DeflateGate: Brady suspension expected (mega merge / updated)

[Dustin]

http://www.necn.com/news/new-england/Sources-Patriots-Concerned-About-6-8-Game-Suspension-for-Tom-Brady-303099401.html

Oh.

Still not enough. He needs to be banned and have all of his numbers stricken from the record books. I'd even be for them stripping them of their most recent Super Bowl "win".

[Restored]

I've been very honest and objective about this, but just have to point out...

 

It's premature to crap on Brady's legacy at this point. You can call him a cheater, a liar, whatever, but if the Patriots come out next season, go 12-4 again, and make a deep run or maybe even get to another SB, then how much did deflated balls have to do with anything? 

 

If they come out and go 8-8, different story.

 

This is what happened with Spygate. People said they would suck once the league took Belichick's cameras away. How did that work out? 

 

Be objective. Be reasonable. Wait and watch to see what happens. If Brady has a career year in 2015, with new rules and "clean" footballs, a lot of you are going to still hate him anyway. 

 

It'll be tough for any of what you are saying to happen if he's suspended 6-8 games. It's a shame you wasted all that time typing that fantasy.

[PeterBowman]

Same guy on the radio yesterday said he didn't think Brady should get punished at all, so we know he's not pulling for a suspension.  Clarity on what he personally thinks and if there is a bias.

plus there's the Boston sports radio people tweeting before the report was released that Colts fans would not be happy.......

[garydellabate]

Still not enough. He needs to be banned and have all of his numbers stricken from the record books. I'd even be for them stripping them of their most recent Super Bowl "win".

I'd like the Colts to be made "whole" somehow considering they cheated against us and the NFL knew about it and failed to prevent it.

[csmopar]

BTW, Don Yee has been everywhere this week - CNN, Mike and Mike, Dan Patrick and he was just on our local afternoon show. It is clear that he and Brady believe this report is bogus and will fight any league discipline.

 

 

Yeah, who gives a crap....I can go to every country, every city, every town and say that I'm richer than Bill Gates.....doesn't make it true.

[ReMeDy]

I can understand the outrage to a certain extent...but then it goes too far....like 40 pages too far lol. Most threads are only a couple pages on most boards besides ours. It doesn't need to be this big conspiracy and doesn't need to be some big black ops secret. This isn't watergate...its a football...a player trying to alter the pressure...and its a game...a kids game.

 

About 10% of the posts are from AM. About 20% of the posts are in response to AM. This topic would probably only be 16 pages if AM wasn't posting. I'm not saying, I'm just saying.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

I've been very honest and objective about this, but just have to point out...

 

It's premature to crap on Brady's legacy at this point.

 

Premature would be Kraft who blasted the NFL & demanded an Apology maybe he should have waited or maybe Tom Brady should have told him the truth .

 

Because Kraft looks pretty foolish now after the fact .

 

Not when the guy who's legacy is in question is the one taking the dump . Brutal Honesty we waited for the report the report is final now we wait for the penalties .

 

The Patriots & Tom Brady were foolish & did'nt cooperate like most who are innocent its all over but the crying ..

[dgambill]

It's mostly arguing. I wouldn't classify 90% of the posts as outrage. 

Good point....ton of arguing....but I still sense quite a bit of anger for a good deal of them. Guess overall I think its a lot of getting worked up over a small infraction. Just my opinion....I still respect others but this is more a dissappointing thing than some overall scandalous thing.

[Superman]

Still not enough. He needs to be banned and have all of his numbers stricken from the record books. I'd even be for them stripping them of their most recent Super Bowl "win".

 

Wake up, guy. I'll be surprised if he's suspended at all. 

[dgambill]

Its the NFL's baby of course judge prosecuter  jury nah just fans who have been bottled up for months happy to have an opportunity to talk about something that had been denied to us for months .

 

Now that the report is here we got plenty to say .

 

At every opportunity to come clean Tom Brady has chosen lie or not answer or just say there are those out there that don't like me .

 

Lies & denials turned a mole hill into a mountain .

