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Brady suspended four games, Pats fined and docked two draft picks (Mega Merge)


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Yep that is the narrative and it still does not change a thing. 4 titles in cap/FA era. Best ever. All challengers welcomed ...

It should change your perception of the integrity of those accomplishments

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I realize Shady Brady is the golden boy for you NE Cheaters fans, but if he wasn't guilty of anything, he would've handed over his phone and not lied on TV to the nation. It's really that simple.

 

Besides the fact that all you need is probable cause is all you need to convict someone of murder, let alone deflating balls. 

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It should change your perception of the integrity of those accomplishments

I salute all of Mods in this. It has to be real annoying to read some of this nonsense. Letting forum members speak and having to decide what was said that went too far. My hats off to all of you.

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So, what you're saying is that it does not matter HOW you win, it's just a matter of winning?

Integrity or playing fair does not matter?

 

I guess Patriot fans follow the old Jesse "The Body" Ventura mentality

 

Quotation-Jesse-Ventura-play-Meetville-Q

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Are you really questioning Adonis on obsession and insanity?  Pot = kettle

 

 

Discussing this with NE fans has me just shaking my head. It's one thing to hope Brady get's away with it so your team will be more able to contend. It's another thing when you actually defend his and Kraft's position on this matter. My God , keep it to yourself.Anyway you follow the "path of logic" , it takes you to the same conclusion. I have come to have more disdain for Kraft than I do I do for Brady. And that says a lot. One word.... INSANE

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It should change your perception of the integrity of those accomplishments

Ok. How much? 5 percent? 10 percent? If you want to show me one team that is completely clean in all areas than I will come over and sulk but honestly all teams have dings and blemishes. In the grand scheme of offenses, the Pats infractions are the most benign yet the most over blown in the media age we live in.

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Ok. How much? 5 percent? 10 percent? If you want to show me one team that is completely clean in all areas than I will come over and sulk but honestly all teams have dings and blemishes. In the grand scheme of offenses, the Pats infractions are the most benign yet the most over blown in the media age we live in.

 

Here we go again with the speeding car logic. Why do you seem content with the idea that since everyone else has done it, it makes it alright? Your loyalty has clouded your judgement.

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  1. Colin Cowherd and 12 others follow

In Wellsreport on Dolphins, Wells failed to include comments of many who made the case that Jonathan Martin also played a role in issues.

  •  

  1. My biggest issue with Wellsreport this time (he didn't include Brady’s comments) is similar to biggest issue with Wellsreport on Miami.

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Here we go again with the speeding car logic. Why do you seem content with the idea that since everyone else has done it, it makes it alright? Your loyalty has clouded your judgement.

Who said that? We are talking about how I should feel.  My feelings as it pertains to professional sports is not one where I look at teams and look for perfection or a clean record and if I don't find it then I condemn their accomplishments. If we do that then the Ravens and Seahawks past two championships are stained as much if not more so than the Pats. And sorry but I don't feel that way about those teams or my team.

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Who said that? We are talking about how I should feel.  My feelings as it pertains to professional sports is not one where I look at teams and look for perfection or a clean record and if I don't find it then I condemn their accomplishments. If we do that then the Ravens and Seahawks past two championships are stained as much if not more so than the Pats. And sorry but I don't feel that way about those teams or my team.

The Seahawks I can see because of all their PEDs violations.  But why the Ravens?

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  1. Colin Cowherd and 12 others follow
  2. In Wellsreport on Dolphins, Wells failed to include comments of many who made the case that Jonathan Martin also played a role in issues.
  •  
  1. My biggest issue with Wellsreport this time (he didn't include Brady’s comments) is similar to biggest issue with Wellsreport on Miami.

 

 

 

What makes more sense.. Kraft saying it was the cold weather and then firing the employees  ? Or Kraft and you saying the league wanted to frame Brady or this ?

