Colts Release Saunders, Sign Adongo [Merge]

[AntonMcG]

Personally I would've thought league players would transition better to the NFL than union players, especially on the defensive side of the ball.  Here's a few ball and all tackles from last year that NFL fans might also like 

 

Agreed... though League does not have the clout it used to and is struggling to attract the best athletes, especially outside Australia, which really is its one remaining stronghold.

[davort]

right first off Super 15 while a high level isn't the highest well at club level anyway that belongs to the Heineken Cup two southern Kings not the biggest club in the 15 's. Now International is obviously the highest level and Kenya ain't great at that either. What worries me s that the Bulls didn't renew his contract and that he moved to the kings. he prob can hit as he'll more protection with the pads so will likely throw himself around more. also does it say were he played in rugby if he played center he should be well able to tackle as well as if he played full back if he played wing however i'd be a bit worried.  

Dude you don't know what you're talking about. The super 15 is played between club sides from New Zealand, South Africa and Australia. The top 3 ranked International sides in the world are: New Zealand, South Afica and Australia. So how is Heineken cup the highest club level? - it's nowhere near Super 15. You're talking about him playing center, wing or fullback?? If you look at him for a second you can see he is a forward. He plays lock or in the loose trio. How he performs in Football is yet to be seen, at least his fitness will be higher than anyone as rugby isn't nearly so stop-start, he'll probably get better as he gains experience.   

[Crunked]

Dear Mr. Saunders,

 

Nothing says I love you more than releasing you and signing a guy to replace you that has never played the sport. Thank you for your time, please keep your arms and hands inside the cart until the ride comes to complete stop....thank you and enjoy your day at Grigs' Island.....

[Jay Kirk]

8 games...why would we?  I was amazed when I read the thread on Pags saying we were not releasing him.....that one to me was a no brainer.  Cunningham makes the roster and Jones the PS again...just my opinion.

I think Cunningham was on the roster ,no matter what.Lol this new addition is interesting to say the least.

[BrentMc11]

I think Cunningham was on the roster ,no matter what.Lol this new addition is interesting to say the least.

I agree, and I still like the Athleticism of Dom Jones.....whether he makes the PS or not.

 

You never know, we may see another veteran TE brought in.  I too like Cunningham.  I cannot wait to see the special teams side as well as his blocking mentality....I hope he plays 'grouchy!     

[BrentMc11]

Dear Mr. Saunders,

 

Nothing says I love you more than releasing you and signing a guy to replace you that has never played the sport. Thank you for your time, please keep your arms and hands inside the cart until the ride comes to complete stop....thank you and enjoy your day at Grigs' Island.....

You must have known I was going to the fair today  Good advice

 

Love it crunked!  

[PrincetonTiger]

Caesar Rayford might be affected by this signing

[Smonroe]

Present day- Antonio Gates, Ray Seals, Eric Swann and Darren Bennett.  Former players- Marcus Pollard, Otis Sistrunk, Jimmy Graham (Seahawks) and Charlie Powell (he was also a boxer who fought Ali)  

 

I know Gates played in high school, I'm pretty sure Swann and Sistrunk did too.  I'd have to check on the others, but I bet they played in high school.

 

I'll give you kickers - it's the one position where someone can come in and "play" without having prior American football experience.

 

(Just checked, you're right about Pollard.  They didn't have a football team at his college and he played BB in HS)

[HarassedOffTheSite]

There seems to be some ambiguity regarding whether he is a LB or TE.

Regardless, he'll be lucky to survive the 1st cut. At best right now, he is a special teams player. If he makes it through, he's likely to be PSd anyway. Nice story. Good for him and good luck.

[lollygagger8]

Why did I immediately think of the Donger...

[MTC]

Not surprised to see Saunders go. Interesting that we signed a rugby player. There's no way he will be in rotation for our defense but I believe we signed him for special teams purposes only. Adongo is a great hitter if you look at his tapes which can help out the special teams unit.

[NZRug]

Agreed... though League does not have the clout it used to and is struggling to attract the best athletes, especially outside Australia, which really is its one remaining stronghold.

 

The problem with league to NFL is that by comparison it has far less organisation involved and is more of a free flowing game where improvisation is the rule and players are much more uniform in build and role.  Rugby is closer to American Football in that it involves more specialised positions and co-ordinated movements for many of them (lineouts, rucks, scrums, kickoff fielding), so the training aspect is there.  League simply isn't as complex and therefore the leap to NFL training with all the plays/timing involved would be much bigger.