I'm happy you can get this out...hopefully it will be over with soon and we can move on but alas this board will hold on to this to the end of time.....still people crying about spygate...if it was just getting it out of peoples system than that would be fine...but they way people act on here....no...they will bring it up forever...and thats dissappointing.

[Gramz]

Wake up, guy. I'll be surprised if he's suspended at all.

Prepare to be surprised

[dgambill]

Wake up, guy. I'll be surprised if he's suspended at all. 

 

 

Still not enough. He needs to be banned and have all of his numbers stricken from the record books. I'd even be for them stripping them of their most recent Super Bowl "win".

Supes this is what I was getting at..and plenty of other posts...its just nonsense. I do hope we get this out of our system and can bury it....I won't stay on these boards if this is all I hear about week in and out when Tom plays or NE wins.

[OffensivelyPC]

I've been very honest and objective about this, but just have to point out...

 

It's premature to crap on Brady's legacy at this point. You can call him a cheater, a liar, whatever, but if the Patriots come out next season, go 12-4 again, and make a deep run or maybe even get to another SB, then how much did deflated balls have to do with anything? 

 

If they come out and go 8-8, different story.

 

This is what happened with Spygate. People said they would suck once the league took Belichick's cameras away. How did that work out? 

 

Be objective. Be reasonable. Wait and watch to see what happens. If Brady has a career year in 2015, with new rules and "clean" footballs, a lot of you are going to still hate him anyway. 

But for this scandal, he's a first ballot hall of famer. I don't think anyone can really argue that.  that being said, this set of events is loosely being compared to the NFL's version of Pete Rose - and I don't think that it's an unfair comparison.  Neither guy did anything better or worse than the other, they both compromised their own personal and professional integrity as it pertains to their accomplishments on the field.  That alone kept Pete out of the HOF, and only until now is the idea of him being up for HOF voting being mulled.  Perhaps your opinion is that what Brady did was not as bad.  That's fine, I don't know or even care to debate that.  My only point is that, he could do better in 2015, but his legacy is absolutely affected by all of this.  Like Brady, were it not for the allegations, Rose was absolutely a hall of famer and would be in today.  And my feelings on Rose are the same as they are Brady.  On the one hand, I recognize that he deserves to eb in the hall of fame because of the type of player he was, but on the other, I have a hard time (as I suspect any voter might) voting in someone who has compromised the integrity of the sport into the Hall.  

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

I'm happy you can get this out...hopefully it will be over with soon and we can move on but alas this board will hold on to this to the end of time.....still people crying about spygate...if it was just getting it out of peoples system than that would be fine...but they way people act on here....no...they will bring it up forever...and thats dissappointing.

 

Patriot fans for years dogged Peyton Manning who I would point out is a honorable man who is not a liar .

 

This is Karma & the Patriots & there fans earned it  Obnoxious & arrogance  demoted to liars & cheaters . I will never feel sorry for them & after my visit there I'm happy knowing just how miserable this is for them they have lost something that can never be regained IMO there honor & pride .

[Valpo2004]

Bill Belichek proved in America it's OK to cheat as long as you cheat your way to the top.

 

Tom Brady has reinforced that notion.

[Jaric]

I've been very honest and objective about this, but just have to point out...

It's premature to crap on Brady's legacy at this point. You can call him a cheater, a liar, whatever, but if the Patriots come out next season, go 12-4 again, and make a deep run or maybe even get to another SB, then how much did deflated balls have to do with anything?

If they come out and go 8-8, different story.

This is what happened with Spygate. People said they would suck once the league took Belichick's cameras away. How did that work out?

Be objective. Be reasonable. Wait and watch to see what happens. If Brady has a career year in 2015, with new rules and "clean" footballs, a lot of you are going to still hate him anyway.

What I find irritating is that you guys are good enough that you don't have to do this crap.

[SilentHill]

This is an oldy, but a good one!

