What Would U List As The 10 Worse Colts Contracts

[dn4192]

What players has Bill Polian signed to deals that you feel were horrible contracts when signed?

[justnhlsmok]

Tony Ugoh pops in my mind.

[jskinnz]

Tony Ugoh pops in my mind.

I am guessing that is not the intent of the question. My guess is that it has to do with contracts that he gave either to existing Colts free agents or the ones he gave to free agents from other teams.

[SilentHill]

What players has Bill Polian signed to deals that you feel were horrible contracts when signed?

Kerry CollinsatQuarterback 1 yr/$4,000,000

Curtis PainteratQuarterback 4 yr/$1,841,000

Anthony GonzalezatWide Receiver 5 yr/$7,500,000

Peyton ManningatQuarterback 5 yr/$90,000,000

ONES i DONT HAVE NUMBERS FOR:

Bob Sanders

I'll think of some more....

[mark_dk]

kelvin hayden...

[justnhlsmok]

I am guessing that is not the intent of the question. My guess is that it has to do with contracts that he gave either to existing Colts free agents or the ones he gave to free agents from other teams.

Ah, I got ya.

I would say Collins is a clear-cut choice. I would like to also throw Corey Simon in the mix.

[oldunclemark]

How much does jerry Hughes make

[justnhlsmok]

Ah, I got ya.

I would say Collins is a clear-cut choice. I would like to also throw Corey Simon in the mix.

About Simon's contract (per ESPN):

The Colts, who signed Simon to a five-year, $30 million contract, ended up paying him more than $14 million in bonuses and salaries. The club attempted to recover an $8 million option bonus paid to Simon in March of 2006 but were unable to recoup the money because of a ruling in a case involving former Denver Broncos first-round wide receiver Ashley Lelie.

Clearly, the Colts got very little return for a pricey investment.

[Jaric]

Ah, I got ya.

I would say Collins is a clear-cut choice. I would like to also throw Corey Simon in the mix.

If Corey Simon isn't number one, that will completely invalidate this list.

[WSO]

If Corey Simon isn't number one, that will completely invalidate this list.

agreed Colts pretty much gave him free money

[supremecoltsfan300]

Collins was pretty bad. peyton was fine because he will return and all the top qbs get paid a lot. tb gets paid the same. brees will get about the same next year and a-rod in a few years.

[tonychen]

How about the latest contract to Addai? I doubt his $$/play rate could be among the top of NFL.

[Superman]

What's wrong with $4 million to Kerry Collins?

[fvantagio]

Bob Sanders but you cant blame him really, he was DPOY when he got his new contract just couldnt stay on the field.

Corey Simon

Kerry Collins

Kelvin Hayden

Marvin Harrison's last contract

Those are probably the top 5 worst contracts. Really not all that bad though especially when you look around the league. The redskins have a worse top 5 then that each year.

[jgstriker]

It is hard to determine a contract bad due to injury. Collins may have been overpaid regardless of his injury. But Harrison's contract, IMO was not too bad. He was still playing at an elite level and his knee just gave out. The fact that we continued to pay him and not cut him for an extra season was just bad roster management.

Corey Simon comes to mind.

Kelvin Hayden

Clark, perhaps?

[Smitto]

Gary Brackett

Bob Sanders

Joseph Addai

Melvin Bullit

Kerry Collins

Tyjuan Hagler

Cato June

Kelvin Hayden

Freddie Kieaho

Hank Basket...

Some of those guys had good seasons but the colts could have shopped for MUCH better players.

[The Fish]

What's wrong with $4 million to Kerry Collins?

He's old, and no one thought he was going to do squat. That's besides the point that he played like a turd for 2 games before he got K.O'd and our hero Curtis Painter showed up.

[SilentHill]

What's wrong with $4 million to Kerry Collins?

Your kidding right?

[jskinnz]

Your kidding right?

