Polian's Defensive Philosophy

[LUVTHESHOE]

I believe that also, but it would not turn a 32 ranked defense into a top 5. The scheme is flawed. When playing defense, the object is to read and react, not to read and allow. Comparing this to a fight, we are letting the other fighter hit us and hoping he is too tired by the end of the fight to put up a fight. That is flawed. That doesn't sit easy with me in anyway. I don't care if we had Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Suh, and any other high caliber players with the same scheme, the scheme would still haunt me.

Could you imagine any of those players you just spoke of putting up with this kind of system being coached to them. Not one real nfl defensive player would support this system.

[Smitto]

I believe that also, but it would not turn a 32 ranked defense into a top 5. The scheme is flawed. When playing defense, the object is to read and react, not to read and allow. Comparing this to a fight, we are letting the other fighter hit us and hoping he is too tired by the end of the fight to put up a fight. That is flawed. That doesn't sit easy with me in anyway. I don't care if we had Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Suh, and any other high caliber players with the same scheme, the scheme would still haunt me.

that is true the scheme is flawed but so is every scheme, the problem that plagues the colts is that they do not have the right players and some of the players they have playing are either not very skilled or not very experienced... just like how Nhamdi was so good in oakland look at him now in philly playing zone he isnt as good as he was playing man... to me zone is much harder to play because playing a really good QB you can be fooled big time, unless the colts get some pretty good corners and another good saftey with a good LB or two they are gonna be plagued.

[dn4192]

Are you the same poster who said it is obvious that peytons time is over & that the team needs to move on without him, but brings up the history of POLIANS success every time to defend Bill Polian...

Laughable...

Yes the era of Peyton is or has come to a close. He may never play for the Colts again he may play for a couple of seasons for them but for all purpose, the next big run this franchise goes on will be with a different QB. We will have to wait and see what happens, but so far under Bill Polians direction this franchise has been successful. And it's due to more then just (18).

[ReMeDy]

Why do you listen to what he says? No GM/coach or owner is ever going to state in a public forum how they operate and do things.

It's possible he may be here on the forum... as one of us... Now if you'll excuse me, my son, Chris, wants me to play some Madden with him...

[Buck Showalter]

Yes the era of Peyton is or has come to a close. He may never play for the Colts again he may play for a couple of seasons for them but for all purpose, the next big run this franchise goes on will be with a different QB. We will have to wait and see what happens, but so far under Bill Polians direction this franchise has been successful. And it's due to more then just (18).

So you can fathom that peoples perform can decline, but you refuse to understnad that polian & caldwells performance decline of 14-2, 10-6, 0-12 is a massive decline and should imply that some management & philosophy schemes need to change...

[LUVTHESHOE]

So you can fathom that peoples perform can decline, but you refuse to understnad that polian & caldwells performance decline of 14-2, 10-6, 0-12 is a massive decline and should imply that some management & philosophy schemes need to change...

I will bet you money that a, YA BUT IS COMING. that is not regression, in his mind. He stated yesterday they have not regressed at all.

[Fatboyslim11]

So Polian is now a coach in addition to the Vice Chairman and de facto GM. He is dictating the defensive schemes so why have a coach? I wonder why Irsay don't wake up and realize Polian is ruining this franchise with his uncontrollable need to be in charge of everything. The job of any GM is to procure the talent for the team. The X's and O's are the responsibility of the head coach and staff.

Once Caldwell is fired what self-respecting head coach candidate will want the job if his hands are already tied by the Vice Chairman/GM? It is looking more and more like we will get a Caldwell clone.

[dn4192]

So you can fathom that peoples perform can decline, but you refuse to understnad that polian & caldwells performance decline of 14-2, 10-6, 0-12 is a massive decline and should imply that some management & philosophy schemes need to change...

I look at what is behind the decline. With Peyton you have age/injury. The decline of the team is due to injury. Do you think the team would have the record it had if we didn't suffer key injuries?

