PFT: Multiple Colts players upset with Dorsett selection

[bababooey]

No. My point was that Dorsett and Brown will forever be linked (not Dorsett and Easley) given the Colts could have selected him and then he fell to the Pats.

You think that is true? I mean I can see why guys like Luck and RG3 are linked, or Manning and Leaf, but the 29th pick and the 32nd pick? Considering both will not be the best players on their respective teams nor will they be looked at to be the guy that leads the team. Your linking Dorsett and Brown together just because you only know we can't scheme well enough to stop New England's run is quite the stretch.

 

Dorsett could be the next OBJ or Reggie Wayne and Brown could tear his acls tomorrow or vice versa and we still could get trampled by Blount and nobody would think "Oh man....dumb pick at 29".

[bababooey]

No, no way.  For picking defense?  Surely that can't ......  uhhh,      mmmmmm.....     wait.  Nevermind,

 

In their defense the Texans still suck.

[dw49]

lol. You mean Malcolm Brown and your jet as that will forever be the comparison from now to infinity given the Colts could have taken him instead of the jet allowing him to land in the Pats laps filling one of their biggest needs ...

 

 

Sure, we can do that one too.

 

BTW.. reports were that the Pats had traded out of the round and they had to cancel the trade when the guy Houston wanted was gone. I know your still waiting for "Bill " to confirm it but nobody in Texan lad has denied it. So one would think it would be true as no doubt the Texans would love to put that one to sleep .. no ? 

[ColtsBlueFL]

Your point in this entire debate has not been to draft need first?

 

Unfortunately, she often really has no point, or it shifts.  She'll toss out a position, then puts on her ballerina dress and spins her way through the thread. How something was bad for you, but genius for the Pats.  Dances and spins all the while singing  'I am rubber, you are glue...' You'll probably get tired of dancing with her soon enough, after trying to debunk her latest theorems with a few well thought out posts that get chewed up in the 'spin cycle'.

[ColtsBlueFL]

In their defense the Texans still suck.

 

I'm sure Grigson can find room for Watt if the Texans don't want him...  Put his locker right beside Dorsett's...;-)

[Lawrence Owen]

I'm sure Grigson can find room for Watt if the Texans don't want him...  Put his locker right beside Dorsett's...;-)

 

Lol, in an article about the Colts getting A.J. Texan fans were blowing up about how he lost a step and they were just moving on and we can have  their "scraps".  I pointed out to them that Watt had 5 less tackles last year than the year before and he must have lost a step also, and that we'd gladly take those scraps as well...lol

[amfootball]

Sure, we can do that one too.

 

BTW.. reports were that the Pats had traded out of the round and they had to cancel the trade when the guy Houston wanted was gone. I know your still waiting for "Bill " to confirm it but nobody in Texan lad has denied it. So one would think it would be true as no doubt the Texans would love to put that one to sleep .. no ? 

I would imagine the trade being put to bed was mutual as once the Pats saw the Colts took Dorsett instead of Brown they were not trading out to any team.

[amfootball]

Unfortunately, she often really has no point, or it shifts.  She'll toss out a position, then puts on her ballerina dress and spins her way through the thread. How something was bad for you, but genius for the Pats.  Dances and spins all the while singing  'I am rubber, you are glue...' You'll probably get tired of dancing with her soon enough, after trying to debunk her latest theorems with a few well thought out posts that get chewed up in the 'spin cycle'.

Wow. I had no idea ... and this whole time I thought we were buds.

[amfootball]

You think that is true? I mean I can see why guys like Luck and RG3 are linked, or Manning and Leaf, but the 29th pick and the 32nd pick? Considering both will not be the best players on their respective teams nor will they be looked at to be the guy that leads the team. Your linking Dorsett and Brown together just because you only know we can't scheme well enough to stop New England's run is quite the stretch.

