Ways to fix the OL going forward

[Superman]

IF Mewhort can play RT well as Cherilous did last year, I'd rather have him there.  Decent Gs are easier and cheaper to find than Ts, and I'd rather improve other parts of the team if we can upgrade RT play from within.

 

I think Mewhort is 6.6, which I think is more of  T body type.  And since he will likely get stronger and heavier from his rookie year, it seems like it might be his future.  Diem wasn't the quickest guy, and had his bad moments, but he did well for the Colts for many years. 

 

My issue with Mewhort isn't that I don't think he can play it somewhat adequately. It's that I think he'd be top notch at guard. Moving him to RT weakens the interior, and doesn't really strengthen RT. It's hard to even call it treading water; it's going backward, actually. My way, we let Mewhort continue to get better at guard, where I think he'd eventually be dominant.

 

You're right, you can find players at guard in free agency and in the draft, but I don't think the free agent class at guard is particularly impressive this year, aside from Iupati, and he's gonna want $8m/year. That's more than the RT we want to get rid of.

 

To me, we could draft a true RT caliber guy in the first or second round who can immediate play well and bring some premium potential to the position. Keep Mewhort at LG, where he has premium potential. And now, all we're doing is competing at RG, really, with Reitz and young guys.

[Superman]

Your perspective regarding how we move forward with the offensive line now sounds eerily similar to what I and many others were saying an off-season ago. Particularly about giving the young players competition, which you seemed to disagree with back then. Not trying to pick on you, but I have to admit I kinda laughed when I read this post from you

 

Not really. Before the offseason, I wanted us to add a veteran lineman to solidify the interior. Once the team chose not to do that, I moved on.

 

I also hoped the young guys could show more than what they have. We have some answers that we didn't have before the season, particularly with Thornton. It's also hard to be excited about Holmes when the staff had him benched for 75% of the season. I still think he's a solid player, but he can't help the team in street clothes.

 

As of now, I think we have plenty of competition at RG, but could use another veteran. And I think we're worse at RT than expected, so it's time to do something about that.

[DougDew]

My issue with Mewhort isn't that I don't think he can play it somewhat adequately. It's that I think he'd be top notch at guard. Moving him to RT weakens the interior, and doesn't really strengthen RT. It's hard to even call it treading water; it's going backward, actually. My way, we let Mewhort continue to get better at guard, where I think he'd eventually be dominant.

 

You're right, you can find players at guard in free agency and in the draft, but I don't think the free agent class at guard is particularly impressive this year, aside from Iupati, and he's gonna want $8m/year. That's more than the RT we want to get rid of.

 

To me, we could draft a true RT caliber guy in the first or second round who can immediate play well and bring some premium potential to the position. Keep Mewhort at LG, where he has premium potential. And now, all we're doing is competing at RG, really, with Reitz and young guys.

Yes, the key to my scenario is Mewhort being a good RT.   He would probably only tread water next year, but if the $5M cap money was spent wisely on a vet RG, who could also help Mewhort learn, the right side of the line would be upgraded compared to the line at any time during the past 5 years.

 

Yes, a vet might not be available, but I might be persuaded to give up an extra $3M for Lupati.  Maybe do something at S to get the savings.

 

I think Reitz and Nixon are pretty good LGs actually.

[YOUR GM]

Not really. Before the offseason, I wanted us to add a veteran lineman to solidify the interior. Once the team chose not to do that, I moved on.

I also hoped the young guys could show more than what they have. We have some answers that we didn't have before the season, particularly with Thornton. It's also hard to be excited about Holmes when the staff had him benched for 75% of the season. I still think he's a solid player, but he can't help the team in street clothes.

As of now, I think we have plenty of competition at RG, but could use another veteran. And I think we're worse at RT than expected, so it's time to do something about that.

Hmmm, must've been someone else I'm thinking of then. I thought you felt Louis was an adequate acquisition to challenge Thornton back then, and that Holmes couldn't improve if he had legit competiiton.

At any rate, fair points on your part. I'm not entirely sure I even subscribe to the lack of talent theory anymore, regarding our O line struggles. It was a bit of an eye-opener to see Satele move on and perform at a relatively high level for a good portion of this season. Maybe it's position coaching that's the real issue? I don't know, but this is something that they can't afford not to figure out before the start of next season. This problem is beyond old, at this point

[ColtsHoosiersBB]

Draft the best O lineman with the first pick of the draft for the next 3 years. Dallas did that

with 3 of their last 4 first rounders and now how well does Romo and Murray's play look now?

