DeflateGate: Brady suspension expected (mega merge / updated)

[21isSuperman]

"They kept saying I was a dirty player. It hurt my feelings. I would never play dirty"

"Guilty as charged"

[NewColtsFan]

Perhaps Gramz but this is the most ridiculous part of the report - the entire organization from Kraft to Bill and personnel to the equipment manager were completely exonerated. The fall guys appear to be the two part-time ball guys and a "probable" Brady. And this just after the league sent Brady a letter asking him to come to the SB MVP ceremony at next year's Super Bowl. To be honest, this report smells to high heaven. IF something happened here, something of which Brady may be culpable then how can Bill and the org be completely exonerated??

 

You know,  when you went to sleep last night,  it was dark out.

 

And when you woke up,  it was light outside....

 

Did you actually SEE the sun come up?     No.     Then how do you know it did?     Because it's right there in the sky.

 

The balls were all 12.5 pounds of pressure.    And then,  they weren't.    They somehow lost more than a pound each.   Did we SEE someone deflate the footballs?     No.    Then how do we know it happened?      Because the balls were re-measured and found to be under-inflated.

 

The report is fine.    You want proof -- ask Tom Terrific to confess now.   Will that make you happy?

[Gramz]

No, and at least you're admitting it, which is a lot more than most will do/say!

I haven't read a page yet, but knew from Day One that it wouldn't really matter what the report said unless there was definitive, rock-solid evidence either way. No perceptions will change either way.

It is what it is. Punish Brady if necessary. They'll keep winning games and people will hate them even more. Circle of life.

My one regret is that after a long friendship on here, you and I nearly came to blows over this, due to the fact that I was very outspoken with my opinion back in the very beginning.

It's hard when someone is put on a pedestal, and portrayed to be perfect and doing no wrong ever. There is no such person. Many Colts fans, and rightfully so, get sick of the Brady worshipping that goes on ~ on our forum. I just felt with every fiber of my being that he was guilty from the get go.

[BrentMc11]

Cue the essay long explanation from amfootball in 3....2.....1....

Times that by 30 posts and you have a REAL winner .

[pgt_rob]

Is this another day where I run out of likes?

[amfootball]

ask Tom Terrific to confess now.   Will that make you happy?

I am very interested actually in Tom's response ...

[SDakColts]

By reaching I mean the verbiage - "probable" "likely" and this gem related to the weather/scientific explanation:

 

Our scientific consultants informed us that the data alone did not provide a basis

for them to determine with absolute certainty whether there was or was not tampering, as the

analysis of such data is ultimately dependent upon assumptions and information that is uncertain.

I admit there is a lot of reaching "connotations" in this report, but it still all points to the same conclusion anyway you look at it. It shows there is clearly guilty parties in the Pats organization with Tom Brady being one of the guiltiest.

[Superman]

There would be no reason for the NFL.com to have this story and sit on it and wait to get quotes and reaction.

 

You release the report,  with observations from your reporters,  just as you lifted sections of the report here.   And then, over time, you get the reactions from Kraft and Goodell and you report those....

 

But you don't sit and wait to assemble everything....   that's just not how it works.

 

 

I'm not the NFL's media wing. No one is relying on my for information, and the way I disseminate that information doesn't reflect on my multibillion dollar enterprise.

 

If the NFL -- namely, Goodell -- said "I don't want this on the site until we're ready," then that's that. He had the opportunity to try to present it in a way that would be as neat as possible in order to manage expectations. And if that's what happened, then he would have known that the opportunity existed that someone else would get the story.

 

What likely happened is that someone not on the NFL side sent this story to someone at ESPN, and maybe other media people. Someone from Wells' side, most likely, since Wells has been getting heat for taking 104 days to get this done. He didn't want the league to sit on this, for any reason. 

 

To me, like I said to begin with, I don't know why it matters. I get why you would pick up on it, but even the way you're presenting it, I don't think NFL.com comes off looking bad. I actually prefer the way they presented the story to the way ESPN did.

[PeterBowman]

Pats fans should ask Aaron Hernandez how circumstantial evidence works.

[SilentHill]

This made my day, literally.

[wig]

I don't see why this is such a big deal. 

