Broncos sign Ware

[oldunclemark]

And the #1 offense scored how many points in the SB?

 

 

And the #1 offense scored how many points in the SB?

That doesn't make offense their problem.....

 

Their defense was 22nd and gave up 43 points to Seattle....Think it over

[supremecoltsfan300]

I don't know where anybody gets the idea that Zane Beadles is a bad player. That's message board fantasy

Because he was bad. In all the broncos losses he played horrible. He was perfect for the blocking scheme they ran in the running game and in the screen game but he struggled mightily against good inside pass rushes.

[sweetsurrender]

Who was the last team to lose the SB and then make it back to the SB following year? 

[amfootball]

Who was the last team to lose the SB and then make it back to the SB following year? 

No team has come back from a Super Bowl loss to win it again the next year in 41 years. The 1971 Miami Dolphins lost to Dallas in Super Bowl VI, but then came back to win Super Bowl VII against Washington the following year.  

 

So Miami would be the last team to lose the SB and make it back again the following year.

 

[supremecoltsfan300]

Who was the last team to lose the SB and then make it back to the SB following year?

Dolphins, forget the year but i think it was the 1970 ones.

[TKnight24]

That doesn't make offense their problem.....

 

Their defense was 22nd and gave up 43 points to Seattle....Think it over

 

Like I said, you can only hold a team for so long. How many 3 and outs did Denver's offense have that game? How many turnovers did Denver's offense have that game? Defense can only hold for so long, offense has to help at some point. Denver didn't score until..... actually I didn't see when they scored cause I turned it off at halftime cause I knew it was over

[Fx Stryker]

Who was the last team to lose the SB and then make it back to the SB following year?

I k ow the Cowboys did it in '70 and '71. Which wad followed up by the '71 and '72/'73 Dolphins. Then there is the four Super Bowl appearances by the Bills.

[sweetsurrender]

Like I said, you can only hold a team for so long. How many 3 and outs did Denver's offense have that game? How many turnovers did Denver's offense have that game? Defense can only hold for so long, offense has to help at some point. Denver didn't score until..... actually I didn't see when they scored cause I turned it off at halftime cause I knew it was over

Denver was obliterated. These signings are a response to that beat down but they will fail once they meet the brawn of the NFC.

[amfootball]

I k ow the Cowboys did it in '70 and '72. Then there is the four Super Bowl appearances by the Bills.

Shame on me. How could I forget the Bills. So the Skins were the last to lose and win the following year and the Bills were the last to get back.

[Beauregarde]

Stephen Holder (Colts writer) just said it's a Super Bowl or Bust year for the Broncos

As it was last year and just about every year in Peyton's career.

[dgambill]

And the #1 offense scored how many points in the SB?

By your view everyone in the league should just not even try to play. It's pointless..no one can beat Seattle. Broncos were caught off-guard with Seattles speed/intensity, crowd noise, and didn't make good in-game adjustments. They can beat Seattle....I mean we saw Arizona do it IN Seattle. Your redundancy doesn't make your point any more valid. They played a horrible game....play them again and they may or may not win but the outcome would not be 40-8 or whatever. The Broncos offense is fine and really there is almost nothing they could do to make it better...than can make their defense better and they are doing that. With this defense what is to say Ware and Miller dont knock Wilson out of the game or cause fumbles. Talib doesn't pick him off...point being if you think the way you do...Luck will throw another 7 ints next post-season so whats the point...we may as well call it now.

[Beauregarde]

Who was the last team to lose the SB and then make it back to the SB following year? 

All the teams since didn't have 18.....

[supremecoltsfan300]

As it was last year and just about every year in Peyton's career.

Probably Peyton's rookie year was the only exception. Although I'm betting some people were bitter he couldn't win it that year

[TKnight24]

By your view everyone in the league should just not even try to play. It's pointless..no one can beat Seattle. Broncos were caught off-guard with Seattles speed/intensity, crowd noise, and didn't make good in-game adjustments. They can beat Seattle....I mean we saw Arizona do it IN Seattle. Your redundancy doesn't make your point any more valid. They played a horrible game....play them again and they may or may not win but the outcome would not be 40-8 or whatever. The Broncos offense is fine and really there is almost nothing they could do to make it better...than can make their defense better and they are doing that. With this defense what is to say Ware and Miller dont knock Wilson out of the game or cause fumbles. Talib doesn't pick him off...point being if you think the way you do...Luck will throw another 7 ints next post-season so whats the point...we may as well call it now.

 

Crowd noise? Really? It was a NEUTRAL game site!

[sweetsurrender]

All the teams since didn't have 18.....

Had Peyton made back-to-back bowls?