Pretty darn good, a quality O line makes everyone on offense look good.

[Superman]

Yes, the key to my scenario is Mewhort being a good RT.   He would probably only tread water next year, but if the $5M cap money was spent wisely on a vet RG, who could also help Mewhort learn, the right side of the line would be upgraded compared to the line at any time the past 5 years.

 

Yes, a vet might not be available, but I might be persuaded to give up an extra $3M for Lupati.  Maybe do something at S to get the savings.

 

I think Reitz and Nixon are pretty good LGs actually.

 

You'll get $3.25m from Thomas getting released, which I expect to happen.

 

And I agree on Reitz and Nixon. But Reitz is a UFA and can't stay on the field (four years in a row, now), and Nixon showed well in limited time last year, but I wouldn't want to rely on him.

 

I'm open to a vet at RG, I just don't think the market looks good right now. It's Iupati, probably Levitre and Grubbs/Evans, and then a bunch of guys like Carpenter (meh), Boling (better)... there are some guys, just no one I'm terribly excited about. And then, the teams that spent $8m/year on guard all seem to have put themselves in bad situations, and aren't getting the quality of play they expected. So I'm really not a fan of the Iupati deal; besides, he's been leaky in pass pro this season.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/free-agents/nfl/ufa/guard/

 

I haven't really gotten into the draft prospects, but I've already noticed a couple guys that can play RT right away, IMO, and they are 2nd/3rd round guys. That's why I think the most cost effective way forward is to draft a RT, keep Mewhort at LG, and then maybe add a vet at RG. But I still think there's plenty of young potential at RG for us. Also, with that strategy, we're not necessarily getting rid of Cherilus, although I think that might be the best course...

[Superman]

Hmmm, must've been someone else I'm thinking of then. I thought you felt Louis was an adequate acquisition to challenge Thornton back then, and that Holmes couldn't improve if he had legit competiiton.

At any rate, fair points on your part. I'm not entirely sure I even subscribe to the lack of talent theory anymore, regarding our O line struggles. It was a bit of an eye-opener to see Satele move on and perform at a relatively high level for a good portion of this season. Maybe it's position coaching that's the real issue? I don't know, but this is something that they can't afford not to figure out before the start of next season. This problem is beyond old, at this point

 

Not to be argumentative or contentious, but I felt like you were miscategorizing my position back then, and still feel that way.

 

The conversations you're probably thinking of took place in July and August, after it was obvious that the team was done bringing new players in. I bought in. It wasn't my preferred course of action, but it was the reality.

 

And I didn't think that Holmes couldn't improve with legit competition. My opinion was that he was drafted to be the center, and it made sense to give him a chance to play the position, rather than drafting another young center. Similar thoughts on Thornton, but I already felt like we had plenty of competition at guard. Turns out, we had plenty of competition at center, also. Questions have been answered, but unfortunately, needs have not been met.

 

I do agree that the line coach might be an issue here. Not because of Satele, necessarily, but there's been a lot of shuffling and not a lot of noted improvement. Satele came back down to earth as the season went on, and guys like McGlynn and Linkenbach were just as irrelevant as they were here. But Thornton seemed to go backward, the weirdness at center, and there were a lot of blown assignments on run plays. 

 

I also agree that the problem is old. It needs to be fixed.

[lollygagger8]

I didn't read the entire thread, but......

 

 

Harrison at guard and Holmes at Center was a pretty decent combo. Why did it take 14,936 injuries for our coaching staff to try that combo?? It's really disheartening how they don't put players in the best possible position to play well. 

[DougDew]

You'll get $3.25m from Thomas getting released, which I expect to happen.

 

 

Forgot about that. 

 

AC will get his money.  And my potential other starters of Nixon/Harrison/ Holmes/ Thornton at LG/C and Mewhort at RT means that three positions will be under rookie contracts.  So if you look at how much money could be spent on the Oline as a whole and not at each part, the team could afford to overpay a vet RG a bit if it came down to that.

 

If Cherilous comes back healthy then other scenarios take over, IMO.