[JoKeR]

I'm thinking he's only going to play special teams unless he starts to show great instincts in practice

[JoKeR]

Dear Mr. Saunders,

 

Nothing says I love you more than releasing you and signing a guy to replace you that has never played the sport. Thank you for your time, please keep your arms and hands inside the cart until the ride comes to complete stop....thank you and enjoy your day at Grigs' Island.....

Grigs made an example out of his situation.

[NZRug]

I know Gates played in high school, I'm pretty sure Swann and Sistrunk did too.  I'd have to check on the others, but I bet they played in high school.

 

I'll give you kickers - it's the one position where someone can come in and "play" without having prior American football experience.

 

(Just checked, you're right about Pollard.  They didn't have a football team at his college and he played BB in HS)

Some positions would be borderline impossible to play without prior experience, QB most obviously.  CB would also be quite a learning curve and doubt there'd be many suitable types in other sports.

 

DE/Linebacker on the other hand may not be too much of a stretch for a top level rugby loose forward as there is a lot of crossover there.  Same with Safety for some rugby backline positions or a lighter/faster loose forward.  Lock in rugby involves many of the same skills as TE and an athletic lock could probably transition quite quickly.

 

The issue is not so much that they got a rugby player on the roster, it's just why they'd choose this particular player when they could have got better prospects for the same money.

[AntonMcG]

The problem with league to NFL is that by comparison it has far less organisation involved and is more of a free flowing game where improvisation is the rule and players are much more uniform in build and role.  Rugby is closer to American Football in that it involves more specialised positions and co-ordinated movements for many of them (lineouts, rucks, scrums, kickoff fielding), so the training aspect is there.  League simply isn't as complex and therefore the leap to NFL training with all the plays/timing involved would be much bigger.

 

I don't see how they are complex concepts, simple training and explanation can articulate to any fairly in-tune person these concepts. Yes you need to understand the game more in Union, but it is a completely different game to football, so I do not see any real advantage. I get what you are saying, but I just do not see it as overly significant.

 

League is less organized, but relies more an pure physical ability, which is why I feel there may be more transferrable skillsets.

 

That said, the transition would still be incredibly difficult unless you relied on pure physical superiority to subset technique... that is unlikely however, as they don't come much bigger and faster than NFL players.

[crazycolt1]

I know Gates played in high school, I'm pretty sure Swann and Sistrunk did too.  I'd have to check on the others, but I bet they played in high school.

 

I'll give you kickers - it's the one position where someone can come in and "play" without having prior American football experience.

 

(Just checked, you're right about Pollard.  They didn't have a football team at his college and he played BB in HS)

Your comment just made me curious as to who has played in the NFL without prior experience. It is an interesting subject. These names I come up with came from ask.com. I have no clue to the actual facts, just what came up. It would be a very rare feat to get a contract in the NFL without previous experience especially in todays game. 

[jvan1973]

Grigs made an example out of his situation.

i think he made an example of himself. if you are a fringe player, any team in the league willcut you if you are suspended eight games

[illdubb]

Dear Mr. Saunders,

 

Nothing says I love you more than releasing you and signing a guy to replace you that has never played the sport. Thank you for your time, please keep your arms and hands inside the cart until the ride comes to complete stop....thank you and enjoy your day at Grigs' Island.....

 

Saunders is a TE, they're throwing Odongo on the roster as an OLB.

 

http://www.wbiw.com/sports/archive/2013/07/colts-waive-saunders-sign-rugby-player.php

[NZRug]

I don't see how they are complex concepts, simple training and explanation can articulate to any fairly in-tune person these concepts. Yes you need to understand the game more in Union, but it is a completely different game to football, so I do not see any real advantage. I get what you are saying, but I just do not see it as overly significant.

 

League is less organized, but relies more an pure physical ability, which is why I feel there may be more transferrable skillsets.

 

That said, the transition would still be incredibly difficult unless you relied on pure physical superiority to subset technique... that is unlikely however, as they don't come much bigger and faster than NFL players.

As a youngster I used to participate in rugby trainings and league trainings.  League there really wasn't much to train so it often just became a practice game of a few hit ups and then improv passing/running.  Which when you think about it is the core for league at any level-it isn't a complex game compared to rugby or american football.

