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oldunclemark

Baltimore (+7) @ New England (1-10-15)

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One nit pick. Evans did not drop it. The NE DB chopped it out of his hands. It was a great defensive play.

 

Yea this is a misconception that bothers me because it makes it look like the Ravens just let the game slip away from them when in reality Sterling Moore made a fantastic defensive play to knock that ball out to win the game.

 

Its all about context again.. some people like to view that play as a "drop" that cost the Ravens the game which takes away credit from the Patriots for making a great play to win it.

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Ravens have a great defensive front. Patriots have an inconsistent offensive line, and struggle in pass coverage. Ravens have a secondary that struggles to cover deep. Patriots struggle to throw deep.

Is it just me, or is this the worst matchup the Patriots could have drawn in the AFC?

How in the heck do the Patriots struggle in pass coverage ? #5 in the NFL in pass defense.

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How in the heck do the Patriots struggle in pass coverage ? #5 in the NFL in pass defense.

 

Typo. I meant pass protection...

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Yea this is a misconception that bothers me because it makes it look like the Ravens just let the game slip away from them when in reality Sterling Moore made a fantastic defensive play to knock that ball out to win the game.

 

Its all about context again.. some people like to view that play as a "drop" that cost the Ravens the game which takes away credit from the Patriots for making a great play to win it.

 

 

I personally think Evans should/could have better secured the ball, but credit to the defender for sticking with the play and knocking it out.

 

However, what hasn't been mentioned is Billy Cundiff missing a 32 yarder with 11 seconds, which would likely have sent the game into overtime. I'd probably take the Pats to win in OT, but Flacco had surprisingly outplayed Brady to that point, so nothing is certain there.

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I think the anxiety in NE has been caused by the Ravens winning 2 out of 3 in NE, and should have won the third game that Flacco brought them back in the last seconds . Had Evans not dropped it, it would have been 3 for 3. That being said , this is a different game with different teams.

So we're dismissing the Patriots' annihilation of the Ravens last year? You know , their most recent game?

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So we're dismissing the Patriots' annihilation of the Ravens last year? You know , their most recent game?

 

Last year was last year, 2 years ago was 2 years ago, etc etc..

 

All that matters is this year and I like the Patriots chances given the opponents they've faced and their strength of victory over a lot of division leaders and playoff teams.  They have a legit, elite defense for the first time since their last Super Bowl victory in 2004, so I love their chances but obviously on any given Sunday.. that's what makes this sport better than any other by a mile!

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I keep hearing that Defense Wins Championships.

 

I don't know about the rest of you, but the game I saw last week between Baltimore and Pittsburgh,  the DEFENSE definitely came to Win.

 

I still say this will be a close game, and I think it will come down to the wire.

 

Can't wait for the games to begin.

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Maybe but the DB chopped it out right as he was catching it and securing it. Had Flacco led him more than the DB never gets his hands on it. I always put that play more on Flacco than Evans. It was not a drop by any stretch though.

No one but you blames Flacco. Any decent NFL receiver makes that catch and secures it. Honestly, it doesn't fit in your theories of Brady supremacy because Flacco totally outplayed Brady in this game. You know the stats .

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Yea this is a misconception that bothers me because it makes it look like the Ravens just let the game slip away from them when in reality Sterling Moore made a fantastic defensive play to knock that ball out to win the game.

Its all about context again.. some people like to view that play as a "drop" that cost the Ravens the game which takes away credit from the Patriots for making a great play to win it.

You

Left out the Cundiff 32 yard miss right after this. Two bums clearly cost the Ravens.

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I personally think Evans should/could have better secured the ball, but credit to the defender for sticking with the play and knocking it out.

However, what hasn't been mentioned is Billy Cundiff missing a 32 yarder with 11 seconds, which would likely have sent the game into overtime. I'd probably take the Pats to win in OT, but Flacco had surprisingly outplayed Brady to that point, so nothing is certain there.

If any sane person after watching the above clip blames Flacco, when all Evans has to do is get a foot down, turn, and secure the ball , I don't know what to tell you. No decent receiver drops that ball. I agree.

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So we're dismissing the Patriots' annihilation of the Ravens last year? You know , their most recent game?

No, I'm not dismissing that anymore than the Ravens beating you guys twice in 2012. The fact of the matter is, these teams are different than past years, so other than historical context, this is a different year and situation. I think I've already acknowledged the Pats are better on paper , and are at home, but so was Pittsburgh. That being said, the Patriots are much better than the Steelers. A tough game it will be for Baltimore.

