Archie Manning's Take On Andrew And Peyton Co-Existing (Merge)

[GoPats]

So you think it's simply a coincidence that everyone on Earth is talking about Manning/Luck and how this is all going to go down, and then all of a sudden we find Archie giving interviews where he says they don't want to play together?

Archie Manning might be a lot of things, but he isn't stupid. He had to know the kind of reaction saying something like this would create. I have to believe he said what he said for a reason. I'm just not sure if his motivation is to stop the Colts drafting Luck, or to get Peyton out of Indy.

This.

If anyone thinks this wasn't contrived, you're being a bit gullible. Archie Manning has set a precedent with the entire Eli situation when he was drafted. There was an ulterior motive to these comments. Maybe he's saying what Peyton feels but cannot come out and say. But there's absolutely plenty of evidence out there to suggest that Archie never says anything like this without an MO.

[Jason_]

Stephen A Smith and Skip Bayless debated Archie's comments and what the Colts/Luck/Manning might/might not do. I typed a transcript of the conversation and posted it here for anyone who'd like to read that didn't catch the show...

[BProland85]

I still dont know how you can pass on Andrew Luck with the 1st overall pick. He is unquestionably the best player in the draft, and you dont pass on a guy that is a franchise QB guy.

I still believe that if Manning truly wants to play for a contender then he could be willing to restructure his deal to where he can be traded and it wont handicap the Colts financially. That would be the best case scenario for the Colts because they would get something in return for Manning to give Andrew Luck more talent around him.

I think there are teams out there willing to pay Manning his big bonus in order to have his services on the team.

If you dont go that route, then I think you gotta get what you can get in a trade for the 1st overall pick by getting future 1sts in return and still get a QB like RGIII or a playmaker like Justin Blackmon or Morris Claiborne.

[pacolts56]

Yes, I do actually. In fact I think it's more than possible.

Also, Archie is supposed to be on Mike and Mike in a little bit to talk about this again.

So yeah, I definitely think this was intentional to provoke a certain response.

I'm also starting to understand the anger San Diego fans have towards Archie and Eli.

Amen....and I'll go a step further.

I'm a Colts fan before I'm a fan of ANY player that plays for them. I'm pretty sure most of us are.

It might a bit abstract for some folks to tell whether Archie is playing some kind of surrogate PR game for Peyton...but I sure as heck don't like the smell of it. And at this point Archie would do well to put some serious clarification to his comments. If this IS a case of Archie inserting himself, with Peyton's blessings, into the situation we have...by all means they have the right to do so.

And the team in turn has a perfect right to decide accordingly.

IMO, if the Manning family pulls any of this "tail wags the dog" Draft Day-type crap that Archie pulled in the past....then I'd release Peyton Manning and draft Luck with the #1 overall pick, or trade the pick if the front office so chooses, and begin the rebuild of the Colts.

I don't expect and I'd be surprised at (sort of) this kind of outcome to Peyton's career in Indianapolis....but the business of a player orchestrating his career wind-down DOES NOT include influencing or manipulating that team's front office decisions regarding his successor. Those decisions are and should be solely conducted by team management and ownership.

IMO....the organization overrides the player and comes first in that kind of situation EVERY time.

If the team doesn't put itself and its long-term interests first and stand rock-solid....then trust me, they are sowing seeds they'll later regret.

[SanAntonioColt]

.... where there's money involved there will always be an issue.

Especially when pride is also involved. Peyton is not going to ride the bench if he is able to play and Luck will watch for one season at most.

[Jaric]

If the team doesn't put itself and its long-term interests first and stand rock-solid....then trust me, they are sowing seeds they'll later regret.

Yeah, all of this.

[Jay305]

I dont know why everyone is so caught up on Luck to be honest. Someone who would sit behind Peyton and who has a higher ceiling than Luck in RG3

[jedi.creech]

Feels like curse of Bambino is coming....

Just can't get over the fact we have so many people that is ready to show Manning a pink slip, for someone who has never throw a single pass in the NFL... If this happens we say good bye to Manning for a player who we have no idea what he can do, I say it now I hope Luck is a complete flop. And Manning gets more rings with whoever he goes to, while we are fighting to be .500 because we only addressed a QB issue with a HOPE he will be as good as he is suppose to be, and didn't address other issues that this team obviously has.

