The Curious Case of Hugh Thorton

[Superman]

Yeah but I mean there's a difference in teasing a young guy a little in the locker room and totally disrespecting your QB on national television.

 

Did he really disrespect him? Isn't that making a bit much out of what happened? 

 

Meanwhile, Incognito verbally abused his teammate repeatedly over the span of two years.

[colts8718]

Jesus you guys making a huge deal that he was crying? You have no idea what's going on in his life, have no idea what stress he might have at home and with his family. We all break down he was just unfortunate it was caught on t.v.

I no a good therapist

[TheRustonRifle#7]

Really The facts are most of the fans that love the colts know that the colts number one need in the off season was oline yet  with our first pick in the draft we pick a w/r if management had a clue most of these conversations would not be taking place. What would the colts record be if they would have drafted for need intead of being greedy and expecting luck to preform like an elite qb behind a high school line?

 

I am wondering why you are replying to me when your obvious issue is with Superman's post? Hmmmm, taking the path of least resistance me thinks...new guy vs Moderator? Superman caught it though and his reply was on the money! I am also unsure of why Dorsett is even being mentioned by you as the thread is about Hugh Thorton and the post I agreed with Superman with was in regards to some fans screaming for an O'Line change then complaining about the actual change many wanted?

[TheRustonRifle#7]

Probably the same, or maybe 0-3, seeing as how Dorsett made a great catch on third and 20, and there are no rookie OL playing well right now.

 

#dontreachforperceivedneed

 

Exactly! Plus I foolishly thought that "most of the fans that love the colts" wanted Malcolm Brown in the 1st instead of Dorsett? Now it is an Offensive Lineman? If Luck is truly injured will their cry be for a QB instead of Dorsett? Those "most of the fans that love the colts" are a fickle bunch ;)?

[Gavin]

I meant linemen who were available at 29, and in that range on a typical draft board.

Ya kinda got me thinking, I believe Harrison played one of the Guard spots at one point I just cant remember the game

[John Waylon]

Grigson does not think so

Yeah, well, it's pretty obvious by now that he isn't exactly qualified to build an o-line.

[twfish]

I no a good therapist

How do you no a therapist?

[Gavin]

Did he really disrespect him? Isn't that making a bit much out of what happened? 

 

Meanwhile, Incognito verbally abused his teammate repeatedly over the span of two years.

Not to mention Incognitos issues with trying to conduct himself as a grown adult have failed other times since being drafted as well, It goes beyond just the Martin drama

[Moncrief]

This is a VERY interesting thread. Especially about Thornton crying, being soft, and not being a "tough guy". OK here's why its so, so very interesting to me.......Cultural differences!!!! OK I grew up in southern Kentucky. As did most of my family. My grandpa lived in Indiana several years (work) but was still born and raised in Ky. and returned before I was born. We have a lot of family in Indiana, but we're all, for the most part born and raised in southern Ky. The cultural difference are just amazing to say the least. In the south its a totally different world. I know we have some posters here from everywhere. I think NewColtsFan is from Cali right? Some guys from other countries too. Total differences in the way of life when you compare Ky. to Cali. Down here. Its like cool to be the tough guy you know. The alpha male, etc. You cant be soft lol. You got made fun of for crying or being weak. When we were in High School, if you got in a fight and won, you were literally like the coolest kid in school LOL. And Every parent whips their children. Whipping you son isn't considered wrong here by the majority. Hell my elementary school was still paddling students when I was in 5th grade. (Like 2001) Its just a totally different world in the south and especially So. Ky. Everyone down here was just amazed that AP got in so much trouble for whipping his son. Nobody could comprehend it lol. Also If you put a back woods country boy from my town in California the California folks would be in shock LOL. I'm no redneck in no way, shape, or form. but still in certain ways a product of environment.

 

I feel like this could be worthy of it's own thread discussion.  I grew up(still am) in northern Indiana, a little passerby town called Akron.  The most noteworthy town is about a 70 minute drive to Fort Wayne to put it in perspective.  All there is here is country boys and hipsters.  Anyways, me and a friend go to Chicago and again, being small town boys we have all these manners, very conversational and personable people.  We were asking for directions to somewhere in Chicago and the amount of people that basically just said "* you" and kept walking was unreal.  Finally found a person that helped us but arrghhhh.  We asked if he knew where this place was and he replied with "yeah...."  Nothing else.  Waited for a good 20 seconds before we asked if he could point us in the right direction.  He replied with "ahh that's the right question."  I hated the man for that but at the same time I loved it just because of the sarcastic approach and how different interactions are with people that grew up in an urban area.