I have no idea what Superman meant so if this take is off base, my aplogies. But I think the point is the $4 million they spent on Collins did not prevent the team from doing anything else with personnel. In other words, they were so late in the preseason and Manning was not getting healthy, the coin they spent on Father Time did not prevent them from going after someone else who could have made a difference.

Gary Brackett

Bob Sanders

Joseph Addai

Melvin Bullit

Kerry Collins

Tyjuan Hagler

Cato June

Kelvin Hayden

Freddie Kieaho

Hank Basket...

Some of those guys had good seasons but the colts could have shopped for MUCH better players.

I think you don't understand the point of the question. There are people on your list that simply don't belong - like any mid-round pick who never got past their first contract with the team. Those guys never had bad contracts.

[BOTT]

addai, hayden, brackett, bullit, tyrone poole and chad cota

[Smitto]

I have no idea what Superman meant so if this take is off base, my aplogies. But I think the point is the $4 million they spent on Collins did not prevent the team from doing anything else with personnel. In other words, they were so late in the preseason and Manning was not getting healthy, the coin they spent on Father Time did not prevent them from going after someone else who could have made a difference.

I think you don't understand the point of the question. There are people on your list that simply don't belong - like any mid-round pick who never got past their first contract with the team. Those guys never had bad contracts.

lol jskinz you do realize for you to play for a team you have to have signed a contract or resigned.. and most of the players i mentioned were resigned or signed by the colts... im answering the OP... he didnt say first round pick he just mentioned what deals BP signed players to

[Superman]

Your kidding right?

What was the alternative? Just roll with Painter? We needed to pay a backup quarterback, and it was Collins. $4 million is about the going rate for a veteran backup. Sucks that he got hurt, but that doesn't make it a bad signing. What makes it a bad signing is that he wasn't good for our offense, but still, that $4 million was going to somebody to play quarterback.

I'm saying that, in the grand scheme of things, that contract isn't that big of a deal. To list it among the worst Colts contracts in recent history is sensationalizing, I think.

[Robin]

Lacey no mather how much he gets..

[CR91]

brackett's contract was stupid

[IndyTrav]

Dallas Clark being the highest paid TE in the league, laughs at this thread.

[Superman]

brackett's contract was stupid

Brackett's contract was perfect, assuming they release him this season. His cap hit the first two years was minimal, his guaranteed money is minimal. You can either cut him, or renegotiate. No big deal.

[Jay305]

Sanders(hurts to say this)

Hayden

Simon

Lilja(over Scott)

off the top of my head ill probably think of others later on

[jskinnz]

lol jskinz you do realize for you to play for a team you have to have signed a contract or resigned.. and most of the players i mentioned were resigned or signed by the colts... im answering the OP... he didnt say first round pick he just mentioned what deals BP signed players to

Here is your list...

Gary Brackett - can make a case for a bad signing, although not a very good one

Bob Sanders - can certainly make the case

Joseph Addai - guess you can make the case here for a bad signing

Melvin Bullit - don't know how you would make a case for his 2nd contract being bad without the benefit of hindsight

Kerry Collins - what was the alternative?

Tyjuan Hagler - mid round played through his rookie contract and then was brought back for a partial season when injuries dictated it. Was most certainly not a bad contract

Cato June - left after his rookie contract and a mid round pick. I would say the starting LB on a Super Bowl winning team, he was not under a bad contract.

Kelvin Hayden - won't debate you here

Freddie Kieaho - only played through his rookie contract. Was a 3rd round pick and certainly played under a team friendly contract

Hank Basket - was picked up after Gonzo got hurt. What was the alternative. And when he was here, he certainly was on a team friendly deal.

My point is you can make a case for the Brackett, Sanders, Hayden deals. But June, Kieaho, etc were nothing close to bad contracts and certainly not on anyone's top ten list of bad contracts other than yours. Which is why you don't understand the question.

[GoColts8818]

Tony Ugoh pops in my mind.

That wasn't a bad contract that was a bad draft pick.

Bob Sanders or Corey SImon probably go at number one on the list for bad contracts.