 

[GoPats]

But for this scandal, he's a first ballot hall of famer. I don't think anyone can really argue that.  that being said, this set of events is loosely being compared to the NFL's version of Pete Rose - and I don't think that it's an unfair comparison.  Neither guy did anything better or worse than the other, they both compromised their own personal and professional integrity as it pertains to their accomplishments on the field.  That alone kept Pete out of the HOF, and only until now is the idea of him being up for HOF voting being mulled.  Perhaps your opinion is that what Brady did was not as bad.  That's fine, I don't know or even care to debate that.  My only point is that, he could do better in 2015, but his legacy is absolutely affected by all of this.  Like Brady, were it not for the allegations, Rose was absolutely a hall of famer and would be in today.  And my feelings on Rose are the same as they are Brady.  On the one hand, I recognize that he deserves to eb in the hall of fame because of the type of player he was, but on the other, I have a hard time (as I suspect any voter might) voting in someone who has compromised the integrity of the sport into the Hall.  

 

 

Fair points but Rose is a little different.

 

No one ever doubted Rose's actual ability to play his sport. He stepped outside the rules in a much different way, IMO. From what I'm seeing from other fans, people are ready to basically dismiss everything Brady has accomplished and chalk it up to one millimeter of grip strength on a football. Everyone has an ulterior motive... tearing Brady down brings their guy up a notch somehow. 

 

My prediction/thought is that, assuming Brady plays in 2015, no one is going to notice even a little difference despite the forthcoming changes to how footballs are handled pre-game. He broke the rules, yes, but the worse part is that he lied about it. That doesn't magnify the original transgression. 

 

It's a plea for objectivity that I realize will largely go unheard. 

[jskinnz]

I've been very honest and objective about this, but just have to point out...

 

It's premature to crap on Brady's legacy at this point. You can call him a cheater, a liar, whatever, but if the Patriots come out next season, go 12-4 again, and make a deep run or maybe even get to another SB, then how much did deflated balls have to do with anything? 

 

If they come out and go 8-8, different story.

 

This is what happened with Spygate. People said they would suck once the league took Belichick's cameras away. How did that work out? 

 

Be objective. Be reasonable. Wait and watch to see what happens. If Brady has a career year in 2015, with new rules and "clean" footballs, a lot of you are going to still hate him anyway. 

I can't stand Brady largely because he QB's the team we in Indy are conditioned to hate.

 

I think he got caught with his hand in the cookie jar in this nonsense and deserves some kind of punishment.

 

I also think the Pats will be dangerous during his likely suspension and doubly so once he gets back on the field.

 

I also believe he is one of if not the greatest QB to ever play the game - which makes me hate him even more.

[DougDew]

But for this scandal, he's a first ballot hall of famer. I don't think anyone can really argue that.  that being said, this set of events is loosely being compared to the NFL's version of Pete Rose - and I don't think that it's an unfair comparison.  Neither guy did anything better or worse than the other, they both compromised their own personal and professional integrity as it pertains to their accomplishments on the field.  That alone kept Pete out of the HOF, and only until now is the idea of him being up for HOF voting being mulled.  Perhaps your opinion is that what Brady did was not as bad.  That's fine, I don't know or even care to debate that.  My only point is that, he could do better in 2015, but his legacy is absolutely affected by all of this.  Like Brady, were it not for the allegations, Rose was absolutely a hall of famer and would be in today.  And my feelings on Rose are the same as they are Brady.  On the one hand, I recognize that he deserves to eb in the hall of fame because of the type of player he was, but on the other, I have a hard time (as I suspect any voter might) voting in someone who has compromised the integrity of the sport into the Hall.

And there are people suggesting that deflated balls had no outcome on the games or Brady's career in the past. It doesn't matter. Rose never bet on his team to lose, so someone could argue his gambling had no outcome on the games. But yet he's banned from his sport for life.

Anther analogy. What if Brady has been cheating since the mid 2000's? What of all of those passing duels with Manning where fans are glued to the TV watching records being set in some years were the result of Brady cheating to overcome his 6th round small hands and weak grip?

