Whose In Charge - Tryon Says Caldwell Overaruled, Irsay Says Caldwells Decision ((Merge))

[bayone]

Tryon Says Caldwell Overaruled, Irsay says Caldwells Decision

September, 29, 2011

SEP 29

7:54

By Paul Kuharsky

Beware of a bitter player.

A guy who feels he's unfairly let go may be unafraid of burning bridges on his way out, and he may be emotional about his exit.

That said, we must look at the tweets last night from Justin Tryon, the outgoing Colts cornerback, as they were powerful enough to prompt a response from owner Jim Irsay.

THE TWEETS

While he's calling for support of the coach, he's also revealing Caldwell can be handcuffed and overruled.

I do think if there was nothing to it, Irsay wouldn't have touched it.

I believe Tryon is a better player than Jacob Lacey, who's been in front of him since the lockout ended. Has Tryon's play slipped so dramatically that he's not even worth a roster spot anymore? Or are politics that go beyond keeping the best players at play?

My link

[1959Colts]

Just more annoying drama involving the Colts front office.

Time to get a real head coach, not just a yes man for Polian.

http://www.indystar.com/article/20110929/SPORTS03/110929004/Colts-coach-Jim-Caldwell-confronts-perception-he-lacks-control-team

[Coffeedrinker]

Just more annoying drama involving the Colts front office.

Time to get a real head coach, not just a yes man for Polian.

http://www.indystar.com/article/20110929/SPORTS03/110929004/Colts-coach-Jim-Caldwell-confronts-perception-he-lacks-control-team

Is this thread going to some how get a different response than the other three threads discussing this exact same thing.

Plus Irsay's tweets refute Tryon's completely. So who are you going to believe?

[The Fish]

Tryon. The Front Office will never ever suggest anything other than unity and harmony. That can't always be the case, no surprise at all coming from a 0-3 team.

[LUVTHESHOE]

Tryon Says Caldwell Overaruled, Irsay says Caldwells Decision

September, 29, 2011

SEP 29

7:54

By Paul Kuharsky

Beware of a bitter player.

A guy who feels he's unfairly let go may be unafraid of burning bridges on his way out, and he may be emotional about his exit.

That said, we must look at the tweets last night from Justin Tryon, the outgoing Colts cornerback, as they were powerful enough to prompt a response from owner Jim Irsay.

THE TWEETS

While he's calling for support of the coach, he's also revealing Caldwell can be handcuffed and overruled.

I do think if there was nothing to it, Irsay wouldn't have touched it.

I believe Tryon is a better player than Jacob Lacey, who's been in front of him since the lockout ended. Has Tryon's play slipped so dramatically that he's not even worth a roster spot anymore? Or are politics that go beyond keeping the best players at play?

My link

My money would be on polian, i would guess that it is his dog house he was in, after all bill treats

his paying customers with no respect and i am sure he is a bully who answers to nobody. he has done alot of good

things here but kinda reminds me of another indiana legend who could not just bow out gracefully. bp's refusal to

ever feel he owes anyone an explanation for decision he makes blows me away. his treatment of the fans and the media is getting worse not better. he needs to be reminded without us there is no him. jmo

[Coffeedrinker]

Tryon. The Front Office will never ever suggest anything other than unity and harmony. That can't always be the case, no surprise at all coming from a 0-3 team.

And a player that was just cut has no reason to try to start a controversy?

[Moose Of Woe]

Tryon > Lacey. Whatever issues lay between "Coach" Caldwell and Justin Tryon should have been brushed aside in favor of upgrading the CB position.

Instead of doing what was best for the team and playing the BETTER player, now Tryon is gone and we're stuck with god awful Lacey.

If Caldwell has as much power as he thinks as "coach" then great. He's apparently content to have an inept CB over a mediocre one which makes yet another horrendous decision on his resume.

If Caldwell doesn't have as much power as he says, then he's just Polian's puppet and is lying through his teeth.

Either way, we need a real head coach. It shouldn't be too hard to find an upgrade from a yes man/worst in the league.

[The Fish]

I'm sure that's a part of it, but you don't see that kinda thing being said about some of the other "Class of the AFC" teams to often. I guess I just tend to think that Caldwell isn't a great leader. He's O.K. but again 0-3 is a tough locker room to hold together.

[LUVTHESHOE]

Just more annoying drama involving the Colts front office.

