Chris Borland retires

[ColtRider]

Glad the Ping-Pong match has stopped. Good-googlie-mooglie.

[BloodyChamp]

Glad the Ping-Pong match has stopped. Good-googlie-mooglie.

Who are the Chefs?

[ruksak]

 

 

So, in a nutshell, you would have preferred if Mr. Borland left the game quietly, discretely, & without all the media pomp & circumstance attention & fan fair. Got it. 

Yes. Something about this seemed contrived, purposeful, with intent to do X, Y, or Z. 

 

1) I feel some of his language could easily be received by his former peers as saying he's better than them, he's better than this (playing football like a brute).

2) Apparently his family knew of his lack of desire to play in the NFL as far back as before the 2014 season even started (which is alarming to me).

3) He had to have some self-righteous reason to leave, he didn't just leave. 

 

 Borland isn't responsible for what the media does, that entity has a life all it's own. But he had to know what those words, his supposed reason for retiring, would do. Now, maybe he is genuinely concerned about brain injury? Maybe someone (his parents perhaps) filled his head with fear of impending mental disability if he pursued this career?

 

I don't know, but thanks to you and the link you posted, I have a great example to use as to what I would expect a pro athlete to say upon suddenly retiring early. You don't need to blame someone/something, just leave and be happy doing something else. 

[ColtRider]

Guess I was wrong. ;)

[Gavin]

Yes. Something about this seemed contrived, purposeful, with intent to do X, Y, or Z. 

 

1) I feel some of his language could easily be received by his former peers as saying he's better than them, he's better than this (playing football like a brute).

2) Apparently his family knew of his lack of desire to play in the NFL as far back as before the 2014 season even started (which is alarming to me).

3) He had to have some self-righteous reason to leave, he didn't just leave. 

 

 Borland isn't responsible for what the media does, that entity has a life all it's own. But he had to know what those words, his supposed reason for retiring, would do. Now, maybe he is genuinely concerned about brain injury? Maybe someone (his parents perhaps) filled his head with fear of impending mental disability if he pursued this career?

 

I don't know, but thanks to you and the link you posted, I have a great example to use as to what I would expect a pro athlete to say upon suddenly retiring early. You don't need to blame someone/something, just leave and be happy doing something else.

Now this I can get on board with about leaving quietly, Though perhaps he felt he owed 49er fans an explanation why he was retiring so early so maybe that's why he spoke to ESPN

[amfootball]

For many years the NFL downplayed the effects of football-related concussions on players' cognitive functioning. Their doctors said there was no connection between head injuries incurred on the football field and brain disorders/cognitive impairment. So, it does not surprise me that a doctor affiliated with the NFL would say what you referenced.

Just because football "has never been safer" does not mean that it is safe.

The Pitt doctor did not refute anything you said above but gave clarity on just how often CTE actually occurs in his experience which is rare in the NFL. I think he provided some interesting perspective on the disease itself which is why I shared it.

 

In terms of football being safe, it is safer but it will never be safe. He is right about the equipment and the way the teams deal with head injuries and the rules and all but still there is risk. I think this doctor wanted folks to understand that grenades are not going on the field which is what some of the media spin on this can make people feel like is happening.

[amfootball]

I think an angle to this story that is missing is Borland not honoring his contract. I was saying to my husband last night that if it was him and he came to me with this decision, I would tell him to let the niners know now and play this next season for them so they can find a replacement. Kind of a one season's notice if you will.

 

We get on owners all the time for cutting guys and not honoring their contract but here is an example of a player walking out on a team that desperately needed him to play this year.

[NFLfan]

The Pitt doctor did not refute anything you said above but gave clarity on just how often CTE actually occurs in his experience which is rare in the NFL. I think he provided some interesting perspective on the disease itself which is why I shared it.

In terms of football being safe, it is safer but it will never be safe. He is right about the equipment and the way the teams deal with head injuries and the rules and all but still there is risk. I think this doctor wanted folks to understand that grenades are not going on the field which is what some of the media spin on this can make people feel like is happening.

I believe the NFL is trying to make the game safer but this doctor's comments are misleading. CTE can only be diagnosed posthumously. Very few have been examined and almost all (if not all) have been found to have had CTE; so, how can he argue that CTE is rare in football players. As more and more football players die and their brains are donated for examination and research, I believe the number of players found to have CTE will grow exponentially.

As for Borland, he made a personal decision. He is placing greater value on his health than on money and fame. It is incomprehensible why people would get so bent out of shape by his decision, especially if he does not play for the team they root for. (I am not referring to you.)