Compare that to MacGuire and Sosa when they were cheating to set their records. Later, fans felt baseball took advantage of them because the players, in many ways, committed fraud.

Is the NFL going to become like baseball where the fans stop taking the game seriously?

I'm going to ask, who will be cheating on which rule next season?

[dw49]

Wake up, guy. I'll be surprised if he's suspended at all. 

 

 

I think this is his attempt to "poke fun" at those that think this isn't "something all teams do" or anyone that thinks it a "serious offense ."

[DougDew]

Just curious. is it possible for fans who spent a lot of money to watch a game get their money back from the athletes who now have it if they win a class action lawsuit claiming fraud?

Maybe Brady's attorney has advised him to not admit to anything.

[ColtRider]

Last night, I read the entire Ted Well report. I also saw Tom Brady speak briefly last night on TV at that previously arranged speaking engagement function. Here are my thoughts:

 

--Tom Brady's agent needs to shut the hades up. The guy is being paid by Tom Brady. Is he an expert on air pressure, NFL rules & regulations, & why didn't your client relinquish his phone to Mr. Wells to exonerate his name? Ah genius, & I use the term loosely, neither Ted Wells or Roger Goodell  have a vested interest in falsely creating a report designed to take down a future HOF QB in light of Ray Rice & Adrian Peterson egg on the NFL's face scandals sir. Do you realize how stupid you are sounding right now sir? 

 

--The league is really only saying or the report rather that Jim McNally, Patriots Locker Room attendant, had the AFC Championship Game balls in his possession, entered a bathroom alone for over a minute, locked the door, & later took the bag of footballs on the field without referee Walt Anderson's permission. No direct evidence puts a needle in Brady's hands deflating footballs. However, McNally called himself the "Deflator" & that presumably in return for doing this activity Brady gave Mr. McNally autographed footballs & jerseys signed by Brady. 

 

--If I was a HOF QB & I was accused of breaking a well established rule, darn it I'd pound my fist & say defiantly "I'm not a cheater. I am a man of integrity. I respect the rules of this game & I will defend my innocence with my last dying breath." Not smirk, ask the friendly audience venue for support, & not turn the gathering into a pep rally. Or I would say "You know, I made a mistake. I need to own up to my role in this shady activity & I need to apologize to the organization & fans across the globe." Do that & I will forgive Brady eventually. 

 

--After reading that report, it's clear to me that Brady turned a blind eye to deflating balls in order to have plausible deniability at his disposal. All that text traffic between McNally & Brady proves that Brady knew what in the hades was going on. To me, it's not the infraction that ticks me off; It the effort he went to & continues to go to perpetuate this notion that codes of conduct don't apply to a HOF QB. NE must be fined heavily, lose a 2nd round draft pick, & Tom must be suspended for 4 games minimum. 

 

--If Luck or Peyton Manning, 2 guys I revere were accused of the exact same violation; I would demand the same punishment by the way since the league goes to great pains to inform all 32 teams what the rules & regulations are. I view Deflate Gate as a separate incident & the SpyGate Scandal has no bearing on the punishment here IMO. 

 

--Don't use Jim McNally as the primary scapegoat here NE fans or the fact that the infraction seems minor at face value. No, what matters here is that all tested Colts footballs met psi requirements, environmental conditions did not result in Patriots deflated balls, & coverups will bring you down faster than just manning up & telling the truth. 

 

--Are NE's 4 SB Championships now tainted? No, because air pressure won't win games or accumulate titles execution & sideline adjustments do. However, Brady's reputation has taken a huge symbolic hit that won't be easy to recover from. Brady is still 1 hades of a QB, but he knew what Jim McNally was doing & all their text conversions are not about a good friend's upcoming wedding nuptials. Please...Tommy knew what was going down & there's no way Mr. McNally did this football deflation on a whim without Brady's consent or approval. Come on now. 

 

--I am really disturbed by how Brady's smiling demeanor blows this psi scandal off as haters gotta hate man mentality. Are you freaking kidding me man?! Sigh...I'm really disappointed in you Brady. Your reputation is under attack & all you can say in "Not everybody is going to like me or the team I play for?" Seriously? 