[Blue Horseshoe]

Feels like curse of Bambino is coming....

Just can't get over the fact we have so many people that is ready to show Manning a pink slip, for someone who has never throw a single pass in the NFL... If this happens we say good bye to Manning for a player who we have no idea what he can do, I say it now I hope Luck is a complete flop. And Manning gets more rings with whoever he goes to, while we are fighting to be .500 because we only addressed a QB issue with a HOPE he will be as good as he is suppose to be, and didn't address other issues that this team obviously has.

I actually wish they would liberate Manning to go win some championships to cement his legacy rather than hold him hostage to this 0-16 wreck of a football team.

[Jaric]

Feels like curse of Bambino is coming....

Just can't get over the fact we have so many people that is ready to show Manning a pink slip, for someone who has never throw a single pass in the NFL... If this happens we say good bye to Manning for a player who we have no idea what he can do, I say it now I hope Luck is a complete flop. And Manning gets more rings with whoever he goes to, while we are fighting to be .500 because we only addressed a QB issue with a HOPE he will be as good as he is suppose to be, and didn't address other issues that this team obviously has.

Why would you want the guy we draft to flop?

That just doesn't make any sense.

[pacolts56]

Feels like curse of Bambino is coming....

Just can't get over the fact we have so many people that is ready to show Manning a pink slip, for someone who has never throw a single pass in the NFL... If this happens we say good bye to Manning for a player who we have no idea what he can do, I say it now I hope Luck is a complete flop. And Manning gets more rings with whoever he goes to, while we are fighting to be .500 because we only addressed a QB issue with a HOPE he will be as good as he is suppose to be, and didn't address other issues that this team obviously has.

I don't want that either, jedi....I don't think anybody does. But there is the matter of the Colts future to think about.

And what the is Archie doing publicly flapping his jaws about such a difficult set of personnel decisions facing the front office when his son is smack-dab in the middle of it.....and with potentially the team's long-term interests hanging in the balance?

Now.....does he have the right to say all that stuff and express his opinion? Sure he does.

Do I trust his motives after his gambit with Eli and San Diego?

No I do not.

[JColts72]

If the Colts would win some games, this would all be a moot point. But if they did win, I'm afarid Emotion Man Caldwell will get another 5 year contract. I saw Johnny U in SD uniform, and if Peyton goes, who will follow? I don't care who is the QB, as long as their is a new head caoch, new d. coach, new line coach, new offesive coach, etc. New GM would help too. If Joe Thomas GM back in the day cleaned house, same should be done now.

[CjMcGirt23]

Part 2-http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d824d2a65/article/archie-manning-uncertain-of-peytons-future-in-indy?module=HP11_headline_stack

[pacolts56]

Part 2-http://www.nfl.com/n..._headline_stack

Interesting comments.....but Archie HAS to know that Peyton is untradeable due to the $38 million cap hit the Colts would take versus the $10 million hit if he is simply released. Unless there's a way around that huge cap hit in a trade.

Make no mistake....Archie could very well be flashing the warning signs that Peyton might be done in Indianapolis, and under the trade/cap hit scenario could probably hand-pick his destination if we release him.

The team isn't in the best bargaining position.....that's for sure.

If I have any of this cap stuff wrong someone correct me...but I'm pretty sure thats what I read in a article that Smitto linked yesterday.

[Jason_]

Interesting comments.....but Archie HAS to know that Peyton is untradeable due to the $38 million cap hit the Colts would take versus the $10 million hit if he is simply released. Unless there's a way around that huge cap hit in a trade.

Make no mistake....Archie could very well be flashing the warning signs that Peyton might be done in Indianapolis, and under the trade/cap hit scenario could probably hand-pick his destination if we release him.

The team isn't in the best bargaining position.....that's for sure.

If I have any of this cap stuff wrong someone correct me...but I'm pretty sure thats what I read in a article that Smitto linked yesterday.

I said in another thread, but after listening to Archie's original comments and his follow up comments on Mike and Mike, I don't think Archie is trying to indicate anything about Peyton. If anything, he might be trying to indicate that Luck won't be a Colt because the Luck family might be planning to, or at least considering, trying to request/force an Eli/Rivers type trade...but even that is very debatable and purely speculative. However, his original comments did come the day after he spent time talking to Oliver Luck the day before but take that with a grain of salt.

