Nicks less effective than Whalen

[Flash7]

This is the type of stuff that we'll get since it's the off-season. Please take this with a grain of salt, and take it easy on me.

 

Here are Nicks stats for 2014:

16 games  38 REC  405 Yards  4 TDS   10.7 Avg. per catch

 

Whalen's stats in 2013:

9 games  24 REC  259 Yards   2 TDs   10.8 Avg. per catch

 

Whalen in 9 games averages 2.6 catcher per game, where Nicks averages 2.3 catches per game. Whalen also gives us a special teams option. Luck also has a lot of comfort with Whalen and I speculate that over time, he would target Whalen more and more, increasing Whalen's effectiveness.

 

Can we let Nicks and his bigger contract go and just play Whalen? 

[bavanlan]

Not sure you can compare 2014 with Hilton, Moncrief, Nicks, and Reggie (ish) with 2013 and Hilton, DHB, Whalen. Lots more opportunities available for the latter.

[AntonMcG]

This is the type of stuff that we'll get since it's the off-season. Please take this with a grain of salt, and take it easy on me.

 

Here are Nicks stats for 2014:

16 games  38 REC  405 Yards  4 TDS   10.7 Avg. per catch

 

Whalen's stats in 2013:

9 games  24 REC  259 Yards   2 TDs   10.8 Avg. per catch

 

Whalen in 9 games averages 2.6 catcher per game, where Nicks averages 2.3 catches per game. Whalen also gives us a special teams option. Luck also has a lot of comfort with Whalen and I speculate that over time, he would target Whalen more and more, increasing Whalen's effectiveness.

 

Can we let Nicks and his bigger contract go and just play Whalen? 

 

 

Whalen also has a considerably higher percentage catch-rate when thrown at 63.3 to 57.9 whilst both averaging 11.4 yards per reception, so it is not as if Whalen had easier, checkdown catches.

 

Whalen has his limitations, but I think he was valuable. Unfortunately for him though, Hamilton preferred passing plays to develop a bit, meaning deeper routes for wideouts, whilst giving Luck a bit more help. So he often had to leave someone in to block for a few seconds before giving Luck a checkdown. It made more sense to have a TE like Jack Doyle do this than a smaller receiver like Whalen.

 

He was a casualty of our offensive philosophy.

[indyagent17]

He is a clutch receiver without fear across the middle. I dont know why he is not given the chance to play the 4th receiver spot for a whole season

[House]

No

[Superman]

Not sure you can compare 2014 with Hilton, Moncrief, Nicks, and Reggie (ish) with 2013 and Hilton, DHB, Whalen. Lots more opportunities available for the latter.

 

Hakeem Nicks played 451 passing snaps this year. That's one catch per 11.87 pass plays. He had 68 catchable targets. That's a target percentage of 15%, and a catch per target percentage of 55.9%.

 

Whalen played 198 passing snaps last year. That's one catch per 8.25 pass plays. He had 39 catchable targets. That's a target percentage of 19.7%, and a catch per target percentage of 61.5%.

 

There are a lot of variables to consider -- coverage, role in the offense, etc. -- but Nicks wasn't buried on the bench with no opportunities. certainly not in comparison with Whalen in 2013. He had more than twice as many pass play reps, twice as many opportunities, and he produced at a lower adjusted rate than Whalen. Considering how much more accomplished of a player Nicks is, considering how much more physically gifted he is (or at least, was), and especially considering one was a veteran free agent who was once a first round pick, compared to the other who was a UDFA that's been shuffled on and off the practice squad, it's strange that we'd even be having this discussion.

 

Nicks should be far more effective than Whalen. That's what we all expected five months ago. Sad to say, he was not. In fact, he was less effective.

[TKnight24]

Probably will see Nicks walking through the door on his way out this offseason. Don't see him coming back as a Colt

[21isSuperman]

Nicks was pretty reliable towards the end of the year and into the playoffs.  Whalen has shown some flashes as a good possession, move-the-chains-on-3rd-down type of receiver.  But I think Nicks' ceiling is much higher than Whalen's

[SilentHill]

This is the type of stuff that we'll get since it's the off-season. Please take this with a grain of salt, and take it easy on me.