Time to get a real head coach, not just a yes man for Polian.

http://www.indystar.com/article/20110929/SPORTS03/110929004/Colts-coach-Jim-Caldwell-confronts-perception-he-lacks-control-team

this is the reason i have always been critical of caldwell is has no backbone. i thinks the reason he stands at press room and never gives us anything is because he does'nt know what he is allowed to say. so he just stands there

and says we gotta get better with that smug smirk he has. he is not a leader and it shows. maybe some of this is the

reason guys like mudd and moore are gone. send coach packing and let polian lead the way.

[deedub75]

Where there's smoke there's usually fire. There is something to this story, otherwise Irsay wouldn't have had to come to Polian's defense. As fans we will never really know the true story.

[DILLIGAFER]

What a mess..

[smittywerb]

Another reason for why we need a new coach. I understand Polian is his boss but when are you going to put your foot down? Yes, he has been cleaning house but I feel Caldwell is just a puppet. I'm not a Caldwell basher but this just doesn't sit right. I want (and I think majority of us do) a coach who stands up and shows emotion when it's crunchtime instead of bowing down to his superiors and giving us answers that sound like they were read off a paper. I'm sorry, but Caldwell is coming off as weak to me. I gave him a chance, but this just takes the cake.

And another thing, to add onto the "What Peyton brings to this team" discussion, with Peyton gone, a lot of holes are really being exposed and it seems like the holes are getting higher and higher, from the team to the coaches to the front office. This is getting out of hand. Now coaches are being exposed, who's next?

[swflacoltsfans]

Irsay needs to quit acting like a kid with tweeter and run this team like a professional.

They were all sleeping on a backup QB.

[Andy]

I feel that Jim has no say in anything, but that's just me. Obviously I have no idea what goes on in there.

[oldunclemark]

Tony Dungy lacked emotion, too..

..and I'm sure a new coach would make Painter into Manning...

..we arent really whining about a back up DB are we?

[smittywerb]

Tony Dungy lacked emotion, too..

Yeah, but he wasn't any push over either. He signed who he wanted, traded for who he wanted, and LEFT when he wanted. Tony Dungy wasn't a puppet and had respect from EVERYONE in the organization. From what Tyron says, Caldwell is questionable. Belicheck lacks emotion too, but he isn't a pushover. (Sorry to use a Patriots example, lol)

[LUVTHESHOE]

Tony Dungy lacked emotion, too..

..and I'm sure a new coach would make Painter into Manning...

..we arent really whining about a back up DB are we?

Yes but coach dungy would stand in front of a camers like a man and tell like it was, not stand there with a blank

stare on his face and grin. There is a big difference. i think when jc got offered this position it was you can coach

but!!!

[vitoaf27]

That is a very interesting article. Thanks for sharing.

[LUVTHESHOE]

I think the most telling thing ever since pulling the starters vs jets and the many errent TIMEOUTS. i have

yet to here any player who's voice is often heard come out in anyway and support this coach. i can count and recall

several cases even on the worst teams in the league players supporting there winlees coaches, not here though ,i

believe that speaks volumes to the respect factor. please corrct me if i have missed that support.

[Larry Horseman]

Gary Bracket, Dwight Freeney and/or Robert Mathis (can't remember exactly who or if it was both), Pat McAfee, and Curtis Painter have all publicly discussed their satisfaction with/support of Caldwell over the last few weeks. I'm not going to waste my time digging up links on all these, and am not trying to defend or attack Caldwell. Suffice it to say the players have supported in him publicly, we have no way of knowing what they really think, and I'm sort of disappointed in myself by legitimizing this thread with a response.

Edit: Just wanted to point out that this was originally its own thread and was in response to this comment by LUVTHESHOE:

I think the most telling thing ever since pulling the starters vs jets and the many errent TIMEOUTS. i have

yet to here any player who's voice is often heard come out in anyway and support this coach. i can count and recall

several cases even on the worst teams in the league players supporting there winlees coaches, not here though ,i

believe that speaks volumes to the respect factor. please corrct me if i have missed that support.

Edited September 29, 2011 by Larry Horseman

[oldunclemark]

Be cool. We're 0-3...Its bad. We get it.

[Coffeedrinker]

Tryon > Lacey. Whatever issues lay between "Coach" Caldwell and Justin Tryon should have been brushed aside in favor of upgrading the CB position.

Based on what? I'm not a Lacey fan by any stretch of the imagination but what did Tryon do in the preseason or in the games this year to make that statement?

