Peyton Manning's legacy now and if he wins the Super Bowl [Merge]

[amfootball]

Not sure what this means, but it doesn't change the fact that Bart Starr (who averaged less than 20 attempts/game over his career) was less affected by the weather in the Ice Bowl than either QB was affected by the rain in SB41. 

What? Manning relied on his RBs to win SB 41.

[amfootball]

Neat, you know how to use wikipediia.

Yeah too bad you don't as it proves there was not close to a monsoon for SB 41.

[jvan1973]

What? Manning relied on his RBs to win SB 41.

Do you really want too bring up passing stats in superbowls?

[Shane Bond]

What? Manning relied on his RBs to win SB 41.

Who did Manning rely on last week?.

[jvan1973]

Yeah too bad you don't as it proves there was not close to a monsoon for SB 41.

I never said it was a monsoon. I asked you what superbowl had more rain. And of coarse you said there had been others, along with snowy and icy Superbowls.

Also, i didn't need wiki to explain a monsoon

[amfootball]

Do you really want too bring up passing stats in superbowls?

I don't disagree about Starr and his era but that does not change the fact that Manning relied on his run game to win SB 41 in inclement conditions.

[Coltsince4]

What? Manning relied on his RBs to win SB 41.

No actually he relied on the other teams QB to win and that was totally GROSS MAN... Heeee!!!Heeee!!!   

[jvan1973]

Who did Manning rely on last week?.

What did Brady rely in against the colts a couple weeks ago?

[amfootball]

I never said it was a monsoon. I asked you what superbowl had more rain. And of coarse you said there had been others, along with snowy and icy Superbowls.

Also, i didn't need wiki to explain a monsoon

Good because all my posts were pointed at the title of this thread and the mis-use of the word monsoon. Glad we have done this to this subject

[jvan1973]

I don't disagree about Starr and his era but that does not change the fact that Manning relied on his run game to win SB 41 in inclement conditions.

What would any qb rely on when given a six man box the entire game?

[jvan1973]

Good because all my posts were pointed at the title of this thread and the mis-use of the word monsoon. Glad we have done this to this subject

Mentioning snowy superbowls was pointed at the title of the thread?

[Shane Bond]

Good because all my posts were pointed at the title of this thread and the mis-use of the word monsoon. Glad we have done this to this subject

Is it?.

 

Why did you drag Manning and 40 degree if it was about Monsoon and why are trying to bash Manning and try to degrade him in this thread if all you want to talk is monsoon.

 

I am sure you will ignore this again as you have no answer.

[amfootball]

Mentioning snowy superbowls was pointed at the title of the thread?

Good point. Mis-use of the word blizzard as well which also like monsoon having nothing to do with the amount of rain also has nothing to do with the amount of snowfall. Right now the weather looks like flurries at best with only a 30 percent chance at that.

[Superman]

What? Manning relied on his RBs to win SB 41.

 

I'm going to ignore the nonsense, and just point out that Manning threw 38 passes in that game, in the downpour, while Starr threw 24 passes in the Ice Bowl. Don Meredith threw 25. It was a different game. Weather affects QBs more now than it did 50 years ago.

[Shane Bond]

What did Brady rely in against the colts a couple weeks ago?

Manning just touched 400 yards with epic beatdown

 

Brady relied on Blount ( 6 TDs ).

[OffensivelyPC]

I'm going to ignore the nonsense, and just point out that Manning threw 38 passes in that game, in the downpour, while Starr threw 24 passes in the Ice Bowl. Don Meredith threw 25. It was a different game. Weather affects QBs more now than it did 50 years ago.

I think you mean that weather affects QBs more often now than it did 50 years ago.  A wet ball and hand thrown today is the same as one thrown 50 years ago. 

Edited January 24, 2014 by Nadine
inappropriate

[amfootball]

I'm going to ignore the nonsense, and just point out that Manning threw 38 passes in that game, in the downpour, while Starr threw 24 passes in the Ice Bowl. Don Meredith threw 25. It was a different game. Weather affects QBs more now than it did 50 years ago.

Don't forget that Grossman threw 28 and completed more passes (71 %) then Manning (65 %) in that game.

[jvan1973]

Don't forget that Grossman threw 28 and completed more passes then Manning in that game.

i guess basic math is another thing you aren't very good at

[amfootball]

i guess basic math is another thing you aren't very good at

71 % is better than 65 %.

[jvan1973]

71 % is better than 65 %.

you said completed more passes 25>20

[MAC]

What I'm afraid of is if Manning wins the Super Bowl period you will see so many @$^%$# trolls ripping us a new A@#&*^% for letting him go like their doing else where already... Hope everyone is ready for that because they will be back all the ones that haven't been back since he left to jam you a new you know what...?  And hey all you so called Peyton Manning fans and Broncos fan (and that's OK with me if you are) but what you should be doing is going to Irsay and bowing down to him and worshiping him as your God for having the sense to let him go because deep down you know just as well as I do with line offence etc that we had especially the first year he was not here he would have ended up staying in the fetal position, career ending injury are playing QB in a wheelchair... And you know it... So all I can say and I hope I'm wrong but I doubt it... If the Broncos win get ready for the most TROLLS you ever saw on a football site in the history of Profession football and a football organization site. Think about it???      