 

Here are Nicks stats for 2014:

16 games  38 REC  405 Yards  4 TDS   10.7 Avg. per catch

 

Whalen's stats in 2013:

9 games  24 REC  259 Yards   2 TDs   10.8 Avg. per catch

 

Whalen in 9 games averages 2.6 catcher per game, where Nicks averages 2.3 catches per game. Whalen also gives us a special teams option. Luck also has a lot of comfort with Whalen and I speculate that over time, he would target Whalen more and more, increasing Whalen's effectiveness.

 

Can we let Nicks and his bigger contract go and just play Whalen? 

 

We can let them both walk, they were both equally bad.

[grmasterb]

Part of me says Whalen should get more reps, and part of me says he's the second coming of Blair White.

[LJpalmbeacher2]

Let's Not have neither next season!

[Flash7]

Let's Not have neither next season!

Well, the point is that Whalen can be effective if given a chance.

[dudeski]

I can't wait until whalen is off this team for good.

[Solon]

LOL, you have to be bleeping kidding me. Why not anoint him the best WR on the colts already? I wonder why Whalen's stats were batter? Maybe Whalen has more chemistry with Luck unlike Nicks. We saw the possibilities down the stretch with Luck and Nicks finally developing some chemistry. 

[Archangel]

Does anybody know if nicks was still recovering from a injury he suffered with Giants

[masterlock]

Nicks was pretty reliable towards the end of the year and into the playoffs.  Whalen has shown some flashes as a good possession, move-the-chains-on-3rd-down type of receiver.  But I think Nicks' ceiling is much higher than Whalen's

Nicks' ceiling might be higher, but that doesn't really matter if he never reaches it.

[Flash7]

LOL, you have to be bleeping kidding me. Why not anoint him the best WR on the colts already? I wonder why Whalen's stats were batter? Maybe Whalen has more chemistry with Luck unlike Nicks. We saw the possibilities down the stretch with Luck and Nicks finally developing some chemistry.

No one is saying Whalen is the best receiver on the team. I am stating that he was more effective than Nicks, which he was, as a 4th receiving option. Not a #1 or 2 or 3, but 4th. I'm for putting the best players on the field regardless of pay, reputation, or perceived potential. What's wrong with that?

[DougDew]

The stats mentioned above pretty much show that Whalen could have been just as effective as Nicks this year.

And since Cribbs didn't light it up on punts or KOs, Whalen was just as effective as Cribbs too.

IOW, Whalen could have done with one roster spot, what Nicks and Cribbs took two roster spots to do.

That's not the best reflection on the coaching staff.

[21isSuperman]

Nicks' ceiling might be higher, but that doesn't really matter if he never reaches it.

I think he was showing some progress towards the end of the year.  I don't know why he had a slow start to the year.  Maybe it was injuries, but it was because he was buried on the depth chart, maybe he didn't grasp Pep's playbook, maybe he wasn't in shape.  But I think he was starting to show progress

[Jdubu]

Nicks was pretty reliable towards the end of the year and into the playoffs. Whalen has shown some flashes as a good possession, move-the-chains-on-3rd-down type of receiver. But I think Nicks' ceiling is much higher than Whalen's

Whalen is what the mix needs though. A reliable, move the chains guy. We don't need 3 guys running down the field to catch a 30+ yard play, those are just mixed in after softening the defense up or starting them off by testing deep. Look at the pats and other teams, it's dink dink dink run dink boom. We go boom (thud) run (puke) then try for the final 10 yards to get a 1st down with mixed results. Pep needs a guy who can be reliable to catch those 7-10 yard passes for 7-15 yards at a time. First downs eat clock and wear you down physically and mentally.

[The Fish]

Nicks had a few nice grabs, but by in large he was trying to fill a role that was already filled by T.Y. A guy who clears out the secondary.

 

Bad fit and he's about out of gas anyway. Whalen might be more in line with what this offense needed. 

 

Not a bad point, OP.

[throwing BBZ]

Nicks was pretty reliable towards the end of the year and into the playoffs.  Whalen has shown some flashes as a good possession, move-the-chains-on-3rd-down type of receiver.  But I think Nicks' ceiling is much higher than Whalen's

 

 Foggy man.