[dn4192]

So Polian is now a coach in addition to the Vice Chairman and de facto GM. He is dictating the defensive schemes so why have a coach? I wonder why Irsay don't wake up and realize Polian is ruining this franchise with his uncontrollable need to be in charge of everything. The job of any GM is to procure the talent for the team. The X's and O's are the responsibility of the head coach and staff.

Once Caldwell is fired what self-respecting head coach candidate will want the job if his hands are already tied by the Vice Chairman/GM? It is looking more and more like we will get a Caldwell clone.

I am willing to bet that if Bill Polian said the sky was falling people would believe him. PEOPLE he is an NFL pro at NFL speak and I am continually amazed at how people just suck up what he says and believes everything he says to the press....come on folks...

[LUVTHESHOE]

I am willing to bet that if Bill Polian said the sky was falling people would believe him. PEOPLE he is an NFL pro at NFL speak and I am continually amazed at how people just suck up what he says and believes everything he says to the press....come on folks...

PURE GENIUS!

[dn4192]

PURE GENIUS!

Yes it is...can't believe it took you this long to see that. Glad to see you are opening your eyes and seeing....

[Buck Showalter]

I look at what is behind the decline. With Peyton you have age/injury. The decline of the team is due to injury. Do you think the team would have the record it had if we didn't suffer key injuries?

This season? Winnless?? No, I think we would be competitive with 18, we would sneak into the playoffs & be exposed due to poor coaching & defensive scheme, O-line etc. go one & done like we have so many other times this past decade...

[Buck Showalter]

Yes it is...can't believe it took you this long to see that. Glad to see you are opening your eyes and seeing....

Sarcasm is a dificult theory to comprehend...

I think everyone knows Polian is king at NFL speak, & his skillful ability to speak on & on & on without saying anything, or at least anything meaningful, a big reason why some of us find it ridiculous that the ego-maniac even bothers to host a pointless radio show.

[jwilli69]

Why do you listen to what he says? No GM/coach or owner is ever going to state in a public forum how they operate and do things.

Well quite honestly, he doesn't have to say anything about it, the product shows on the field so his plans have worked, in his mind anyways.

[Douzer]

So Polian is now a coach in addition to the Vice Chairman and de facto GM. He is dictating the defensive schemes so why have a coach? I wonder why Irsay don't wake up and realize Polian is ruining this franchise with his uncontrollable need to be in charge of everything. The job of any GM is to procure the talent for the team. The X's and O's are the responsibility of the head coach and staff.

Once Caldwell is fired what self-respecting head coach candidate will want the job if his hands are already tied by the Vice Chairman/GM? It is looking more and more like we will get a Caldwell clone.

Nailed it.

Another day has passed and I'm still burning over BP's comments. Irsay needs to hit the handle and flush this load down the drain today.

[Douzer]

From STAMPEDE BLUE

http://www.stampedeblue.com/

Perfect timing!

For those that don't remember, Jim Mora was fired after the 2001 season because he refused to dismiss his then-defensive coordinator, Vic Fangio, per the orders of team president Bill Polian. In Mora's eyes, it wasn't the coach who was at fault for the Colts defense giving up 30 points per game. It was the front office. Coaches can't take sub-par talent and make it win, and talent on defense was nonexistent in 2001.

Mora refused to dismiss Fangio. Upon that refusal, both men were sent packing. Mora hasn't even spoken to Polian since.

Ironically, Jim Caldwell was in the exact same position this year as Mora was in 2001. Caldwell opted to obey the orders from the Polians, and he fired Larry Coyer last week. Meanwhile, in San Francisco, Vic Fangio is currently coordinating the No. 1 defense in all of football, surrendering only 13.4 points per game

[dn4192]

Sarcasm is a dificult theory to comprehend...

I think everyone knows Polian is king at NFL speak, & his skillful ability to speak on & on & on without saying anything, or at least anything meaningful, a big reason why some of us find it ridiculous that the ego-maniac even bothers to host a pointless radio show.

He has a show because he is an ego maniac. They love that stuff, they love messing with people's mind or in his case fans minds...this is like a kid in a candy store....