Yeah, so? I think that you think about it too much.   You sound as if you're fighting reality, not posters. Do you think deep down that they might be right? I wanted Peyton to stay regardless of the consequences, but it was still the blindingly obviously the "right" decision. Peyton winning 10 superbowls isn't going to change that. Ignore the meaningless noise and it will blow over.

 

I see threads on here on a virtually constant basis which aggravate the living :cuss: out of me, but I'd never consider altering my rooting interests as a result. Why would I do that to myself? If I "couldn't handle" the trolls (which is essentially what you are telling us is your problem) I would leave the site. My rooting interests are vastly more important to me than a platform in which I talk about them.

 

are fun. They give you license to be a complete :cuss: without compromising your ethics. You should thank them for their service to the community, not root against someone that you treasured for 14 years in hopes they'll stay away.

[amfootball]

you said completed more passes 25>20

Manning had more attempts but was less successful. But Grossman did not have the run game Manning had to win the game in the inclement weather.

[Boilermaker]

Lolololol a monsoon? How can you even say that Manning played in a monsoon? Sure it was rainy, but that is such a ridiculous statement. So what is Kap's legacy after playing the Packers in the playoffs this year? I mean, he practically won the game at absolute zero. 

[Superman]

I think you mean that weather affects QBs more often now than it did 50 years ago.  A wet ball and hand (that's what she said) thrown today is the same as one thrown 50 years ago. 

 

Can't "more often" be derived from "more" in that context?

 

If not, okay. Bad weather affects QBs more often now than it did 50 years ago.

 

Extra credit for the bolded.

[Moose Of Woe]

Manning had more attempts but was less successful. But Grossman did not have the run game Manning had to win the game in the inclement weather.

Grossman didn't go up against the #1 defense in football, either.

[Coltsince4]

 Weather affects QBs more now than it did 50 years ago.

You got that right

[Superman]

Don't forget that Grossman threw 28 and completed more passes (71 %) then Manning (65 %) in that game.

 

And threw two picks, and fumbled twice. And lost.

 

And as has already been pointed out, and as you've already tried to wiggle away from, 25 > 20. 

[jvan1973]

Manning had more attempts but was less successful. But Grossman did not have the run game Manning had to win the game in the inclement weather.

you still said completed more passes, which is incorrect

[Superman]

you said completed more passes 25>20

 

Sometimes, what amfootball says doesn't count. Especially if it's later proven to be wrong.

[amfootball]

And threw two picks, and fumbled twice. And lost.

 

And as has already been pointed out, and as you've already tried to wiggle away from, 25 > 20. 

I never said Grossman was a good QB. Does not change the fact that Manning who also threw a pick relied heavily on his run game to win the SB in inclement weather. Same as the QBs in the ice bowl. 

[Superman]

Manning had more attempts but was less successful. But Grossman did not have the run game Manning had to win the game in the inclement weather.

 

Are you going to give Manning that same excuse for Colts vs. Pats in the 2004 playoffs? You know, when Corey Dillon had 144 yards against Edgerrin James' 39 yards? No? 

 

Bottom line, Manning is the only quarterback to win the SB in any kind of precipitation.

[OffensivelyPC]

Can't "more often" be derived from "more" in that context?

If not, okay. Bad weather affects QBs more often now than it did 50 years ago.

 

Extra credit for the bolded.

I guess it could.  I thought it was a bit ambiguous, given that part of this discussion has revolved around the degree to which weather affects a QB.  And to that, I say that I don't think Manning's reputation is properly analyzed.  I don't think i'ts the cold weather that gets him.  If anything, you could say that, before his SB win, it was the pressure of the playoffs (and the fact that Pats' DBs were permitted to maul our WRs).  Coupled with the fact that all 3 of those playoff losses in cold weather were when we were the visiting team, Manning underperformed.  Nothing to do (or at least, much less to do) with the temperature.  Yeah, the snow is a problem, but that's tough for any QB.

[amfootball]

Are you going to give Manning that same excuse for Colts vs. Pats in the 2004 playoffs? You know, when Corey Dillon had 144 yards against Edgerrin James' 39 yards? No? 

 

Bottom line, Manning is the only quarterback to win the SB in any kind of precipitation.

I have no idea what 2004 has to do with this but you can pretend like it does.

 

My only issue with this thread was the use of the word "monsoon" which is comical to try to build Manning's victory more than it was. Fact is he won that SB on the strength of his run game precisely because it was raining.

[Superman]

I never said Grossman was a good QB. Does not change the fact that Manning who also threw a pick relied heavily on his run game to win the SB in inclement weather. Same as the QBs in the ice bowl. 

