Could The Decision Have Been Made?

[dn4192]

I am not saying it has, but what if Colt's management has made the decision to play for the number 1 pick? Not saying they will throw games, but they are not going out of their way to win either. I mean there is a number of questions surrounding the play calling, the schemes we are using and who is and isn't playing. What if the brass (both Polians and Irsay) have met, looked at the team overall, know what coaching changes they are going to make and voiced to Caldwell that they are "happy" with what is happening knowing that it will lead to that No. 1 pick?

[WSO]

Even if the management somehow decided this (which I HIGHLY doubt)

that is not going to stop the players from playing their butts off even if its in a bad scheme or with bad play calling. These are jobs for the players and they know that. They can't just quit at the benefit of an unproven college quarterback. For all they know, they could be cut after this season and never play in the NFL again. For other FAs even if the Colts are 0-10 they are playing to showcase what they can bring to other teams if the Colts can't re-sign them.

This is silly.

[dn4192]

Even if the management somehow decided this (which I HIGHLY doubt)

that is not going to stop the players from playing their butts off even if its in a bad scheme or with bad play calling. These are jobs for the players and they know that. They can't just quit at the benefit of an unproven college quarterback. For all they know, they could be cut after this season and never play in the NFL again. For other FAs even if the Colts are 0-10 they are playing to showcase what they can bring to other teams if the Colts can't re-sign them.

This is silly.

Not saying the players have quit. But if the players are not put in the right position, or the wrong players are played because it is the decision of those in charge to secure the number 1 pick, why is that hard to be possible? I mean why is Painter still at QB? Why isn't our rookie RB getting more chances, why has there been no change of offensive game calling without Peyton in there, why has the D continue to use a system that doesn't work?

[sfergson727]

Not saying the players have quit. But if the players are not put in the right position, or the wrong players are played because it is the decision of those in charge to secure the number 1 pick, why is that hard to be possible? I mean why is Painter still at QB? Why isn't our rookie RB getting more chances, why has there been no change of offensive game calling without Peyton in there, why has the D continue to use a system that doesn't work?

Because our coaching staff is inept, and our front office is dillusional.

[ponys]

I think some people need to take more Prozac. You probably believe our government is destroying the economy and that taxing working people more is a bad thing. I need a double perscription.

I think it's so appearent that the brass has decided to lose as many games as possible for a high pick.

[jskinnz]

Not saying the players have quit. But if the players are not put in the right position, or the wrong players are played because it is the decision of those in charge to secure the number 1 pick, why is that hard to be possible? I mean why is Painter still at QB? Why isn't our rookie RB getting more chances, why has there been no change of offensive game calling without Peyton in there, why has the D continue to use a system that doesn't work?

This conspiracy theory is simply not accurate - especially with the examples you cite. What wrong players are being played? What players are not put in the right position? Painter is playing because he is the best option. Do you really think they are keeping Orlovsky on the bench because he is the best QB? Carter was due to get all kinds of carries but he has put the ball on the turf. Don't any farther than that. They have changed offensive philosophies to a degree. That is why you saw more huddles and more runs on 1st and 2nd downs yesterday. The cover 2 / tampa 2 is just about the easiest D to play. It hides mediocre talent. What would you have them do - become the Jets and blitz whenever possible?

I think if these things you suggest are to be believed the conspiracy was on week 1 and I find that to be a big bunch of nonsense.

[Buck Showalter]

Not saying the players have quit. But if the players are not put in the right position, or the wrong players are played because it is the decision of those in charge to secure the number 1 pick, why is that hard to be possible? I mean why is Painter still at QB? Why isn't our rookie RB getting more chances, why has there been no change of offensive game calling without Peyton in there, why has the D continue to use a system that doesn't work?

????

bad decision making by those in charge, oh yeah, thats the coaches & front office ...

the people you continuously defend...

it is these bad decisions you are finally seeing result in a winless season, a winless season by a team (made up of several key players) that only two seasons ago could've gone 16-0

so either it is purposeful i.e. throwing games for draft etc.

or HORRIBLE decision making & coaching....

both things you often defend

[dn4192]

This conspiracy theory is simply not accurate - especially with the examples you cite. What wrong players are being played? What players are not put in the right position? Painter is playing because he is the best option. Do you really think they are keeping Orlovsky on the bench because he is the best QB? Carter was due to get all kinds of carries but he has put the ball on the turf. Don't any farther than that. They have changed offensive philosophies to a degree. That is why you saw more huddles and more runs on 1st and 2nd downs yesterday. The cover 2 / tampa 2 is just about the easiest D to play. It hides mediocre talent. What would you have them do - become the Jets and blitz whenever possible?