 

--Brady participated in a scheme with 2 other people from the Patriots organization to release air from sanctioned Wilson footballs & you can just laugh this episode off. If you lie about this, what will you do when it comes to something of a grand & elaborate nature Tom? Own you role in this debackle & the scandal disappears, but play dumb & a dark cloud will linger forever around your NFL reputation & legacy Tom Brady.

 

--What's better Tom to be viewed as willing to win at any cost or incompetent & blissfully ignorant? Spygate, Inactive player routes on the field of play, & depleted air pressure...No other franchise gets associated with repeatedly playing fast & loose with the rules over & over again other than NE...Are you being unfairly picked on or do you need to refrain from shady NFL practices? Hmmm....At some point take ownership of your own team's actions & you can begin to move past these speed bumps. I'm just saying...

 

I like Brady & even though NE routinely kicks my beloved Colts caboose in the Playoffs; Brady lied about his knowledge of deflate gate & until he owns up to his responsibility in allowing this to happen & extend this absurd lie I cannot forgive him. Brady didn't deflate the balls himself; He just remained silent which is even worse IMO. Take responsibility & this scandal begins to fade; Deny it & your reputation is tarnished forever.

Nice, SW1! My thoughts and sentiments mirrored here as well with most of what you said. Brady should've taken the opportunity last night at Salem State to proclaim his innocence. If he is in fact, that. The smiles, deflection, seemingly uncomfortableness, and stating he would address this at an appropriate time just hit me as disingenuous. His rep, Yees, came off the exact same way this morning on Mike & Mike ESPN. You just do not do that if you're innocent. I'd be screaming and kicking all the way to proclaim it to as many people who had chances to listen at any and every opportunity given to me.

[Jason_]

I guess that is your take but I am just as horrified at those outside of NE that are comparing this to Nixon and Lance Armstrong. As with everything, the extremes run wild and are a sad commentary on the human condition.

 

I would be incredibly surprised if there was a single person anywhere the would compare the voracity of what Brady did to Nixon/Armstrong.  You know that though. 

 

[OffensivelyPC]

Fair points but Rose is a little different.

 

No one ever doubted Rose's actual ability to play his sport. He stepped outside the rules in a much different way, IMO. From what I'm seeing from other fans, people are ready to basically dismiss everything Brady has accomplished and chalk it up to one millimeter of grip strength on a football. Everyone has an ulterior motive... tearing Brady down brings their guy up a notch somehow. 

 

My prediction/thought is that, assuming Brady plays in 2015, no one is going to notice even a little difference despite the forthcoming changes to how footballs are handled pre-game. He broke the rules, yes, but the worse part is that he lied about it. That doesn't magnify the original transgression. 

 

It's a plea for objectivity that I realize will largely go unheard. 

It's not about tearing down his legacy to bring anyone else's guy up.  I'm not going ot put words in your mouth, but just to illustrate, there's room in the HOF for both Brady and Manning.  And if Brady plays well again next year, I'd look at that performance and be like, yeah, he had a good season.  I can admit that.  But when people (and specifically, the media and voters) talk legacy, they include more than just statistics and trophies.  But going even beyond that, just in day to day conversations like this, it's hard to acknowledge Brady's on the field play without also acknowledging what he has done off it - or in his case, done to affect the field if I'm speaking candidly.  

 

It's just the nature of sports and it's all relevant.  It's the reason why I have a man crush on JJ Watt.  He's great on the field, but what he does off the field makes me respect him more than I otherwise would.  It makes him transcendant and it's a great thing to watch.  It's why I don't feel the same way about Adrian Peterson as I used to.  Not saying that Brady did is on the same level.  It's not.  It is, however, relevant, when I - and most people - discuss greatest, hall of famer, or transcendant players

[jskinnz]

I would be incredibly surprised if there was a single person anywhere the would compare the voracity of what Brady did to Nixon/Armstrong.  You know that though. 