 

Rugby training involved all sorts of boring drills to get timing and co-ordinated movement right for scrums, lineouts, rucks etc.  And this was junior stuff.  Move it up to senior pro level rugby and it's obviously much more hardcore.  You have players used to showing up week after week to perform very specific tasks in groups in the correct way at the right time.  They have to because one piece of a lineout/scrum/kickoff reception not working can end up stuffing the whole situation, just like a missed blocking assignment or receiver not where they're supposed to be can stuff an otherwise good football play.   NFL training would closely resemble rugby training than league.

 

If you get a league player there's just no proof they have the mental aspect to show up week after week and get that stuff right.  It's one of the reasons many of them find rugby too slow and boring when they try and transfer.  Some cope, but many just want to go back to a less rigid environment.

 

With a decent rugby player you at least know they could at least handle NFL training because they've mostly had to do similar things every week for years to get to a high level, particularly in the lock/loose forward positions.

[Kyle]

 

The issue is not so much that they got a rugby player on the roster, it's just why they'd choose this particular player when they could have got better prospects for the same money.

total blasphemy.

 

seems like you know a lot about rugby, but not much about football.  so what makes you think you know who would transition to the NFL better than Grigson does?

 

The dude is 23 years old, 6'6, 250 lbs and fast.  Name and list those same stats of the guy we should have signed please.

[BrentMc11]

also zero contact in track and field

I disagree.....that pole vault pole hits a mean belly

[NZRug]

total blasphemy.

 

seems like you know a lot about rugby, but not much about football.  so what makes you think you know who would transition to the NFL better than Grigson does?

 

The dude is 23 years old, 6'6, 250 lbs and fast.  Name and list those same stats of the guy we should have signed please.

I've watched both sports closely for 20 years, used to be a hardcore fantasy rugby player so knowing the attributes of every decent player was part of that.

 

Leave aside the physical aspect as a selling point.  There are guys who go undrafted with physical tools.  Much like there are reasons why those guys go undrafted, there are reasons why this guy can't get a starting spot in the worst of 15 Super Rugby teams and now the super rugby season was over he was looking at another season playing in a semi pro league for a middling Counties team.

 

If physical stats were the main thing then Pierre Spies would be the most amazing rugby player around and could have walked into the NFL on his combination of strength/speed.

 

Assuming the Colts scouting department didn't randomly start watching Super Rugby games, then this guy has basically been shopped to them on his physical tools and maybe some highlights, which is probably how he's already ended up playing for 4 different rugby teams in 2 years.  Think about that, teams lock up their stars, nobody locked him up.  But for the Colts it's fairly low risk, not much lost if they cut him so why not take the chance.

 

The reason guys like that get shopped is they don't have a stable well paying job in rugby, because they aren't quite good enough.  A better, more established player has more to risk because they're earning more and in a safer career position, looking at being able to play into their mid 30s earning enough to set themselves up, without the risk of trying a new game.  An obvious example of that would be someone like Kieran Read or Sam Whitelock, where you're getting a true top level international player, athletic enough to crossover, who could come in an play Linebacker/DE/TE (Read) or TE (Whitelock).  The thing is these guys are already set up for life so not much incentive for them to switch.  A player like Adongo doesn't have that security so would probably go anywhere and try anything.

 

So you probably can't get established stars like Read or Whitelock and you don't want to be taking fringe journeymen like Hayden Smith (Jets) or Adongo.  The logical goal is the guys who aren't established in pro rugby and are young enough to learn football before they hit their prime.  Would also help if they have an interest in American Football.  Best place to look for that is the kind of guys who find coming through Super Rugby development squads as 19-20 year olds or playing at the Under 20 World Cup.  Top rugby players move into pro ranks around age 20-21 on average (so 23 isn't considered quite as young in rugby as football)

 

I mentioned a few names earlier in the thread, Ardie Savea is 19 and a rising star, needs to bulk up but could easily project into a safety or linebacker role depending on how much bulk he can add while retaining his pace.

 

Steven Luatua would be another one but now he's an All Black the price would have gone up and he's probably locked in.  That type of guy a year or two younger is the prototype though.  Or Kieran Read when he was 20 instead of 27 now.

 

The reality is there is no obvious career track for that type of guy to the NFL in NZ/Australia so they just end up directed towards rugby or league.  Probably some hidden jewels to be found for any NFL or College scout who bothered to visit Auckland, Wellington or Sydney and check out a few high school or club games.