I think if these things you suggest are to be believed the conspiracy was on week 1 and I find that to be a big bunch of nonsense.

How do we know Dan O. can't do better, I mean it's hard to think he would do worse? What about the play calling, and where was the rookie RB on Sunday? Why are we not trying some new or different things on offense or defense?

[dn4192]

????

bad decision making by those in charge, oh yeah, thats the coaches & front office ...

the people you continuously defend...

it is these bad decisions you are finally seeing result in a winless season, a winless season by a team (made up of several key players) that only two seasons ago could've gone 16-0

so either it is purposeful i.e. throwing games for draft etc.

or HORRIBLE decision making & coaching....

both things you often defend

I watched the game and sunday and will wait to see what happens in two weeks, but I am not sure why it is hard to think that upper mag't (Chris/Bill/Jim) have come to the conclusion that the number 1 pick is the best route for that and with that plan they allow a coaching staff they know now they will replace just continue and not make them make some changes.

[Buck Showalter]

it is not hard to believe...

it is either what is happening,

or

the coaches are just that bad...

either way bad decision making.....

[presto123]

No way we just suck because of an inept FO.

it is not hard to believe...

it is either what is happening,

or

the coaches are just that bad...

either way bad decision making.....

Coaching?.....c'mon yes the coaching is bad(I want Caldwell gone) but you can only do so much with lack of talent. Far too many people are letting the FO slide for this state the Colts are in.

[jskinnz]

How do we know Dan O. can't do better, I mean it's hard to think he would do worse? What about the play calling, and where was the rookie RB on Sunday? Why are we not trying some new or different things on offense or defense?

You simply like to argue and apparently don't like to read.

[dn4192]

No way we just suck because of an inept FO.

Coaching?.....c'mon yes the coaching is bad(I want Caldwell gone) but you can only do so much with lack of talent. Far too many people are letting the FO slide for this state the Colts are in.

The only real lack of talent on this team is at QB. If we had even a decent QB this team has 3-4 wins this season, so yes they are at fault thinking Painter was an NFL QB, but to say the Colts team as a whole lacks talent isn't correct.

[jskinnz]

The only real lack of talent on this team is at QB. If we had even a decent QB this team has 3-4 wins this season, so yes they are at fault thinking Painter was an NFL QB, but to say the Colts team as a whole lacks talent isn't correct.

There are holes all over this roster.

Positions or players who are not quality NFL starters or have played below their previous levels

QB - Painter and Orlovsky are not the answer

WR - Wayne is MIA and getting old. Collie has been MIA all year. Not all of their issues can be tied to the QB

TE - Clark has been awful all season

OL - there are serviceable to decent players in Costanzo, Reitz & Saturday. Link, Pollak, Tepper are all below average o'linement

DE - Freeney & Mathis have not been as good as in year's past. Anderson & Brayton are decent back ups and nothing more.

DT - Nevis is a keeper. Can you say the same about Moala, Johnson, & Matthews?

LB - Angerer has played fairly well but can you say that there is no upgrade needed for Conner or Wheeler?

CB - Powers has been OK at best and the others are just not good NFL corners

S - Aside from Bethea, who else is truly an NFL caliber player?

[Nadine]

There is no conspiracy.

We are so unbelievably bad that it is incomprehensible.

I do wish I could be a fly on the wall and have an inside look at how coaches and management are approaching this but we shall just have to wait.

[NM_Colts]

Not saying the players have quit. But if the players are not put in the right position, or the wrong players are played because it is the decision of those in charge to secure the number 1 pick, why is that hard to be possible? I mean why is Painter still at QB? Why isn't our rookie RB getting more chances, why has there been no change of offensive game calling without Peyton in there, why has the D continue to use a system that doesn't work?

Ding, ding ding! I have to agree with you. It's obvious to me that players, including Painter, are not being put in a position to win (horribly bad playcalling, ZERO protection). Painter started off pretty decent and now... it's like difference between night and day. Yes I know they have more game tape on him and etc. but my gut feeling says something isn't right with the huge decline in his play as well as that of several others. And then you have the GM's open support of a HC who is obviously failing to reach his players in any way. I fail to understand how ANY GM could support the coaching of the pathetically bad product we saw on the field yesterday unless the decision was made to do as DN suggested.

I fully believe most players haven't quit because they have pride in themselves and the coaches are just doing what they are used to doing and being told probably to keep on doing it.

No sane organization would support zero accountability for the nonsense coaching, nonsense playcalling, nonsense gameplanning / lack of in-game adjustments and tell the world that the HC is doing a good job unless something was going on..

[Buck Showalter]

No way we just suck because of an inept FO.

Coaching?.....c'mon yes the coaching is bad(I want Caldwell gone) but you can only do so much with lack of talent. Far too many people are letting the FO slide for this state the Colts are in.

