking up a boat load of new players in the draft...I challenge that. These rookies are just that...rookies...even with Manning 100% it could take 1-2 years for these guys to be immediate playmakers. We aren't going to get a group of Suh's, Green's and Peterson's. And what would we be sacrificing? A potential franchise quarterback...THE RAREST OF COMMODITIES for about a draft's worth of extra players spread over 2 drafts.

How about we do something different...how about we wait and see what Manning looks like in March and then if he is healthy shop him around. I know that reality hurts for a lot of us...me included but you can't be sentimental about this stuff. It's NOT personal...it's just business. The realities are that Manning is great but he is nearing the end of his career. Don't tell me he has 5 years left...if that is the truth then let's demand more in trade!

Opportunities at the #1 spot don't come very often. It's been 13 years since this team had the #1 pick. Not only that but the stars have aligned to give us one of the best prospects in an equal amount of time. We still have the first pick of each round following the 1st round so we can still get a good CB, DT, SS, and a good guard. WR can be dealt with by scouting the UDFA's and in next year's draft.

[Peyton and Eli fan]

This new FO would be CRIMINALLY STUPID to pass Luck for picks in this year's draft.

For those who saw last night's game you saw a hint of what this kid will become. He is already breaking down defenses, changing plays at the line, and putting his team in position to make first downs every play. He throws accurately on the run, can maintain accuracy with rushers in his face...he is quite frankly the most NFL ready quarterback this league has seen since Manning.

For those who say we are drafting to win now by picking up a boat load of new players in the draft...I challenge that. These rookies are just that...rookies...even with Manning 100% it could take 1-2 years for these guys to be immediate playmakers. We aren't going to get a group of Suh's, Green's and Peterson's. And what would we be sacrificing? A potential franchise quarterback...THE RAREST OF COMMODITIES for about a draft's worth of extra players spread over 2 drafts.

How about we do something different...how about we wait and see what Manning looks like in March and then if he is healthy shop him around. I know that reality hurts for a lot of us...me included but you can't be sentimental about this stuff. It's NOT personal...it's just business. The realities are that Manning is great but he is nearing the end of his career. Don't tell me he has 5 years left...if that is the truth then let's demand more in trade!

Opportunities at the #1 spot don't come very often. It's been 13 years since this team had the #1 pick. Not only that but the stars have aligned to give us one of the best prospects in an equal amount of time. We still have the first pick of each round following the 1st round so we can still get a good CB, DT, SS, and a good guard. WR can be dealt with by scouting the UDFA's and in next year's draft.

You can't trade Manning unless the day of the $28 million pay out is changed and Manning would have to agree to change it. If the colts don't pick up that option, Manning is a free agent. If they pay the $28 million, that means they are sticking with Manning. The money is due before the trading period starts.

[Case]

This new FO would be CRIMINALLY STUPID to pass Luck for picks in this year's draft.

For those who saw last night's game you saw a hint of what this kid will become. He is already breaking down defenses, changing plays at the line, and putting his team in position to make first downs every play. He throws accurately on the run, can maintain accuracy with rushers in his face...he is quite frankly the most NFL ready quarterback this league has seen since Manning.

For those who say we are drafting to win now by picking up a boat load of new players in the draft...I challenge that. These rookies are just that...rookies...even with Manning 100% it could take 1-2 years for these guys to be immediate playmakers. We aren't going to get a group of Suh's, Green's and Peterson's. And what would we be sacrificing? A potential franchise quarterback...THE RAREST OF COMMODITIES for about a draft's worth of extra players spread over 2 drafts.

How about we do something different...how about we wait and see what Manning looks like in March and then if he is healthy shop him around. I know that reality hurts for a lot of us...me included but you can't be sentimental about this stuff. It's NOT personal...it's just business. The realities are that Manning is great but he is nearing the end of his career. Don't tell me he has 5 years left...if that is the truth then let's demand more in trade!

Opportunities at the #1 spot don't come very often. It's been 13 years since this team had the #1 pick. Not only that but the stars have aligned to give us one of the best prospects in an equal amount of time. We still have the first pick of each round following the 1st round so we can still get a good CB, DT, SS, and a good guard. WR can be dealt with by scouting the UDFA's and in next year's draft.