[colts8718]

How do you no a thera

You where the one who told me about her 

[TheRustonRifle#7]

Ya kinda got me thinking, I believe Harrison played one of the Guard spots at one point I just cant remember the game

 

Harrision played at least one game last year at RG.

[JR Indy]

Hugh had a terrible game going, then after that last holding call.  Something clicked, Hugh finally got mad, started playing like he was upset and put in work.  If he can play like that all the time I think we may have found our long awaited right guard.

[krunk]

I would leave Thornton in for now. Absolutely. 

 

He only played one game in preseason, then he got hurt. That's been his issue, and IMO, has hurt his development. His physical tools are outstanding, and he's easily the most gifted interior lineman on the roster. His technique lacks at times, but that one preseason game, he was very good. He rehabs, rides the bench for two weeks, and then suddenly gets thrown back in the fire. Gotta be ready, but it's not surprising at all that he didn't have a clean game. By the way, none of the linemen did, including AC, especially.

 

Give him a chance to clean up the hands issue, which was really the only issue he had yesterday. Not just on the penalties, but even on the other missed blocks he had. It's like the game was faster than he remembered. And I said already, I think he got robbed on two of those penalties. One was borderline, but the other was an awful call. 

 

So yeah, I'd give him the start next week. Full week of practice with the 1's, let him get his feet under him, and give him another crack at it. If he has a rough first half, then he can go back to the bench, and we'll give one of the vets another crack. Or maybe Harrison at some point. I don't have to commit to him for the rest of the year, especially if he isn't playing well, but I wouldn't yank him yet. 

 

 

Hugh is who they intended to have in there all along, but he's always had some sort of injury it seems. I'm cool with him being in there.  Mewhort, Holmes, and Thornton should make a pretty good trio although now we are left with a question at the right tackle.  Reitz is okay there for now and even he isn't the best in the world.  If he gets hurt I suppose we'll see them shuffle the lineup again and move Mewhort back outside?  Guess that would leave us with either Louis or Herremans at the LG unless you move Hugh back over to the left guard and put Herremans over to the right.  I guess we'll see when we get there.

[Coffeedrinker]

I was wondering about trying Harrison at Guard too. Do you think he could possibly be a pretty good guard? I know the dude is like country strong LOL.

 

 

I've been thinking about this too.  I don't know enough about Harrison's technique, and I do remember him getting pushed around all over the place when he was playing C, so he might not be a good candidate.  But it wouldn't hurt to try

 

 

He doesn't move all that great, but I think he can play guard. He's definitely strong enough. He's had a few snaps at guard at times. How well he'd play, I don't know.

The problem I have with Harrison at guard is he is like a rook in chess, he can only move straight.  If he has to take an angle to a defender he loses all form and gets beat.  So if a DT lines up directly over him, he will do well but if a DT lines up in the gap then Harrison is going to get beat often.

 

Additionally when working with his guards (as center) he over commits taking the DT to the guard and leaves a gaping hole for the delayed blitz or stunt and he doesn't have the athleticism to get back and fill that hole.  And at guard you need to work with the center or tackle in a similar manner

[CoachSmok3]

Did he really disrespect him? Isn't that making a bit much out of what happened? 

 

Meanwhile, Incognito verbally abused his teammate repeatedly over the span of two years.

 

 

lol some people i cannot understand the line of thinking...."thornton dissed the team he needed to walk home alone and should have been cut mon blah blah lol"...."but in the offseason we should have got Richie!!!! hes this and that and our oline"....

 

lol...my how short some's memories be lol...

 

if we argue Richies talent vs Thorntons....no brainer...but when bringing character in to the debate....i repeat:

...my how short some's memories be lol...

[Jim H.]

Tears of frustration and embarrassment, IMO.

[jaybird95]

Not man enough to play in the NFL. Weak.

[C0LT5]

What is his problem? After one holding penalty in particular (of which there were several!), Luck puts his hand on his shoulder, and Thorton shakes Luck away. Then when Thorton is on the sideline, Chuck Pagano puts two hands on Thorton's helmet, looks him straight in the eyes, and lectures him on something. Then, wait... Is Thorton crying!? Save the crying for the national anthem.