And you're right about the cap hit...if we keep Manning then we pay him $17 mil, if we release him we still pay him $10 mil but if we trade him we pay him $38 mil.

[pacolts56]

I said in another thread, but after listening to Archie's original comments and his follow up comments on Mike and Mike, I don't think Archie is trying to indicate anything about Peyton. If anything, he might be trying to indicate that Luck won't be a Colt because the Luck family might be planning to, or at least considering, trying to request/force an Eli/Rivers type trade...but even that is very debatable and purely speculative. However, his original comments did come the day after he spent time talking to Oliver Luck the day before but take that with a grain of salt.

And you're right about the cap hit...if we keep Manning then we pay him $17 mil, if we release him we still pay him $10 mil but if we trade him we pay him $38 mil.

So he's doing the Luck family's bidding now, with no regard at all for his son's immediate proximity to the situation?

Sorry Jason....if he has Luck's agenda in mind he has Peyton's as well.

As a fan of the Colts organization.....I don't like any of it.

And where is Tom Condon in all of this? Oh yeah....keeping quiet.

[Jason_]

So he's doing the Luck family's bidding now, with no regard at all for his son's immediate proximity to the situation?

Sorry Jason....if he has Luck's agenda in mind he has Peyton's as well.

As a fan of the Colts organization.....I don't like any of it.

And where is Tom Condon in all of this? Oh yeah....keeping quiet.

I tried to be as clear as I could.. I don't think Archie is doing anyone's bidding. I don't think he was intentionally speaking for anyone...be it Peyton, Oliver or Andrew. If anything, he could have said what he did after talking to Oliver and getting the impression that Oliver and Andrew don't want Luck to come to Indy and sit for 4 years but even that is pure speculation on my part. However if I'm right and he's merely stating an opinion based on a conversation he had with Oliver then I don't see how that's having Peyton's agenda in mind. Should he have just kept quiet and not said anything? Yeah I'd say he should have. However based on his comments and the tone of the comments, I don't think he had anyone's agenda in mind and I don't think he was trying to manipulate anything for anyone. Like I said though, I could be way off.

[ViriLudant]

Why would you want the guy we draft to flop?

That just doesn't make any sense.

Because some Colt fans are more Manning fans than Colt fans. Sad, really.

[Susie Q]

Well today the Indy Star has an article saying that Archie is now say that Peyton and Luck can coexist on the Colts. Sounds like back peddling to me but check it out if you like. Sorry didn't know how to post the link. :unsure:

[Jason_]

Well today the Indy Star has an article saying that Archie is now say that Peyton and Luck can coexist on the Colts. Sounds like back peddling to me but check it out if you like. Sorry didn't know how to post the link. :unsure:

Archie never said he didn't think Manning and Luck couldn't co-exist. He said that they probably wouldn't want to be teammates because they'd both likely want to be on the field but only one of them would be able to.

[Susie Q]

Archie never said he didn't think Manning and Luck couldn't co-exist. He said that they probably wouldn't want to be teammates because they'd both likely want to be on the field but only one of them would be able to.

I fully realize that but I was just posting that there was another article if anyone was interested.

[Jason_]

I fully realize that but I was just posting that there was another article if anyone was interested.

Based on the wording of your previous post, I wasn't sure if you fully realized it or not. So that is why I said what I did. Was just clarifying that he never said they couldn't co-exist but rather that they probably wouldn't want to be teammates....so based on that I don't think there was really anything to backpedal from.

[Coltssouth]

Here ya' go SusieQ:

http://www.indystar.com/article/20111207/SPORTS03/111207030/Time-out-Archie-Manning-now-says-Peyton-Luck-can-coexist?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|IndyStar.com

Simply go to the article, right click on the topic title at the top of your browser, click copy, come back here, right click again and choose paste.

[Malakai432]

I just heard on the Fox 59 news that Archie is back tracking on his comments and said he thinks now that Peyton and Luck CAN co-exist... Now I'm really confused. He clarified his comments from yesterday but still says they're both are too good to sit on the bench. I know I know it's contradicting but the reporter mentioned that he pulled a 180 on several radio shows today. Uhhh, my brain is about to explode.