Perfectly said

[smittywerb]

It solves one big problem; Who our QB is after Manning. However it creates some serious logistical and financial problems.

One of the problems for Luck I have not even heard brought up yet. If he intended to be patient, learn the game from the best and wait behind Manning, his career stats are going to take a wallop. Statistics are a players legacy in black and white. The greats, like Manning, are stat hounds. If Luck spent 3 years behind Manning, he would be throwing away a modest figure of 8,000+ yards and 60+TD's for his career.

If you were Luck would you be willing to sit three years, he is a competition junkie, all guys at his level are. He is not Jim Sorgi or Curtis Painter, he is a player and twice the player Andy Dalton is and he is in the playoffs. I watched him being interviewed about it last night, his tone was a I am not into being lackey for three years, nor would any of us!

Well, for both of you guys, all I'm saying is you can not make an argument by speaking for other people. What you guys are saying has not been documented. Neither Manning nor Luck said "We do not want to co-exist.". In fact, the opposite has been said by both, they have said they wouldn't mind doing the whole "co-exist" thing. Will it hinder us financially, maybe and maybe not. Are we gonna draft Luck, maybe and maybe not. But you can't speak for them.

[LUVTHESHOE]

This new FO would be CRIMINALLY STUPID to pass Luck for picks in this year's draft.

For those who saw last night's game you saw a hint of what this kid will become. He is already breaking down defenses, changing plays at the line, and putting his team in position to make first downs every play. He throws accurately on the run, can maintain accuracy with rushers in his face...he is quite frankly the most NFL ready quarterback this league has seen since Manning.

For those who say we are drafting to win now by picking up a boat load of new players in the draft...I challenge that. These rookies are just that...rookies...even with Manning 100% it could take 1-2 years for these guys to be immediate playmakers. We aren't going to get a group of Suh's, Green's and Peterson's. And what would we be sacrificing? A potential franchise quarterback...THE RAREST OF COMMODITIES for about a draft's worth of extra players spread over 2 drafts.

How about we do something different...how about we wait and see what Manning looks like in March and then if he is healthy shop him around. I know that reality hurts for a lot of us...me included but you can't be sentimental about this stuff. It's NOT personal...it's just business. The realities are that Manning is great but he is nearing the end of his career. Don't tell me he has 5 years left...if that is the truth then let's demand more in trade!

Opportunities at the #1 spot don't come very often. It's been 13 years since this team had the #1 pick. Not only that but the stars have aligned to give us one of the best prospects in an equal amount of time. We still have the first pick of each round following the 1st round so we can still get a good CB, DT, SS, and a good guard. WR can be dealt with by scouting the UDFA's and in next year's draft.

This is why a started this. I agree 100% of what you have said, so I will say it again, this type of talent is not sitting anywhere longer than a preseason.

[LUVTHESHOE]

Well, for both of you guys, all I'm saying is you can not make an argument by speaking for other people. What you guys are saying has not been documented. Neither Manning nor Luck said "We do not want to co-exist.". In fact, the opposite has been said by both, they have said they wouldn't mind doing the whole "co-exist" thing. Will it hinder us financially, maybe and maybe not. Are we gonna draft Luck, maybe and maybe not. But you can't speak for them.

I am speaking for what makes football sense, nothing more. I am not speaking for either player, but I promise you that Luck will not be holding a clipbord this time next year anywhere.

[scorptile]

lets see take one great player or take 3-4 the next three years and build an actual team hmmmmm id take the latter of the two. give me a beast wide reciever, RB and CB over one hyped up QB any day. you can get a average qb to help win championships. and if anyone looks at the past 30 years there has been alot of average qb's winning the SB. so yeah taking luck will only put us back into the same situation were in now. one great player (maybe or he could be a ryan leaf in disguise) or we can have 3-4 great players hhmmm yeah ....

[BmoreColt]

lets see take one great player or take 3-4 the next three years and build an actual team hmmmmm id take the latter of the two. give me a beast wide reciever, RB and CB over one hyped up QB any day. you can get a average qb to help win championships. and if anyone looks at the past 30 years there has been alot of average qb's winning the SB. so yeah taking luck will only put us back into the same situation were in now. one great player (maybe or he could be a ryan leaf in disguise) or we can have 3-4 great players hhmmm yeah ....