[dgambill]

No team has come back from a Super Bowl loss to win it again the next year in 41 years. The 1971 Miami Dolphins lost to Dallas in Super Bowl VI, but then came back to win Super Bowl VII against Washington the following year.  

 

So Miami would be the last team to lose the SB and make it back again the following year.

 

Well Buffalo made it back to 3 more only to lose....Denver had its runs in there too but not sure they were in back to back....that all said this team is good enough to win it all....if things go well health wise and they play to their capability they can win it all....they can win agaist SF and Seattle...any given sunday they could lose...point is they are better on paper...now it will be up to them to do it on the field...and we all know Peyton led teams are professional..and will play hard. He will have them all up to get back.

[chad72]

 

So Miami would be the last team to lose the SB and win it the following year in 1972.

 

 

Yep, that is the last one to do so.

 

I felt Talib's contract was offset by the relatively cheaper signing of T.J.Ward. But when you throw money on an aging guy like Ware, it does not set the roster up for the future years.

 

I personally am sick and tired of the Broncos and Patriots, and I am sure everyone here knows that.  But then, I am sick and tired of the Ravens and Steelers too, .

 

The only one that will make me happy would be the Colts heading to the big dance.

[Poster X]

10M$ a year? Isn't he 32? They over paid.

They are overpaying for everyone... they are desperate to build a winning team for a final run. Even if it bites them in the butt in the long run.

[dgambill]

Crowd noise? Really? It was a NEUTRAL game site!

They went to a silent count...it was the reason for the botched snap...did you WATCH the SB. They didn't expect it and it was Loud. They should have been prepared but fact was they weren't.

[tmccoy1]

The Broncos are really reaching,I know they caught a beat down but really D.Ware,and Talib getting older is always a good thing!

[TKnight24]

They went to a silent count...it was the reason for the botched snap...did you WATCH the SB. They didn't expect it and it was Loud. They should have been prepared but fact was they weren't.

 

Didn't seem that loud to me. But I guess it would make sense with all the bandwagon Seattle fans

[dgambill]

Yep, that is the last one to do so.

 

I felt Talib's contract was offset by the relatively cheaper signing of T.J.Ward. But when you throw money on an aging guy like Ware, it does not set the roster up for the future years.

 

I personally am sick and tired of the Broncos and Patriots, and I am sure everyone here knows that.  But then, I am sick and tired of the Ravens and Steelers too, .

 

The only one that will make me happy would be the Colts heading to the big dance.

I love my PM...but I agree Colts in SB would make me the happiest. I just look at it as two shots to be happy as opposed to one. The Colts have a lot more time though...NE and DEN are running on emergancy reserves...

[chad72]

Had Peyton made back-to-back bowls?

 

I don't think the past can be used to gauge future success whatsoever.

 

Don't get me started with patterns. The team that played the Patriots and NFC East had won the SB from 2006-2012, a 7 year run that got broken when the Broncos (who played the Patriots and NFC East) lost to the Seahawks.

 

Peyton, for all his playoff years with the Colts, had NEVER had back-to-back HFA in the AFC playoffs, go figure. He did so with the Broncos in 2012 and 2013. That is why I put less stock in past results.

 

One thing has continued, the passing yardage leading team had never won the SB. Once the Broncos incorporate more running in their O by design and pull it off vs good Ds, that is when their reliance on their passing game goes down and that is how they can be a legit SB contender vs the likes of the Seahawks and 49ers. It cannot be 65-35 in favor of passing, it has to be more like 55-45 if they need their running game to be taken seriously. Same goes for the Colts and any AFC contender too.

[dgambill]

Didn't seem that loud to me. But I guess it would make sense with all the bandwagon Seattle fans

There were reports of that. In fact many reporters said it was louder than a Giants home game. Between the jumbo-trons telling the fans to make noise and the reported of 65% Seattle fans it was loud. No excuse...Broncos should have been ready. Fact was during the week they turned down the noise in practice thinking it wouldn't be that loud....they did go to silent count the rest of the game...and it wasn't by design as I think it really affected Peytons play calling...he wasn't ready and that is on HIM and FOX.

[amfootball]

Some Pats/Broncos scuttle from Boston sports radio. Apparently both the Pats and Broncos were trying to land Revis. When it became clear that Revis was favoring the Pats, the Broncos made the crazy offer to Talib. Now let's see if the Pats really do get Revis. They just cut a defensive player today opening up another 3.5 mil in cap space.

[Valpo2004]

Not a chance in hell of Welker playing anywhere but in the slot. He is exceptional in the slot and I doubt that it would translate. Swap them and you've downgraded two positions instead of one.