[LUVTHESHOE]

Gary Bracket, Dwight Freeney and/or Robert Mathis (can't remember exactly who or if it was both), Pat McAfee, and Curtis Painter have all publicly discussed their satisfaction with/support of Caldwell over the last few weeks. I'm not going to waste my time digging up links on all these, and am not trying to defend or attack Caldwell. Suffice it to say the players have supported in him publicly, we have no way of knowing what they really think, and I'm sort of disappointed in myself by legitimizing this thread with a response.

Not really sure if you responding to a post makes it legit or not. i just thought it was a fair

thought. if there were to have been overwhelming support , the thought would not be needed.

[LUVTHESHOE]

Based on what? I'm not a Lacey fan by any stretch of the imagination but what did Tryon do in the preseason or in the games this year to make that statement?

what do any of our guys do in the preseason. tryon was established enough that maybe he bought

into the preseason has no bearing on the season, that is the attitude, correct>?

[Fx Stryker]

Tryon after being released supported Caldwell.

Now done with that!! I'm def ready for the next chapter in this wonderful story!! IM BLESSED!! lay off of Caldwell he's a great coach! Peace

19 hours ago via Twitter for iPhone

http://twitter.com/#!/JTTRYON20/status/119207616739155968

[jskinnz]

Not really sure if you responding to a post makes it legit or not. i just thought it was a fair

thought. if there were to have been overwhelming support , the thought would not be needed.

So wait a minute. You ask for evidence of support in case you missed it, evidence was supplied, but then you dismiss it as not voluminous enough. If that is how you feel, no matter the counter evidence, then why ask for it in the first. It seems clear you had made up your mind already.

[Fatboyslim11]

Is this thread going to some how get a different response than the other three threads discussing this exact same thing.

Plus Irsay's tweets refute Tryon's completely. So who are you going to believe?

That is one set of opinions. Another opinion is the reasons there is so much reaction to "Is Caldwell really in charge" is a lot of people believe Polian is pulling all the strings (between the three Polians they have a hook into and control of everything Colts - Irsay is so busy tweeting, he is out of the loop on key decisions). Caldwell has done nothing in his history prior to, and he has not demonstrated the least leadership ability as QB coach, assistant head coach or now as Colts Head Coach to prove that he is a good X and O's, dynamic, coach that can lead the team. I truly believe Polian wants it that way - he will not tolerate anyone who will outshine him because his ego leads him to believe his OLD press clippings. Polian continues to draft players that can't compete in the NFL due to Polian's criteria that they be fast and small to the detriment of anything else. Our team looks like a Big 10 team while the rest of the division plays like a LSU or Alabama.

The Colts won't return to glory until Irsay gets smart and get rid of the Polians and bring in a Head Coach who actually has a clue. Man - we are staring down an 2-14 record for sure this year. I hope Blinky doesn't lose eyesight for all the clueless blinks he will display on the sidelines this year.

[jskinnz]

Yes but coach dungy would stand in front of a camers like a man and tell like it was, not stand there with a blank

stare on his face and grin. There is a big difference. i think when jc got offered this position it was you can coach

but!!!

Absolute nonsense.

Dungy was just a misleading on injuries, in fact sometimes downright untruthful.

Dungy & Caldwell both say the mistakes are "correctable" and they just have to play a "little bit better."

Is Belichick a "man" when he gets up there are avoids basically every question in the same manner with the same tone and says virtually nothing?

[FireJimCaldwell]

No comment.

[WoolMagnet]

Did you hear that?

Thats the sound of 31 other organizations laughing their butts off!

How unprofessional can it get? Sheesh, one guy goes down and the whole thing implodes.

Its kinda embarrassing.

[jbaron04]

first off tryon had regressed this year and second he wanted to be a starter but showed nth also rucker and thomas has more size a look better than him hes not a starter period

[Jason_]

Polian continues to draft players that can't compete in the NFL due to Polian's criteria that they be fast and small to the detriment of anything else. Our team looks like a Big 10 team while the rest of the division plays like a LSU or Alabama.

1) The Colts being grossly undersized is simply no longer true

2) It may have been a typo, but Polian drafts players due to Polian's criteria? If it wasn't a typo then I assume you meant Chris Polian doing the drafting and it being Bill Polian's criteria the players be small but fast? Even if that were the case that is simply not true. Dungy and Monte Kiffin co-founded the tampa 2 and it was their belief the players needed to be a little smaller but much faster. In Tampa, they gave up a little bit of size but not a whole lot. When Dungy came here, he took it to a whole new level and that's how we wound up with 215-220 lb linebackers, 275 lb DT's etc etc.

The players that have been brought in have been the type of players that fit the mold that the head coach wants. With Dungy, the guys were tiny....as soon as Dungy left, the players being brought in have been bigger and stronger.