[Carl Dzienkiewicz]

does anyone think don brown will stick?

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

Must be someone to nurture on the PS squad. How did Grigson determine which position to try him out with just a single

Big , fast, athletic, & long arms sounds like a rush OLB in a 3/4 defense.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

Like the athleticism playing in pads is alot different for some but hey try him at alot of positions. He could be very good at ST courage right now? He will be fun to watch for sure.

[atapcl]

Big , fast, athletic, & long arms sounds like a rush OLB in a 3/4 defense.

If he can block and catch he could also be a TE.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

If he can block and catch he could also be a TE.

YEP

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

I'm thinking he's only going to play special teams unless he starts to show great instincts in practice

 

He can also moonlight as the Waterboy our Colts can't get enough high quality H2o .

[ColtsFanMikeC]

Curious signing to me. But it seems like Grigs/Pag likes hard, hard hitters. If this guy can hit in the NFL like he does in that video, i'd say its a decent pick up. Minimal risk, potential gain . I like where they are going. I've thought for years that the defense needed to be bigger, faster and more high speed motor wise. Landry, Werner, Betha, Mathis plus Toler and Warden, our defense is setting up nicely, I still think our DL needs that big, mean nose tackle though

We have a big, mean NT -- his name is Josh Chapman.

[crestmount]

 

The dude is 23 years old, 6'6, 250 lbs and fast.  Name and list those same stats of the guy we should have signed please.

Most major Rugby teams would have a player physically similar

[BrentMc11]

I wanna say I have enjoyed this thread as much as any on here.  

 

Instead of Colts/Patriots.....it is rugby wars from many of our International friends.  I have thoroughly enjoyed the opinions here from all of our Colts fans around the world!  Thank you for contributing to a good clean thread!!     

[TKnight24]

does anyone think don brown will stick?

Barring injury he will. Not guaranteed that Bradshaw will be able to go week 1. So carry Ballard, Brown, & K Willy into Oakland. But I had us carrying 4 RB's regardless. K Will being our special teamer for returns hoping he can show off that speed of his

[kiwi_colt]

I guess at the end of the day the scouts "might" have tried to tempt other up and coming rugby players but failed as the risk of changing sport would be too high.  Adongo on the other hand would be at a turning point in his career, he wouldn't be earning much money in rugby, he hadn't cemented a position in a top flight team and the minimum salary in the NFL is a lot more than he would ever have earned in rugby.

 

Extremely low risk project for the Colts and a pay day for Adongo :-)

 

I'm fascinated to see if he gets past the practise squad and will be cheering for him.

 

We should start a thread of rugby/league players we'd like to see in the NFL.

[FalseStart]

 

 

Welcome to the Colts.

[JoKeR]

Did anyone see that video? The guy looks like a physical freak, hand him the ball some.

[GoColts8818]

Saunders was probably a guy who was going to be in a real camp battle to keep his spot and the suspension just sealed his fate so the Colts did the smart thing, take a shot at a guy who you might get lucky on and who might be able to help you rather than holding on to a guy you know you are going to release. 

[GoColts8818]

Grigs made an example out of his situation.

So based on that logic and the fact that Lefeged and Brazil are still on the team that would seem to mean that the Colts are cool with what they did then...

 

I don't think they cut Saunders to make an example out of him.  They just knew he was a boarder line player in terms of making the roster to start with and then the suspension just sealed his fate in terms of making the final roster so they cut him and replaced him with a guy who even if he's a long shot might be able to help the team.  Makes more sense to keep him than it does to keep a guy you know you are going to end up cutting. 

 

It tells me that Brazil is in a much more secure roster spot and probably more secure than some around here would like to think he is.  As for Lefeged yet the Colts are still probably waiting to see how that plays out.  The league hasn't officially suspended him yet even though I think we all know it's coming.  It also doesn't hurt Lefeged that he plays a position in safety that the Colts aren't nearly as deep at as they are at tightend. 

[Kyle]

Most major Rugby teams would have a player physically similar

ok. name one...  who should we have signed instead???   

 

[csmopar]

We have a big, mean NT -- his name is Josh Chapman.

To me, he's a bench warmer till he actually plays. I've had the same injury he has had, only i tore my ACL and PCL at the same time, knee injuries for most people do take time (unless you're AP) so I'm not writing him off totally but until we see just how good or bad Chapman is, I will still say we need a mean,big aggressive NT.