There's a lot of o-line issues, so I hate to single one man out, but let's start by getting rid of the men who cry and work our way up.

 

I know I'm late to the party on this thread but this post is wrong. Thornton didn't shake Luck away, he just pushed Lucks hand away. It's not like he body slammed the guy from his last holding penalty. Thornton wasn't crying on the sideline. I don't even know how anyone could assume that unless if you took it from the announcers and they just said emotional, which doesn't mean crying. Rewatch the game before throwing people under the bus.

[dudeski]

Nor whilst peeling onions.

why would a man do that to begin with

[theanarchist]

I'm sticking to my opinion that he's the dumbest player in the NFL. He needs to go NOW. Wasted draft pick and bad teammate. He's just so awful. I just cant understand why we didn't trade for Ben Grubbs, or sign Incognito or something this offseason.

Ya, cuz Incognito is a great teammate.

[theanarchist]

I'm sticking to my opinion that he's the dumbest player in the NFL. He needs to go NOW. Wasted draft pick and bad teammate. He's just so awful. I just cant understand why we didn't trade for Ben Grubbs, or sign Incognito or something this offseason.

Ya, cuz Incognito is a great teammate.

[theanarchist]

Not man enough to play in the NFL. Weak.

If you know Thornton's life story you would most likely change your opinion about that unless you're a just not a compassionate human being.

[Cribbsfaircatch]

Ya, cuz Incognito is a great teammate.

He's a captain in buff. And his teammates do seem to like him. Even his Dolphins teammates preferred him over Martin.

[theanarchist]

He's a captain in buff. And his teammates do seem to like him. Even his Dolphins teammates preferred him over Martin.

Good for him. The guy has been a problem everywhere he has gone from Nebraska on up. No thanks, don't need those kinds of players.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/richie-incognito-troubled-timeline-dates-back-early-college-224648711--nfl.html

[theanarchist]

Seriously. We need guys like that. A lot of the time guys like that are....Winners. They put winning first and foremost and had rather be in physical pain than to lose. We need some guys like Bernard Pollard. Being the nice team isn't going to get us anywhere. This is the NFL. Its a mans league. But like I said its trying to turn soft with the rest of the world lol.

A guy can be a great player, play with passion and nastiness not be a complete tool i.e. JJ Watt, Reggie White, Jeff Saturday, Anthony Munoz, the list goes on and on. The only thing Richie Incognito is going to be remembered for is being a pariah. Lightening rod for controversy wherever he has been.

[jaybird95]

If you know Thornton's life story you would most likely change your opinion about that unless you're a just not a compassionate human being.

 

You got it, I'm just not a compassionate human being.

[Superman]

Hugh Thornton played a good game today.

[jimmy g]

Real men don't get fingers in their eye.

I'm gonna risk a question.

Superman stands tall letting bullets bounce off his chest. Why does he duck from an empty gun being thrown?

[jimmy g]

men shouldn't cry at funerals either

I always thought that. Then I gave my Dad's eulogy.

[jimmy g]

I don't have a problem leaving thornton in, but its only because there's no one better. Not being in has hurt his development, but at some point, not being able to develop because of injury becomes an excuse...it's been 2 years. Like Vick Ballard...when do you cut the strings? We're getting close to that point with Thornton...

EDIT: I just want to be clear, I'm not trying to start the fire here, I am just curious...Because at some point...a player's development, even if stalled beyond conditions he can't control, gets him cut. I don't knwo when that is, but I know he's running out of time, regardless of how much he tries his hardest.

see Donald Thomas. Depends on if you have a better replacement on hand.

[OffensivelyPC]

see Donald Thomas. Depends on if you have a better replacement on hand.

I wasn't trying to make the argument that we cut him in season.  I wasn't even really saying that we cut him at all.  I was just talking more about once we get to the offseason, when he is evaluated his body of work over the year and where he is in his development.  Would when we would draft/sign a free agent replacement and either cut Thornton or just keep him as depth?  I prefer the latter, because he's not altogether horrible, he just had not been good enough at the time I made the original comment you quoted.  But he did do much better this week.  I think the new arrangement of the line has really helped with protection.  Our run game wasn't the best, but a big part of that can be put on Gore - I thought he missed a few reads, not to mention the dropped passes and fumble.