[Superman]

That wasn't a bad contract that was a bad draft pick.

Bob Sanders or Corey SImon probably go at number one on the list for bad contracts.

I don't see how Bob Sanders was a bad contract. He was one of the best safeties in the league. Maybe we could have anticipated that he wouldn't stay healthy, but he was coming off a full season that earned him DPOY. So, do we let him walk?

This is what I don't like about this entire topic. We can suggest that the front office made a mistake because we can look back on the last several years and see what moves panned out and what moves didn't, but I'm pretty sure people would have been up in arms had we let Bob Sanders walk (or Kelvin Hayden, or Dallas Clark, etc.) People around here still complain about us letting Mike Peterson and David Thornton walk.

My idea of a bad signing is having a choice between Jake Scott and Ryan Lilja, and not making it an absolute priority to retain Jake Scott. I think we should have done whatever it took to keep him, especially considering the fact that Tarik Glenn had just retired. Instead, we resign Ryan Lilja for $30 million, and he's not on the team three years later.

[GoColts8818]

I don't see how Bob Sanders was a bad contract. He was one of the best safeties in the league. Maybe we could have anticipated that he wouldn't stay healthy, but he was coming off a full season that earned him DPOY. So, do we let him walk?

This is what I don't like about this entire topic. We can suggest that the front office made a mistake because we can look back on the last several years and see what moves panned out and what moves didn't, but I'm pretty sure people would have been up in arms had we let Bob Sanders walk (or Kelvin Hayden, or Dallas Clark, etc.) People around here still complain about us letting Mike Peterson and David Thornton walk.

My idea of a bad signing is having a choice between Jake Scott and Ryan Lilja, and not making it an absolute priority to retain Jake Scott. I think we should have done whatever it took to keep him, especially considering the fact that Tarik Glenn had just retired. Instead, we resign Ryan Lilja for $30 million, and he's not on the team three years later.

He played in 8 games out of a possiable 53 under that contract. If that's not a bad contract I don't know what is. I don't care what he did to get that contract I am saying what he did under that contract made it bad. Also for the record I was one of the few at the time who said the Colts should have let Sanders walk rather than give him that deal because of his injury history and that Clark was a more important guy to keep. I think it's safe to say going back and looking at it that point has been proven correct.

[21isSuperman]

Bob got way too much, as did Kerry Collins. Same goes for Kelvin Hayden

[everybodysgotone]

Issues with the Colts over the years include the have/have nots salary disparity, coupled with holding roster spots open too long for non-contributors and a couple of contract timing situations. Within the framework of OP here are ten for consideration even though some may not be considered by all to be "bad" contracts by their definition, plus a couple of notes at the end for perspective on the big picture -

Corey Simon (obvious FA bust as one of the highest paid D linemen at the time at 30M)

Kelvin Hayden (at 5 for 43M was never worth elite money even though he turned out to be injury inhibited, as well)

Bob Sanders (at 5 for 37.5 as the highest paid safety in league history, was not worth more than Polamalu at the time and we know the rest of his injury prone history which drove his per game and per year cost up astronomically)

Melvin Bullitt (shouldn't have been resigned for any amount coming off recurring injury....can't find his salary figures anywhere)

Gary Brackett (5 for 33M ending at 34yo is too much for what he produces...particularly if he plays the contract out)

Mike Hart (b/c he ate up a roster spot for yrs & any amount paid to him past the approximate mid-way point of his contract was wasted. At 4 for 3.5M he didn't cost a lot of money unless you consider good RBs in the league pile up his career numbers in two games.)

Anthony Gonzalez (b/c he ate up a roster spot for yrs & any amout paid to him past the approximate mid-way point of his contact was wasted. At 5 for 10M w/incentives he's not been worth it.)

Ryan Diem (7 for 36M was high as bang for the buck but he's been fairly steady for us. A positive is this year's salary was re-negotiated)

Dallas Clark (6 for 36M through 35yo was a lot to shell out for one of the highest paid TEs and he now has multiple injuries while Tamme gets good nos. w/Manning. Clark got his deal immediately after being franchised.)