 

Dorsett could be the next OBJ or Reggie Wayne and Brown could tear his acls tomorrow or vice versa and we still could get trampled by Blount and nobody would think "Oh man....dumb pick at 29".

Sure all that could happen but I was looking at this more from a macro level. Colts pick WR even though defense was a bigger need. Pats take a defender the Colts could have had. So you have the Colts/Pats rivalry now sparked by two players separated by three picks from the two teams that just played for the AFCCG. I would expect to see both players getting playing time next year which should make the comparison oodles of fun for the networks and talking heads ...

[Lawrence Owen]

Sure all that could happen but I was looking at this more from a macro level. Colts pick WR even though defense was a bigger need. Pats take a defender the Colts could have had. So you have the Colts/Pats rivalry now sparked by two players separated by three picks from the two teams that just played for the AFCCG. I would expect to see both players getting playing time next year which should make the comparison oodles of fun for the networks and talking heads ...

 

First off Colt did not even want Brown...they wanted Anderson,..whom they got in the 3rd round and he had a better year last year than Brown did.

Secondly, on having two T.Y.  type players, Who would not want two speedsters with hands that can stretch the field  in the game at the same time? Name a team that would NOT want that?.... Most teams have 1 good corner (if any) that can cover that man to man...not two.

[dw49]

I would imagine the trade being put to bed was mutual as once the Pats saw the Colts took Dorsett instead of Brown they were not trading out to any team.

 

 

Right AM but the word from Texan land was the trade was ready to be reported. In fact it was already being tweeted all over the place that the Texans had traded into the 32nd spot. I kinda of think it was the Texans who backed out of the trade for sure. We don't know if it was "mutual" as you claim as it could never be a sure thing that the Colts were taking Brown. Very convenient for you to say that it was because the Pats never thought Brown would be there. If they coveted Brown they would not have pretty much done the trade with Houston . They would have waited to see if Brown went in the next two picks. That's pretty no brainer stuff.

 

Really cute for you to say it was probably NE that cancelled the trade. LOL on that one.

[dw49]

Sure all that could happen but I was looking at this more from a macro level. Colts pick WR even though defense was a bigger need. Pats take a defender the Colts could have had. So you have the Colts/Pats rivalry now sparked by two players separated by three picks from the two teams that just played for the AFCCG. I would expect to see both players getting playing time next year which should make the comparison oodles of fun for the networks and talking heads ...

 

 

BTW.. Can you give me a little info on the 5th rounder the Pats selected ? Can't find him listed anywhere in the pre draft stuff. Projected to go high or what ? Sneaky brilliant pick by Bill ? Help me out a bit. I find some guy with a commitment to the US Navy that snapped for FG's . That can't possibly the guy they drafted at pick 166 . Help me out please ?

[ColtsBlueFL]

Wow. I had no idea ... and this whole time I thought we were buds.

 

I am not trying to be mean in any way.  I have no personal vendetta against you.  We have have had a few circular disagreements the came to no resolution, nor really even got back to the original point.  I have watched you posts from afar and you go a rounds with many others.  And I can claim my state of mind regarding most all of them at some point- frustrated bewilderment.  My mind melts and at some point all I see is a 'Colts did it wrong, Pat's do it right' mantra droning on and on and on.

 

No matter what situation is brought to counter, it is 'a reach' on Colts poster part or Genius pre-planning on Patriots front office and coaching staff.  Over time, it gets old and tiring.  But I commend you because you never drift into name calling or flaming or other obvious rule breaking behavior. Unfortunately, some in dialog with you aren't as fortunate and get dinged for it. 

 

Try as I might, my perception keeps going to you are right, others are wrong.  I've never (or cannot recall) having seen you change your position based upon items brought forth in a lengthy dialog (yes, I have.  Ask Superman.  I'll bet he has done it as well at some time, we'll see).  Or even move to the center based upon new information that may prove viable.  I try to have an open mind to the exchange of  information and ideas.  I have opinions, but I am not beyond forming a new opinion based upon new information, should it prove true and substantial.  It would be nice to see that happen by all members at times when warranted.  That's all.  And if others get frustrated, I  sadly must admit I can empthacize with them, and wish it weren't so.