[amfootball]

I believe the NFL is trying to make the game safer but this doctor's comments are misleading. CTE can only be diagnosed posthumously. Very few have been examined and almost all (if not all) have been found to have had CTE; so, how can he argue that CTE is rare in football players. As more and more football players die and their brains are donated for examination and research, I believe the number of players found to have CTE will grow exponentially.

As for Borland, he made a personal decision. He is placing greater value on his health than on money and fame. It is incomprehensible why people would get so bent out of shape by his decision, especially if he does not play for the team they root for. (I am not referring to you.)

I think CTE is still largely something that doctors are still figuring out. I think most people who are involved in any type of physical activity by life's end will show brain deterioration. Most people who live every day lives with no head trauma have brain deterioration in their older years. I think the doctor was trying to diffuse some of the hyperbole that exists and provide context.

 

It is interesting to me that former players like Steve Young and Troy Aikman who left the game due to concussions seem fine and able to do their jobs which require them to be articulate and analytical on an everyday basis.

 

To you last sentence, I agree. Borland can do whatever he wants. Many guys leave not just because of concussions but because of overall health due to back injuries, knee injuries, etc. My only issue with Borland is the timing of it. The niners were counting on him this season so it would have been nice for them to give them some more notice and at least play out this season. Also, I do agree with rusak that his positioning on this is poor and he appears to be grandstanding a bit but then again he has the whole world wanting to speak to him given the nature of the retirement and his age.

[DougDew]

I don't understand why it's so hard to believe that someone would have legitimate concerns about their long-term well-being, and be willing to act on those concerns. Why can't it be as simple as that?

 

There are easily THOUSANDS of high school kids who choose not to play football because of the health risks. It's not like this is some radical proposition.

 

Also, I don't know what you're getting at with his comment about having a degree. First, no they all don't have degrees, and it's hard to believe that you don't know that; Donte Moncrief left school early, and hasn't earned a degree yet. Second, his comment wasn't 'I can do this because I have a degree.' 

 

I don't understand what you two are on about. First, he's a spoiled silver spooner who doesn't have to work. Then he's a coward for choosing not to play football because of  perceived health risks. Now, he's a media seeking phony. Unreal.

I don't disparage Borland for quitting for whatever reasons he wants.  It sounds like he researched the subject of CTE and made a decision that he felt satisfied his personal goals.

 

But in the statement you quoted him saying, he also attributes part of his decision to what is background is and how he was raised, and implies that someone else may risk CTE because they need football due to the inability to support themselves by other means, because they had a different background or upbringing. 

 

Those statements go beyond his knowledge about football and CTE but delve into other topics, of which, he is no expert and shouldn't really be afforded much of an audience for those opinions more so than anybody else.

[DougDew]

One question Doug: Why would ESPN & it's NFL programming want to cater to a message exclusively about the dangers of CTE & brain trauma? It's counterproductive & not a wise business move. 

 

All Trey Wingo & the NFL LIVE analysts are doing is playing devil's advocate showing the other side of the argument a player on the verge of super stardom deciding to walk away. It just shows the public that key players promoting the NFL product understand 2 sides of the same coin: The benefits & drawbacks of playing professional football.

 

I see no ulterior motive here & if Borland gets paid to be an advocate for CTE research & brain trauma more power to him. Is it any different than a parent whose college son gets injured, becomes addicted to pain pills, tragically dies, & the parents later become crusaders for educating kids about the dangers of pain pills & later heroin addicts to maintain their role on the football team? No, not really. Most people wouldn't call these parents greedy individuals exploiting their child's death for personal gain. 

 

If you wanna believe Borland is insincere in his decision to leave the NFL that's fine, but I wouldn't read much more into it than that personally. 

I don't see an ulterior motive on Borland's part really.  I think that he could make more money being a football player than anything else. 

 

As far as ESPN, they routinely try to elevate NFL player's personal lives into something of greater social meaning.  And...portray both sided of the debate.  That's what garners the most ratings because they know the general population can't leave social topics alone......especially when one side of the debate contains the class warfare attitude that portrays rich businesses as big bad organizations that get rich by exploiting the oppressed underclass.

 

That ratings grab tactic gets pretty obvious when you listen to topic...after topic....after topic....

[Superman]

I think an angle to this story that is missing is Borland not honoring his contract. I was saying to my husband last night that if it was him and he came to me with this decision, I would tell him to let the niners know now and play this next season for them so they can find a replacement. Kind of a one season's notice if you will.

 

We get on owners all the time for cutting guys and not honoring their contract but here is an example of a player walking out on a team that desperately needed him to play this year.