 

But I'd also be astonished if Caldwell didn't put up similar numbers to Decker - who was essentially the offenses FIFTH option. How much could they realistically pay him? A high"ish" draft pick for depth (and the future), and perhaps a cheap vet just in case should be all that's needed.

 

On offense, the oline is more of an issue. Curious to see how they adjust for Beadles, and concerned a bit about depth. Also concerned that about Hillman needing to step up. I wouldn't be surprised if Anderson becomes the #2 back.

 

Now see I hate that because obviously the people who say it didn't take the time to look at the stats.  Because if they had looked at the stats they would see he was actually the 2nd option the whole time.  

 

Last year

 

Player           Rec          Targets

D Thomas      92              143

E Decker        87              137

W Welker       73              110 - Missed 3 games

J Thomas       65                89 - Missed 2 games

K Moreno       60                74

 

If you want lets expand out Welker and J Thomas as if they played all 16 games based on their previous averages.

 

Welker       Rec: 90    Targets: 135

Thomas     Rec: 75     Targets: 103

 

So Welker and Decker are about even with Decker getting 2 more targets but Welker having 3 more catches.  Which is to be expected because Welker if he had theoretically played all 16 games would have gained 958 yards based on his average, while Decker gained 1288.  Welker was the short yardage guy to throw to and as a result caught a higher percent of his passes.  Decker was more of a big play guy then Welker.  

 

J Thomas isn't even close to Decker's numbers in receptions or yards.  Neither is Moreno in terms receptions and receiving yards.

 

Decker was clearly the #2 receiver.  If Welker had played 16 games he would be 3 shy of Welkers receptions but put up 330 more yards then Welker.  His yardage gives him the edge on Welker.  J Thomas and K Moreno don't even come close and arn't in the discussion.

 

Moreno's rushing touches don't count in this discussion because if you start counting that then he got more touches then all the other guys combined.  

 

Decker was not at all the 5th option.  He was clearly the #2.  Now I will say I question his ability to be a true #1.  But saying he was the 5th option is just not factually correct.  

[Susie Q]

On paper sure you could say they're the biggest threat to SF & Seattle. But you have to see them play first. All these names mean nothing if the chemistry & teamwork isn't there

Then why are you getting so worked up about it ?  I don't think honestly that any team in the NFL could have beat Seattle in the SB with the way they were playing. Before you say well the Colts beat Seattle that they did but not in the SB. Regular season games and SB games are totally different. JMO  ;)

[Beauregarde]

That doesn't make offense their problem.....

 

Their defense was 22nd and gave up 43 points to Seattle....Think it over

You won that round fair and square...

[Beauregarde]

Had Peyton made back-to-back bowls?

Not yet but he has a much better team now and he may just do it.

[jvan1973]

No team has come back from a Super Bowl loss to win it again the next year in 41 years. The 1971 Miami Dolphins lost to Dallas in Super Bowl VI, but then came back to win Super Bowl VII against Washington the following year.

So Miami would be the last team to lose the SB and make it back again the following year.

actually it would be buffalo, three times in a row

[sweetsurrender]

Not yet but he has a much better team now and he may just do it.

He has had the most talent of any QB his entire career.

[chad72]

actually it would be buffalo, three times in a row

 

Yeah, she didn't quote the fact that the only team to make it back the very next year AND WIN it the next year. That would be Miami in 1972.

 

But on technicality, you are right, Buffalo did make it back 3 times but did not win whatsoever.

[MAC]

Now see I hate that because obviously the people who say it didn't take the time to look at the stats.  Because if they had looked at the stats they would see he was actually the 2nd option the whole time.  

 

Last year

 

Player           Rec          Targets

D Thomas      92              143

E Decker        87              137

W Welker       73              110 - Missed 3 games

J Thomas       65                89 - Missed 2 games

K Moreno       60                74

 

If you want lets expand out Welker and J Thomas as if they played all 16 games based on their previous averages.

 

Welker       Rec: 90    Targets: 135

Thomas     Rec: 75     Targets: 103

 

So Welker and Decker are about even with Decker getting 2 more targets but Welker having 3 more catches.  Which is to be expected because Welker if he had theoretically played all 16 games would have gained 958 yards based on his average, while Decker gained 1288.  Welker was the short yardage guy to throw to and as a result caught a higher percent of his passes.  Decker was more of a big play guy then Welker.  

 

J Thomas isn't even close to Decker's numbers in receptions or yards.  Neither is Moreno in terms receptions and receiving yards.

 

Decker was clearly the #2 receiver.  If Welker had played 16 games he would be 3 shy of Welkers receptions but put up 330 more yards then Welker.  His yardage gives him the edge on Welker.  J Thomas and K Moreno don't even come close and arn't in the discussion.