 

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000492361/article/wells-bradys-agent-wrong-to-criticize-my-integrity

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My goodness, Wells look likes a used car salesman

 

CE0zNadUgAALi5n.jpg

That's a great way to defend an argument.  Let's criticize his personal appearance, because he can control what he looks like.  His facial shape, facial structure, body type, etc. were all decided by himself before he was born.  My goodness....attack ideas, not people.

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That's a great way to defend an argument.  Let's criticize his personal appearance, because he can control what he looks like.  His facial shape, facial structure, body type, etc. were all decided by himself before he was born.  My goodness....attack ideas, not people.

It was a joke. I should have used this :)

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Wells was asked why he included a footnote dispelling the notion that this was a sting operation by the NFL, which was brought up because the NFL didn't react after the Colts' warning. The halftime inspection was triggered when the Colts complained again during the game.

"Nobody paid that much attention to it," Wells said about the Colts' claims the day before the AFC championship game. "It wasn’t a sting operation. I addressed it because the Patriots urged me to look at it."

 

Wait, nobody paid that much attention to it? The NFL, with its punishment, found that deflating footballs was the biggest crime in NFL history. Seriously. It was arguably the harshest punishment the league has ever given out, in terms of a team punishment (the $1 million fine is the largest single team fine ever), draft picks stripped (a first-round pick in 2016 and a fourth-round pick in 2017) and Brady's four-game suspension. So what is it NFL? Is deflating balls the biggest crime in NFL history? Or was the thought that the Patriots were pulling off the biggest crime in NFL history so insignificant that "nobody paid that much attention to it"? Should be one or the other.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/ted-wells-battles-back-about-deflate-report--but-not-everything-adds-up-193645486.html

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Antler juice Ray Lewis.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/01/ray-lewis-deer-antler-spray-science_n_2601031.html

 

A small study of questionable merit (it has never been scientifically reviewed or published in any journal) claims weightlifters who used the supplement for 10 weeks had some measurable strength gains when compared with weightlifters who were given a placebo, CNBC reports.

 

But other, more credible studies rebut that finding. Researchers of a 2012 report in the New Zealand Medical Journal said, "Claims made for velvet antler supplements do not appear to be based upon rigorous research from human trials, although for osteoarthritis the findings may have some promise."

 

...

But Dr. Roberto Salvatori, an endocrinologist at Johns Hopkins Medicine in Baltimore, told the Sun there is no medically valid way to deliver IGF-1 orally or in a spray. "If there were, a lot of people would be happy that they don't need to get shots anymore," Salvatori said. "It's just simply not possible for it to come from a spray."

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Wells was asked why he included a footnote dispelling the notion that this was a sting operation by the NFL, which was brought up because the NFL didn't react after the Colts' warning. The halftime inspection was triggered when the Colts complained again during the game.

"Nobody paid that much attention to it," Wells said about the Colts' claims the day before the AFC championship game. "It wasn’t a sting operation. I addressed it because the Patriots urged me to look at it."

 

Wait, nobody paid that much attention to it? The NFL, with its punishment, found that deflating footballs was the biggest crime in NFL history. Seriously. It was arguably the harshest punishment the league has ever given out, in terms of a team punishment (the $1 million fine is the largest single team fine ever), draft picks stripped (a first-round pick in 2016 and a fourth-round pick in 2017) and Brady's four-game suspension. So what is it NFL? Is deflating balls the biggest crime in NFL history? Or was the thought that the Patriots were pulling off the biggest crime in NFL history so insignificant that "nobody paid that much attention to it"? Should be one or the other.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/ted-wells-battles-back-about-deflate-report--but-not-everything-adds-up-193645486.html

You pick and choose what you want to report.  No, deflating footballs isn't the biggest crime.  But you're dealing with a repeat offender in the New England Patriots and there is clearly a strong sense of entitlement and arrogance in that franchise.  So, arrogance + entitlement + refusing to give up stuff investigators request + saying you look forward to an apology from the league + being a repeat offender...I think he got a pretty favourable punishment.  Honestly, Brady and the Patriots' attempts to cover it all up were worse than the crime itself.  And don't compare it to things like the Ray Rice situation.  That was poor handling of the situation.  But just because that was handled poorly, doesn't mean it should set the standard for what punishments should be given out for various offenses.