Marvin Harrison (6 for 66M as the highest paid WR at the time was a costly cap hit but he was great for us)

""Dwight Freeney (6 for 72M was the richest D contract in history at the time and has taken a toll on the cap but he has been great for us)

"""Robert Mathis (5 for 30M has been great for us and a necessity to offset Freeney under the current attack plan)

"""Lilja over Scott at 5 for 19M then being injured while Scott played 16 games for TEN.

[Andy]

Kelvin Hayden's definitely my number one. I would put Gary Brackett up there too, and then I'll maybe put Ryan Diem and maybe Rob Morris'.

[Superman]

He played in 8 games out of a possiable 53 under that contract. If that's not a bad contract I don't know what is. I don't care what he did to get that contract I am saying what he did under that contract made it bad. Also for the record I was one of the few at the time who said the Colts should have let Sanders walk rather than give him that deal because of his injury history and that Clark was a more important guy to keep. I think it's safe to say going back and looking at it that point has been proven correct.

You have the benefit of hindsight. If there was a minority saying we should let him walk, they were proven right, but we're talking about some serious prognostication.

I think Bob Sanders was a really good player who had proven his worth to our team. He was a significant factor in us being able to play better defense in the playoffs and win the Super Bowl. He followed that injury-plagued season with a 15 game season in which he won DPOY. Like I said, it certainly sucks that he wasn't able to stay on the field after that. I wish like heck that he had. But I don't think there were many fans saying we should let Bob Sanders walk.

Also, his contract was structured so that he never had a significant cap hit. He didn't live up to the contract, but it wasn't that big of a contract.

[GoColts8818]

You have the benefit of hindsight. If there was a minority saying we should let him walk, they were proven right, but we're talking about some serious prognostication.

I think Bob Sanders was a really good player who had proven his worth to our team. He was a significant factor in us being able to play better defense in the playoffs and win the Super Bowl. He followed that injury-plagued season with a 15 game season in which he won DPOY. Like I said, it certainly sucks that he wasn't able to stay on the field after that. I wish like heck that he had. But I don't think there were many fans saying we should let Bob Sanders walk.

Also, his contract was structured so that he never had a significant cap hit. He didn't live up to the contract, but it wasn't that big of a contract.

Again, you judge a contract on if it was bad or not based on what he did with it. He did next to nothing once he got, it was a bad contract. Also I might have the benefit of hindsight but I was also saying at the time Sanders should not have been signed because of his injury history. I am fully aware I was in the minority.

Tony Ugoh was the last tackle left with a first round grade the year we drafted him was he a good pick because we got a first round round graded player in the second round? That's the kinda logic you are trying to use with Sanders. He played well before he got the contract so it was a good contract even though he did next to nothing once he got it.

[everybodysgotone]

You have the benefit of hindsight. If there was a minority saying we should let him walk, they were proven right, but we're talking about some serious prognostication.

I think Bob Sanders was a really good player who had proven his worth to our team. He was a significant factor in us being able to play better defense in the playoffs and win the Super Bowl. He followed that injury-plagued season with a 15 game season in which he won DPOY. Like I said, it certainly sucks that he wasn't able to stay on the field after that. I wish like heck that he had. But I don't think there were many fans saying we should let Bob Sanders walk.

Also, his contract was structured so that he never had a significant cap hit. He didn't live up to the contract, but it wasn't that big of a contract.

After the 2007 season the Colts gave Sanders his 37.5M extension through 2012 with 20M guaranteed. He played a total of 9 games between 2008 - 2010 at a cost of 20M. That's bananas. Extrapolating that out over a hypothetical 16 games season we're talking about a 40M/yr. player, dang near. This.....after playing 6 games in '04; 14 in '05; 4 in '06; and 15 in '07 - - very up & down. Hindsight or no, his contract was typical of Colt willingness to overpay for players to the tune of tops in the league and/or league history.