 

So if that means you consider we're not buds, I apologize. As I said, I have nothing against you personally.  I'm am somewhat befuddled and at times miffed at the steadfast stubborn persona of your positions, though. Nothing more.

[NewColtsFan]

What Michael Silver said he thought, and what he did when he heard the colts got Dorsett.:

"Late Thursday night, Grigson chose Miami wide receiver Phillip Dorsett with the 29th overall selection, provoking an immediate chorus of ridicule and dissent on social media, blogs and other platforms. Critics complained that the swift, diminutive Dorsett merely gave the Colts a second helping of T.Y.Hilton, their leading receiver from 2014, and that the pick had done nothing to shore up Indy's biggest weaknesses, such as a defensive unit that surrendered 45 points to the Patriots in the AFC Championship game.

 

Since I tend to be a strong advocate of Grigson's body of work, I started texting some of the talent evaluators around the league I respect most to solicit their opinions, and also asked some people in the Jags' war room(where I was at the time).

The replies I got were overwhelmingly positive about the pick: "Grand slam!!!" was one scout's response.

I also texted Colts owner Jim Irsay, the man whose opinion of Grigson's pick will ultimately matter most. Granted, Irsay wasn't likely to express displeasure in the wake of the selection, but he could easily have chosen not to reply, or to say something generic and let the situation play out for itself.

Instead, he sent a voice memo, which I received well after midnight, after getting off the phone with the NFL's after-hours travel department to book a flight to St. Louis.The message lasted more than a minute, and the excitement in Irsay's voice was palpable and infectious. He said a lot of glowing things about Dorsett, and he insisted that the pick had been an easy one. Seven words in particular stayed with me."        "We let the board talk to us."

 

 

Thanks very much....

 

I appreciate very much you taking the time to write such a thoughtful post....

 

I hope people read it and take it to heart....

[NewColtsFan]

Articles like this is what makes me believe we should not have freedom of speech in this country.

 

Media lies - no consequences.

 

It's freedom of speech that allows you and CR91 and TKnight the right to post what you do.

 

It's your opinion that the article is a lie....    but you don't know it.      You think it's a lie because you don't like it.

 

The consequences are that if enough people don't read Mike Florio's work,  he's out of a job....   somebody pays him, and if they're not happy with his work,  he's loses his job.      Maybe not when you want,  but eventually.

 

On the other hand, if people read his work,  then he keeps his job.    Consequences.

[NewColtsFan]

If you'd like to know why Collins wasn't taken, I can break it down for you.

 

Collins is almost exclusively an "in-the-box" safety.  His coverage skills are questionable.

 

The Colts' 3-4 likes to use "interchangeable" safeties so that we can more easily confuse opposing offenses/QBs.  When the QB doesn't know who the FS/SS is, it can affect his play calling and setting of protections. 

 

When your similarly-skilled safeties are constantly moving around, it makes it harder for the QBs to ascertain whether they have a "bodies" advantage in the running game.  It can confuse a QB when it comes to making pre-snap passing reads.

 

3-4 defenses are all about creating pre-snap confusion.  When you can work your safeties into this approach, it only helps the defense's pre-snap advantage.

 

BUT, in order to implement this approach, BOTH safeties have to be good in the running game AND good in coverage.  You need have two guys that are capable of playing FS/SS.

 

Landry did NOT fit this scheme.  That is why he is gone now.  He was dreadful in pass-protection.  He was put in positions where he had to play FS and he got exposed.  Pure and simple.  Collins would have been similarly exposed in this scheme. 

 

Some defenses, particularly 4-3, non-Cover 2 defenses, do not need those interchangeable safeties.  They like to use the SS as an extra run stuffer. 