 

It isn't to anyone but him.

 

Still reading through the "report" but much is just speculative and circumstantial so I am not sure what punishment would come of this. I think the text messages are the most damning part for the Pats. Not to mention the ball pressure measurements. As most of said from the beginning, it is very hard to prove ball tampering but the NFL can punish for just the appearance ...

 

This, and the rest of your posts in here, are just sad.

 

they've never won a superbowl without a Probowl corner

 

*or cheating

[lollygagger8]

Hey all. Longtime no talk. Patriots fan here...

 

So in reading the summary of the Wells report and reading the conclusion in the report, and reading the ball measurements in the report, etc., without reading all of it, it's my conclusion that YES, Brady knew about the scheme to deflate footballs, and lied to us all this time. I'm disappointed in that. Even the fact that the PSI had nothing to do with the outcome of the game, that's no excuse. He cheated. That's hard for me to say being a life-long Patriots fan. Some people will say but we won 28-0 in second half with properly inflated footballs. That means nothing. He cheated.

 

I'm at least glad the organization/head coach per the report shows they nothing to do with this. Some may still think they did, but I can't speak to that, only what the report shows. At least this wasn't a organization-wide conspiracy, which really would have ruined my day.

 

Having said that, Brady needs to be fined at least $50,000 and I would fine him $100,000. This appears to be one player with two clowns who attempted to influence the game by altering the balls. The fact they deflated balls after the refs inspected them, that's cheating.

 

To those who want to make this a greater organization conspiracy, top-down, I won't entertain those posts. To say they didn't deserve to beat Seattle, etc.. I won't entertain that. The SB was the most well-officated game in the history of the NFL. No rules were broken there with the spotlight on cheating.

 

So yeah, throw the book at Brady, fine him hard, I'll be right there to praise the fine. He should have came and out said he wanted light balls at his press conference. Should have taken the blame then, and not had us wait 100 days to find out he lied.

 

Bryan

 

If the GM from the Browns gets suspended for 4 games and fined $250k for texting (which didn't effect game play) Shady Brady's punishment should be way worse. Like you said, Brady even held a press conference and lied through his teeth about it and also saying he was just doing what he's always been doing. He just finally got caught. 

 

Also, let's be real here. Pete Carrol's bonehead decision to throw instead of handing off to beast mode won the NE Cheaters the SB. <- Which will forever have an asterisk next to it. 

[amfootball]

 

 

Also, let's be real here. Pete Carrol's bonehead decision to throw instead of handing off to beast mode won the NE Cheaters the SB. <- Which will forever have an asterisk next to it. 

[bababooey]

I am very interested actually in Tom's response ...

He will never own up to it because he's an entitled lying cheater. He lied to us all months ago and he will again. You will never believe it unless it came from his mouth (which it won't) and anyone else that does is just a "hater". Please go home.

[Superman]

I admit there is a lot of reaching "connotations" in this report, but it still all points to the same conclusion anyway you look at it. It shows there is clearly guilty parties in the Pats organization with Tom Brady being one of the guiltiest.

 

It's not reaching. It's called drawing conclusions. When you have a preponderance of evidence, you can do that. You don't need a smoking gun.

 

And ironically, fans and media types that are undermining the conclusions published in this report are known to jump to conclusions and offer implausible explanations/scenarios all the time, then get mad when they're called out for it. Wells and his team interviewed 60(?) people, relied on an abundance of sources and expert analysis, and collected tons of evidence dating back months. It's not speculative, nor is it a reach, to say what this report is saying.

[Warhorse]

You know,  when you went to sleep last night,  it was dark out.

 

And when you woke up,  it was light outside....

 

Did you actually SEE the sun come up?     No.     Then how do you know it did?     Because it's right there in the sky.

 

The balls were all 12.5 pounds of pressure.    And then,  they weren't.    They somehow lost more than a pound each.   Did we SEE someone deflate the footballs?     No.    Then how do we know it happened?      Because the balls were re-measured and found to be under-inflated.

 

The report is fine.    You want proof -- ask Tom Terrific to confess now.   Will that make you happy?

Comn....you know that balls will automatically deflate more on the cold side of the field. That must be why ours were correct.... 