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Wells was asked why he included a footnote dispelling the notion that this was a sting operation by the NFL, which was brought up because the NFL didn't react after the Colts' warning. The halftime inspection was triggered when the Colts complained again during the game.

"Nobody paid that much attention to it," Wells said about the Colts' claims the day before the AFC championship game. "It wasn’t a sting operation. I addressed it because the Patriots urged me to look at it."

 

Wait, nobody paid that much attention to it? The NFL, with its punishment, found that deflating footballs was the biggest crime in NFL history. Seriously. It was arguably the harshest punishment the league has ever given out, in terms of a team punishment (the $1 million fine is the largest single team fine ever), draft picks stripped (a first-round pick in 2016 and a fourth-round pick in 2017) and Brady's four-game suspension. So what is it NFL? Is deflating balls the biggest crime in NFL history? Or was the thought that the Patriots were pulling off the biggest crime in NFL history so insignificant that "nobody paid that much attention to it"? Should be one or the other.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/ted-wells-battles-back-about-deflate-report--but-not-everything-adds-up-193645486.html

 

“Here, there are several factors that merit strong consideration in assessing discipline. The first is the club’s prior record. In 2007 the club and several individuals were sanctioned for videotaping signals of opposing defensive coaches in violation of the Constitution and Bylaws. Under the Integrity of the Game Policy, this prior violation of competitive rules was properly considered in determining the discipline in this case.

“Another important consideration identified in the Policy is ‘the extent to which the club and relevant individuals cooperated with the investigation.’ The Wells report identifies two significant failures in this respect. The first involves the refusal by the club’s attorneys to make Mr. McNally available for an additional interview, despite numerous requests by Mr. Wells and a cautionary note in writing of the club’s obligation to cooperate in the investigation. The second was the failure of Tom Brady to produce any electronic evidence (emails, texts, etc.), despite being offered extraordinary safeguards by the investigators to protect unrelated personal information. Although we do not hold the club directly responsible for Mr. Brady’s refusal to cooperate, it remains significant that the quarterback of the team failed to cooperate fully with the investigation.

“Finally, it is significant that key witnesses – Mr. Brady, Mr. Jastremski, and Mr. McNally – were not fully candid during the investigation.

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You pick and choose what you want to report.  No, deflating footballs isn't the biggest crime.  But you're dealing with a repeat offender in the New England Patriots and there is clearly a strong sense of entitlement and arrogance in that franchise.  So, arrogance + entitlement + refusing to give up stuff investigators request + saying you look forward to an apology from the league + being a repeat offender...I think he got a pretty favourable punishment.  Honestly, Brady and the Patriots' attempts to cover it all up were worse than the crime itself.  And don't compare it to things like the Ray Rice situation.  That was poor handling of the situation.  But just because that was handled poorly, doesn't mean it should set the standard for what punishments should be given out for various offenses.

Do you realize the Wells report on page 23 says, "the Patriots provided substantial cooperation throughout the investigation."

 

And what cover up? The Wells report was unable to prove anything. And if a team gets punished for arrogance and challenging the league this bad than Roger really needs to go. And lastly, Suh was a repeat offender but got his one game suspension over turned for a playoff game this past season because the league had said enough time has passed since his most recent offense and treated him like a first time offender. But I guess the 8 years between spygate and air pressure did not count for the Pats?