[Buck Showalter]

Nailed it.

Another day has passed and I'm still burning over BP's comments. Irsay needs to hit the handle and flush this load down the drain today.

Basically yes...

[dn4192]

Nailed it.

Another day has passed and I'm still burning over BP's comments. Irsay needs to hit the handle and flush this load down the drain today.

Take a deep breath and just remember he is just pulling the chains of the fans because he can...

[dn4192]

From STAMPEDE BLUE

http://www.stampedeblue.com/

Perfect timing!

For those that don't remember, Jim Mora was fired after the 2001 season because he refused to dismiss his then-defensive coordinator, Vic Fangio, per the orders of team president Bill Polian. In Mora's eyes, it wasn't the coach who was at fault for the Colts defense giving up 30 points per game. It was the front office. Coaches can't take sub-par talent and make it win, and talent on defense was nonexistent in 2001.

Mora refused to dismiss Fangio. Upon that refusal, both men were sent packing. Mora hasn't even spoken to Polian since.

Ironically, Jim Caldwell was in the exact same position this year as Mora was in 2001. Caldwell opted to obey the orders from the Polians, and he fired Larry Coyer last week. Meanwhile, in San Francisco, Vic Fangio is currently coordinating the No. 1 defense in all of football, surrendering only 13.4 points per game

And you point is? How many divisional titles do the 49ers have over the past decade? How many SB appearances?

[Buck Showalter]

He has a show because he is an ego maniac. They love that stuff, they love messing with people's mind or in his case fans minds...this is like a kid in a candy store....

He has a show because he is an ego maniac... Fantastic . They love that stuff, they love messing with people's mind or in his case fans minds,Again fantastic the guy running an NFL franchise/a business, to MESS with his fans/customers minds???...this is like a kid in a candy store..yeah???

Whats your point? You defend the guy. Polian has turned his team into a disgrace & you think the guy is awesome, just look at his resume... Take away Manning & relook at the reusme... WINNLESS...

[Fatboyslim11]

And you point is? How many divisional titles do the 49ers have over the past decade? How many SB appearances?

Once again your commments show your mind is not of this world (I hope you find it soon because the comedy aspect of your postings are wearing thin). . Fangio is in his first year as SF defensive coordinator so the past niners teams is not a part of the equation. Just like your hero Polian it is what you write or don't write in your pointless posts that really defines you.

[Douzer]

And your point is?

Already made, and needs no further clarification.

[Buck Showalter]

Already made, and needs no further clarification.

Some people on here do not get or understand the blatantly obvious...

[dn4192]

He has a show because he is an ego maniac... Fantastic . They love that stuff, they love messing with people's mind or in his case fans minds,Again fantastic the guy running an NFL franchise/a business, to MESS with his fans/customers minds???...this is like a kid in a candy store..yeah???

Whats your point? You defend the guy. Polian has turned his team into a disgrace & you think the guy is awesome, just look at his resume... Take away Manning & relook at the reusme... WINNLESS...

This team is not a disagrace, it's having a bad season that's all. Bill Polian took a disgraceful franchise and turned it into one of the top franchises in pro sports, let alone the NFL. He built a winning franchise and to "insult" the other players who have won Colt Blue that is do just to Peyton is a joke. I dare you to go up to Jeff Saturday or any Colt and tell them that. Did Polian make some bad moves, YES, all GM's do. Ask the Philly GM right now how he is felling with all the money he spent this past off season for the team and how well that is going.

[LUVTHESHOE]

This team is not a disagrace, it's having a bad season that's all. Bill Polian took a disgraceful franchise and turned it into one of the top franchises in pro sports, let alone the NFL. He built a winning franchise and to "insult" the other players who have won Colt Blue that is do just to Peyton is a joke. I dare you to go up to Jeff Saturday or any Colt and tell them that. Did Polian make some bad moves, YES, all GM's do. Ask the Philly GM right now how he is felling with all the money he spent this past off season for the team and how well that is going.