Oh I agree, bad choices moving forward, from the top on down.... A front office that is loyal to a fault... Wanting to carry on the Dungy-esque style of coaching with Caldwell... Wanting to carry on the Polian name with Chris... Keeping the out-dated Tampa 2 scheme... Continuously drafting smaller framed players who 'fit' our failing defensive scheme... etc. etc. lots of bad decisions, that Peyton has masked for the most part...

from a perrenial play-off team on the verge of a 16-0 season to winless in two seasons is crazy...

[NM_Colts]

There is no conspiracy.

We are so unbelievably bad that it is incomprehensible.

I do wish I could be a fly on the wall and have an inside look at how coaches and management are approaching this but we shall just have to wait.

So incomprehensibly bad that the whole team pretty much collapses once Manning is gone? Peyton would have to be beyond a miracle worker to have taken this team to the playoffs year after year.

I agree; I'd love to be a fly on the walls of everyone involved in the Colts decision making.

[dn4192]

There are holes all over this roster.

Positions or players who are not quality NFL starters or have played below their previous levels

QB - Painter and Orlovsky are not the answer

WR - Wayne is MIA and getting old. Collie has been MIA all year. Not all of their issues can be tied to the QB

TE - Clark has been awful all season

OL - there are serviceable to decent players in Costanzo, Reitz & Saturday. Link, Pollak, Tepper are all below average o'linement

DE - Freeney & Mathis have not been as good as in year's past. Anderson & Brayton are decent back ups and nothing more.

DT - Nevis is a keeper. Can you say the same about Moala, Johnson, & Matthews?

LB - Angerer has played fairly well but can you say that there is no upgrade needed for Conner or Wheeler?

CB - Powers has been OK at best and the others are just not good NFL corners

S - Aside from Bethea, who else is truly an NFL caliber player?

The WR/TE are much better when you have a real QB

[jskinnz]

The WR/TE are much better when you have a real QB

Thanks. Really needed that pointed out but those guys have been less then expected regardless of who is playing QB. But even accepting the WR's and TE's are OK, that still leaves a huge talent void at multiple other positions.

[bryceman777]

I can't believe there's people on here asking if the team or front office or both is trying to lose games just to get the number one pick. Do you even want to support a team if they try to throw games or don't try to play the best they can. These are professionals and other teams will be watching film of them, and they all won't be on the Colts next year, so who would sign a player, coach, or GM who tries to lose. Again if they were trying to lose than why would you want to cheer for this team at all. I for one don't think anybody in the Front office or on the field is trying to lose games. Everyone seems to think the number one or a high draft pick is the Holy Grail of the NFL. Us and many other teams have done quite well without the number one draft pick for the past 10 years.

[Buck Showalter]

I can't believe there's people on here asking if the team or front office or both is trying to lose games just to get the number one pick. Do you even want to support a team if they try to throw games or don't try to play the best they can. These are professionals and other teams will be watching film of them, and they all won't be on the Colts next year, so who would sign a player, coach, or GM who tries to lose. Again if they were trying to lose than why would you want to cheer for this team at all. I for one don't think anybody in the Front office or on the field is trying to lose games. Everyone seems to think the number one or a high draft pick is the Holy Grail of the NFL. Us and many other teams have done quite well without the number one draft pick for the past 10 years.

I think the point is, at least what I am suggesting, is how could you not think FO & coaching are throwing games at times this season, the team just looks that bad, a team that for the most part (minus 18) was on the verge of 16-0 two seasons ago...

it feels like ZERO adjustments are being made throughout games, and several questionable in game decisions & roster moves i.e. Tryon...

It just seems like the FO & Coaches are purposefully tanking the season...

I am not saying they ARE, it is just the easiest conclusion to come to... if that makes sense...

[dn4192]

I can't believe there's people on here asking if the team or front office or both is trying to lose games just to get the number one pick. Do you even want to support a team if they try to throw games or don't try to play the best they can. These are professionals and other teams will be watching film of them, and they all won't be on the Colts next year, so who would sign a player, coach, or GM who tries to lose. Again if they were trying to lose than why would you want to cheer for this team at all. I for one don't think anybody in the Front office or on the field is trying to lose games. Everyone seems to think the number one or a high draft pick is the Holy Grail of the NFL. Us and many other teams have done quite well without the number one draft pick for the past 10 years.

to me there is a huge difference in "tanking" games and not doing everything possible to win.