 

To the bolded, no "we" don't. The team has an out; they can cut a guy whenever they want. The player has an out; he can stop playing whenever he wants, but won't be paid anymore. 

 

If Borland had received a crazy signing bonus last year, I might be of a different mind. But I don't think he's obligated to keep playing, so long as he doesn't expect to keep being paid.

[Superman]

No. Driving down the street is much more dangerous. 

 

No it isn't.

 

...and I said a few pages ago, I was cool with Ricky Williams' departure. Borland, his departure seemed phony, contrived and holier than thou. As if he is saying that being an NFL player is for impoverished animals that come from the ghetto. 

Bloodsport is for slaves, history shows us this. Maybe this is Chris using his bachelors degree in history? He is clearly above these slaves fighting to the death in our lush venues.

Sorry I didn't articulate what about this event that has rubbed me the wrong way, but the more I give this issue thought, the more it seems like his actions are insulting to his former peers. If he doesn't want to play, fine....buh-bye. Leave. Nothing more needs said beyond "I'm just not that into it".

Because that's not all he said. He also talked about how fortunate he is, which is also a way of saying "I'm better than this". You'll see and hear more angry backlash from offended players here soon, I'm sure of it.

It's not WHAT he did, it's how he did it.

 

Yeah, I think that's crazy talk. Especially coming from a person who has accused the black community of playing the victim, to turn around and accuse Borland of condescending on people who aren't like him is incredibly two-faced of you.

[Superman]

I don't disparage Borland for quitting for whatever reasons he wants.  It sounds like he researched the subject of CTE and made a decision that he felt satisfied his personal goals.

 

But in the statement you quoted him saying, he also attributes part of his decision to what is background is and how he was raised, and implies that someone else may risk CTE because they need football due to the inability to support themselves by other means, because they had a different background or upbringing. 

 

Those statements go beyond his knowledge about football and CTE but delve into other topics, of which, he is no expert and shouldn't really be afforded much of an audience for those opinions more so than anybody else.

 

Borland didn't say anything about anyone else's background and upbringing, but isn't the bolded true?

 

Forget Borland's insinuation. Read what Maurice Clarett and Damien Woody directly said: http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12501613/chris-borland-retirement-players-thinking-life-football

 

And forget about CTE, and just consider the other health risks associated with football. In the same article, toward the end, Wesley Walker talks about his quality of life and what he'd do differently: 

 

If I had to do it over again, and I knew I'd end up in the amount of pain I'm always in, there's no way in hell I'd play football again. With all of my injuries, including my neck, I took a chance of breaking my neck and ending up in a wheelchair. I look back and ask, 'What was I thinking?' "

"Every individual has to make his own decision, and there's so much money to be made these days. But is money more important, or is your life more important? I could never see myself hurting myself, but there have been times when I've thought, 'God, I wish you'd just end this right now.' I don't sleep, I'm in constant pain, I haven't felt my feet in 20 years. I feel like there are times when my whole body shuts down. Sometimes I feel like I'm 90 years old.

 

 

Former NFL players who sue the league over head trauma and painkillers get called hypocrites, because they knew they were playing a violent sport, and did it anyway, for the money. Then a player says "I don't want to do this anymore," retires, and he gets criticized for making a conscientious decision? Who's really being hypocritical?

[amfootball]

To the bolded, no "we" don't. The team has an out; they can cut a guy whenever they want. The player has an out; he can stop playing whenever he wants, but won't be paid anymore. 

 

If Borland had received a crazy signing bonus last year, I might be of a different mind. But I don't think he's obligated to keep playing, so long as he doesn't expect to keep being paid.

Exactly. There are "outs" and teams are looked down upon for exercising where players are not.

 

Who cares what Borland was making anyways? That is not the point. The niners were counting him to fill an important role on their team this season and he bailed out of the contract. That is wrong IMO. We can disagree on it and that is fine. But I believe you honor your contract or at the very least give the niners more of a heads up so they can replace you. Borland said he was thinking about this last August. Might have been nice to let the niners know then so they could begin to prepare for his exit.

[amfootball]

Borland didn't say anything about anyone else's background and upbringing, but isn't the bolded true?

 

Forget Borland's insinuation. Read what Maurice Clarett and Damien Woody directly said: http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12501613/chris-borland-retirement-players-thinking-life-football

 

And forget about CTE, and just consider the other health risks associated with football. In the same article, toward the end, Wesley Walker talks about his quality of life and what he'd do differently: 

 

 

Former NFL players who sue the league over head trauma and painkillers get called hypocrites, because they knew they were playing a violent sport, and did it anyway, for the money. Then a player says "I don't want to do this anymore," retires, and he gets criticized for making a conscientious decision? Who's really being hypocritical?