Bingo! And that is 3-4 players just this year from the trade! Not including draft picks for next year or the following and even players in compensation!

[ruksak]

Well, for both of you guys, all I'm saying is you can not make an argument by speaking for other people. What you guys are saying has not been documented. Neither Manning nor Luck said "We do not want to co-exist.". In fact, the opposite has been said by both, they have said they wouldn't mind doing the whole "co-exist" thing. Will it hinder us financially, maybe and maybe not. Are we gonna draft Luck, maybe and maybe not. But you can't speak for them.

For them to say anything but, would be seen as unprofessional. Would you profess that you wouldn't be willing to work with a new co-worker because you view him as a threat or a hindrance? That wouldn't look good on the 'ol resume, would it?

[Bleedin Blue]

lets see take one great player or take 3-4 the next three years and build an actual team hmmmmm id take the latter of the two. give me a beast wide reciever, RB and CB over one hyped up QB any day. you can get a average qb to help win championships. and if anyone looks at the past 30 years there has been alot of average qb's winning the SB. so yeah taking luck will only put us back into the same situation were in now. one great player (maybe or he could be a ryan leaf in disguise) or we can have 3-4 great players hhmmm yeah ....

You think we can't get anything for Manning?

[BmoreColt]

For them to say anything but, would be seen as unprofessional. Would you profess that you wouldn't be willing to work with a new co-worker because you view him as a threat or a hindrance? That wouldn't look good on the 'ol resume, would it?

Luck's tone was that he did not want to sit.. even though he didn't come out and say that, but why would he?

[LUVTHESHOE]

Bingo! And that is 3-4 players just this year from the trade! Not including draft picks for next year or the following and even players in compensation!

Again, that is great if Manning is healthy.

[BmoreColt]

You think we can't get anything for Manning?

No you can't! Manning will either be retained or released! Why would Irsay pay Manning $28 Million dollars to turn around and trade him. So in theory he would be paying $28 million for the draft picks Manning would bring! Teams know this... they would be patient and wait on the Manning situation knowing, they could get him without giving up any draft picks!

[WSO]

lets see take one great player or take 3-4 the next three years and build an actual team hmmmmm id take the latter of the two. give me a beast wide reciever, RB and CB over one hyped up QB any day. you can get a average qb to help win championships. and if anyone looks at the past 30 years there has been alot of average qb's winning the SB. so yeah taking luck will only put us back into the same situation were in now. one great player (maybe or he could be a ryan leaf in disguise) or we can have 3-4 great players hhmmm yeah ....

Those 'average' QB's winning championships all had stellar defenses or other variables the Colts don't have. You're contradicting yourself by thinking you can get to the SB with a 'beast wide receiver', 'rb' and a 'cb'. The Colts have had a very good offense for 12 or so years and only one SB to represent all that offensive firepower.

You're also assuming Luck will be a flop and these '3 -4 great players' won't. What if the Colts pass up on Luck and draft '3-4 great players' and they flop? Just playing devil's advocate here.

[BmoreColt]

Again, that is great if Manning is healthy.

Yeah, I am assuming he will be and what I would do.

[smittywerb]

I am speaking for what makes football sense, nothing more. I am not speaking for either player, but I promise you that Luck will not be holding a clipbord this time next year anywhere.

I agree, it's a chance we will not draft Luck and trade the pick. Anything can happen. But speaking for a player or anyone is not football sense. Who said Steve Young wouldn't sit behind Montana for 3 years?

[BmoreColt]

Those 'average' QB's winning championships all had stellar defenses or other variables the Colts don't have. You're contradicting yourself by thinking you can get to the SB with a 'beast wide receiver', 'rb' and a 'cb'. The Colts have had a very good offense for 12 or so years and only one SB to represent all that offensive firepower.

No, he is insinuating that those 3-4 players this year will help to rebuild the team for a future QB not named Luck, while still helping Manning win Super Bowls short term!

[LUVTHESHOE]

I agree, it's a chance we will not draft Luck and trade the pick. Anything can happen. But speaking for a player or anyone is not football sense. Who said Steve Young wouldn't sit behind Montana for 3 years?