Hey clown , your act is wearing thin. Please stop your daily assault on this forum. You were cute and funny for awhile, now I am sure you a just a troll or possibly an employee.,Please stop!!!!!!!!!! Mods please feel free to jump in here. This guy as taken ever side to every thread now for weeks. He is nothing more than a spoon who will take any position at any time, please jump in here.

[Dustin]

Interesting how so many couch potato fans think they know more then someone on the level of Bill Polian. My question to all of those here who disagree with Bill...

1. What is your record as a NFL GM?

2. How many drafts have you overseen in your career in the NFL

3. How many teams have you built that have gone on to the SB

It's real easy to sit from your lazy boy or seat in the stadium and say "how things should be done" without all the information and such. I mean if you really think you can do a better job then why not pay a visit to the 56th street HQ, put in your resume for GM, list all of your qualifications and see what happens?

People need to relax, lets see how the mag't teams reacts to this season and what actual changes occur before leaping off the ledge....

I'm no Gm, but I'm pretty sure letting the WR catch the ball is not a good defensive philosophy.

[billpolianx]

bill polian is not a gm anymore his son is supposed to be ,but he was never a coach, coordinator but yet still pulls all the strings on those jobs i believe jim irsay is a good owner and good person but unless he is ultra loyal to manning for making the colts franchise what it is today and cans all the polian, his team will be an also ran franchise and be what jacksonville is now a team with really no city or support

[unitaswestand]

How is this Polian's defense? When Jim Mora was coach, we ran a different defense with Vic Fangio. Dungy brought in the Tampa-2 and that is what Caldwell runs too. I think Polian is given far too much credit/blame for what systems that team is running.

[The Peytonator]

I don't think anything more needs to be said to dn. It is clear at this point he either is Bill Polian, or he's employed by Bill Polian.

The fact that anyone defends the General Manager of a team that is 0-12, is just a comedic situation alone. It's as funny as saying Jamarcus Russell is a good quarterback because he had good numbers in college. I don't see how anyone can defend Polian at this point. I actually feel bad for Caldwell now. I feel for all the coaches. I can't remember who said it, but the gist of it was, in football you can fire coaches but it doesn't mean the mess was their fault. I honestly feel Caldwell, Christenson, and now Mike Murphy, are all doing everything they can with this team of scrubs, and the schemes Bill Polian chooses to employ.

[unitaswestand]

So...fire Bill Polian and replace him with who??? Good GM/talent evaluators at his level just don't grow on trees. Firing Polian is a popular topic, but I really want to know what the suggested plan is to replace him? From 1979-1998 the Colts have been mostly bad with bad drafts. Do we want to go back to that?? I sure don't. Bill bothers people, but he is one of the best talent evaluators in the NFL. Sure, it was a mistake to build a team around one guy without a backup QB who could fill it. But as Jim Irsay pointed out, 12 years of success and one bad season doesn't mean you first Bill Polian.

[BobbyMorris94]

And you point is? How many divisional titles do the 49ers have over the past decade? How many SB appearances?

This guy is definitely trolling for Polian. He can't see why we were good the last decade. It was all #18. Without the GOAT we wouldn't have had the greatest mind in football directing our offense, and we might not have made any playoff runs at all. There is a reason we used to be number one year and and year out on the MetLife protection index. Now we are bottom on the barrel minus 18 and the o-line isn't really any worse.

Polian probably cost Manning at least three super bowls by fielding inferior talent on defense and firing Mora and Fangio. We are doomed as long as Polian remains.

[John Dee]

I don't like it, I think we need to be more aggressive. We can't wait for a team to make a mistake or cough up the ball. This is the NFL, teams practice like mad to get these plays down. We need to force them to make mistakes by disrupting their timing (jamming receivers) and hitting their QB (blitzing). I don't think you can wait and hope Brady or Brees or Rodgers makes a mistake in the red zone. Force them to make mistakes.

YEAAAAASSSSSSS... I am also quit sick and tired of watching this D. If they had the "proper" talent to run a C2 then fine. But this D is not set up "proper" to run ANY D effectively.