[John Dee]

I am not saying it has, but what if Colt's management has made the decision to play for the number 1 pick? Not saying they will throw games, but they are not going out of their way to win either. I mean there is a number of questions surrounding the play calling, the schemes we are using and who is and isn't playing. What if the brass (both Polians and Irsay) have met, looked at the team overall, know what coaching changes they are going to make and voiced to Caldwell that they are "happy" with what is happening knowing that it will lead to that No. 1 pick?

You are saying they are "NOT TRYING TO WIN GAMES".... I really hope our team has more pride than this.

[John Dee]

to me there is a huge difference in "tanking" games and not doing everything possible to win.

Please explain....

[coltsfangudorbad]

i think the players have to much pride to throw games , but the play calling is aweful and when it comes to money, nuthin would surprise me about the coaching staff and management trying for a number 1 pick, but if there goal is is to replace peyton well good luck very huge shoes to fill. he was the glue that held the team together not to mention he is one of the best to ever play quarterback. if he isnt able to play anymore fire caldwell make peyton coach hes been calling the plays for years anyhow!

[dn4192]

Please explain....

Tanking a game is when you don't play up to your full potential and are playing to lose. The Colts are not, we are just playing the players who have limited talent. If the Colts were taking you would see less playing time for the likes of Freeney, Mathis, Wayne, Saturday and such and the excuse given we need to see our young talent.

[John Dee]

Tanking a game is when you don't play up to your full potential and are playing to lose. The Colts are not, we are just playing the players who have limited talent. If the Colts were taking you would see less playing time for the likes of Freeney, Mathis, Wayne, Saturday and such and the excuse given we need to see our young talent.

So tanking is a "fancy" term for "quitting" ???????

And to me ... this damages every bit of respect these core players have "earned" the last decade.

Show some pride people. If I were Manning I would be ashamed how how this team has just quit.

[dn4192]

So tanking is a "fancy" term for "quitting" ???????

And to me ... this damages every bit of respect these core players have "earned" the last decade.

Show some pride people. If I were Manning I would be ashamed how how this team has just quit.

No quiting is you stop playing, I don't see that, what I see are questionable decisions on whom is playing and play calling.

[Jaric]

No quiting is you stop playing, I don't see that, what I see are questionable decisions on whom is playing and play calling.

Sorry man, it's pretty much either or.

You either are doing everything you can to win or you aren't. It's that simple.

[John Dee]

Sorry man, it's pretty much either or.

You either are doing everything you can to win or you aren't. It's that simple.

Right On...

[doogansquest]

... why has the D continue to use a system that doesn't work?

That isn't the problem. The D never gets to rest for more than 2 minutes because the offense is off of the field before they can sit down.

[super8todd]

Not only was part of our success at Offense because Manning was on the field... but BECAUSE he was always on the field moving it up the field, he was also our best Defensive (Strategy/Player). So when we lost the 1 MVP player, we see that without the Duct-tape, we are indeed bad. Its time to rebuild. Let Manning have his last 2 years, see where we can go with him, and Luck learn behind him.

[oldunclemark]

The sad, sad truth is..we're playing as hard and as well as we can

..and we're the 32nd horse in a 32-horse race...

[imacoltfan]

The sad, sad truth is..we're playing as hard and as well as we can

..and we're the 32nd horse in a 32-horse race...

I have heard that if we clinch the # 1 pick we will rest the starters.

[BIGugly]

I have heard that if we clinch the # 1 pick we will rest the starters.

We are officially eliminated from the playoffs. If we win out we cannot pass the Texans.

Now about the draft. Everyone else has won at least 2 games. So if we get to 0-14, do we rest the starters??

[Horseshoes_fan15]

Being 0-10 and having a two game lead over the next closest team means the colts are almost guaranteed of that #1 pick. I find it hard to believe that the colts will win more than two games if even that. The Colts might as well try their best for the rest of the season because they have the #1 draft pick locked up at this point.

[-JJ-]

I am not saying it has, but what if Colt's management has made the decision to play for the number 1 pick? Not saying they will throw games, but they are not going out of their way to win either. I mean there is a number of questions surrounding the play calling, the schemes we are using and who is and isn't playing. What if the brass (both Polians and Irsay) have met, looked at the team overall, know what coaching changes they are going to make and voiced to Caldwell that they are "happy" with what is happening knowing that it will lead to that No. 1 pick?

yeah they're all in the back room strategizing on how to lose without looking like you're losing.

[GoGoColts]

Injuries, lack of adjustments, bad clock management, were all problems in seasons past. They are just more magnified without a HOF QB at the helm. In short, there is no evidence that the Colts are tanking.

[shaunzo]

What would you have them do - become the Jets and blitz whenever possible?

If they're losing 62-7, then why not? What is there to lose when your team is 0-10? I don't even feel like they should be punting or kicking field goals at this point. Go for it, if you don't get it, oh well, just another loss.