 Whalen history is of coming up short on 3rd downs. He couldn`t drive his defender off of him. The end.

[dudeski]

The stats mentioned above pretty much show that Whalen could have been just as effective as Nicks this year.

And since Cribbs didn't light it up on punts or KOs, Whalen was just as effective as Cribbs too.

IOW, Whalen could have done with one roster spot, what Nicks and Cribbs took two roster spots to do.

That's not the best reflection on the coaching staff.

not the best reflection of your evaluation skills

[scooter4910]

Nicks was pretty reliable towards the end of the year and into the playoffs.  Whalen has shown some flashes as a good possession, move-the-chains-on-3rd-down type of receiver.  But I think Nicks' ceiling is much higher than Whalen's

How much of that was because of his manager getting on his case about the off season and any upcoming contracts or he actually got better? Desperation can be an effective motivator. How will he react with a longer term contract?

[21isSuperman]

How much of that was because of his manager getting on his case about the off season and any upcoming contracts or he actually got better? Desperation can be an effective motivator. How will he react with a longer term contract?

I'm not sure.  I don't know why his game picked up in the 2nd half.  But it makes me think he still has some talent and can contribute to the team

[DougDew]

Whalen in 2013 was as effective as Nicks in 2014.

Whalen was as effective as Cribbs.

Gotta be blind not to see it.

[scooter4910]

I'm not sure.  I don't know why his game picked up in the 2nd half.  But it makes me think he still has some talent and can contribute to the team

Personal opinion...Nicks was terrified with his prospects come 2015 and with Reggie coming up lame he had a window of opportunity. Right place at the right time. I think if he gets a long term contract he will become complacent and some up and comer will call him out.

 

Get rid of him and work with the hungry rookies.

[bertjones#1]

Don't see Nicks being on the team next year. Even our best receivers cant seem to catch the ball ,so why keep an average receiver that cant catch the ball. Dropped passes killed us all year.

[masterlock]

I think he was showing some progress towards the end of the year.  I don't know why he had a slow start to the year.  Maybe it was injuries, but it was because he was buried on the depth chart, maybe he didn't grasp Pep's playbook, maybe he wasn't in shape.  But I think he was starting to show progress

Yes, he played much better toward the very end, after having been a non-factor for 90% of the regular season. He made an impact with the Giants as a rookie, and then had 2 more outstanding seasons. But that's only HALF of his career. The other, more RECENT half has been utterly unimpressive. So it's a dicey proposition. I'd be in favor of bringing him back for a low-$$$, very cap-friendly contract.

 

All that said, Griff Whalen is probably a safer bet.

[Arby0359]

I personally think Whalen is great and should not be sent to the Practice squad time after time..

[Valpo2004]

Whalen also has a considerably higher percentage catch-rate when thrown at 63.3 to 57.9 whilst both averaging 11.4 yards per reception, so it is not as if Whalen had easier, checkdown catches.

 

Whalen has his limitations, but I think he was valuable. Unfortunately for him though, Hamilton preferred passing plays to develop a bit, meaning deeper routes for wideouts, whilst giving Luck a bit more help. So he often had to leave someone in to block for a few seconds before giving Luck a checkdown. It made more sense to have a TE like Jack Doyle do this than a smaller receiver like Whalen.

 

He was a casualty of our offensive philosophy.

 

He's serviceable in the slot. . . sure you can get better more explosive players out there and I'm not calling for us to start Whalen. . . 

 

But if you consider how effective he his when he is on the field he's a darn good #4 or #5.  

[AntonMcG]

He's serviceable in the slot. . . sure you can get better more explosive players out there and I'm not calling for us to start Whalen. . . 

 

But if you consider how effective he his when he is on the field he's a darn good #4 or #5.  

 

True. And young and cheap.

[Track Guy]

The bottom line is that over the past 2 years neither of them have shown any reason to believe they have any business being the #3 receiver on an NFL depth chart. They're both guys that you'd feel pretty good about having as your 4th or 5th receiver and step in every now and again or in case of injury. But they haven't played at NFL starter level.