 

The Giants are a perfect fit for Collins.  The Colts were NOT.

 

For people that have played/coached the game at a high level (beyond HS), this is pretty basic football stuff.  For the casual fan, this kind of analysis may not be readily apparent.

 

Hopefully this post was helpful to you.  My apologies for the length. 

 

 

I'm out of "likes" for the day,  but wanted to thank you for such a good post.

 

We need more of them.    Especially in threads like this when the ants are swarming the picnic... (if you know what I mean?!)

[NewColtsFan]

If Dorsett lives up to his potential no one is going to be complaining.

 

I wish this was true, and I hope you're right....   but I fear that won't be the case.

 

If the Colts don't win the Super Bowl and if the reason is because of the defense,  the arm-chair GM's here will all point to this pick for the reason.    Doesn't matter how good Dorsett might turn out to be......

 

Haters going to hate and there are plenty of haters in this thread.....

[jskinnz]

No. My point has been the best talent is available in round one. Good GMs draft both talent and need.

 

You are in over your head.  You simply do not know what you are talking about.

[dw49]

I wish this was true, and I hope you're right....   but I fear that won't be the case.

 

If the Colts don't win the Super Bowl and if the reason is because of the defense,  the arm-chair GM's here will all point to this pick for the reason.    Doesn't matter how good Dorsett might turn out to be......

 

Haters going to hate and there are plenty of haters in this thread.....

 

 

Gosh ... the was the 29th pick in the first round. Around 3 spots later than we selected Werner two years ago. We sweet defense there and that sure didn't bring us a SB.

 

 This is being blown so far out of proportion that it's laughable. It's not like Portland taking Bowie and passing on Jordan. It's a pick at the end of round one.. teams blow them all the time. NE took Easley last year with the same spot. He played about 20 plays . Maybe he'll be alright , maybe he won't. If NE needs a WR this year as they appear to be thin , will they crucify BB for going Defense in the SWR rich draft. I doubt it....

[Rally5]

I think we all need to remember that we're all passionate about our team or we wouldn't be here in the first place and it should be no surprise there are strong feelings about what is a controversial pick in the eyes of the fan base, I mean who here had us taking Dorsett?  But in Grigson we trust....here's my last post on the matter (I hope) and I will move on to rooting for Dorsett!

 

What isn't discussed enough in all this is last year we had 5 picks, the second of which we took a WR. So, in the top three picks of the last two years we have selected a WR.  The logic last year was Moncrief would have been a first-round talent in 2015.  That to me means in order for that pick to make sense Moncrief should see considerable time this year, if not start.  There's a lot of people jumping to Grigson's rescue saying just trust Dorsett is going to be amazing.  I hope he is!! I just can't square what we were told last year, what we did this year, clear and present needs and the number of players that can hit the field at once. On addition, we made WR a priority in FA by signing Johnson.  Johnson and TY will be our starters barring injury. So, it's a tough spot to justify the pick although you can create some logic for it.  We already under-utilize Dwayne Allen in the passing game and that whole class should have it's best year ever yet we add another wide-out. Since I'm a massive fan, I hope I'm way off on this one, otherwise it was a really good draft, I like our other picks quite a bit.  To the point of this thread, creating any sort of distrust and strife between front office and players is just another ill side effect.   

 

PS. Dorsett wasn't a PR/KR you can't assume because he's fast he'll be great at something he really hasn't done (it seemed like an afterthought during the presser) BUT again, I hope he's a beast! Mercifully, I'm moving on.....and I hope this turns out to be an amazing pick, Go Colts!!!!

[dw49]

I think we all need to remember that we're all passionate about our team or we wouldn't be here in the first place and it should be no surprise there are strong feelings about what is a controversial pick in the eyes of the fan base, I mean who here had us taking Dorsett?  But in Grigson we trust....here's my last post on the matter (I hope) and I will move on to rooting for Dorsett!