[Archangel]

 

Sorry, Saw this and had to share...lol

 

Now that is funny

[NewColtsFan]

I'm not the NFL's media wing. No one is relying on my for information, and the way I disseminate that information doesn't reflect on my multibillion dollar enterprise.

 

If the NFL -- namely, Goodell -- said "I don't want this on the site until we're ready," then that's that. He had the opportunity to try to present it in a way that would be as neat as possible in order to manage expectations. And if that's what happened, then he would have known that the opportunity existed that someone else would get the story.

 

What likely happened is that someone not on the NFL side sent this story to someone at ESPN, and maybe other media people. Someone from Wells' side, most likely, since Wells has been getting heat for taking 104 days to get this done. He didn't want the league to sit on this, for any reason. 

 

To me, like I said to begin with, I don't know why it matters. I get why you would pick up on it, but even the way you're presenting it, I don't think NFL.com comes off looking bad. I actually prefer the way they presented the story to the way ESPN did.

 

 

What was the difference?

 

I've looked at both places....   they're both running almost the exact same quotes.    The important information is obvious.  They're both using it.

 

How is the NFL.com version somehow better than ESPN??

[CanuckColt]

I wonder how Kraft is going to get his lap dog Goodell to whitewash this one.

[bavanlan]

Never heard such a great explanation. Great work there, sir.

I blame law school.

[Superman]

What was the difference?

 

I've looked at both places....   they're both running almost the exact same quotes.    The important information is obvious.  They're both using it.

 

How is the NFL.com version somehow better than ESPN??

 

The difference was in the 30 minutes before NFL.com posted their story, complete with the report, the statement from Goodell, and the rebuttal from Kraft. 

 

Up to that point, we had a bunch of tweets from info people like Schefter on ESPN's sidebar crawl, and eventually a brief story sharing the conclusion of the findings. NFL.com's initial post was much more complete than anything ESPN had up to that point. At least, that's what I saw. 

[bababooey]

I think Turdulant has to come in here and admit that a pressure gauge is a tool and not a feel test

[pgt_rob]

What was the difference?

 

I've looked at both places....   they're both running almost the exact same quotes.    The important information is obvious.  They're both using it.

 

How is the NFL.com version somehow better than ESPN??

 

Why does this still matter? NFL.com had the report up probably 5 whole minutes later than somebody else. Whoopidy doo!

[Fx Stryker]

I wonder how Kraft is going to get his lap dog Goodell to whitewash this one.

Goodell isn't the one determining the punishment.

[Surge89]

No, and at least you're admitting it, which is a lot more than most will do/say! 

 

I haven't read a page yet, but knew from Day One that it wouldn't really matter what the report said unless there was definitive, rock-solid evidence either way. No perceptions will change either way. 

 

It is what it is. Punish Brady if necessary. They'll keep winning games and people will hate them even more. Circle of life. 

 

Maybe you should read the report first.  Much perception will be changed if not changed already.  If you are fine with winning despite completely trashing the integrity of the game I guess that is your choice.  But for him soaking up his whole Cinderella 6th round pick story for all these years and DIRECTLY lie to everyone about the circumstances of his triumphant raise to the elite QB is pretty low to me.  He is no better than any washed up QB in my book.  Shouldn't even be in the same sentence as Manning.  Nonetheless Montana. 

 

Fact were brought up.  PSI levels were revealed where your organizations stupid attempt to use Science to cover is completely trashed as all variable under the same conditions have vastly different results.  Text messages and denial of information as well.  If it jumps like a frog, looks like a frog and acts like one then I guess...

[BlueCollarColts]

The Pats probably cheated!??! I am shocked! Absolutely shocked!

 

 

 

.... Yes that was sarcasm. 

[dynasty13]

Here is my feeling on this. 

 

The report itself will do little to change the mind of many who formed their opinion on Day 1 of the investigation. There are people on both sides of the argument with very strong opinions and we were all waiting for proof one way or the other. The problem with the report is that it left just enough for each side to continue that same argument by using terminology like 'more probable than not'...it leaves that little bit for it's defenders to cling to because in the end, still, nothing was proven. And this is why I think it will be difficult to punish.