[Superman]

Again, you judge a contract on if it was bad or not based on what he did with it. He did next to nothing once he got, it was a bad contract. Also I might have the benefit of hindsight but I was also saying at the time Sanders should not have been signed because of his injury history. I am fully aware I was in the minority.

Tony Ugoh was the last tackle left with a first round grade the year we drafted him was he a good pick because we got a first round round graded player in the second round? That's the kinda logic you are trying to use with Sanders. He played well before he got the contract so it was a good contract even though he did next to nothing once he got it.

Nice try, but that dog don't hunt. There's absolutely no parallel with what I'm saying about Bob Sanders and what you're saying about Tony Ugoh.

Sanders proved himself to be an important player to us. He proved (we thought) that he could last a whole season. When you have a player coming off his rookie contract, you project what you think he can do in his next contract, but his market value is mostly based off what he's done prior to that. And immediately prior to that, in the four most important games in recent Colts history, Bob Sanders was one of the most important players on the field for us. He followed that up with an MVP performance for a defensive unit that was much improved over the course of the season. Most would say he earned the right to demand top level money for his talent. And again, we've got a full season of a healthy Bob Sanders under our belts now. You're telling me that there wouldn't have been a riotous uproar, not just among Colts fans, but around the league, had we not resigned him?

If you called it, you called it. You're better at this than I am, and you're evidently better than most people associated with professional sports. But I think the consensus at the time was that we resign Bob Sanders no matter the cost, because he was that good and meant that much to us. And that's why I have a hard time calling it a bad signing. It didn't work out well for us, but that's just the way the cookie crumbles sometimes. But I can't call that a bad signing.

[Superman]

After the 2007 season the Colts gave Sanders his 37.5M extension through 2012 with 20M guaranteed. He played a total of 9 games between 2008 - 2010 at a cost of 20M. That's bananas. Extrapolating that out over a hypothetical 16 games season we're talking about a 40M/yr. player, dang near. This.....after playing 6 games in '04; 14 in '05; 4 in '06; and 15 in '07 - - very up & down. Hindsight or no, his contract was typical of Colt willingness to overpay for players to the tune of tops in the league and/or league history.

Tell me, what would your response have been if we had let Bob Sanders walk after 2007?

This is the hindsight I'm talking about. We paid him because he earned a new contract. But I don't think it's fair or reasonable to look back on the way that contract worked out and call that contract a mistake. It was the obvious option at the time. He's one of your best players, and he's critically important to your defense, so you resign him.

[everybodysgotone]

Tell me, what would your response have been if we had let Bob Sanders walk after 2007?

This is the hindsight I'm talking about. We paid him because he earned a new contract. But I don't think it's fair or reasonable to look back on the way that contract worked out and call that contract a mistake. It was the obvious option at the time. He's one of your best players, and he's critically important to your defense, so you resign him.

I hear ya, Superman. Truly. But my whole thing for the purpose of this thread is to look at the big picture, and that is an area where hindsight does come to bear because we're looking at a body of work going back a good number of years right on up through the present with regard to the front office decision tree. There are team tendancies detrimental to long range sustain, and that's what the spirit of this thread is about. Bob's contract was just a part of things, of course, but at some great cost both monetarily and in terms of roster space. 9 of a possible 48 games played over his last three years is a lot of wasted time on one player....so you get the double-whammy vacant roster spot thus driving the true cost up to _____ (fill in the blank Lord knows what). What it boiled down to was too much money spent on Bob Sanders and he was kept around taking up a roster spot until his 20M guarantee was met, hoping he could play and hoping money wasn't thrown away.

Following the 2007 season, yes I say resign Bob. But for the richest contract in league history at his position? No. I didn't agree with that then and never did. In my opinion, Polamolu was a better player then and I believe there's a part of Irsay that just doesn't like to be outdone when it comes to showing how much he cares for his guys and level of commitment he's willing to go to. It's to a fault.