 

What isn't discussed enough in all this is last year we had 5 picks, the second of which we took a WR. So, in the top three picks of the last two years we have selected a WR.  The logic last year was Moncrief would have been a first-round talent in 2015.  That to me means in order for that pick to make sense Moncrief should see considerable time this year, if not start.  There's a lot of people jumping to Grigson's rescue saying just trust Dorsett is going to be amazing.  I hope he is!! I just can't square what we were told last year, what we did this year, clear and present needs and the number of players that can hit the field at once. On addition, we made WR a priority in FA by signing Johnson.  Johnson and TY will be our starters barring injury. So, it's a tough spot to justify the pick although you can create some logic for it.  We already under-utilize Dwayne Allen in the passing game and that whole class should have it's best year ever yet we add another wide-out. Since I'm a massive fan, I hope I'm way off on this one, otherwise it was a really good draft, I like our other picks quite a bit.  To the point of this thread, creating any sort of distrust and strife between front office and players is just another ill side effect.   

 

PS. Dorsett wasn't a PR/KR you can't assume because he's fast he'll be great at something he really hasn't done (it seemed like an afterthought during the presser) BUT again, I hope he's a beast! Mercifully, I'm moving on.....and I hope this turns out to be an amazing pick, Go Colts!!!!

 

 

C'mon man... Montcrief was the 90th pick in that draft. I few spots from the end of the 3rd round. If you look at the list of players right below him , I have a hard time finding any impact  player we passed over to select him. He was there because that draft was loaded with good WR's and he just fell. Give the thing a little time and it might be that both Montcrief and Dorsett were bargains at 29 and 90. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

{snipped for brevity}

 

PS. Dorsett wasn't a PR/KR you can't assume because he's fast he'll be great at something he really hasn't done (it seemed like an afterthought during the presser) BUT again, I hope he's a beast! Mercifully, I'm moving on.....and I hope this turns out to be an amazing pick, Go Colts!!!!

 

Actually, he didn't in his injured year and last year, but he did as a Frosh and Soph...

 

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/phillip-dorsett-1.html#kick_ret::none

[Gavin]

Gosh ... the was the 29th pick in the first round. Around 3 spots later than we selected Werner two years ago. We sweet defense there and that sure didn't bring us a SB.

 

 This is being blown so far out of proportion that it's laughable. It's not like Portland taking Bowie and passing on Jordan. It's a pick at the end of round one.. teams blow them all the time. NE took Easley last year with the same spot. He played about 20 plays . Maybe he'll be alright , maybe he won't. If NE needs a WR this year as they appear to be thin , will they crucify BB for going Defense in the SWR rich draft. I doubt it....

Easley had roughly 261 regular season snaps if the Football Media website is accurate

[dw49]

Easley had roughly 261 regular season snaps if the Football Media website is accurate

 

 

I was joking around. I never watched the guy a play in my life. But yeah  not as bad a rookie year as I thought.

 

 

http://www.patspulpit.com/2014/12/17/7409807/how-would-you-grade-dominique-easleys-rookie-season

[rock8591]

It's freedom of speech that allows you and CR91 and TKnight the right to post what you do.

 

It's your opinion that the article is a lie....    but you don't know it.      You think it's a lie because you don't like it.

 

The consequences are that if enough people don't read Mike Florio's work,  he's out of a job....   somebody pays him, and if they're not happy with his work,  he's loses his job.      Maybe not when you want,  but eventually.

 

On the other hand, if people read his work,  then he keeps his job.    Consequences.

 

 

It's an obvious blatant lie. I KNEW the media were going to print it the moment the pick was selected. Worst job of lying ever.

 

When they don't list sources, they have a way of saying something like "multiple players upset" or "sources tell us". I'm willing to bet my life on that.

[NewColtsFan]

It's an obvious blatant lie. I KNEW the media were going to print it the moment the pick was selected. Worst job of lying ever.