 

Do I think Brady knew about this and was involved? Yes I do...but the fact that he didnt hand his phone over isnt what makes me believe that. That isn't proof. Unfortunately the report stopped just short of actually saying that he did it, and that is what makes it difficult to punish. I will be very surprised if there is any type of suspension...a fine maybe, but how do you suspend a player for 'probably' doing something?

[Hoosier]

What I'd like to know is whether the Colts will get any apology from any of the sports media *s who perpetuated the asinine notion that the Colts deflated the INT ball, or that the team and the league somehow conspired to bushwhack the Patriots on this.

[amfootball]

Here is my feeling on this. 

 

The report itself will do little to change the mind of many who formed their opinion on Day 1 of the investigation. There are people on both sides of the argument with very strong opinions and we were all waiting for proof one way or the other. The problem with the report is that it left just enough for each side to continue that same argument by using terminology like 'more probable than not'...it leaves that little bit for it's defenders to cling to because in the end, still, nothing was proven. And this is why I think it will be difficult to punish.

 

Do I think Brady knew about this and was involved? Yes I do...but the fact that he didnt hand his phone over isnt what makes me believe that. That isn't proof. Unfortunately the report stopped just short of actually saying that he did it, and that is what makes it difficult to punish. I will be very surprised if there is any type of suspension...a fine maybe, but how do you suspend a player for 'probably' doing something?

The verbiage was intentional regarding for Brady I think for this reason. No real proof. I can't imagine a suspension without more than a probable and likely.

[PeterBowman]

my concern is that if it was "widely known" around the league that the Pats doctored the balls, then how come there was no investigation prior to this?

[Surge89]

This made my day, literally.

 

me 2

[radiogirl]

Comn....you know that balls will automatically deflate more on the cold side of the field. That must be why ours were correct.... 

BULL CRAP!  Even football manufacturers were saying it doesn't happen.  They make them to withstand the cold.

[bababooey]

Here is my feeling on this. 

 

The report itself will do little to change the mind of many who formed their opinion on Day 1 of the investigation. There are people on both sides of the argument with very strong opinions and we were all waiting for proof one way or the other. The problem with the report is that it left just enough for each side to continue that same argument by using terminology like 'more probable than not'...it leaves that little bit for it's defenders to cling to because in the end, still, nothing was proven. And this is why I think it will be difficult to punish.

 

Do I think Brady knew about this and was involved? Yes I do...but the fact that he didnt hand his phone over isnt what makes me believe that. That isn't proof. Unfortunately the report stopped just short of actually saying that he did it, and that is what makes it difficult to punish. I will be very surprised if there is any type of suspension...a fine maybe, but how do you suspend a player for 'probably' doing something?

first bold: no, no it does not. the evidence is circumstantial, ask aaron hernandez about it.

 

second bold: did you read the other texts? also lawyers have to write in legal-speak, can't straight up say "yea he def did it based on what I know". an accountant does the same thing in an audit report. he's going to get punished, so will his team because it's clear they cheated.

 

You should probably add those asterisks to your signature about now...

[Jay Kirk]

 Wow imagine that the Patriots cheated . Im shocked !

[lollygagger8]

So it just so happens that the same process as always includes balls inflated under, excuse me I mean deflated under 12.5 psi. Hmmm...

 

See? You get it. 

[Qwiz]

Sorry they won the game due to the seahawks not running the instead elected to pass the ball on 4th and 1 on the patriots 1 yard line otherwise the patriots was getting their butts beat

Theoretically. Butler made the play when it had to be made though. And Seattle didn't exactly beat anyone's butt, even if they had scored and won there.

[BlueCollarColts]

I think my dog might of torn up my couch...... he has shreds of the couch all around him and is laying by it, but I didn't actually see him do it..... Damn I don't think I have enough evidence to punish him  .

[GoColts8818]

The only people who can't peace together things like those who wrote the report did are those who don't want to because they don't want the report to be true and are looking for a loop hole for it to not be.

[pgt_rob]

[Jay Kirk]

I think my dog might of torn up my couch...... he has shreds of the couch all around him and is laying by it, but I didn't actually see him do it..... Damn I don't think I have enough evidence to punish him  .