When I read comments like Walker, I often wonder about Manning and what his life will like post-retirement. My chiropractor who used to work on sports athletes told me that Manning will probably be looking at being in a wheel chair within 10 years or sooner of retirement because the stability in his neck from being fused will deteriorate. The procedure he had done so he could keep playing football is not one any doctor would have recommended otherwise. They did it specifically so he could play and that will compromise his health after retirement.

[Superman]

Exactly. There are "outs" and teams are looked down upon for exercising where players are not.

 

Who cares what Borland was making anyways? That is not the point. The niners were counting him to fill an important role on their team this season and he bailed out of the contract. That is wrong IMO. We can disagree on it and that is fine. But I believe you honor your contract or at the very least give the niners more of a heads up so they can replace you. Borland said he was thinking about this last August. Might have been nice to let the niners know then so they could begin to prepare for his exit.

 

I don't look down on teams for terminating contracts. That's their right. And I don't look down on players for trying to get the most money they can, when they can, including hold-outs (it's only repeated hold-outs that bug me). It's a give and take. The only way to stop either of these things from happening is fully guaranteed contracts, and no one wants that.

 

That being the case, your argument about Borland 'not honoring his contract' doesn't hold up, IMO. I know some think teams are wrong to cut players, but I disagree with that thinking. It actually shows a shallow understanding of the way contracts work. He didn't bail out of his contract. He's actually still obligated to the Niners, should he decide he wants to play. He can't even go to another league and play while the Niners have his rights. (Just like if you sign a contract when you take a job, it doesn't mean you can't quit, but there might be a non-compete that prevents you from working at another company. And of course, you won't be paid anymore.) The word "contract" doesn't mean what people think it means.

 

I agree that it would have been nice of him to give the team a heads-up, but that's not really practical. He wasn't sure he would quit, and if he had told the team, they probably would have benched or cut him. And realistically, there's nothing they could have done between August and now to prepare for his departure. This is when players are available, not August-February. They can try to grab Brandon Spikes, Nate Irving, Rolando McClain, etc. They can draft another ILB. They aren't hung out to dry, no more than they would have been if they had known 7 months ago.

[Superman]

When I read comments like Walker, I often wonder about Manning and what his life will like post-retirement. My chiropractor who used to work on sports athletes told me that Manning will probably be looking at being in a wheel chair within 10 years or sooner of retirement because the stability in his neck from being fused will deteriorate. The procedure he had done so he could keep playing football is not one any doctor would have recommended otherwise. They did it specifically so he could play and that will compromise his health after retirement.

 

I don't know enough about spinal fusion to speak on that, but I do know that what you're stating is contrary to what many doctors have said about his operation.

 

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/story/2012-03-08/doctors-upbeat-on-manning-health/53424974/1

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7304392/peyton-manning-doctor-says-fusion-healed-firmly

 

Ahmad Bradshaw had a similar operation in 2013. I'd be more worried about his long term health than Manning's, given the fact that he takes a lot more contact. Manning was hit or sacked 40 times in 2012, 47 times in 2013, and 40 times in 2014, which is way less than practically any other QB, including quick-release guys like Brady, Brees, etc.

[DougDew]

Borland didn't say anything about anyone else's background and upbringing, but isn't the bolded true?

 

Forget Borland's insinuation. Read what Maurice Clarett and Damien Woody directly said: http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12501613/chris-borland-retirement-players-thinking-life-football

 

And forget about CTE, and just consider the other health risks associated with football. In the same article, toward the end, Wesley Walker talks about his quality of life and what he'd do differently: 

 

 

Former NFL players who sue the league over head trauma and painkillers get called hypocrites, because they knew they were playing a violent sport, and did it anyway, for the money. Then a player says "I don't want to do this anymore," retires, and he gets criticized for making a conscientious decision? Who's really being hypocritical?

Upstream, you quoted Borland from an ESPN interview "I've got the luxury of choice with the way I've been raised and the good fortune of growing up in a middle class family and having my college degree.....I think there's guys who don't have that choice"

 

What player who earns a living playing football does not have a college degree or doesn't have the opportunity to earn one?  And why does a person even need a college degree to be able to support themselves?  He's choosing to not become daffy at 40, and is giving up the earnings potential of the NFL...but he makes it sound as if there are others who need to play football, and risk the chance of being daffy at 40, in order to afford to eat. 