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If any sane person after watching the above clip blames Flacco, when all Evans has to do is get a foot down, turn, and secure the ball , I don't know what to tell you. No decent receiver drops that ball. I agree.

It wasn't a drop, even the nfl recorded it as a pass defensed, not a drop on Evans

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Ne will win ....... Don't get the vibes of Baltimore winning like they did 2 years ago . NE is a much better team this time around and Baltimore has regressed . If that front gets no pressure on Brady it's going to be a long day for Baltimore and their vulnerable secondary . NE's defense is much improved and I see a similar outcome like the meeting between the two last season . I'm Pulling for the Ravens though haha

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Felt bad for Baltimore in 2011 that game was theirs .... I immediately cut of the television when Bill Cundiff missed that field goal . I couldn't watch NE March on to another Super Bowl appearance .

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One nit pick. Evans did not drop it. The NE DB chopped it out of his hands. It was a great defensive play.

it was a bogus call by refs, he caught the ball and relaxed and DB stripped it. Should have called it completion. It was not a bang bang play

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No one but you blames Flacco. Any decent NFL receiver makes that catch and secures it. Honestly, it doesn't fit in your theories of Brady supremacy because Flacco totally outplayed Brady in this game. You know the stats .

Honestly, I blame neither as Moore made a great defensive play IMO. But if you want to assign blame then yes, I would go with Flacco as Evans had Moore beat and if he lays it up than Moore never gets his hands on it. If you want to call Evans soft for having the ball chopped out right as he was making the catch that is fine. But it is most certainly not a drop by any stretch. That was my main point.

 

And enough already with Flacco outplaying Brady. Geesh. Brady was going against one of the best NFL defenses that year while Flacco got one of the worst secondaries. And prior to that game, Suggs had called Flacco out for playing like a bum the week prior vs Houston so don't act like Flacco is somehow this better QB because he had a good game vs a terrible secondary.

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it was a bogus call by refs, he caught the ball and relaxed and DB stripped it. Should have called it completion. It was not a bang bang play

He never got two feet down with possession.

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If any sane person after watching the above clip blames Flacco, when all Evans has to do is get a foot down, turn, and secure the ball , I don't know what to tell you. No decent receiver drops that ball. I agree.

Ravens fans seriously blame Evans for that play? Wow. You can see the ball was behind him as he has to turn and face the defender to catch it which allowed Moore to swipe it out. I believe even Flacco said after the game he could have made a better throw to lead him to the corner away from Moore. Hard to blame Evans unless you think he should have turned into the hulk in a split second while Moore ripped the ball out.

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I personally think Evans should/could have better secured the ball, but credit to the defender for sticking with the play and knocking it out.

 

However, what hasn't been mentioned is Billy Cundiff missing a 32 yarder with 11 seconds, which would likely have sent the game into overtime. I'd probably take the Pats to win in OT, but Flacco had surprisingly outplayed Brady to that point, so nothing is certain there.

Maybe the worst shank I have ever seen on a short field goal. He missed it by 10 yards left. They rightfully cut him after that.

 

OT would have been interesting as most forget that Gronk went out of the game in the fourth quarter with the ankle. Brady led the GW drive where he scored on fourth and one from the goal line himself with no Gronk. I can't remember if the new OT rules were in place then about each team getting a possession? I don't think they were so if the Ravens won the toss they would have a very tired Pats D to go and score on. If the Pats win the toss then Brady probably marches them down for the win.

 

Glad it didn't happen and we got the win. ;)  Billy Cundiff is the Pats second favorite FG kicker behind Adam. I think it was the Herald that had a title the next day that said "Thank you Billy."  lol.

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Honestly, I blame neither as Moore made a great defensive play IMO. But if you want to assign blame then yes, I would go with Flacco as Evans had Moore beat and if he lays it up than Moore never gets his hands on it. If you want to call Evans soft for having the ball chopped out right as he was making the catch that is fine. But it is most certainly not a drop by any stretch. That was my main point.

And enough already with Flacco outplaying Brady. Geesh. Brady was going against one of the best NFL defenses that year while Flacco got one of the worst secondaries. And prior to that game, Suggs had called Flacco out for playing like a bum the week prior vs Houston so don't act like Flacco is somehow this better QB because he had a good game vs a terrible secondary.

How come when we have a weak secondary like this year, we get no slack, but the Patriots do ? We got torched by Big Ben, pulled a couple of guys off the waiver wire and practice squads, and beat him. On Baltimore, you win or lose with what you got. I wish we had Jimmy Smith , because we don't. And I agree, Evans should have secured the ball.