I will say it for the last and final time. I simply cannot believe ONE player could have possibly meant so much to ONE team.

Truly amazing. And I swear, If I had an MVP vote... I would put it in for Manning.

I hope PM is healthy, and then.... if so.. Indy does the "right thing" ... and

TRADE THE darn PICK AND GET A BOUNTY OF PICKS AND LETS GO BACK TO THE SUPER BOWL.

[John Dee]

This guy is definitely trolling for Polian. He can't see why we were good the last decade. It was all #18. Without the GOAT we wouldn't have had the greatest mind in football directing our offense, and we might not have made any playoff runs at all. There is a reason we used to be number one year and and year out on the MetLife protection index. Now we are bottom on the barrel minus 18 and the o-line isn't really any worse.

Polian probably cost Manning at least three super bowls by fielding inferior talent on defense and firing Mora and Fangio. We are doomed as long as Polian remains.

Are you serious? Did you watch any of the pre 2006 playoff games? The Colt D "was good enough".. but 18 was not "good enough" in MOST.

Manning has had maybe a handful of "off the chart" playoff games. and a "double fist" of really unimpressive ones.

The Colt D played "good enough" in 99, 03, 04, and 05.... But the GOAT could not score enough. Or Vandy choked. Either way they lost, not fair at all but it is the way it goes in big boy NFL football.

Peyton is the best ever in my book, but he defiantly has work to do if he plans of cementing his legacy. 9-10 is not a stellar post season mark. And Indy was in every single one of those games. Maybe one of he NE games went south late but... hehe..

Polian has been sub par lately but don't kid ... This team was a very good "all around squad" for most of the Polian years.

[BobbyMorris94]

Are you serious? Did you watch any of the pre 2006 playoff games? The Colt D "was good enough".. but 18 was not "good enough" in MOST.

Manning has had maybe a handful of "off the chart" playoff games. and a "double fist" of really unimpressive ones.

The Colt D played "good enough" in 99, 03, 04, and 05.... But the GOAT could not score enough. Or Vandy choked. Either way they lost, not fair at all but it is the way it goes in big boy NFL football.

Peyton is the best ever in my book, but he defiantly has work to do if he plans of cementing his legacy. 9-10 is not a stellar post season mark. And Indy was in every single one of those games. Maybe one of he NE games went south late but... hehe..

Polian has been sub par lately but don't kid ... This team was a very good "all around squad" for most of the Polian years.

It wasn't just Peyton choking. Jets 41-0 ring a bell? The team around him was soft. He has never had a great offensive line. Glenn wasn't a hall of famer or anything. And just because a lot of those playoff scores weren't high or blowouts doesn't mean the other team didn't play it conservative and run the ball down our throats and complete quick passes and hold on to the ball to win time of possession. They did. I suggest you go back and watch how many times that "great d" got off of the field on third down. The two pats losses was because Marvin Harrison was almost our whole passing offense, and Ty Law exploited him as soft. Well that and the refs seemed to swallow the whistle. The year Marvin went down Peyton struggled because no one could catch the ball outside of Wayne.

For as good as Dallas Clark is, he is soft. Joseph Addai is soft. We've lost a lot of games in the trenches due to be overpowered in the trenches, and jammed up on the line. The more physical teams owned us in the playoffs. It's not like when Peyton "choked" all those times he was missing wide open throws. Teams put bodies and power on us, and we got exposed. Many times.

[bayone]

YEAAAAASSSSSSS... I am also quit sick and tired of watching this D. If they had the "proper" talent to run a C2 then fine. But this D is not set up "proper" to run ANY D effectively.

I will say it for the last and final time. I simply cannot believe ONE player could have possibly meant so much to ONE team.

Truly amazing. And I swear, If I had an MVP vote... I would put it in for Manning.