 

That statement just feeds into the constant stream of dogma that people in this country are perpetually oppressed and are exploited...with sports media being yet another outlet of conveying that inaccuracy.  I don't see any relevance between Borland growing up in a middle class family and having whatever good fortune he's talking about being relevant to him getting an athletic scholarship and then being drafted, then deciding to give it up and implying others can't do the same because of the situation they were in before they started playing in the NFL. 

 

The more I think about how irrelevant Borland's statement is, the more I think he was simply reading an ESPN prepared cue-card.

[amfootball]

I don't know enough about spinal fusion to speak on that, but I do know that what you're stating is contrary to what many doctors have said about his operation.

 

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/story/2012-03-08/doctors-upbeat-on-manning-health/53424974/1

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7304392/peyton-manning-doctor-says-fusion-healed-firmly

 

Ahmad Bradshaw had a similar operation in 2013. I'd be more worried about his long term health than Manning's, given the fact that he takes a lot more contact. Manning was hit or sacked 40 times in 2012, 47 times in 2013, and 40 times in 2014. 

I am no expert either but my chiropractor has spoken to me a few times about it. He said the issue for Manning is not that he is playing football but the procedure itself poses long term effects as it compromises the area under and above the fusion. That is why Manning gets a physical every year to determine if those areas are weakened not just from football contact but from the surgery itself as the weight bearing is tremendous on those areas after fusion. My chiropractor has expressed amazement at how well Manning has thrown the football given the procedure as he told me even without taking any hits, it is hard to throw at all given he had nerve damage that most likely will never recover and only worsen over time.

[Superman]

Upstream, you quoted Borland from an ESPN interview "I've got the luxury of choice with the way I've been raised and the good fortune of growing up in a middle class family and having my college degree.....I think there's guys who don't have that choice"

 

What player who earns a living playing football does not have a college degree or doesn't have the opportunity to earn one?  And why does a person even need a college degree to be able to support themselves?  He's choosing to not become daffy at 40, and is giving up the earnings potential of the NFL...but he makes it sound as if there are others who need to play football, and risk the chance of being daffy at 40, in order to afford to eat. 

 

That statement just feeds into the constant stream of dogma that people in this country are perpetually oppressed and are exploited...with sports media being yet another outlet of conveying that inaccuracy.  I don't see any relevance between Borland growing up in a middle class family and having whatever good fortune he's talking about being relevant to him getting an athletic scholarship and then being drafted, then deciding to give it up and implying others can't do the same because of the situation they were in before they started playing in the NFL. 

 

The more I think about how irrelevant Borland's statement is, the more I think he was simply reading an ESPN prepared cue-card.

 

I'm not surprised that you've found a way to spin this into your anti-establishment agenda.

 

Borland said he has "luxury of choice." Damien Woody and Maurice Clarett pretty much echoed that sentiment. That you are pretending there aren't NFL players who are relying on their career to provide for themselves and their families is hard to swallow.

 

http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2014/05/18/colts-wr-donte-moncrief-went-pro-support-daughter-sick-father/9253275/

 

But by all means, fight the fight. Rather than respecting the man's decision and reasoning, go ahead and accuse him of lying and promoting an agenda for the media. That makes sense...

[Superman]

I am no expert either but my chiropractor has spoken to me a few times about it. He said the issue for Manning is not that he is playing football but the procedure itself poses long term effects as it compromises the area under and above the fusion. That is why Manning gets a physical every year to determine if those areas are weakened not just from football contact but from the surgery itself as the weight bearing is tremendous on those areas after fusion. My chiropractor has expressed amazement at how well Manning has thrown the football given the procedure as he told me even without taking any hits, it is hard to throw at all given he had nerve damage that most likely will never recover and only worsen over time.

 

Ehh, I'm sure your chiropractor is awesome and all, but I get the feeling that the surgeons who perform spinal fusions and have said that Manning's neck is probably stronger than it was before have a little better insight on the matter. Spinal fusion isn't something the doctors made up for Peyton Manning to be able to play football again. Lots of people have spinal fusion surgery, including at more critical spots along the spine, and do just fine long-term. For your chiropractor to say that Manning will be in a wheelchair in ten years and that no doctor would have recommended a spinal fusion just seems like sensationalism. 

[amfootball]

Ehh, I'm sure your chiropractor is awesome and all, but I get the feeling that the surgeons who perform spinal fusions and have said that Manning's neck is probably stronger than it was before have a little better insight on the matter. Spinal fusion isn't something the doctors made up for Peyton Manning to be able to play football again. Lots of people have spinal fusion surgery, including at more critical spots along the spine, and do just fine long-term. For your chiropractor to say that Manning will be in a wheelchair in ten years and that no doctor would have recommended a spinal fusion just seems like sensationalism. 