 

 

Agreed.  They are not in the same ball park and she does know that.  But she has a role to play so we get the constant barrage of complete nonsense.

 

I do think the Nixon comparison is valid in that neither the Pats or Tricky Dick needed to cheat to win but...

[buccolts]

What I find irritating is that you guys are good enough that you don't have to do this crap.

 

It's possible Tom Brady disagrees with you.

[GoPats]

I can't stand Brady largely because he QB's the team we in Indy are conditioned to hate.

 

I think he got caught with his hand in the cookie jar in this nonsense and deserves some kind of punishment.

 

I also think the Pats will be dangerous during his likely suspension and doubly so once he gets back on the field.

 

I also believe he is one of if not the greatest QB to ever play the game - which makes me hate him even more.

 

I think you're right... and this time around it's kind of a lot more personal than Spygate. 

 

Thanks for the honest and unbiased answer. I've grudgingly accepted that Brady was involved here, there's very little doubt if any of that... but I do think they'll respond/rebound in an effort to "prove" that what they've accomplished has been earned. 

[buccolts]

Just curious. is it possible for fans who spent a lot of money to watch a game get their money back from the athletes who now have it if they win a class action lawsuit claiming fraud?

Maybe Brady's attorney has advised him to not admit to anything.

 

I'm pretty certain that's SOP.

[GoPats]

 

Edit:I forgot to say right up front - I don't hate Brady and I understand your emotional vantage point.

 

Except for one thing.  And this is where the "Nixonian" comparison comes in.  They didn't have to cheat.  They didn't have to break the rules.  Their character (or fear or lack of character) drove them to it and that's just plain sick...  That's not competition - that's something deeply wrong at the core of their being.  

 

Meant to respond to this by quoting myself from an earlier post. 

 

 

The crazy part, which is almost exactly like Spygate, is the "why?" He clearly didn't need an advantage, however minor anyone may think it is, against you guys. He played lights-out against an extremely good defense in the Super Bowl with the cleanest footballs in the history of the sport. A softer ball gives you slightly better grip, resulting in improved accuracy for some throwers, but it takes velocity off the ball. With the give-and-take nature of it, and the possible consequences, and the team's history/reputation fallout from Spygate, it was very foolish of Brady to push the envelope. 

 

[OffensivelyPC]

And there are people suggesting that deflated balls had no outcome on the games or Brady's career in the past. It doesn't matter. Rose never bet on his team to lose, so someone could argue his gambling had no outcome on the games. But yet he's banned from his sport for life.

Anther analogy. What if Brady has been cheating since the mid 2000's? What of all of those passing duels with Manning where fans are glued to the TV watching records being set in some years were the result of Brady cheating to overcome his 6th round small hands and weak grip?

Compare that to MacGuire and Sosa when they were cheating to set their records. Later, fans felt baseball took advantage of them because the players, in many ways, committed fraud.

Is the NFL going to become like baseball where the fans stop taking the game seriously?

I'm going to ask, who will be cheating on which rule next season?

Well stated.  It's one of hte reasons I don't really follow basketball like I used to with teh whole Donaghy scandal and refs betting on games.  Because, while the score in the AFCCG indicated it didn't matter if the balls were underinflated or not, the fact that the Patriots (at the time) were playing in the superbowl and later won while being investigated for tampering with the footballs, I couldn't help but think, "So, cheating is okay as long as you win?"  I'm over that, but that's not the question you want your fans asking of your sport.  I get that it was too premature to put the super bowl on hold until an investigation was complete, so the NFL was in a ahrd place there, I can forgive that, even if I didn't like it at the time.

 

That said, I don't care to watch any sport where it feels rigged or cheating goes unpunished.  You can't stop it in all instances.  That's impossible and I get that.  But what matters is, you have a meaningful way of discovering cheating and when you do, you respond in a way that sets a meaningful deterrent.  So far, I think the NFL has done that, at least since I've been watching.  We'll see what happens with this, though.