Here is an article confirming it:

http://www.santacruzsentinel.com/nationalbreaking/ci_19490559

[CjMcGirt23]

So everyone who's opinion was swayed by what Archie said is back to square 1. I don't see where anyone gained anything out of what he said, imo he just stated the obvious. "I don’t think it'd necessarily be great for either one,"- of course since Andrew is considered the most pro ready qb in decades and being drafted by the colts would hinder his ability to start for a while. It would also generate pressure on peyton (speculation) colt's fans would want to see Andrew Luck play if Peyton had even a slightly bad game. "Peyton's also tried to help Andrew and kind of be a friend. I doubt if either one want to play on the same team." What two quarterbacks of that caliber would want to be on the same team? Especially a hall of famer, and maybe G.O.A.T, and (once again) the most pro ready quarterback to come out of the draft in decades. I can't even gain anything on articles about the Colt's anymore, it's just a waste of time. Everything is just obvious truth being stated or biased and mostly wrong opinion and speculation.

[DarkHorseColts]

Maybe he's pulling a 360 and you're just dizzy

[Coltssouth]

Merging posts as this is already being discussed in another thread.

[Malakai432]

Merging posts as this is already being discussed in another thread.

Thanks

[FireJimCaldwell]

I just heard on the Fox 59 news that Archie is back tracking on his comments and said he thinks now that Peyton and Luck CAN co-exist... Now I'm really confused. He clarified his comments from yesterday but still says they're both are too good to sit on the bench. I know I know it's contradicting but the reporter mentioned that he pulled a 180 on several radio shows today. Uhhh, my brain is about to explode.

Here is an article confirming it:

http://www.santacruz...ing/ci_19490559

I don't know about any other show, but on Mike & Mike this AM he said that if Peyton is healthy and he wasn't sure that he would be,he's not yet. If Peyton were healthy he would want to play, and Luck is good enough that he should play and he referenced Newton & Dalton as an examples and IMO implied that Luck was better than those two and that he he should play.

There wasn't any back tracking, and from what I gather that is about what he said yesterday, of course some members of the media will attempt to twist and fluff it up into something its not.

[Malakai432]

I don't know about any other show, but on Mike & Mike this AM he said that if Peyton is healthy and he wasn't sure that he would be,he's not yet. If Peyton were healthy he would want to play, and Luck is good enough that he should play and he referenced Newton & Dalton as an examples and IMO implied that Luck was better than those two and that he he should play.

There wasn't any back tracking, and from what I gather that is about what he said yesterday, of course some members of the media will attempt to twist and fluff it up into something its not.

According to the article and the news on a phone interview he stated that "I'm sure they could," when asked if they could co-exist. He did go onto mention that he thinks Andrew Luck is to good to sit. It does seem to me he thinks they could co-exist but it might not necessarily be a good thing.

[Susie Q]

Here ya' go SusieQ:

http://www.indystar....xt|IndyStar.com

Simply go to the article, right click on the topic title at the top of your browser, click copy, come back here, right click again and choose paste.

Thanks but I think I'm done posting for a while. It's getting to deep for me and I think I will chill. :rolleyes:

[Malakai432]

Thanks but I think I'm done posting for a while. It's getting to deep for me and I think I will chill. :rolleyes:

Hah, yeah it's wearing me out as well. Who knows maybe the Colts will win the next 4 games and we can just forget about this stuff HAH!!!!!!!!

[jedi.creech]

Because some Colt fans are more Manning fans than Colt fans. Sad, really.

Actually it's being almost completely opposite of "more Manning fan"... If it was more Manning fan I think I would welcome a trade to get Manning off a very possible 0-16 team. A team where the GM doesn't demand his * (we play defense this way because their WR will get tired and make mistakes) attitude...

My point is if Manning is healthy ready to go what sense does it make to push in my opinion the best QB in the league out of town for a kid who's a complete gamble never played at NFL level... Because he's suppose to be something great maybe?... Sorry we have something great already just rest of team sucks, and a trade of first pick gives more picks to fix rest of team for future... To me that sounds like a team fan... Maybe you should check to make sure you're not just a Luck fan???