[Superman]

I wasn't trying to make the argument that we cut him in season. I wasn't even really saying that we cut him at all. I was just talking more about once we get to the offseason, when he is evaluated his body of work over the year and where he is in his development. Would when we would draft/sign a free agent replacement and either cut Thornton or just keep him as depth? I prefer the latter, because he's not altogether horrible, he just had not been good enough at the time I made the original comment you quoted. But he did do much better this week. I think the new arrangement of the line has really helped with protection. Our run game wasn't the best, but a big part of that can be put on Gore - I thought he missed a few reads, not to mention the dropped passes and fumble.

I thought Gore was hesitant and slow around the edge also.

As for Thornton, I feel like your question is more of a February question than an October question. Evaluate him weekly and then at the end of the year, and decide whether he can be the guy.

[CanuckColt]

Thornton has a couple of bad knees...he tries very hard.

[cbear]

Didn't get to watch the entire game, but from what I saw, he was great in pass protection.  Didn't miss or wasn't off balance once that I saw.  Was this true for the entire game?

[Superman]

I'm gonna risk a question.

Superman stands tall letting bullets bounce off his chest. Why does he duck from an empty gun being thrown?

Because he knows his enemies find it irritating.

I honestly don't remember seeing Superman duck an empty gun.

[cbear]

Because he knows his enemies find it irritating.

I honestly don't remember seeing Superman duck an empty gun.

 

So who is your favorite alter ego?  The guy who plays him now is pretty good.

[Superman]

So who is your favorite alter ego? The guy who plays him now is pretty good.

Nostalgia makes me say Christopher Reeve. But I like Henry Cavill, too. Man of Steel was much better than Superman Returns, but the animated movies are definitely best.

[OffensivelyPC]

I thought Gore was hesitant and slow around the edge also.

As for Thornton, I feel like your question is more of a February question than an October question. Evaluate him weekly and then at the end of the year, and decide whether he can be the guy.

To the second part, yeah, that's what was getting at.  I just wanted to clarify for Jimmy G as his response to me indicated he thought I meant get rid of him now and replace with someone else ASAP.  I'm not one for overreactions - even if we all tend to have knee jerk reactions, no matter how brief from time to time.  He's our best option now and he does make some good blocks here and there.  I'd like to see him be better in pass pro, though.  He usually does enough to get in the guys way, but that's not going to get the job done on its own.  

 

I don't have the time to watch the All-22, but when I do pay attention to him during a particular play or if there's an instant replay, it seems to me that he plays with poor balance  and it causes him to lunge a lot.  There was another time where he helps give the initial punch on the double team but his feet aren't quick enough to slide over and pick up the blitzing LB or the stunt to his assigned gap.  Of course, I don't lock onto Thornton all game long, and I only picked out a few bad plays from a small sample size.  I have seem him make some good blocks too, I just hope that we see less and less of the negative plays over the course of the year.  

 

That just goes back to our original conversation about where Thornton is in his development.  The upside is there, no doubt, and if he really is just a year behind because of injuries, then there should be some good improvement between weeks 1 and 17 of this season.  The new lineup with Mewhort at LG and Reitz at RT appeared to help last week and they looked a little better this week as well.  It didn't hurt that Hasselbeck was generally quicker to get rid of the ball than Luck traditionally has been and Hasselbeck also went hot route a few times (Gore, com'on man, catch the ball).  For the love of everything holy, I pray that we utilize that same strategy when Luck does get back.

[Gyan Rrigson]

Look out, we got some real internet tough guys in here!

[spartancolt]

I feel like this could be worthy of it's own thread discussion.  I grew up(still am) in northern Indiana, a little passerby town called Akron.  The most noteworthy town is about a 70 minute drive to Fort Wayne to put it in perspective.  All there is here is country boys and hipsters.  Anyways, me and a friend go to Chicago and again, being small town boys we have all these manners, very conversational and personable people.  We were asking for directions to somewhere in Chicago and the amount of people that basically just said "* you" and kept walking was unreal.  Finally found a person that helped us but arrghhhh.  We asked if he knew where this place was and he replied with "yeah...."  Nothing else.  Waited for a good 20 seconds before we asked if he could point us in the right direction.  He replied with "ahh that's the right question."  I hated the man for that but at the same time I loved it just because of the sarcastic approach and how different interactions are with people that grew up in an urban area.

hey neighbor I am from Rochester tho now in Illinois