[DougDew]

I can't stand Brady largely because he QB's the team we in Indy are conditioned to hate.

 

I think he got caught with his hand in the cookie jar in this nonsense and deserves some kind of punishment.

 

I also think the Pats will be dangerous during his likely suspension and doubly so once he gets back on the field.

 

I also believe he is one of if not the greatest QB to ever play the game - which makes me hate him even more.

I think Brady is a loser. I think he's had to cheat his entire career to overcome his 6th round small hands and weak grip. Its a complete statistical outlier for a 6th round draft choice to play like a HOFer, unless that player cheats.

[DougDew]

I'm pretty certain that's SOP.

Yes, I agree, if the judicial system is about to get involved, not just a sports league.

[buccolts]

I suppose if, after Tom comes back from suspension, he turns into a fumbling machine, we'll have a better idea of how far back this may have gone.

[PeterBowman]

I suppose if, after Tom comes back from suspension, he turns into a fumbling machine, we'll have a better idea of how far back this may have gone.

that goes for the rest of the team too

[ColtRider]

It's possible Tom Brady disagrees with you.

buccolts, your bottom SIG should be put on every interstate sign entering Massachusetts! Just heard Bruschi on ESPN support Brady no matter what. He's trying to pin it on the Colts. What a tunneled-vision individual when it comes to the Patriots organization. You're better off keeping your mouth closed and quit speaking for Brady. Now he's saying the text messages were just "joking around".

Unbelievable gall.

[buccolts]

that goes for the rest of the team too

 

Yep. That info another poster put out yesterday on fumble stats for the 'law firm' was pretty eye opening.

And that's just one example.

 

I wonder what Blount's fumble rate was for the Steelers last year.

Heck, now I'm wondering if the whole Blount to the Pats thing sparked this issue.

[Dustin]

I would be incredibly surprised if there was a single person anywhere the would compare the voracity of what Brady did to Nixon/Armstrong. You know that though.

I do. At least to Armstrong. Lance Armstrong may have been worse, but at least he had the decency to cheat in a sport nobody cares about.

[jskinnz]

I think Brady is a loser. I think he's had to cheat his entire career to overcome his 6th round small hands and weak grip. Its a complete statistical outlier for a 6th round draft choice to play like a HOFer, unless that player cheats.

 

Yeah, that seems over the top.

 

Probably best we agree to disagree and move on. 

 

See you in other threads.

[Btown_Colt]

Fair points but Rose is a little different.

 

No one ever doubted Rose's actual ability to play his sport. He stepped outside the rules in a much different way, IMO. From what I'm seeing from other fans, people are ready to basically dismiss everything Brady has accomplished and chalk it up to one millimeter of grip strength on a football. Everyone has an ulterior motive... tearing Brady down brings their guy up a notch somehow. 

 

My prediction/thought is that, assuming Brady plays in 2015, no one is going to notice even a little difference despite the forthcoming changes to how footballs are handled pre-game. He broke the rules, yes, but the worse part is that he lied about it. That doesn't magnify the original transgression. 

 

It's a plea for objectivity that I realize will largely go unheard. 

 

First I want to say that your post so far in this thread have been pretty logical and fair. My reply is not pointed at you directly.

 

This is what makes me mad. Not at you or just Patriot fans, but everyone saying it didn't matter or it didn't help him. It obviously helped him (maybe only in his own head) or else wouldn't have done it. If the PSI in the football didn't matter, then it he wouldn't have been mad at the ref's during the Jets game. He and Manning also led the charge in getting the rules changed allowing teams to use their own balls. You may see it as a insufficient and as only a "millimeter of grip strength", but Brady sees it as a whole lot more than that. So yes, I would venture to say that the "millimeter of grip strength", helped Brady accomplish what he has. Could he have done with balls that had a "millimeter LESS of grip strength"? Probably, but he didn't. He chose to do this because it benefited him, end of discussion. Whether it really did or not is irrelevant. I assure you he didn't have the balls deflated so that the game would be more of a challenge for him!