Anyone watch the Gruden and Kiper draft special on ESPN?

[BlueShoe]

I want to first say that I do have a lot of respect for Mel Kiper. I don't believe he would have ever been a good enough scout to work for an NFL team, but Kiper was one of the pioneers of the Fan Mock Draft. He knows more about these players than any of us.

 

Chucky had Kiper going, and owned him throughout the entire program. Gruden called Kiper out for every tiny flaw and exaggeration. It kind of puts things into perspective. Kiper has made a living working as a draft media analyst and Gruden did not let Kiper get away with anything. As the show went on, it was noticeable that Kiper felt more and more inferior, as well he should have. Hell, there are not many people in this world who could have held their ground in that dual of wits.

 

My favorite part was when Chucky asked Kiper how many players are taken in the second round. Gruden said he was going to call the commissioner and ask to have the second round extended to 63 players so Mel could fit all of these players in there. 

 

Gruden also highlighted some prospects as his gems.

 

If they replay it and you have not seen this then I highly recommend it. You will not be disappointed. 

 

This was truly one of best draft specials I have seen in quite some time. 

[loudnproudcolt]

Who were some of his gems? I know he believes Mariotta should be the first pick, and fits better in TB's system. Problem with John is he gets so excited, he loses a bit of objectivity. I remember a couple years ago him spending a couple of minutes on how great Tebow is and he would be a very good QB in the NFL. Lost a little respect after that.

[Superman]

I read the transcript when they were talking about corners. I'm watching the clips online right now. Good stuff.

 

The one that stands out is them talking about Armstead. Gruden says 'you guys got him going in the top 10-12, I don't have him in the first round.' And I agree with him. I've been asking what the story is with Armstead. I don't see what everyone else is so in love with. 

[BlueShoe]

Who were some of his gems? I know he believes Mariotta should be the first pick, and fits better in TB's system. Problem with John is he gets so excited, he loses a bit of objectivity. I remember a couple years ago him spending a couple of minutes on how great Tebow is and he would be a very good QB in the NFL. Lost a little respect after that.

Obviously he loves Marcus Mariota.

He was in love with Dante Fowler. Said he was the kind of player who would play a double header for free. He said Fowler just loves the game.

He loves Marcus Peters ability to play, but is very worried about his character issues.

His said CB D'Journ Smith is the whole package. Can tackle and cover. Says he can do it all.

Gruden really likes Jeremy Langford.

Some other players he highlighted who he is high on (using my best short-term memory) are:

Trey Flowers - said he will be the next Lamarr Woodley.

Todd Gurley

Melvin Gordon

Denzel Perryman

Brandon Scherff

Amari Cooper

He said in Tampa Bay they had a sign in the locker room that read "If you can't tackle, then you can't play".

He was talking about Trey Waynes and Kevin Johnson. I got the feeling he would not draft them, at least not in the first round.

He ripped Arik Armstead. Said this guy just doesn't stand out as a first round player.

He said Beasley and Gregory are only pass rush specialist who can't stop the run, while Ray is the entire package.

I can't remember them all right now.

[BlueShoe]

I read the transcript when they were talking about corners. I'm watching the clips online right now. Good stuff.

 

The one that stands out is them talking about Armstead. Gruden says 'you guys got him going in the top 10-12, I don't have him in the first round.' And I agree with him. I've been asking what the story is with Armstead. I don't see what everyone else is so in love with. 

 

I saw Armstead as 3-4 end, but now I am starting to wonder myself. He is the classic underachiever. We have to ask the question, why is he?

[BleedBlu8792]

I saw Armstead as 3-4 end, but now I am starting to wonder myself. He is the classic underachiever. We have to ask the question, why is he?

 

He is a 3-4 end, however it's his size that everyone is enamored with. He's 6'8 but not even 300lbs, and really isn't as athletic as they make him out to be. He's nowhere close to being a first round player, nor a 2nd, in my opinion.

[Bluefire4]

He really owned Kiper in that corner segment when he said D'Joun Smith was the total package and the first round corners couldn't tackle as effectively. Kiper had no comeback.

[arkana04]

Armsted will be a bust has little to no technique watsoever just totally reliant on his athletic ability 

[Patagonia Chris]

I read the transcript when they were talking about corners. I'm watching the clips online right now. Good stuff.

 

The one that stands out is them talking about Armstead. Gruden says 'you guys got him going in the top 10-12, I don't have him in the first round.' And I agree with him. I've been asking what the story is with Armstead. I don't see what everyone else is so in love with. 

 

Gotta agree with you here. I saw an NFL.com article where league exec said "Armstead has the size and build of a 1st rounder, but he plays like a 4th rounder." No way I'd pick a project player in the first 12 picks. How many times do those guys pan out?

[bananabucket]

link to clips?

[crazycolt1]

Grudens history as far  as drafts has been sketchy at best. He is more of a celebrity than a draft guru. Has anyone ever noticed Gruden lights up like a Christmas tree when the camera is on? I know a lot of fans like him but from what I read and hear he is not that well liked by players who have played for him. I think he fell into a Tony Dungy team that was ready to win a super bowl and got the credit. Every year he was at Tampa his teams got worse till he was fired because he couldn't produce a winner on the field. His name is mentioned every once in a while as a head coach but that is by the media, not by the people in the NFL. Maybe off subject but that is just my take on Gruden.

[krunk]

I saw Armstead as 3-4 end, but now I am starting to wonder myself. He is the classic underachiever. We have to ask the question, why is he?

 

It's funny, when I was watching Game Changers it didn't seem like Willie Mcguinest was all that enamored with Armstead either.  You could just pick up little things in Mcguinest body language. 

[krunk]

Grudens history as far  as drafts has been sketchy at best. He is more of a celebrity than a draft guru. Has anyone ever noticed Gruden lights up like a Christmas tree when the camera is on? I know a lot of fans like him but from what I read and hear he is not that well liked by players who have played for him. I think he fell into a Tony Dungy team that was ready to win a super bowl and got the credit. Every year he was at Tampa his teams got worse till he was fired because he couldn't produce a winner on the field. His name is mentioned every once in a while as a head coach but that is by the media, not by the people in the NFL. Maybe off subject but that is just my take on Gruden.

 

I always felt that way about Gruden.  I'll give him his credit for taking Dungys players and doing what Dungy couldn't do, but it got progressively worse each year under Gruden after the Super Bowl win.  The talent level of that team reduced and so did the wins.

[Manning1887]

It was awesome! Gruden is a gem, and someone needs to give him his own show!

 

I really liked what Gruden had to say about Randy Gregory. First, he panned his game. Pointed to some terrible plays in run support. Then, he brought a little insight into drafting him in the first round. He talked about selling a guy like Gregory to the owner, tough to stake your job to drafting him early. 

[Superman]

It's funny, when I was watching Game Changers it didn't seem like Willie Mcguinest was all that enamored with Armstead either.  You could just pick up little things in Mcguinest body language. 

 

Me too.

[krunk]

Me too.

 

Yeah it was funny and a bit awkward.  His body language said "This boy is not a Game Changer"

[Superman]

I saw Armstead as 3-4 end, but now I am starting to wonder myself. He is the classic underachiever. We have to ask the question, why is he?

 

That's his position. And I see some ability, obviously. But he doesn't make plays, he doesn't really influence the game consistently... I've been critical of Bud Dupree for some of the same reasons, but at least I can see teams scheming away from Dupree, doubling him, etc. I see teams run right at Armstead, and he does nothing about it.