Yeah, who knows for sure. Everyone's body is different too. That was just my chiropractor's opinion and he is from New York so no Boston bias in his comments. I think his main point was that spinal fusion was not necessary in Manning's case but was performed so he could continue to play football. Without the fusion, there is no way he could have still played. Fusion is reserved for people as a last resort and that was not the case with Manning but done specifically so he could continue his career. 

[Superman]

Yeah, who knows for sure. Everyone's body is different too. That was just my chiropractor's opinion and he is from New York so no Boston bias in his comments. I think his main point was that spinal fusion was not necessary in Manning's case but was performed so he could continue to play football. Without the fusion, there is no way he could have still played. Fusion is reserved for people as a last resort and that was not the case with Manning but done specifically so he could continue his career. 

 

See, that's not accurate. Manning had three previous operations to relieve the pressure on his nerve and fix a herniated disc. They didn't work, and the disc continued to be a problem. The nerve got worse. The spinal fusion is probably something that would have been recommended whether he wanted to play or not, because it was affecting the use of his arm. Unless your chiropractor thinks only QBs need to be able to use their arms.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/peyton-manning-on-his-neck-surgeries-rehab--and-how-he-almost-didnt-make-it-back/2013/10/21/8e3b5ca6-3a55-11e3-b7ba-503fb5822c3e_story.html

He developed a pinched nerve, for which he underwent surgery in February 2010. Then came the herniated disc and successive surgeries in 2011.

 

...

 

That September, the disc re-herniated yet again. This time, Manning sought a permanent solution: a fusion to stabilize the neck. It would be his fourth surgery in two years.

 

...

 

In February 2012, Watkins declared Manning’s neck firmly fixed and fully healed, and cleared him for NFL play. He was no more at risk of injury than anyone else on the field.

 

As for "who knows for sure," I'd guess that his actual doctors have a better idea than any of us on the Internet, or your chiropractor.

[amfootball]

See, that's not accurate. Manning had three previous operations to relieve the pressure on his nerve and fix a herniated disc. They didn't work, and the disc continued to be a problem. The nerve got worse. The spinal fusion is probably something that would have been recommended whether he wanted to play or not, because it was affecting the use of his arm. Unless your chiropractor thinks only QBs need to be able to use their arms.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/peyton-manning-on-his-neck-surgeries-rehab--and-how-he-almost-didnt-make-it-back/2013/10/21/8e3b5ca6-3a55-11e3-b7ba-503fb5822c3e_story.html

 

As for "who knows for sure," I'd guess that his actual doctors have a better idea than any of us on the Internet, or your chiropractor.

Manning would have never lost his arm to a severe degree but his ability to throw an NFL football? Sure. There was no easy fix for him given this type of thing runs in his family. But he did not have to go to fusion as they could have continued to work on the disc but the time table for him to be able to come back to the NFL and be effective was running out which is why they opted for fusion. There were other options for him but none that gave him the best prognosis for continuing his NFL career.

[Superman]

Manning would have never lost his arm to a severe degree but his ability to throw an NFL football? Sure. There was no easy fix for him given this type of thing runs in his family. But he did not have to go to fusion as they could have continued to work on the disc but the time table for him to be able to come back to the NFL and be effective was running out which is why they opted for fusion. There were other options for him but none that gave him the best prognosis for continuing his NFL career.

 

I'm sorry I even said anything.

[DougDew]

I'm not surprised that you've found a way to spin this into your anti-establishment agenda.

 

Borland said he has "luxury of choice." Damien Woody and Maurice Clarett pretty much echoed that sentiment. That you are pretending there aren't NFL players who are relying on their career to provide for themselves and their families is hard to swallow.

 

http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2014/05/18/colts-wr-donte-moncrief-went-pro-support-daughter-sick-father/9253275/

 

But by all means, fight the fight. Rather than respecting the man's decision and reasoning, go ahead and accuse him of lying and promoting an agenda for the media. That makes sense...

I respect his decision. I have no issue with it. But I don't respect his statements that are irrelevant to his situation...specifically..about what choices OTHER people do or do not have.

But, as usual, ESPN is quick to take a player's specific incident and extrapolate it into some sort of broader social significance...which it isn't...and never is.

[Superman]

I respect his decision. I have no issue with it. But I don't respect his statements that are irrelevant to his situation...specifically..about what choices OTHER people do or do not have.

But, as usual, ESPN is quick to take a player's specific incident and extrapolate it into some sort of broader social significance...which it isn't...and never is.