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SEE MY ANSWER IN YOUR QUOTE:

That's only in your mind, not on paper. The SB was the most fair and regulated game probably in the history of the NFL. Every detail was taken in to account. So I can only imagine you are saying that because they beat the Colts with 2 quarters of light balls. But we both know the second half was played with proper balls and we know how that ended.  What you are missing is that in the statement issued with the punishment yesterday they made it quite clear that this activity was highly likely to have been occurring throughout the entire 2014 season and perhaps beyond that.  That would mean they were CHEATING throughout the season to GET to the playoffs and beyond. 

 

If it were up to the non-Patriots fans, I'm sure every win would have asterisks next to it, and even some losses.  I don't hate the Patriots.  Most fans actually don't really care about your team as much as you and other fans like to think.  I don't support cheating and believe in holding cheaters accountable to the max, no matter what their team name.  I agree with the league the second offense brings a higher and harsher penalty.  A third offense should be a DRASTIC penalty, up to and including stripping the right of ownership from Kraft and forcing a sale.

 

They cheated, got caught, will pay the price. But you can't delude yourself and think that the "cheating" actually led to an outcome that would have been different had the balls been 12.5 PSI for all 4 quarters. That's la-la land.  La-la land is thinking the outcome has anything to do with whether cheating was wrong or not.  AGAIN in the report they clearly state it didn't matter whether or not the cheating was effective.  The simple fact cheating happened is what brought this down on your team.

 

I'm mad the most because Brady lied to me and that they didn't need to do this foolish thing. I don't blame you for being angry and I entirely agree with you.  In fact, the need to cheat to assure every possible chance at victory indicates to me someone who is unbalanced and extremely insecure.  Patriots have the Colts number and nothing was going to allow a Colts win, except maybe cheating on the Colts part. It was just dumb and stupid.  

 

And per the Wells report, 3 of the Colts 4 balls tested at half-time by one of the officials actually had the Colts balls under 12.5 PSI... very interesting... it's in the report, forget which page.

The rest of this post is not specifically replying to you but in general to the theme of the Patriot's posters since the news came yesterday.

 

Cheating matters.

Cheating is the diametric opposite of "sportsmanship."

Cheating is shameful - the appropriate reaction would be to be ashamed of the behavior, not justify it.

Cheating and being caught cheating is not comparable to anyone else's behavior.  "But Atlanta did this..." is equal to "But Johnny did it too."  You cheat.  You pay the price what ever it is determined to be.  I have no patience for the "They only got X games, it's UNFAIR *insert whiney voice tone*"

 

The things that simply cannot be explained away or balanced out with other "facts:"

 

1.  Being called the "Deflator" as a nickname earlier in 2014.  There is no reason whatsoever someone would have that nickname without all the rest of this being true.

2.  Sneaking the footballs from the Refs room against all rules and regulations.  There is not a single reason that can be explained as anything other than intentional breaking of the rules.

3. The balls WERE tampered with.  Period.  After being sealed with officials' seals they had no business touching those balls until the game began.  Simply taking those balls after that point, no matter the inflation level, would have been tampering.

 

There are a few Patriots' fans that have had an appropriate reaction, and I have recognized and honored that attitude. I'm assuming in real life and not on this message board there are a lot more.  But the rest of you are a sad, sad lot.  Your "pennants" and "rings" are to you just as the ring was to Golom, and you have as much valor and honor as he did.  "My precious...." 

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Ray denied using the spray , and the NFL never came down on the Ravens for this, but she will keep trying to excuse Patriot proven offenses by bringing up an old SI article.

Correction, the league never investigated Ray. Again, more probably than not in my book.

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Do you realize the Wells report on page 23 says, "the Patriots provided substantial cooperation throughout the investigation."

And what cover up? The Wells report was unable to prove anything. And if a team gets punished for arrogance and challenging the league this bad than Roger really needs to go. And lastly, Suh was a repeat offender but got his one game suspension over turned for a playoff game this past season because the league had said enough time has passed since his most recent offense and treated him like a first time offender. But I guess the 8 years between spygate and air pressure did not count for the Pats?

cheating carrys bigger penalties. and a cover up to boot

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