 

When they don't list sources, they have a way of saying something like "multiple players upset" or "sources tell us". I'm willing to bet my life on that.

 

 

I was a member of the media for 30 years.    And sometimes it's simply impossible to tell people who the source is.    There is often a very good reason for not revealing who the source is.

 

That's a long-time fact of life.

 

You can choose not to believe it,  but that doesn't mean it's not true.

 

My point is,  I don't care if it's true or not.    It just doesn't mean that much tome.    The Colts have always had a very good locker-room,  so they'll handle this...    and it will not be a long-term problem...

[braveheartcolt]

Sure all that could happen but I was looking at this more from a macro level. Colts pick WR even though defense was a bigger need. Pats take a defender the Colts could have had. So you have the Colts/Pats rivalry now sparked by two players separated by three picks from the two teams that just played for the AFCCG. I would expect to see both players getting playing time next year which should make the comparison oodles of fun for the networks and talking heads ...

Maybe the Colts back office did not think D was s bigger need. That would shame all the Armchair Experts and TV pundits.

I'm still truly amazed that half of this forum do not work within the NFL.

[amfootball]

I am not trying to be mean in any way.  I have no personal vendetta against you.  We have have had a few circular disagreements the came to no resolution, nor really even got back to the original point.  I have watched you posts from afar and you go a rounds with many others.  And I can claim my state of mind regarding most all of them at some point- frustrated bewilderment.  My mind melts and at some point all I see is a 'Colts did it wrong, Pat's do it right' mantra droning on and on and on.

 

No matter what situation is brought to counter, it is 'a reach' on Colts poster part or Genius pre-planning on Patriots front office and coaching staff.  Over time, it gets old and tiring.  But I commend you because you never drift into name calling or flaming or other obvious rule breaking behavior. Unfortunately, some in dialog with you aren't as fortunate and get dinged for it. 

 

Try as I might, my perception keeps going to you are right, others are wrong.  I've never (or cannot recall) having seen you change your position based upon items brought forth in a lengthy dialog (yes, I have.  Ask Superman.  I'll bet he has done it as well at some time, we'll see).  Or even move to the center based upon new information that may prove viable.  I try to have an open mind to the exchange of on formation and ideas.  I have opinions, but I am not beyond forming a new opinion based upon new information, should it prove true and substantial.  It would be nice to see that happen by all members at times when warranted.  That's all.  And if others get frustrated, I  sadly must admit I can empthacize with them, and wish it weren't so.

 

So if that means you consider we're not buds, I apologize. As I said, I have nothing against you personally.  I'm am somewhat befuddled and at times miffed at the steadfast stubborn persona of your positions, though. Nothing more.

Thank you for taking the time to write all of that down. I really appreciate it as it is not often to get so candid feedback. I am not sure which circular argument we were having but I trust it did happen.

 

In terms of my posting style, I usually do stick to my opinion as very often in debates others fail to move me off of it. That being said, posters have changed my position quite often. DW and I had a convo about both RG and Wilson over the past year and he changed my position on both QBs as he did have some great foresight on both that came to fruition. Superman is probably my favorite poster even though we almost never agree. He will defend the Colts to the ninth much as I will the Pats but his points are always well argued, well articulated and give me pause even if I don't agree or change position too much. Old Crow is another poster that has also changed my opinion maybe the most just because his history of the game is so vast.

 

I will keep in mind your thoughts as I continue to post and but honestly forums are for opinion stating and then fighting for those opinions. As you said, I don't ever descend into name calling and such because I enjoy the debate and never take things personally. I enjoy football and the posters on this board and respect their opinions even if I don't agree.

 

I do hope we can continue to debate going forward but understand if you would rather not as well.