 

Yeah, to you, nothing has broader social significance. Everything should be viewed through a narrow prism, practically in a vacuum. Upbringing, culture, etc., are all irrelevant.

 

Borland said what other former players have said about themselves. You can act like it's not true, but I'm not going to join you in that fiction.

[Warhorse]

Where in the heck do people get off spewing nonsense about what anther persons choices are? I can't help but think of Dustin Hoffman's quote in Peter Pan...."I want my war!"

 

That's really what this is about....isn't it? I want my violence and how dare you change your mind about YOUR life and possibly affect MY life's viewing pleasure. As if no one has had a change of heart about:

 

Their job

Their marriage

Their career

etc.....

 

Epiphanies are just that..."an experience of sudden and striking realization". How can anyone state that this young man did not have just that? Regardless, as far the coal miner comparison, one might want to consider options. Perhaps the coal miner has no options...and thus, puts themselves at risk for their family. If that miner had options and still choose to stay their, its there choice...my bet is that they would leave. I am purely speculating, but I would guess that Chris has options. 

 

More power to any individual who chooses for themselves, especially in an environment where the reverse happens to players abruptly ALL THE TIME. 

 

Frankly, I find the negativity towards this young man disturbing. 

[ColtRider]

Where in the heck do people get off spewing nonsense about what anther persons choices are? I can't help but think of Dustin Hoffman's quote in Peter Pan...."I want my war!"

 

That's really what this is about....isn't it? I want my violence and how dare you change your mind about YOUR life and possibly affect MY life's viewing pleasure. As if no one has had a change of heart about:

 

Their job

Their marriage

Their career

etc.....

 

Epiphanies are just that..."an experience of sudden and striking realization". How can anyone state that this young man did not have just that? Regardless, as far the coal miner comparison, one might want to consider options. Perhaps the coal miner has no options...and thus, puts themselves at risk for their family. If that miner had options and still choose to stay their, its there choice...my bet is that they would leave. I am purely speculating, but I would guess that Chris has options. 

 

More power to any individual who chooses for themselves, especially in an environment where the reverse happens to players abruptly ALL THE TIME. 

 

Frankly, I find the negativity towards this young man disturbing.

EXACTLY, INDIGO, EXACTLY! if you get a chance ... read my post in this thread about that same thing of having options in people's lives and how they affect themselves and others. Your choice IS your choice. No one else's.

[DougDew]

Yeah, to you, nothing has broader social significance. Everything should be viewed through a narrow prism, practically in a vacuum. Upbringing, culture, etc., are all irrelevant.

 

Borland said what other former players have said about themselves. You can act like it's not true, but I'm not going to join you in that fiction.

If and how one incident has social significance is subject to interpretation. But at ESPN, the interpretation is obvious. That athletes of less than middle class status have to risk being daffy at age 50 because they have no other choices...and they got a middle class dude with a college degree to say it.

[jvan1973]

I think after the NFL accepts your retirement papers a player become a free agent and free to sign a bigger contract with a different team in the next year or so, if he reconsiders his retirement out of the "love and passion I have for the game I've played since childhood", or something similar. Same goes for Willis.

No, the 9ers continue to own their rights. I'm not sure how long that lasts, but it's longer than a year

[jvan1973]

Manning would have never lost his arm to a severe degree but his ability to throw an NFL football? Sure. There was no easy fix for him given this type of thing runs in his family. But he did not have to go to fusion as they could have continued to work on the disc but the time table for him to be able to come back to the NFL and be effective was running out which is why they opted for fusion. There were other options for him but none that gave him the best prognosis for continuing his NFL career.

You deduced all this from a chiropractor? A chiropractor who had access to none of Mannings medical records? That's impressive for a chiropractor. Is he clairvoyant as well?

[southwest1]

I believe the NFL is trying to make the game safer but this doctor's comments are misleading. CTE can only be diagnosed posthumously. Very few have been examined and almost all (if not all) have been found to have had CTE; so, how can he argue that CTE is rare in football players. As more and more football players die and their brains are donated for examination and research, I believe the number of players found to have CTE will grow exponentially.

As for Borland, he made a personal decision. He is placing greater value on his health than on money and fame. It is incomprehensible why people would get so bent out of shape by his decision, especially if he does not play for the team they root for. (I am not referring to you.)

An excellent point NFLfan. If CTE can only be confirmed after a dead athlete's brain is examined, it almost impossible to make the correlation among medical experts that concussion related CTE incidents in football are on the decline with any degree of scientific authority unless base line brain scans & new concussion tests always include the baseline image next to the current concussion test on say a LB feeling dizzy & seeing stars. 