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Ravens fans seriously blame Evans for that play? Wow. You can see the ball was behind him as he has to turn and face the defender to catch it which allowed Moore to swipe it out. I believe even Flacco said after the game he could have made a better throw to lead him to the corner away from Moore. Hard to blame Evans unless you think he should have turned into the hulk in a split second while Moore ripped the ball out.

He had plenty of time to secure the ball, fall, put his foot down , turn away from the DB. Do you think Tyree catches that one ?

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Maybe the worst shank I have ever seen on a short field goal. He missed it by 10 yards left. They rightfully cut him after that.

OT would have been interesting as most forget that Gronk went out of the game in the fourth quarter with the ankle. Brady led the GW drive where he scored on fourth and one from the goal line himself with no Gronk. I can't remember if the new OT rules were in place then about each team getting a possession? I don't think they were so if the Ravens won the toss they would have a very tired Pats D to go and score on. If the Pats win the toss then Brady probably marches them down for the win.

Glad it didn't happen and we got the win. ;) Billy Cundiff is the Pats second favorite FG kicker behind Adam. I think it was the Herald that had a title the next day that said "Thank you Billy." lol.

That is why he is with the Browns. Our third favorite is Al Del Greco behind Stover and Tucker for similar reasons.

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How come when we have a weak secondary like this year, we get no slack, but the Patriots do ? We got torched by Big Ben, pulled a couple of guys off the waiver wire and practice squads, and beat him. On Baltimore, you win or lose with what you got. I wish we had Jimmy Smith , because we don't. And I agree, Evans should have secured the ball.

I assure you that if the Pats win today it will be mentioned that this was not the same Ravens teams as in previous years and that they are still rebuilding. And then the media will discount your win over the Steelers because Bell didn't play. Sound about right?

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He had plenty of time to secure the ball, fall, put his foot down , turn away from the DB. Do you think Tyree catches that one ?

He was in the process of securing it when Moore ripped it out. The pass was behind him which caused him to turn toward Moore when he had him beat. If he is led to the corner, Moore never touches the ball. Tyree catches it if he had stickum on his hands and arms the way he did on his helmet. lol.

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He never got two feet down with possession.

it wasn't about in or out of bounds. They should have blown the whistle to call a completion.

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I assure you that if the Pats win today it will be mentioned that this was not the same Ravens teams as in previous years and that they are still rebuilding. And then the media will discount your win over the Steelers because Bell didn't play. Sound about right?

Look , you guys know I tell it like it is. The Steelers thing is bogus because we have 19 guys on IR. If you guys beat us today, it will be because you have the better team. We are missing many guys, but it's next man up. That is part of winning Championships ,is having depth. As I told you guys, I'm tickled the Ravens are in this position. It's been a hard season with off field issues, and injuries, but I like the future for this organization. Do I feel good about our chances in NE, no, but I didn't feel great about going to Pittsburgh, and if somehow we got a W, I sure wouldn't feel great about going to Denver or Indy. I never feel good about my team going on the road in the NFL. It's never easy.

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I dont think it's clear cut as team A is better at this and team B is better at that. This is the playoffs. Single elimination. Throw the form book out the window.

That said, Pats have the best team in the NFL on paper in my opinion. If I was a betting man my money is on them. But nothing will suprise me.

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He was in the process of securing it when Moore ripped it out. The pass was behind him which caused him to turn toward Moore when he had him beat. If he is led to the corner, Moore never touches the ball. Tyree catches it if he had stickum on his hands and arms the way he did on his helmet. lol.

It should have been easily secured. I'm not trying to say your DB didn't do his job, he did, but every team has goats like Evans and Cundiff that will be bums of a certain city. God knows , you guys have Bill Buckner.

You have to love how old man Kraft hung that painting from a fan in his office of Cundiff shanking that field goal. In Baltimore, that painting would end up in Rod Serling's Night Gallery !

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I dont think it's clear cut as team A is better at this and team B is better at that. This is the playoffs. Single elimination. Throw the form book out the window.

That said, Pats have the best team in the NFL on paper in my opinion. If I was a betting man my money is on them. But nothing will suprise me.