[Toe Toed Sloth]

Addressing the topic at hand: The decision isn't Luck's or Peyton's...it's Irsay's. Sorry folks. It's all too soon to tell though. A lot depends on Peyton's condition and we'll get a better idea as to what will happen when it's time to reward/not reward him his bonus. I don't think Luck would be too upset to sit behind Manning for 1 or 2 years. He really should look at it as an Aaron Rodgers-like opportunity to sit behind one of the greatest minds to ever play the game and be able to come in guns blazing in a year or two.

As for what will happen: I'm almost certain that the Colts will take Luck and I agree with the decision 100% even though I love Manning to death. I wanted to doubt Luck, to nitpick his game, to say that he is the next Ryan Leaf...but after watching him play and digging through scouting reports, I don't think you can come away and say anything except that this kid may very well be one of the best prospective NFL quarter backs...ever. He looks like Peyton Manning in his reads, his decision making, and even his form. The only exception is that Luck is incredibly athletic for a QB. As much as I hate to say it; Manning is damaged goods at this point. 3 Neck surgeries is nothing to take lightly. We all hope he can come back and make a solid run at it, but realistically, we're in rebuilding mode. Get the new GOAT. Groom him. Draft some CBs! And plan on retaking the division in 2 or so years with Luck at the helm. All good things come to an end. :mellow:

[pacolts56]

I tried to be as clear as I could.. I don't think Archie is doing anyone's bidding. I don't think he was intentionally speaking for anyone...be it Peyton, Oliver or Andrew. If anything, he could have said what he did after talking to Oliver and getting the impression that Oliver and Andrew don't want Luck to come to Indy and sit for 4 years but even that is pure speculation on my part. However if I'm right and he's merely stating an opinion based on a conversation he had with Oliver then I don't see how that's having Peyton's agenda in mind. Should he have just kept quiet and not said anything? Yeah I'd say he should have. However based on his comments and the tone of the comments, I don't think he had anyone's agenda in mind and I don't think he was trying to manipulate anything for anyone. Like I said though, I could be way off.

Well....now it sounds like he's walking back those comments anyway, which may not have amounted to much without Archie's history as a conniver.

By all accounts, Jim Irsay....on salary matters and everything else I'm aware of....has been nothing but fair with Archie's son.

Irsay and the front office didn't need this and you're right, he should have kept quiet.

[Coltssouth]

Didn't see this posted:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7327351/archie-manning-new-take-peyton-manning-andrew-luck-co-exist-indianapolis-colts

Dwight Freeney, however, was upset about something else -- NFL Magazine, a league publication, choosing Manning as the 2011 MVP.

[FireJimCaldwell]

Freeney needs to get over it... What is insulting is that we are 0-12....

[NM_Colts]

I would imagine every QB who is in the league now, whether they are starters, backups or on the PS, thinks they should play and not sit. Ditto for everyone applying for the draft. And I'm sure their fathers and other family members agree.

While I wish Archie had kept his mouth shut, I don't feel his comments were about anything beyond what he said. And I certainly don't believe that Peyton was having his dad set the stage for him to leave Indy. Awhile back when Peyton made comments about the o-line (2005 I believe) and was accused by the media of having thrown his teammates under the bus, Archie spoke up and IIRC, Peyton wasn't very happy about his dad's comments at the time (and ditto this time as well). No one speaks for Peyton but Peyton, nor does he play manipulative games.

[Bond Shane]

I am a colts fan mainly a Peyton Manning fan. This season clearly explains why he has one ring.

Bad coaching, bad special teams and bad defense. Too much on one shoulder against good teams.

Keeping in mind the best scenario for both colts and Peyton, below is my thought ( probably wont happen ).

Peyton goes to Jets, re-unites with Tom Moore. 2 Superbowl winning WRs. One of the best defenses. Great chance for few rings before he retires.

Colts get Luck. Get several first rounders in draft. Re-build the team in few yrs, back to winning ways.

Win win for both

[Andy]

Don't be surprised if Luck pulls an Eli or John Elway.

He's supposedly the most NFL-ready QB in 15 years. If guys like Dalton and Newton are playing at a high level already, why wouldn't Luck want the same opportunity?

Sorry, sitting behind any starter, be it Peyton, Brady, or anyone else, is never the preferred choice of a competitive athlete.

It's not the preffered choice, but as AARON RODGERS said he gain INVALUABLE time sitting behind Favre...