[DougDew]

No, the 9ers continue to own their rights. I'm not sure how long that lasts, but it's longer than a year

Yeah....I don't think it lasts forever.

[southwest1]

Yes. Something about this seemed contrived, purposeful, with intent to do X, Y, or Z. 

 

1) I feel some of his language could easily be received by his former peers as saying he's better than them, he's better than this (playing football like a brute).

2) Apparently his family knew of his lack of desire to play in the NFL as far back as before the 2014 season even started (which is alarming to me).

3) He had to have some self-righteous reason to leave, he didn't just leave. 

 

 Borland isn't responsible for what the media does, that entity has a life all it's own. But he had to know what those words, his supposed reason for retiring, would do. Now, maybe he is genuinely concerned about brain injury? Maybe someone (his parents perhaps) filled his head with fear of impending mental disability if he pursued this career?

 

I don't know, but thanks to you and the link you posted, I have a great example to use as to what I would expect a pro athlete to say upon suddenly retiring early. You don't need to blame someone/something, just leave and be happy doing something else. 

Ruksak, 

 

I never viewed you as taking pleasure in Chris Borland's departure from football. You're a smart guy & I admire that you held steadfast to your position about this LB's decision to walk away. You just didn't want him to portray football as a diabolical entity to blow knees, tear ACLs, & destroy brains. You just wanted Chris to have the balls to say "I just don't wanna do this anymore & I have another career I wanna pursue before constant collisions turn my brain into jello." Ideally, you wanted him to say football is a great sport, I wanna walk off the field will I still can, & I'm ready to do something else with my life." 

 

Just issue your statement, exit stage right, & don't going looking for the spotlight. I read ya Ruk; We are on the exact same page now. I've got your stance down perfectly now. 

[amfootball]

You deduced all this from a chiropractor? A chiropractor who had access to none of Mannings medical records? That's impressive for a chiropractor. Is he clairvoyant as well?

I didn't deduce anything. He just gave me his opinion as someone who has worked in the field for over 25 years and used to work on athletes. I never said he was right nor did he. Just shared his thoughts.

[southwest1]

I don't see an ulterior motive on Borland's part really.  I think that he could make more money being a football player than anything else. 

 

As far as ESPN, they routinely try to elevate NFL player's personal lives into something of greater social meaning.  And...portray both sided of the debate.  That's what garners the most ratings because they know the general population can't leave social topics alone......especially when one side of the debate contains the class warfare attitude that portrays rich businesses as big bad organizations that get rich by exploiting the oppressed underclass.

 

That ratings grab tactic gets pretty obvious when you listen to topic...after topic....after topic....

Actually, I think NFL Network is the worst when it comes to highlighting pointless stuff on the air like what's trending on the internet & who's been the most tweeted athlete or discussion topic today. LOL! I couldn't care less NFL Network, but I didn't grow up with twitter either so that's part of why I dislike it so much. 

 

There are 2 unions for a reason. The players protect their interests & the owners follow suit in kind. I don't really view it as class warfare. Just 2 sides pushing for profitability, natl. exposure, & a comfortable standard of living. The players sacrifice their bodies in practice & on game day & the owners must renovate stadiums, build new stadiums, keep under the salary cap, bring in quality players, keep the lights on, & host several other events at their facility beyond the football calendar. The owners do have 2 advantages players don't though: Lucrative TV broadcasting contracts & their own worldwide promotion network ie NFL Network so I don't feel sorry for owners that much. 

 

Yeah, I have no issue with Chris Borland leaving either. I wouldn't, but that's not my call to make either. At least, he proved he belonged in the this league from WI unlike say Montee Ball & Ron Dane who sucked at the next level. That's why I'm kind of disappointed because Chris made it & said I'm out. Sigh...

[ruksak]

 

Yeah, I think that's crazy talk. Especially coming from a person who has accused the black community of playing the victim, to turn around and accuse Borland of condescending on people who aren't like him is incredibly two-faced of you.

This is likely my last word on the subject.

 

SW1 gave a great example of how a professional should leave his occupation. Glen Coffee; He left without rocking the boat, no drama. He said "My heart just isn't in it". That's all Chris needed to say. I do NOT like people who feel the need to rock the boat on their way out, as if they have to get the last word. I've had countless employess do this on the way out, they gotta start some drama, tell some secrets, rat on people etc etc. 

 

That's what I equate this to. A kid that can't keep his damn mouth shut and move on. 

[Superman]

Yeah....I don't think it lasts forever.

 

I'm pretty sure the team retains the player's rights until the contract would have expired. But retired players don't accrue years of service, so it's possible that the team retains the player's rights indefinitely.