I hope PM is healthy, and then.... if so.. Indy does the "right thing" ... and

TRADE THE darn PICK AND GET A BOUNTY OF PICKS AND LETS GO BACK TO THE SUPER BOWL.

agreed , agrred , agreed ......... to infinity I agree

[smittywerb]

that is true the scheme is flawed but so is every scheme, the problem that plagues the colts is that they do not have the right players and some of the players they have playing are either not very skilled or not very experienced... just like how Nhamdi was so good in oakland look at him now in philly playing zone he isnt as good as he was playing man... to me zone is much harder to play because playing a really good QB you can be fooled big time, unless the colts get some pretty good corners and another good saftey with a good LB or two they are gonna be plagued.

True, but I'm pretty sure some schemes are better than other schemes and take less talent to be effective. Any person who has played a lick of football will know waiting for the opponent to come to you will get you ran over. I can see why we can't tackle now. It's because of the players and the scheme. Even when our defense was playing at its best we were not a top 5 defense. That means something is wrong with the scheme. Why is it so hard for our team to attack the ball before the offense has thrown it? Why is it so hard for our defense to force TO's and not wait for them? You know I hate to bring this up, but maybe Tryon was right, Caldwell doesn't run this team.

And on the Nnamdi point, that is true, but does that mean all the corners we have are man corners because they can't play the zone well? I understand you can't fit a circle into a square hole but this is different. Instead of trying to fit a circle into a square hole, we are hoping the circle will turn into a square. This scheme is horrible. I don't know how this can sit right with anyone that has played organized football. You tell your team to go out and get punched in the mouth and hope the opposing team misses.

I look at what is behind the decline. With Peyton you have age/injury. The decline of the team is due to injury. Do you think the team would have the record it had if we didn't suffer key injuries?

Same Excuse, New year. injuries, injuries, injuries, injuries. Oh, if we wouldn't get injured every year, we would win the SB every year.

[dn4192]

This guy is definitely trolling for Polian. He can't see why we were good the last decade. It was all #18. Without the GOAT we wouldn't have had the greatest mind in football directing our offense, and we might not have made any playoff runs at all. There is a reason we used to be number one year and and year out on the MetLife protection index. Now we are bottom on the barrel minus 18 and the o-line isn't really any worse.

Polian probably cost Manning at least three super bowls by fielding inferior talent on defense and firing Mora and Fangio. We are doomed as long as Polian remains.

I guess we are then doomed to double digit win seaons, repeated divisional titles, some conf titles and a super bowl appearance here and there...man does that suck just being that good...

[dn4192]

True, but I'm pretty sure some schemes are better than other schemes and take less talent to be effective. Any person who has played a lick of football will know waiting for the opponent to come to you will get you ran over. I can see why we can't tackle now. It's because of the players and the scheme. Even when our defense was playing at its best we were not a top 5 defense. That means something is wrong with the scheme. Why is it so hard for our team to attack the ball before the offense has thrown it? Why is it so hard for our defense to force TO's and not wait for them? You know I hate to bring this up, but maybe Tryon was right, Caldwell doesn't run this team.

And on the Nnamdi point, that is true, but does that mean all the corners we have are man corners because they can't play the zone well? I understand you can't fit a circle into a square hole but this is different. Instead of trying to fit a circle into a square hole, we are hoping the circle will turn into a square. This scheme is horrible. I don't know how this can sit right with anyone that has played organized football. You tell your team to go out and get punched in the mouth and hope the opposing team misses.

Same Excuse, New year. injuries, injuries, injuries, injuries. Oh, if we wouldn't get injured every year, we would win the SB every year.

From 2000 - 2009 how many "key" injuries did the Colts suffer? Outside of maybe Bob Sanders missing some time and Edge missing some time, I don't think the injury issue for the Colts was no where near what it has been in the 2010 and 2011 season.

[smittywerb]

From 2000 - 2009 how many "key" injuries did the Colts suffer? Outside of maybe Bob Sanders missing some time and Edge missing some time, I don't think the injury issue for the Colts was no where near what it has been in the 2010 and 2011 season.

Plenty, am I going to sit here and name every one? No. Am I going to tell you that every year I have been apart of this board (I've been here under names, forgot the passwords) people have said "If only we could stay healthy."? Yes, because that is what happens.