 

Again, Manning is the only QB to win a Super Bowl in any kind of precipitation.

 

Your weak attempts to undermine his performance in that game are telling, but they don't change the simple fact, as stated above.

[Coltsince4]

Yeah, so? I think that you think about it too much.   You sound as if you're fighting reality, not posters. Do you think deep down that they might be right? I wanted Peyton to stay regardless of the consequences, but it was still the blindingly obviously the "right" decision. Peyton winning 10 superbowls isn't going to change that. Ignore the meaningless noise and it will blow over.

 

I see threads on here on a virtually constant basis which aggravate the living :cuss: out of me, but I'd never consider altering my rooting interests as a result. Why would I do that to myself? If I "couldn't handle" the trolls (which is essentially what you are telling us is your problem) I would leave the site. My rooting interests are vastly more important to me than a platform in which I talk about them.

 

are fun. They give you license to be a complete :cuss: without compromising your ethics. You should thank them for their service to the community, not root against someone that you treasured for 14 years in hopes they'll stay away.

Still stand by what I say that Peyton and Broncos fans should thank Irsay and yes Trolls will come and go and we shall see and who comes and doesn't come back here that should be interesting!!

[Superman]

I have no idea what 2004 has to do with this but you can pretend like it does.

 

My only issue with this thread was the use of the word "monsoon" which is comical to try to build Manning's victory more than it was. Fact is he won that SB on the strength of his run game precisely because it was raining.

 

It has about as much to do with it as 2006 does. But that's not fair to you, because then it requires you to apply the same nonsensical standard to Tom Brady.

[Fx Stryker]

What I'm afraid of is if Manning wins the Super Bowl period you will see so many @$^%$# trolls ripping us a new A@#&*^% for letting him go like their doing else where already... Hope everyone is ready for that because they will be back all the ones that haven't been back since he left to jam you a new you know what...?  And hey all you so called Peyton Manning fans and Broncos fan (and that's OK with me if you are) but what you should be doing is going to Irsay and bowing down to him and worshiping him as your God for having the sense to let him go because deep down you know just as well as I do with line offence etc that we had especially the first year he was not here he would have ended up staying in the fetal position, career ending injury are playing QB in a wheelchair... And you know it... So all I can say and I hope I'm wrong but I doubt it... If the Broncos win get ready for the most TROLLS you ever saw on a football site in the history of Profession football and a football organization site. Think about it???      

 

I would rather Manning finish his career as a Colt than him winning the next 15 Super Bowls...

[Superman]

I guess it could.  I thought it was a bit ambiguous, given that part of this discussion has revolved around the degree to which weather affects a QB.  And to that, I say that I don't think Manning's reputation is properly analyzed.  I don't think i'ts the cold weather that gets him.  If anything, you could say that, before his SB win, it was the pressure of the playoffs (and the fact that Pats' DBs were permitted to maul our WRs).  Coupled with the fact that all 3 of those playoff losses in cold weather were when we were the visiting team, Manning underperformed.  Nothing to do (or at least, much less to do) with the temperature.  Yeah, the snow is a problem, but that's tough for any QB.

 

Maybe so, but "more" holds true. If Manning threw the ball 38 times in the rain, he was affected more than Starr or Meredith, who only threw the ball 24 and 25 times in the cold. If it was ambiguous, that's fine, but I hope we've clarified it. 

 

I agree with your for the most part on how Manning's reputation is analyzed. Coming up with arbitrary factors like whether it was 40 degrees or more, or whether it was in a dome, etc., etc., are all kind of missing the point. I mentioned earlier that it's not like Manning has played a whole bunch of playoff games in cold weather. The only times that really have any bearing on the discussion were the two in New England, and last year against the Ravens. And it's not surprising that he didn't light up the defense in those situations, but if someone wants to be critical on that basis alone, that's fine. I personally don't think it matters, because a) Manning has won games in the cold, the snow, the rain, the wind, and b) winning or losing isn't really an accurate determination of whether or how much the QB was affected by the elements.

[Superman]

I would rather Manning finish his career as a Colt than him winning the next 15 Super Bowls...

 

That seems kind of selfish. I get what you're saying, and why, but like it's been said many times, this has worked out pretty well for Manning. 

[The Laughing Man]

If he wins? You mean if he plays well? Colts fans should know better than anyone that Peyton's play isn't always reflected in the box score. If he plays great and loses because of unforgivable defensive lapses like last year, I think it still dispels the myth. Likewise if balls bounce off the receivers' hands and get picked, due to the weather making the ball slippery and whatnot. If he has a horrific game and somehow manages to win (which has seldom happened for him in his career), I think the discussion will continue. At the end of the day though, I think it will be a forgotten topic should he win the Superbowl.

Additionally, I think calling the weather in Superbowl against the bears a monsoon is a gross exaggeration, but it doesn't discount the fact that those conditions were very tough to play in. He played as well as anyone would have in those conditions I think.