Apples to cinder blocks.

[ConBro]

I don't think Luck is the STUD he is made out to be. I think he is a good QB who will be good in the NFL. Big Ben like... however I do agree with the OP that the Colts have to decide on Luck or Manning... I prefer Manning myself, Luck said he would sit, but he had such resentment in his tone, and does not want to sit for four years. He was saying that so that there aren't red flags and in the even the Colts were to trade the pick to say a team where Luck may compete for the starting gig and sit the first few games...So agreed, its one or the other, fans are niave to think both can and will co-exist..

Apparently you didn't watch the game last night. So is RG3 a "STUD"?

[smittywerb]

For them to say anything but, would be seen as unprofessional. Would you profess that you wouldn't be willing to work with a new co-worker because you view him as a threat or a hindrance? That wouldn't look good on the 'ol resume, would it?

Eli did it, Elway did it, why wouldn't Luck do it if he had the chance? It's kind of like an interview setting (going off your work analogy). If the interviewer told me the job consisted of rubbing poo on my face, am I going to give him a political answer just to not rub him a certain way and suffer with rubbing poo on my face? Going off history (not speaking for a player), players tend to be vocal. Yes, there are political answers and professionalism, but this is not the NBA, NFL players tend to be upfront when it comes to demands.

[BmoreColt]

Apparently you didn't watch the game last night. So is RG3 a "STUD"?

I watched the game, what was I suppose to be in amaze of? It isn't the first game I saw of Luck and wasn't impressed, it won't be the last. No I don't think RGIII is a STUD.. I think Brock Osweiler coming out in a year or two is a STUD! Nothing Luck does jumps out at me as spectacular. You can be impressed all you want, cause I wasn't.

[WSO]

No, he is insinuating that those 3-4 players this year will help to rebuild the team for a future QB not named Luck, while still helping Manning win Super Bowls short term!

In his words taking WR, CB, and RB. RB is not a problem for the Colts. If the Colts want to win the SB short-term w/ Manning, re-signing Reggie Wayne could make more sense rather than drafting a 'beast' WR.

He is still assuming that these 3 or 4 players won't flop.

[WSO]

I watched the game, what was I suppose to be in amaze of? It isn't the first game I saw of Luck and wasn't impressed, it won't be the last. No I don't think RGIII is a STUD.. I think Brock Osweiler coming out in a year or two is a STUD! Nothing Luck does jumps out at me as spectacular. You can be impressed all you want, cause I wasn't.

Are you kidding? He was 27 for 31 347 YDS and 2 TDS. Even with that INT he finished with a 196 rating which is incredible in college football. He lead the team to a potentially game-winning FG as well. He played absolutely brilliant last night.

[Dan]

I watched the game, what was I suppose to be in amaze of? It isn't the first game I saw of Luck and wasn't impressed, it won't be the last. No I don't think RGIII is a STUD.. I think Brock Osweiler coming out in a year or two is a STUD! Nothing Luck does jumps out at me as spectacular. You can be impressed all you want, cause I wasn't.

How can you not be impressed with 27/31? What more do you want?

[BmoreColt]

In his words taking WR, CB, and RB. RB is not a problem for the Colts. If the Colts want to win the SB short-term w/ Manning, re-signing Reggie Wayne could make more sense rather than drafting a 'beast' WR.

He is still assuming that these 3 or 4 players won't flop.

I didn't know the Colts had such a prepetually dominate run game? You mean Trent Richardson with say the #4 pick... Dennard at #25.. and say Jeffrey at #37 isn't a better Colts roster? That could mean freed up cap space from cutting ties with Brown/Gonzo and a restructure of Addai and Wayne back cheap.

[BmoreColt]

Are you kidding? He was 27 for 31 347 YDS and 2 TDS. Even with that INT he finished with a 196 rating which is incredible in college football. He lead the team to a potentially game-winning FG as well. He played absolutely brilliant last night.

So what, Oklahoma State has an average at best defense.. Two TD's and you are ready to declare this guy the next Peyton Manning? Case Keenum played better yesterday, that's who I was impressed with.