Look, I don't blame any of you guys from picking the Pats. It's smart money. If I wasn't a Ravens fan, I would be there with most of you. As a Ravens fan, for superstitious reasons, I would never bet on my own team. I'm just hoping we have some of that 2012 magic left, although I know both teams are completely different. The Pats are a one seed for a reason, and I respect that and their team. I love that we get to play NE, Indy, and Denver in many of these post seasons. When I was a kid in Baltimore in the old Colt days, we were battling GB and the Rams, and later in the AFC, Shula's Dolphins. I take nothing for granted, and enjoy it all.

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Look , you guys know I tell it like it is. The Steelers thing is bogus because we have 19 guys on IR. If you guys beat us today, it will be because you have the better team. We are missing many guys, but it's next man up. That is part of winning Championships ,is having depth. As I told you guys, I'm tickled the Ravens are in this position. It's been a hard season with off field issues, and injuries, but I like the future for this organization. Do I feel good about our chances in NE, no, but I didn't feel great about going to Pittsburgh, and if somehow we got a W, I sure wouldn't feel great about going to Denver or Indy. I never feel good about my team going on the road in the NFL. It's never easy.

I am not sure who you are arguing against? Pats know all too well about next man up and thankfully this post-season we are as healthy as we have ever been.

 

My point about Brady and Flacco had nothing to do with injuries but the defenses they were facing. Brady was facing one of the best defenses in the league and Flacco one of the worst. Does not mean Joe does not deserve credit but this idea that he outplayed Brady with all things being equal is total hogwash. And Brady did lead the game winning drive scoring himself from the one without Gronk. So when it mattered in that game, Brady was big.

 

I don't agree with the media's take on your win over Pitt. I think it was a great win for your team when most had you losing including myself. But every game has its own story. Missing Bell was huge for Pitt and their game plan was awful but they lost because the Ravens were better. Not sure how that can be denied. The Steelers must be kicking themselves. That loss ranks up with them losing to Denver back in 2011 but at least that was a road game. To lose at home to a team they have owned in the post season is something that will sting all off-season I would imagine.

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I am not sure who you are arguing against? Pats know all too well about next man up and thankfully this post-season we are as healthy as we have ever been.

My point about Brady and Flacco had nothing to do with injuries but the defenses they were facing. Brady was facing one of the best defenses in the league and Flacco one of the worst. Does not mean Joe does not deserve credit but this idea that he outplayed Brady with all things being equal is total hogwash. And Brady did lead the game winning drive scoring himself from the one without Gronk. So when it mattered in that game, Brady was big.

I don't agree with the media's take on your win over Pitt. I think it was a great win for your team when most had you losing including myself. But every game has its own story. Missing Bell was huge for Pitt and their game plan was awful but they lost because the Ravens were better. Not sure how that can be denied. The Steelers must be kicking themselves. That loss ranks up with them losing to Denver back in 2011 but at least that was a road game. To lose at home to a team they have owned in the post season is something that will sting all off-season I would imagine.

AM , I hate to break this to you, but the Ravens defense was ranked number 15 in 2011, and 17 in 2012, hardly 2000 and 2006 Raven's type defenses. This was an aging, but proud defense, but one that Brady could have easily exploited better.

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I am not sure who you are arguing against? Pats know all too well about next man up and thankfully this post-season we are as healthy as we have ever been.

My point about Brady and Flacco had nothing to do with injuries but the defenses they were facing. Brady was facing one of the best defenses in the league and Flacco one of the worst. Does not mean Joe does not deserve credit but this idea that he outplayed Brady with all things being equal is total hogwash. And Brady did lead the game winning drive scoring himself from the one without Gronk. So when it mattered in that game, Brady was big.

I don't agree with the media's take on your win over Pitt. I think it was a great win for your team when most had you losing including myself. But every game has its own story. Missing Bell was huge for Pitt and their game plan was awful but they lost because the Ravens were better. Not sure how that can be denied. The Steelers must be kicking themselves. That loss ranks up with them losing to Denver back in 2011 but at least that was a road game. To lose at home to a team they have owned in the post season is something that will sting all off-season I would imagine.

One other point AM, Tom did get outplayed in those two games by Flacco. That is not to take away from Tom's overall resume which is unbelievable, and superior to Joe's, at this point. Sometimes it happens. Johnny U lost to Frank Ryan if the Browns in the 1964 NFL Championship. I scratch my head at Joe's inconsistency in losing to Kase Keenum , and looking absolutely dreadful in that Texan's game. All QB's , even the great ones, get outplayed on certain days. It's no shame to admit another QB got the best of him on a given day, and it certainly doesn't diminish his overall accomplishments. In those games, their team around them also failed. It happens.