[amfootball]

BTW.. Can you give me a little info on the 5th rounder the Pats selected ? Can't find him listed anywhere in the pre draft stuff. Projected to go high or what ? Sneaky brilliant pick by Bill ? Help me out a bit. I find some guy with a commitment to the US Navy that snapped for FG's . That can't possibly the guy they drafted at pick 166 . Help me out please ?

lol. You will love this. When the Pats selected him and his position was listed as "LS." I was like what is LS? Left safety? Ha. I had no idea. Apparently every time a long snapper has been available in the draft the last few years, Bill has taken him. Word is he drafted this guy so high at 5th round so the Navy will void his years of service so he can actually play. Apparently the higher a serviceman is taken, the more the school and military branch will excuse his service. And not sure if you know that Bill's father coached at Navy so he is always scouting that program every year.

[amfootball]

Right AM but the word from Texan land was the trade was ready to be reported. In fact it was already being tweeted all over the place that the Texans had traded into the 32nd spot. I kinda of think it was the Texans who backed out of the trade for sure. We don't know if it was "mutual" as you claim as it could never be a sure thing that the Colts were taking Brown. Very convenient for you to say that it was because the Pats never thought Brown would be there. If they coveted Brown they would not have pretty much done the trade with Houston . They would have waited to see if Brown went in the next two picks. That's pretty no brainer stuff.

 

Really cute for you to say it was probably NE that cancelled the trade. LOL on that one.

Neither Seattle or GB were expected to take Brown. The Colts were the last team ahead of the Pats thought to take him. But you are probably right. It was most likely the Texans first given they wanted Dorsett.

[amfootball]

Maybe the Colts back office did not think D was s bigger need. That would shame all the Armchair Experts and TV pundits.

I'm still truly amazed that half of this forum do not work within the NFL.

No they did as they picked a lot of defensive players after.

[braveheartcolt]

No they did as they picked a lot of defensive players after.

Pretty irrelevant actually.

[amfootball]

I wish this was true, and I hope you're right....   but I fear that won't be the case.

 

If the Colts don't win the Super Bowl and if the reason is because of the defense,  the arm-chair GM's here will all point to this pick for the reason.    Doesn't matter how good Dorsett might turn out to be......

 

Haters going to hate and there are plenty of haters in this thread.....

It won't be this thread, it will also be the media as well. It is not fair in some ways but with the Werner pick and then the Richardson trade, Grigson's latitude on first round picks is razor thin.

[NFLfan]

I am not trying to be mean in any way. I have no personal vendetta against you. We have have had a few circular disagreements the came to no resolution, nor really even got back to the original point. I have watched you posts from afar and you go a rounds with many others. And I can claim my state of mind regarding most all of them at some point- frustrated bewilderment. My mind melts and at some point all I see is a 'Colts did it wrong, Pat's do it right' mantra droning on and on and on.

No matter what situation is brought to counter, it is 'a reach' on Colts poster part or Genius pre-planning on Patriots front office and coaching staff. Over time, it gets old and tiring. But I commend you because you never drift into name calling or flaming or other obvious rule breaking behavior. Unfortunately, some in dialog with you aren't as fortunate and get dinged for it.

Try as I might, my perception keeps going to you are right, others are wrong. I've never (or cannot recall) having seen you change your position based upon items brought forth in a lengthy dialog (yes, I have. Ask Superman. I'll bet he has done it as well at some time, we'll see). Or even move to the center based upon new information that may prove viable. I try to have an open mind to the exchange of on formation and ideas. I have opinions, but I am not beyond forming a new opinion based upon new information, should it prove true and substantial. It would be nice to see that happen by all members at times when warranted. That's all. And if others get frustrated, I sadly must admit I can empthacize with them, and wish it weren't so.

So if that means you consider we're not buds, I apologize. As I said, I have nothing against you personally. I'm am somewhat befuddled and at times miffed at the steadfast stubborn persona of your positions, though. Nothing more.