 

Moreno's rushing touches don't count in this discussion because if you start counting that then he got more touches then all the other guys combined.  

 

Decker was not at all the 5th option.  He was clearly the #2.  Now I will say I question his ability to be a true #1.  But saying he was the 5th option is just not factually correct.  

That kind of analysis has nothing to do with anything. I watched most of the games. And you DO include Moreno because we are talking about offensive weapons, and Moreno was one of the yards-from-scrimmage leaders in the league.

 

D.Thomas and Welker are two of the most frightening receivers to the opposition in the entire league, and J. Thomas is extraordinarily explosive for his position. He's considered an up and coming star.

 

Decker is a nice player, great size, great willingness to get in tune with Peyton and do whatever is asked of him, and presumably better than Caldwell or he wouldn't have been starting over him. But he's basically a possession receiver who has a tendency to drop the ball.

 

I'm not saying that I wouldn't want him back. I'm just saying that in an offense where two other players are going to be double covered before he is, where a third can explode for a TD on any play, and the RB is a big part of the passing game, Decker is "the guy who only has big days when the defense was ignoring him". How does that translate when he doesn't have an all time great throwing to him.

 

There are a LOT of competent WRs in the league who could thrive in that offense.

[Beauregarde]

He has had the most talent of any QB his entire career.

Not when he was in Indy. He dragged them kicking and screaming into the playoffs year after year. Many times there was a lousy defense. He dealt with bad O-lines too but, unlike Luck, he just got rid of the ball so quickly that it hid their shortcomings. Many years there was no run game at all because of the offensive line. Tom Brady played on much better teams that Peyton during that stretch.

[sweetsurrender]

Not when he was in Indy. He dragged them kicking and screaming into the playoffs year after year. Many times there was a lousy defense. He dealt with bad O-lines too but, unlike Luck, he just got rid of the ball so quickly that it hid their shortcomings. Many years there was no run game at all because of the offensive line. Tom Brady played on much better teams that Peyton during that stretch.

What? Bad teams with two HoFs in Reggie Wayne and Harrison? And then James, Clark, Freeney, Mathas, Sanders. Those Colts teams were stacked. I watched them year after year underachieve. 

[Beauregarde]

What? Bad teams with two HoFs in Reggie Wayne and Harrison? And then James, Clark, Freeney, Mathas, Sanders. Those Colts teams were stacked. I watched them year after year underachieve. 

First, Reggie and Marvin are not in the HOF and it isn't clear if they will ever get there and if they do, Peyton put them there. James was good for about four years. Clark wasn't anything special and fell on his face without Peyton. Freeney and Mathis were pass rushers who never tried to stop the run. Sanders had one great year and was hurt the rest of the time. You didn't watch much if you thought the Colts were better than the Patriots in those years.

[Mameluc]

Defense carried them. The way they man-handled Tom Brady & co. was unreal. Granted Tom did blow two throws that should've went for big gains/touchdowns.

But even in that game that historic offense struggled. Wasn't until Welker took out Talib that they got hot. My point being: I don't understand these defensive signings/splurging when offense was the downfall of the Broncos last year

talib was for like 8 minutes on the whole game.

 

 

they were also winning whle talib was tehre

[DougDew]

I agree to an extent...it is about putting your money to good use. Right now Denver is investing in players that are on the field...making plays..and a big part of their team. Look at Seattle....its best player make the least amount....they had some hugely over paid guys like Miller at TE, Rice at WR, Clemmons/Bryant etc that ate huge portions of the teams money but weren't really the difference makers. Imagine how good they be if the big money they spent played just as big. As they shed those contracts they will put it to use on their big players like Sherman/Thomas and Wilson...but make no mistake...I think Elway has managed his cap well...he has splurged here and we will see how it pays off...but he hasn't mortgaged their franchise. You can have more than 1 big contract on a team...as long as those contracts are paying off on the field its perfectly fine.

 

Agreed. And Elway also knows when to let a productive difference maker leave. He's letting Decker go. 

 

I bet Polian would have had the philosophy that Decker was key to the offense by his ability to "mesh" with Peyton and would be re-signing him for $10M per year. 

[Mameluc]

i think ir ead is really 2 year deal with 20 million guaranteed which is a lot

[sweetsurrender]

First, Reggie and Marvin are not in the HOF and it isn't clear if they will ever get there and if they do, Peyton put them there. James was good for about four years. Clark wasn't anything special and fell on his face without Peyton. Freeney and Mathis were pass rushers who never tried to stop the run. Sanders had one great year and was hurt the rest of the time. You didn't watch much if you thought the Colts were better than the Patriots in those years.

The pats only beat the Colts twice. The rest of the time we lost to the Steelers, Chargers, Jets...the list goes on and on ...