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Balt played a team that had no L bell on the field. Bell even though he is a RB and its a pass happy league he plays a major role in the Pitts offense. Brown got doubled up and that was pretty much game for pitts. Pitts secondary is banged up. I still believe Suggs and company goes into foxboro and get this win against the patriots. We colts fan will also win against Denver. And we will host the AFC champ game win that and go to the SUPERBOWL!!

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Balt played a team that had no L bell on the field. Bell even though he is a RB and its a pass happy league he plays a major role in the Pitts offense. Brown got doubled up and that was pretty much game for pitts. Pitts secondary is banged up. I still believe Suggs and company goes into foxboro and get this win against the patriots. We colts fan will also win against Denver. And we will host the AFC champ game win that and go to the SUPERBOWL!!

I'm not saying losing Bell wasn't a factor, but did the Ravens release Blount, no the Steelers did. They are responsible for not having depth. After 5 cornerbacks went out for us including our top cover guy Jimmy Smith, did you hear anyone making excuses for the Ravens when Ben lit them up for 6 TD's. Of course you didn't. Maybe we should be making excuses because we lost Dennis Pitta ? Do you realize we lost both of our starting offensive tackles in the Cleveland game, Monroe and Wagner, and we're playing with a rookie undrafted free agent Hurst, and another rookie John Urshel. I have news for you, both of those starting offensive tackles are still out for the Patriots , and we are starting a practice player cornerback. I guess though, people only feel bad for the Steelers .

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AM , I hate to break this to you, but the Ravens defense was ranked number 15 in 2011, and 17 in 2012, hardly 2000 and 2006 Raven's type defenses. This was an aging, but proud defense, but one that Brady could have easily exploited better.

Oh please. I don't care what the rankings were. Having Lewis and Reed, two HoFers and maybe the best at their positions to ever play the game made that Ravens D FAR superior to the Pats. To not acknowledge this is to deny logic.

 

And I have no issue with Tom being outplayed, he was. He said he played like doo doo after the game. But still does not discount that fact that he was facing a far superior defense and lost his best weapon in the fourth quarter AND still led the GW drive ...

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it was a bogus call by refs, he caught the ball and relaxed and DB stripped it. Should have called it completion. It was not a bang bang play

 

Well when a player gets the ball stripped (or he looses control of the ball on his own), you need two feet plus a football move for it to be a completion.  There is not football move after second foot coming down.  Again when the ball is lost  - it is two feet PLUS a football move, one came make the point that the second foot came down, but there is no football move. 

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Well when a player gets the ball stripped (or he looses control of the ball on his own), you need two feet plus a football move for it to be a completion. There is not football move after second foot coming down. Again when the ball is lost - it is two feet PLUS a football move, one came make the point that the second foot came down, but there is no football move.

Not sure what you are trying to say but I thought it was a completion and the play was dead

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It should have been easily secured. I'm not trying to say your DB didn't do his job, he did, but every team has goats like Evans and Cundiff that will be bums of a certain city. God knows , you guys have Bill Buckner.

You have to love how old man Kraft hung that painting from a fan in his office of Cundiff shanking that field goal. In Baltimore, that painting would end up in Rod Serling's Night Gallery !

 

I think you are being a little too hard on Evans.  The fact that the DB did what he did makes the securing of the ball difficult at best.   The ball just arrived and the DB punched it out.  Its not like the ball arrived Evans caught it and turned up field 3 steps and had time to get two hands on the ball and/or placed the ball in a secure position against his body.  The act of catching ball is one act and the act the subsequently securing the ball is a separate.  It is very rare that these act occur in the same motion simply because of where the ball arrives dictates this, which is partly on the QB btw.  Now I am not blaming the QB on this play, but none the less a ball coming into the waist area of a WR who is falling backwards (and also needs to turn his body to get away from a defender) is not one of the types of catches where a catch and secure can happen in the same motion.    So its not on Evans no matter how you spin. 

 

It was no different then Amendola against Miami last year for a TD that would of won the game and secure the #1 seed for the pats.   Brady threw the ball to where on Amendola could catch it, but because the defender was inside him the ball had to be delivered over his head to where Amendola caught it and as he came down the defender make a great play by throwing his hand up and dislodged the ball.  Now we can blame Amendola, but the reality was the ball was thrown in the only place it could and was not in a position where he could both secure it and catch it before the defender could make a play.   

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Not sure what you are trying to say but I thought it was a completion and the play was dead

Well, it's quite clear that you're dead wrong in this situation . This play wasn't even reviewed. Perfect play by Moore.

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