My thoughts exactly. I could not have put it better. (Your earlier ballerina comment was a bit out of character but you're allowed that once in a while )... At times it becomes very frustrating reading her posts. But on a positive note, I appreciate that she posts new threads that generate food for thought and allow for an exchange of views. She is one of the best at doing that.

[basspapaw]

I was a member of the media for 30 years.    And sometimes it's simply impossible to tell people who the source is.    There is often a very good reason for not revealing who the source is.

 

That's a long-time fact of life.

 

You can choose not to believe it,  but that doesn't mean it's not true.

 

My point is,  I don't care if it's true or not.    It just doesn't mean that much tome.    The Colts have always had a very good locker-room,  so they'll handle this...    and it will not be a long-term problem...

if they could handle trent this is a breeze

[wig]

I would imagine the trade being put to bed was mutual as once the Pats saw the Colts took Dorsett instead of Brown they were not trading out to any team.

 

This is just made up.  

 

It won't be this thread, it will also be the media as well. It is not fair in some ways but with the Werner pick and then the Richardson trade, Grigson's latitude on first round picks is razor thin.

 

Neither was a bad pick or trade at the time, they just didn't work out.  Richardson was one year removed from being the 3rd pick overall, and Bjoern was looked at as a top 10 pick by most.  

[basspapaw]

It won't be this thread, it will also be the media as well. It is not fair in some ways but with the Werner pick and then the Richardson trade, Grigson's latitude on first round picks is razor thin.

I agree with am, mark this down in the books!

[dw49]

lol. You will love this. When the Pats selected him and his position was listed as "LS." I was like what is LS? Left safety? Ha. I had no idea. Apparently every time a long snapper has been available in the draft the last few years, Bill has taken him. Word is he drafted this guy so high at 5th round so the Navy will void his years of service so he can actually play. Apparently the higher a serviceman is taken, the more the school and military branch will excuse his service. And not sure if you know that Bill's father coached at Navy so he is always scouting that program every year.

 

 

What is really ironic is BB often just blatantly overdrafts a guy by 2 complete rounds. This guy and the safety from Stanford could both qualify in this draft. I say ironic because he no doubt knows what he's doing but tis does appear to be the case. 

[dw49]

Neither Seattle or GB were expected to take Brown. The Colts were the last team ahead of the Pats thought to take him. But you are probably right. It was most likely the Texans first given they wanted Dorsett.

 

Could be true but the talking heads I saw had D line a bigger need than safety for the Packers.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

Thank you for taking the time to write all of that down. I really appreciate it as it is not often to get so candid feedback. I am not sure which circular argument we were having but I trust it did happen.

 

In terms of my posting style, I usually do stick to my opinion as very often in debates others fail to move me off of it. That being said, posters have changed my position quite often. DW and I had a convo about both RG and Wilson over the past year and he changed my position on both QBs as he did have some great foresight on both that came to fruition. Superman is probably my favorite poster even though we almost never agree. He will defend the Colts to the ninth much as I will the Pats but his points are always well argued, well articulated and give me pause even if I don't agree or change position too much. Old Crow is another poster that has also changed my opinion maybe the most just because his history of the game is so vast.

 

I will keep in mind your thoughts as I continue to post and but honestly forums are for opinion stating and then fighting for those opinions. As you said, I don't ever descend into name calling and such because I enjoy the debate and never take things personally. I enjoy football and the posters on this board and respect their opinions even if I don't agree.

 

I do hope we can continue to debate going forward but understand if you would rather not as well.

 

 

am

 

You lil hard head you . I love the debates we'v had a few , I'v always felt your honorable , knowledgable & a die hard fanatic who loves her team , Until this year I did'nt even realize you were a lady , I just hope I was'nt to rude .

 

Point is I respect your feelings & thoughts concerning your team . I have many years of run ins with Patriot fans most obnoxious still yet no worse than I .

 

As a chess player seeing the board clearly & understanding both sides makes me better , It is good to hear outside opinions from a person you respect IMO it promotes learning at any age .