[Coffeedrinker]

what do any of our guys do in the preseason. tryon was established enough that maybe he bought

into the preseason has no bearing on the season, that is the attitude, correct>?

No that is not the attitude. The Colts evaluate players, see if they do their assignments, see if they maintain correct positioning, in the case of CBs, see if they turn their hips at the correct time, see if they come out of the breaks on the correct foot, see if they understand the game plan via game plan tests.

So again based on what is Tryon>Lacey?

[Coffeedrinker]

That is one set of opinions. Another opinion is the reasons there is so much reaction to "Is Caldwell really in charge" is a lot of people believe Polian is pulling all the strings (between the three Polians they have a hook into and control of everything Colts - Irsay is so busy tweeting, he is out of the loop on key decisions). Caldwell has done nothing in his history prior to, and he has not demonstrated the least leadership ability as QB coach, assistant head coach or now as Colts Head Coach to prove that he is a good X and O's, dynamic, coach that can lead the team. I truly believe Polian wants it that way - he will not tolerate anyone who will outshine him because his ego leads him to believe his OLD press clippings. Polian continues to draft players that can't compete in the NFL due to Polian's criteria that they be fast and small to the detriment of anything else. Our team looks like a Big 10 team while the rest of the division plays like a LSU or Alabama.

The Colts won't return to glory until Irsay gets smart and get rid of the Polians and bring in a Head Coach who actually has a clue. Man - we are staring down an 2-14 record for sure this year. I hope Blinky doesn't lose eyesight for all the clueless blinks he will display on the sidelines this year.

that is all that can really be said about this post.

[Coffeedrinker]

Not really sure if you responding to a post makes it legit or not. i just thought it was a fair

thought. if there were to have been overwhelming support , the thought would not be needed.

You're right, it's not needed because there has been overwhelming support.

[Xfiles]

This just confirms what most of us knew already....Caldwell is a puppet and Polian will put personal feelings in front of whats best for the team...including not being able to admit he is wrong or swallow his pride. Disgusting.

[JoKeR]

" or politics that go beyond keeping the best players out of play"

That sounds dirty, implying that were in a race to get Luck?

But that doesn't really make sense either, Justin Tryon wasn't going to win games for the Colts nor is Lacey bad enough to single handedly lose games for us. Well maybe the latter is debatable for some. Lacey is quickly becoming Tim Jennings part 2.

[MAC]

My money would be on polian, i would guess that it is his dog house he was in, after all bill treats

his paying customers with no respect and i am sure he is a bully who answers to nobody. he has done alot of good

things here but kinda reminds me of another indiana legend who could not just bow out gracefully. bp's refusal to

ever feel he owes anyone an explanation for decision he makes blows me away. his treatment of the fans and the media is getting worse not better. he needs to be reminded without us there is no him. jmo

How does he treat his paying customers with no respect exactly? Where do you see him not giving explanations? On that weekly interview they post on the Star he usual goes into far more detail than I see from GMs of the other teams I root for. The fact that you chose not to believe anything he says is your issue, not his.

Come on people! How many players have we seen released from the Colts who go out of their way to say glowing things about the organization that just told them they weren't good enough and took away their chance for a good life. This jerk is the anomaly - wouldn't it make more sense based on an incredibly long track record that TRYON is the problem - just maybe? Why do we need conspiracy theories.

Common sense suggests that either Tryon is lying about Caldwell just for the fun of it, or because he thinks it makes him look like less of a loser, or because Caldwell once in one conversation out of fifty implied that he liked him as a starter and Tryon is hanging his hat on in while ignoring everything else, or any other of a number of things. Far and away the LEAST likely scenario is that Bill Polian is willfully doing something irrational and damaging to the team because of some mystical personality defect.

And by the way, he DOES run the team. Nobody is unearthing any deep dark secrets when alluding to that fact. Its' his JOB for crying out loud!

[LUVTHESHOE]

You're right, it's not needed because there has been overwhelming support.

LOL, you are correct again! it was just a thought, all the support must be kept in house. no need

for sarcasm on your part. i watch a ton of sports shows and just have hardly ever heard a member of the natoinal

media or players say what a great coach or game manager he is. but if you say so. jmo.

[antipatriot]

Polian is the reason we cant get a coach like Gruden here. A coach like that would want to much control and Polian cannot have that, I think thats why he was so good with Caldwell taking over from Dungy, Caldwell can be controlled because he knows there isnt another team out there that would hire him as a head coach so he knows to just do whatever Polian wants.